Open 465 - Wot's... Uh the Deal? (Game Over! Town Win!)

[Mantisdreamz]

@Jiffy, VC is wrong.
Thor is at L-1. Pro voted Mollie instead of me.

mala, i had a few questions for you, you haven't answered them.

Vote Count

Thor665 (L-1): Shrimp85, Guile, Adam-12, ProHawk

Mantisdreamz (L-4): borkjerfkin
Leviathan (L-3): Pirate Mollie, Malakittens

Not Voting: leviathan93, Mantisdreamz,

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is Monday, December 17, 2012 at 12:40 PM EST

[Adam-12]

Rherefore if Mollie, as scum, would be able to get a fresh body in her slot, then he/you would be offered a fresh start. You wouldn't have to answer for any of the scummy play of Mollie because you aren't her. It's the best she could do to help her team win.

Gosh, why does, "I'm not going to read this thread, go ahead and push for my lynch" just seem to fit perfectly with this analysis?

Seems like he is taking fresh start to the limits.

[Malakittens]

PM & Mantiz: Why is Guille "scum" for Post 438

because at the time i thought mollie could be town, and that guille was going over and beyond to make a case on her.

I do not like this post, do not like it one bit. Buddying here needs to stop!

if mollie (at the time), or anyone for that matter looked town to me, what is wrong with buddying. i guess what i'm asking is what is wrong with buddying, in general?

fake edit - you being so adamant about that, makes me wonder if you know that guille is town?

@Mantis

Why should Adam be lynched today?
Oh I misread as it as Shrimp did, neverminddd.

if you kept reading to later discover that i didn't mean Adam should be lynched, why did you include this question, still?

@Mantis: I don't think that is a big scumslip. I mean I can see how it can be considered one, but I wouldn't really take much thought into it as of yet

no, Levi seems townish to me, now.

OKAY, PM is town
METaaaatttackkk.
Oh, but for the sake of conversation. Stop, Drop

& roll

the freaking JMT's. You make me want to twitch when I see them.

...does look kind of townish, that post. only thing, is that mollie said the conversation felt right at a time when her, adam and myself were discussing guille. but then she went to say i'm going to trust mantis's read on him.

if it felt right, mollie, why do you have to trust my read on him, and not your own?




you think it is Levi and Prohawk? i'll look at their posts again.

1) Gracias.

2) To me being buddy/buddy can hurt town unless you are 100% sure of someone's alignment. To me it's not a good thing to do.
No, I'm not being adamant. I was in two different games where I saw scum use budding to their manipulation. One game used it in LyLo for the win because the other townie was so into a focus of buddying that the second townie couldn't convince them to knock it off and see the fact the other person is probably scum.

So long term effect that's it can hurt.

3) Were my thoughts. I didn't want to remove it. >.>

4) How so?

5) I still think it can be Levi/Prohawk, yes.

[Adam-12]

I won't play with her ever again. That is the most anti-town thing I have ever seen a player do with 30+ pages of content. Now we have to start over with a new slot and it will be 50 pages before we are done.

I've replaced players with over 50 pages of material to read, and mostly text-heavy quote walls. This game would be nothing to catch up on, no more than a few hours read.

--- Just found out Thor665 is going to do it. Thanks Thor!

[ProHawk]

For anyone who cares to hammer, I am good with ending the day now. We have plenty to work with in terms of evidence for D-2 after the flip.

[Adam-12]

OK hold your horses!

DO NOT HAMMER.

Express your INTENT to hammer!!!

[Adam-12]

I can't believe that it appears Thor has left this thread.

[Mantisdreamz]

For anyone who cares to hammer, I am good with ending the day now. We have plenty to work with in terms of evidence for D-2 after the flip.

hammer mollie/thor?

may as well let Thor speak a little, don't you think?

[Mantisdreamz]

2) To me being buddy/buddy can hurt town unless you are 100% sure of someone's alignment. To me it's not a good thing to do.
No, I'm not being adamant. I was in two different games where I saw scum use budding to their manipulation. One game used it in LyLo for the win because the other townie was so into a focus of buddying that the second townie couldn't convince them to knock it off and see the fact the other person is probably scum.

i don't know about 100%. you can't really be at that point? but you can have a relatively good sense, and work off that. how come you didn't give me crap for buddying to Adam? i have said more than several times i think he is town.

