Open 465 - Wot's... Uh the Deal? (Game Over! Town Win!)

[pirate mollie]

Don't make me enforce a mid-game post restriction whereby you have to speak in genderless pronouns. I'll do it.

xe and xir

Vote Count

Pirate Mollie (L-3): Shrimp85, Guile
Mantisdreamz(L-4): borkjerfkin
borkjerfkin (L-4): Adam-12
Leviathan (L-4): Pirate Mollie
Malakittens (L-4): ProHawk

Not Voting: leviathan93, Mantisdreamz, Malakittens

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is Monday, December 17, 2012 at 12:40 PM EST

[pirate mollie]

Mollie. I checked Tit and that's your only completed game. The newbie is not finished therefore I can't meta you.
I can handle reading harsh things as long as they aren't directed towards me. So possible link offsite games.

And I don't really want to do the audio >.>

It's only like 3-4 hours of listening.

I have a completed newb game. the one that I am in now I am the SE.

https://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=23357

[Malakittens]

Oh please murder me now, I left off on Page 18/31. I blame Adam!

Adam's post

My case on Mollie boils down to:

1) Her RVS scum-aware vote for Shrimp
2) Her obsession with being lynched & declaring she is not scum
3) Her directing of the Tracker/Watcher
4) Cog-dis & AtE in her defense when wagoned
5) Her anti-town attitude when wagoned

Feel free to inquire about any point.

1) Link me to this post and explain why it's a scum-aware vote.
2) Okay, the only probable thing I see here could be that she's saying lynch me for "town cred" and I agree declaring that you aren't scum can be a scum tell, but that's grasping at straws.
3) I agree with this being a possible scum tell. I hate when people direct Night Actions, but the last few times I have seen someone do it they were town. So conflicted here.
4) AtE is not a scum tell.
5) What anti-town attitude?..

PM & Mantiz: Why is Guille "scum" for Post 438

This post
Why would you lynch make him look bad? Why do you even care what it makes him look like? I don't want this for my team - make it seems like you KNOW his alignment.

I do not like this post, do not like it one bit. Buddying here needs to stop!

Uh
@Borky: Where's your read on Mala and Mantis?

This smells of town
Only problem is that they can fake these special tells, but also change them up. Meta isn't always as reliable as it's made out to be. I just found that out the hard way.

HAI TOWN FEEL
I agree that town tend to be more paranoid in general, but scum tend to be a lot calmer.
There's a few town tells I been getting from Adam which hopefully by finishing reading the clusterfuck of pages I'll be able to describe.

@Mantis

Why should Adam be lynched today?
Oh I misread as it as Shrimp did, neverminddd.

Stop Buddying.

Something commonly done by town

NOT READING THE THREAD DOESN'T MEAN SOMEONE IS SCUM. THIS HAPPENS TO BE DONE BY BOTH ALIGNMENTS, SO IT'S A NULL TELL.

@Mantis: I don't think that is a big scumslip. I mean I can see how it can be considered one, but I wouldn't really take much thought into it as of yet

OKAY, PM is town
METaaaatttackkk.
Oh, but for the sake of conversation. Stop, Drop

& roll

the freaking JMT's. You make me want to twitch when I see them.

No
I have seen town more times out of ten meta someone rather than scum.

Well
Least this time you included both Mantis and Mala, but those reads are so icky, it's not even funny.

Right
I commonly see town tank more rather than scum. Scum like to give up a fight unless they are the last one standing and then they'll just give up.

Bad Levi
Stop being a kissup to Bork, please, kthanks?

@Levi
You already know how I felt about your claim. You didn't help the town out by claiming early instead you fucked us over. If this was just plain vanilla game then I can be like whatever, but the fact IS we do have PR's in this game. You narrowed the field for them having to search for the PR's. So please tell me why you deserved to be Night Killed over any other player here?

Again
Normally done by town.

Awesome
Why did you just take my post before that seriously? I almost think you were willing to sway your read if I said yes.

@Guille
What Mollie was looking at regarding Levi.
I had a reason.
So basically you want me to see if she OMGUS-ed as town or scum. Okay I'll double check that after. I wasn't exactly sure what you wanted out of that.
I removed my vote, but I forgot exactly why I had it. Was something he was doing. >.>

@Bork:
Yeah, I did not have a town read. He was leaning null.

