The next person who says “Oh Mykonian is scummy but used his role in a Pro-Town way he must be Town” and doesn’t suspect Nero for how he handled his role is going to get an Internet Wedgie.
I’m also very curious as to why Yates is getting all the “YOU ARE SCUM FOR NOT MOVING YOUR VOTE TO A VIABLE WAGON AND THUS ZAB DIDN’T GET LYNCHED” while no-one aside from me is blinking at Mastin’s more blatant lack of vote movement at deadline.
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Peregrine wrote: As a scum role, it's kind of pointless, except to create WIFOM. As a scum role, it seems wiser to not use it at all.
No actually this isn’t true at all. A Scum Messenger doesn’t know that a Town Neighborizor is in the game until it is claimed. Thus using the Role to “Look Pro-Town” is exactly the motivation for using it.
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Myk wrote: I believe nero to be town, so such discussion wouldn't lead to anything and it would detract from real scumhunting.
Yeah, scum. He can be noosed after Zab.
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Mastin wrote: (Gee, this'd be a great time for a dayvig, now, wouldn't it, MoI? )
Nope. It would have been great to not be derp and actually lynch yesterday so today would be about mining Zab’s scum flip for relational tells and VCA. So again – your play yesterday was terrible if you are Town and you have lost any leverage you might have had.
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AngryP gets
a lecture
his own section so I can properly
yell at him
discuss why I disagree with him. Skip down if you don’t care about it …
AngryP wrote: MoI, why is Yates not vote-worthy? Hes lurking heavily and his content is fairly comparable to Zab's actually.
I disagree with this on pretty much every level.
First let’s compare raw post count – Yates at 229 versus Zabriel at 70 (which is 30 some odd less than the Mod himself). While post-count doesn’t signify everything on activity (you can certainly have half the posts of another poster with double the content if your posts are content filled) in this case it is pretty terrible to suggest Yates is ‘lurking’ anywhere near the scale that Zab has.
Now let’s address the “Yates content is similar to Zab’s” angle – I disagree completely. Read their ISOs side by side and tell me that Yates doesn’t have significantly better “game releveant content”. If you want to tell me that I’m going to have to laugh at you. While Yates isn’t a strong player his ISO has actual opinions about players being scummy each Day. Meanwhile Zab’s ISO is filled with more flavor and set-up specualation fluff than assessments about the alignment of other players.
The rest of your objections to Zab as scum read to me as borderline White Knighting (that a certain post doesn’t come from scum or that he was “genuine” Day 1). Enough so that as I said earlier – he actually is Town and you are number 1 on my suspect list.
Notice, for example, that Peregrine at
Post 3580 quite nicely gave Zab a Vote count for him to color / format as he chooses to point out scum. Does Zab, who is supposedly Vanilla Town who IS getting lynched today, take him up on it to provide reads? Nope.
AngryP wrote: FWIW, ISO him here. He flipped scum that game. Tell me that is the same Zab. Its not much but I think his posting is notably different here.
What exactly am I supposed to see in that ISO that is supposed to change my mind? Because I see evidence of lurking (post 572 “I need to stop neglecting this game”), a bunch of wishy-washy reads, and low content in what looks like a pretty clear active lurking style. Which I see as pretty consistent with his play here.
AngryP wrote: THINK ABOUT IT. Zab is relatively new. Scum obviously have fake claims. If Zab is scum, he knows that. Zab is flat out pretending they don't. I cannot see him saying that as scum. Unless he is scum and trying to subtly drop a towntell by assuming something that is wrong and is generally against site etiquette. He would have to be aware that what he was saying was ridiculous and then still say it anyways on the hope someone would realize Occams razor suggests that he is town and actually DOESN'T know that fake-claims are incredibly common.. Thats unlikely given that his play really isn't a beacon of originality.
Nope. That’s actually the exact wrong conclusion to take. It is actually a fairly viable scum-tell for newer players to make an “Oops statement” that shows they aren’t scum because they don’t understand the set-up or some facet of the game. Examples –
Maruchan in Zom Com Mafia dropping the “Oh, what is daytalk?” post. He was Mafia and here’s the relevant clip from a scum role Pm
Meeting room: You may speak in the Mafia QT at any time.
Umbrage’s Jungle Republic where Neil1113 posts pretending to not understand the Open Setup (thus showing he didn’t have inside knowledge and is thus Town). He was Mafia. This game actually is the one that made me a believer in this as a tell as I argued with TwistedSpoon about Neil over this very point. Twisted thought he was scum. I did not.
So your “It’s WIFOM but Scum wouldn’t do that” is really not sensible.
AngryP wrote: Its that you had a chance to move to Zab yesterday but opted to keep sitting on Jason.
Well aside from Confirmation Bias / Scum pushing the best counter to Zab they can find why is Yates the only person from this quote you have an issue with on the “Not moving vote” end?
Yates - 3 (mastin2,
zabriel,
mykonian)
AngryPidgeon - 3 (Kublai Khan, Nero Cain, PeregrineV)
jasonT1981 - 1 (
Yates
)
"I am a leaf on the wind ... watch how I soar!"
Pretty much Geriatric game restricted at this point ... unless there are players I REALLY want to play with.