So long term effect that's it can hurt.

i can see, from your example. But, it helps town more to search out for who they think is town and buddy with them.. kind of.

3) Were my thoughts. I didn't want to remove it. >.>

that is fair.

4) How so?

he isn't seeming to be manipulative to me, but comes across as genuine. Your vote on him makes me wonder about you.

5) I still think it can be Levi/Prohawk, yes.

not sure what to say on this yet. especially about prohawk. He has seemed very calm throughout the game, has done quite a few vote switches, and for a moment i thought he and yourself could be scum. i'm neither reading him as scummy or overly townish. I would say he seems a stable and weak town read, to me.

[Thor665]

Blargitty-blarg!

Its contextual which means: YOU-NEED-TO-READ-THIS-THREAD

It's not contextual at all.
Listing every vote she did as weak is actually pretty weak for your case.
What I'm hearing is "being over defensive, dodging (the perfume thing and the Levi=easy vote thing), and playing against your understanding of her meta".
That sum it up?
I disagree with being over defensive even being a scumtell, natch.
Dodging is suspect, I'll agree. The meta is a decent crutch (how often have you read her correctly in the past?)
Is this really the best case of the day?

You are town though. Rather pedantic but...meh.

Thor,

If you're implying that I hadn't voted her before she replaced out, your ignorance precludes you.

And yet my reading comprehension is better than yours.
I was saying that you were voting her *before* she replaced out, so clearly that isn't the case on her.

So you are going to argue that if you are town and are the one that looks the most like scum in the thread that you should go ahead and replace out?

Oh gawds no. That would be almost as derpy as claiming anyone who did tat was scum - clearly neither conclusion holds any logic at all.

You're probably scum, aren't you?

Unvote: Leviathan
Vote: ProHawk

Misreps, using logic he understands is scummy, and salivating for my lynch.

Gosh, why does, "I'm not going to read this thread, go ahead and push for my lynch" just seem to fit perfectly with this analysis?

Seems like he is taking fresh start to the limits.

Have you looked at my town meta? You seem to like meta - try to find me saying I read the game when replacing in as town anytime in the past 1.5-2 years.
Oddly, i can still lynch town as good or better than most - so...

I can't believe that it appears Thor has left this thread.

I did leave - why, was this thread being super exciting and going anywhere fast?
I can't believe you now seem to have left it. SHOCKING!


Mantis is also probably town.
Apparently Levi is fairly obv. town. I'll slip him town side of nullish due to Adam and Mollie apparently agreeing with that.

Anyone have a read worth anything on Mala. He's rather ignoring my entrance to the game - what's he even doing over there?

[Thor665]

For anyone who cares to hammer, I am good with ending the day now. We have plenty to work with in terms of evidence for D-2 after the flip.

Theory question: I flip town. Adam is killed and flips town.
What conclusions do you draw from your evidence?

[ProHawk]

Is that who you would kill? Adam?

[Thor665]

I don't think you understand the concept of "theoretical"

But, sure, feel free to also answer it if I flip scum and Adam flips town if that's what you need to get through the day.

@Adam - remember that 'dodging' tell you like so much? Just saying.

[Malakittens]

I'm a girl and I'm not ignoring your entrance to the game. I don't like how Adam is wanting to others to hold horses regarding hammers, but not un-voting. That bothers me that he wants people to slow down. I understand the intent to hammer thing because I think hammering without asking/waiting for a claim is bad.

I do have a fair town read on Adam though.

---

I must be the only person to disagree with Levi being obv. town. I was originally came to that conclusion at the beginning of the game, but as of late it has decreased.

---

@Thor,

Explain:

Oddly, i can still lynch town as good or better than most - so...

Why would you want to lynch town? I could have misread that though. ^

[ProHawk]

If/when that occurs, we cross that bridge at that time. I am not going to play theory games with you. For those of you willing to let Thor replace in and take the reigns, we will have to start from ground zero on that slot. I am going to say it again because Thor seems to like it. Meta cases are null and extremely weak.

