Diffusion of Power (Open 478) over

[RachMarie]

Yes I do tend to state the obvious when it looks like I am going to be mislynched. And yes I have been lynched as Doc before its in the above list of games.

[Wisdom]

To answer your question Wisdom yes there is more besides the everyone is in the middle somewhere with no solid reads so I can call anyone I want scum, that I have on DO

1. Not only has he not updated his reads since page 8, he has moved around going for the wagon that seems most likely to go through.

2. ? 3. ?
Do you have any more reasons D_O is scum or is that all?

[RachMarie]

2. I could see a Kmd/DO partnership going on, but I would rather see a scum flip first.

3. His comment about Mollie being hard to read. Which I commented on in my read of Mollie/ B and B

4. Also commented on this in my read of M/ B and B. It seems like he is actively lurking, which is different from just being lurky. He keeps talking about oh I will post more, there are so many pages, I will post more and so on.

[mcqueen]

@Wisdom (Post 1024) - Yet, earlier, I was a perfectly fine lynch for you. Yet, when you saw my wagon slowing down, or not even starting, as I was voting myself at the time, the first little bad usage of words from me, was your chance to call me Town, and move on.

As I said, stop votehopping, trying to cover it up, and trying to cover your scummy self up.

[CF Riot]

Spoiler: Riot and ProHawk discuss Wisdom

I guess what I don't understand Wisdom is you were on a wagon (McQueen), then you let your scum-read (D_O) convince you that there were only two viable voting choices (HD or yourself), then you say you would rather be on a D_O wagon (who wasn't a wagon and still isn't a wagon) instead of keep your vote on the wagon you were originally on. If you wanted to be on a wagon, you could have stayed with McQueen.

So your reasoning for voting D_O looks contrived IMO when you started talking about wagons and comparing him to HD. It doesn't add up to me. Now you are back onto McQueen. It's quite the hopping.

Quick Prohawk, what is the scum reason for all this vote hopping?

Did I say there was a scum-reason? My point of his scummy action is the contrived vote for D_O, this hopping is just showing the lack of conviction for his reads which only strengthens my read of his D_O vote having been contrived.

Here's why that doesn't make sense to me. Scum never have conviction about their reads, cause obviously they know it's all bs, right? But this doesn't stop them from feigning confidence or pushing their votes as if they're right because that's the basics of the game. So when I see Wisdom flip flopping between 2 people he's been engaging in conversation with for several pages, I don't really see scum motivation for doing that. Especially when we consider D_O had no votes at the time. I feel like as scum he would rather just stick to the one that either has more traction with the town, or that he feels is the safer vote which won't draw suspicion, while voicing that his suspicion of the other if he wants to set up a move to that wagon later. Now as town, I totally see the reason for flip flopping, because as town of course sometimes you question your own conviction about a read and change your mind about what is and isn't scummy about a person. Sometimes in the heat of debating with someone, your gut reaction to something they say is "OMG OBVSCUM VOTE NAO" when later after rereading with a level head you think, "Okay, that still doesn't make sense to me but maybe it's not as scummy as I thought." This is the impression I get from Wisdom's posts. He's indecisive, he's arguing 2 people he suspects, both are saying things he doesn't agree with, he votes one only to have the other say something that catches his eye, changes his mind switches his vote. All this seems like fluid townplay to me. While I do see what you're saying about him, I don't see why any of it points to Wisdom being scum.

If Wisdom is having a conflict of reads, its internal because I haven't been able to discern anything like what you are describing... do you have any evidence to support your claim?

Pro Idk what you're talking about. The evidence of his conflict in his reads is him changing his vote back and forth between those 2 players. You said you noticed "lack of conviction" in his reads. Is that not very nearly the same as a conflict?

Riot, lack of conviction reads like fake to me, not "I once believed one thing, and now that X transpired, I have changed my read." Like you are trying to explain.

Spoiler: Riot accuses Mitillos of poor push and backtracking on ProHawk

@Pro

: Are you saying reads shouldn't change or that when they do, people shouldn't explain why this happened? Because neither of these positions is pro-town.

No, what I am saying is people should explain why, if they don't its either fake, or an internal conflict both of which we have no way to determine. I don't recall Wisdom having mentioned any of his reads changing, he just moved-on to the next big thing.

Town reads on Wisdom, CF,

Pro,

Beauty and zab, in order of strength.

I remember now. You kind of slow played the original spat between HD, Tigerzone and Wisdom. I also thought the top quote here was reaching pretty far to accuse Pro, and I didn't catch at the time but when looking back to find this quote I also saw you have him in your townpile which interests me because like I say, it looks like you're casting suspicion here and this is the first I remember of you calling Pro town. You should definitely elaborate on this if you can.

@CF: Look back at 791. Pro responded to 790 and explained. And that was the only scummy thing I thought I saw from him. He seems to be earnest in his hunting, so yes, my read on him is town.