[Thor665]

@Mala - No, clearly I meant lynch town. Or scum. Try both of them in the sentence and go with the one that makes sense.

Why did you need me to call you out about not addressing me before you addressed me?
Do you have any sort of opinion on the Mollie lynch?

@Pro - you still haven't answered what would happen if I flip town, clearly that won't help me or my scumbuddies if I am scum.
Also you haven't described your case on me yet.
Dodge, duck, dive, dip, dodge, amirite?

[Malakittens]

Also, if PM had such a town read on Levi, why was she voting him right before she replaced out? She thought he was dropping scum slips.

So Thor, I'm not sure what you are reading, but you have facts wrong.

[ProHawk]

Thor, its nothing personal with you, you just replaced into a ticking time-bomb courtesy of Pirate Molly.

And you failed to address the main reason you need to be lynched while trying to pressure me. Your case on

you

your slot was already summed up in two quotes. Go reference it and get back to me.

[ProHawk]

EBWOP: Should read "My case on your slot"

[Malakittens]

I was reading her as town towards the end right before she replaced out. What really sucks about the wagon is that when she was at L-2 it had a majority of my town reads on it. Prohawk is the only one that I do have a scum read on who just recently hopped onto it.

[Thor665]

Also, if PM had such a town read on Levi, why was she voting him right before she replaced out? She thought he was dropping scum slips.

So Thor, I'm not sure what you are reading, but you have facts wrong.

I was going after her attitude as expressed by Adam in his wall o' barely legible.
I'll accept her opinion changed, but I see no problem with moving Leviathan to the town side of null for that reason - do you?

Also - what's your opinion on the Pirate Mollie wagon? This isn't a complicated question.

Okay, who do you think is the scum pushing the wagon?

Thor, its nothing personal with you, you just replaced into a ticking time-bomb courtesy of Pirate Molly.

And you failed to address the main reason you need to be lynched while trying to pressure me. Your case on

you

your slot was already summed up in two quotes. Go reference it and get back to me.

- No worries, I'm a ticking timebomb by nature - you should stop dropping scumtells though.

- That's not the main reason, I'm still trying to get you to use your words and describe the main reason. But I'll address it (because I don't dodge things)

There is no actual hypocrisy in saying "I do not mind being lynched" and "I think town would benefit from someone else in my slot"
Feel free to explain the hypocrisy to me - but there isn't any there that I see. I'm sure it's an awesome case though, fill me in.

As a reminder, other things you owe me;

1. Your case on Mollie that was the reason you voted her.
2. What you learn from your evidence that is enough to end the day on if Thor flips town.
3. While we're at it, a read on Mala would be sexy.

[ProHawk]

Funny that you are throwing all kinds of ad-hom attacks my way while saying I should drop scum-tells.

1) Go read my case and stop being lazy.
2) Honestly, I don't think you will so I haven't compiled any evidence toward the fact, but believe me after 37 pages, its there.
3) I don't like her play as it stands, but am not willing to pursue it today unless your wagon drops.

[ProHawk]

I swear I can't type tonight....

EBWOP: Should read "while saying I should stop dropping scum-tells"

[Adam-12]

Just a stream of consciousness summary since my head is spinning and work had upticked in the last hour:

Thor replaces in, says some of the case on him so far makes sense but dismisses it, refuses to read the thread, votes Hawk & asks for Mala read from Hawk.

@Hawk: Please lay out your case for Thor.

@Everyone else: If you think Mollie-Thor is scum please lay out your case; everyone on the wagon needs to give their input or unvote.

At this time, Thor=Mollie until everyone on her wagon responds and Thor has fully responded.

I am back to catching up.

[Thor665]

@ProHawk - Funny 'hurm' or funny 'ha-ha'. I actually don't think I've done any ad hom attacks - of course, but feel free to point out the personal attacks against you I'v emade.
None?
Okay then.

1. Link?
2. Like what - just give me one example read you'd get from it?
3. Meaning she's your #2 scumspect?

You also didn't explain the hypocrisy from Mollie after I totally wuss slapped your 'this is all the case needed' case - why not come back at me if that is such a brilliant case-closed moment?