Explain "earnest in his hunting." I don't need an English lesson, I mean show me what makes you think that and break down your thought process for me. I still think 790 was a real stretch by you to put Pro in a scummy light, especially if you didn't suspect him before that post.

@CF: I didn't put him in a scummy light. I asked him what he meant, because I misunderstood it and thought it was something very very scummy. He responded, and I was fine with his response. As for his earnestness, he pushed mollie, when he thought he caught her in a scumslip, he does a thorough research into the posts of whomever he is making a case and he's been actively increasing the content and conversation levels. That's pretty much all I need to read him as town.

This is what I wanted the Hydra to look at. Anyone else can comment too. Basically, I don't think what Prohawk was saying in the 789 area was that scummy, and it looks like Mitillos was trying to stir the pot following the momentum of my extended conversation with ProHawk. Afterwords he doesn't follow up, and when I mention this his response doesn't satisfy me.

[RachMarie]

Thanks CF I knew I was missing someone, with all the replacements and so on it gets kinda confusing...

Will check out Hawk's ISO after a nap.

[CF Riot]

Hey Slimer. Hey McQueen. Hey Zab.

Also, what is your read on Rach?

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

It does kinda look like one

"Vote D_O or Mollie's gonna scumread you!"

Except I said she's already got a scum read on him.
Kind of hard to demand ransom when you've already told everyone you shot the hostages.

So I saw Mollie had some points about Kmd, what about you Majiffy? Thoughts on his lurkiness?

I didn't like him at first because he was my only null read, which is usually a warning sign. But then when he pulled his head out of his ass and made that post of reads I found that he picked up on a lot of the things that I had, and his reads were generally congruent to mine. Thus, he's probably a townie.

CF - Get to your post ASAP. Currently packing and cleaning house, moving this weekend. Consider this a mental note for myself.

Wisdom - Who do you think the scum hopping on the Rach wagon is, myself or CF Riot? Because other than that, KMD is the only one on the wagon, and he was on it first, and for a long while - since it was Siv, IIRC.

[Wisdom]

Beauty did you skip a page or something? HD and Prohawk also joined the wagon.

[CF Riot]

^Doesn't really answer the question.

[Wisdom]

I don't know who, I know I don't like the fast accumulation.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

I guess I must have IDK.

All I know is Rachlynch is goodlynch and if her buddies want to bus her then the more the merrier.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

I guess I must have IDK.

All I know is Rachlynch is goodlynch and if her buddies want to bus here then the more the merrier.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

Please delete 1037, mod

[Human Destroyer]

I don't know who, I know I don't like the fast accumulation.

Hmmm...

RachMarie/Mitillos/Wisdom

It really has a nice ring to it, doesn't it.

Like seriously this defense of Rach is so much fail considering you can't even find a person that got on the wagon who's particularly scummy

[Human Destroyer]

Except I said she's already got a scum read on him.
Kind of hard to demand ransom when you've already told everyone you shot the hostages.

Okay then maybe it's more of a bribe?

"Vote D_O and Mollie will townread you!"

?

[Wisdom]

Except I don't defend her.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

I think I see what you guys mean by too much posting

5 pages overnight wtf

You guys are lucky I'm sick in bed and have time to read all this shit

do you know what is awesomely ironic about this post?

hd then posts 12 more times

[Human Destroyer]

I think I see what you guys mean by too much posting

5 pages overnight wtf

You guys are lucky I'm sick in bed and have time to read all this shit

do you know what is awesomely ironic about this post?

hd then posts 12 more times

^_^

[Human Destroyer]

I don't like the speed of this wagon too much. Looks like a good chance for scum to hop on a lynch most people support.

This looks like you're trying to form a defense based on wagon speed. Am I correct?

[Wisdom]

I am merely pointing out that I don't like this speed wagon as it's likely scum could have benefited from the momentum and pushed it.
I am not defending Rach, in fact she seems scummy to me and I might actually vote her. But as I said, I'd prefer to lynch D_O today.

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

Ehh you have always been nice to me Majiffy, even when you wanted to lynch my butt...

Still working on the last ISO here. Hey Majiffy do you know of any games where Mollie has been scum? Would help me out here a lot.

I guess you missed my very helpful instructions where I said if you move the cursor over the wiki button under my avatar I listed the games where I have been scum on this site.

why is this so hard to do I don't get it

[BeautyAndTheBeast]

Okay then maybe it's more of a bribe?

"Vote D_O and Mollie will townread you!"

?

CF - Pretty good points. Not anything I'd call damning on their own, but certainly enough to merit a good re-read of both PH and Mit.

[mcqueen]

I am merely pointing out that I don't like this speed wagon as it's likely scum could have benefited from the momentum and pushed it.
I am not defending Rach, in fact she seems scummy to me and I might actually vote her. But as I said, I'd prefer to lynch D_O today.

D_O's not getting lynched today, forget it. All of your failed wagons and reads aren't getting lynched today.

[Wisdom]

So if I wagon Rach she won't get lynched?