Loved the beginning of this post of Shrimps, but hated the end

Hey Pro, why did you poke at me for saying the same thing as Levi, but didn't say the same thing to Levi in his post #708.

My town mindset. (:

I'm so glad you are trying to direct attention for me for lurking when I feel that you are constantly jumping into arguments and then laying back as they take off into fireworks.

I LOL'd so hard
Bit of a filler post as you just literally agreed yet went wish-washy afterwards.


I tend to get twitchy and paranoid and panicky as town rather than scum.

I'm going to do a pretty list of anything that gives me a gut "town" read of Adam.
Uno
Dos
Tres

&&&&TLDR&&& (Or something to that nature)

I'm getting twitchy posts from Levi lately. He's no longer much of a town read as it was before the game started. Weak scum read.
I'm going to watch ProHawk, I don't trust him. Leaning scum.
Adam has become a town read.
PM a town read.
Bork is a mild-town read.
Not really sure what to make of Guille.
Mantis is a weak town read. I want to watch for caution though.
Shrimp is town.

@Jiffy:

[ProHawk]

Mala, your links dont work, can you fix them please?

[Malakittens]

WTF is this shit, I worked so hard on it for it not to work.
Even my pretty picture doesn't appear.

Jiffy go fix that.

[Malakittens]

I don't even. -_-

[Majiffy]

Fucking I am not here to fix your stupid shit.

Are all the links broken or just a few?

[Malakittens]

None of them work.

Just fix the picture. Once I get done being annoyed I'll fix the links in a row.

[Majiffy]

Done.

[Adam-12]

None of them go to the right place it seems. They are all formatted correctly however.

[Adam-12]

Maybe a second post with just the links all lined up and correctly directed.

[Adam-12]

@Mala: Are you still processing or are you all caught up?

[Malakittens]

I'm caught up. I'm still annoyed at the forums. That shit took me a while.

[pirate mollie]

hey mala what does jmt's stand for?

also your

My town mindset. (:

with link looks supremely scummy cos it is a psychology piece I think the analogy is a shit sandwitch. not calling you shit or anything like it I quite like you! a lot. but what I mean is that you are placing yourself as town in a link that is in the middle of your long post (expects a but it is only chronological order response) and typically when scum do lists the obvscum reads of scum are in the middle. that you are placing yourself in here as town is scummy, classic scum. (this does not apply when you are going down the order of a player list this is why some people will ask ranking of scummiest to town).

I still think levi did a scumslip guys!!!! but I like xir too.

[Adam-12]

What is the bloody point of asking him what other games he likes?

It will depend on the games he mentions but it boils down to the same thing: He plays those games to win.

The same spirit should be applied here so he can drop the "tip-toe through the tulips" playstyle and start looking for scum to WIN.

[Malakittens]

My links don't currently work. We have established that.

JMT = Jedi Mind Trick

Also, I'm sorry, but my post was a train of thoughts. They aren't in any order. What I was going off by reading the pages.

[leviathan93]

Re: 625 - Who cares if you "claimed" town? You are by no means confirmed and have provided us with little to base reads on. If scum is smart you will live a long and fruitful life until we lynch you, you improve your play, or we win. I am not even going to go down the road of explaining why keeping you around to LYLO with your current play is certain death for us.

Levi, are you afraid to call people scum, point out scum tells & vote for them?

Did you or your scum buddy get lynched in your scum game?

The goal is to discover the "scum thinking" in people's posts. It won't be as obvious as saying "I am scum" but things that indirectly say the same thing. Your reads post #628 is no improvement at all because you have everyone listed as town or null. Granted this game is more difficult than your standard newbie game as most players are experienced in this thread but you need to upgrade your honesty, aggression & confidence levels to the point where you can effectively scum hunt.

Posting a full game of town reads means you are doing it wrong.

What games do you enjoy playing besides Mafia?

Yes, I am afraid to call people scum. I don't really trust myself with scum tells or voting as i feel very new to the site. This being said I don't feel I am reading people very well and my analysis and reasons are very lacking because of it.
i know that i have everyone almost listed as town or null. I know that i have people feeling more town than others and thats what I kind of am going off of for who scum is or not. and yes, i do know this, but i feel that will come with the more games i play and the more players I play with and learn their style. and i know that much. =P i just felt like if I ever have a thought on the game that i should put it out there for people to look at and mull over and see if it helps any. less information won't help us, but more information is always better I feel in the long run.

and i don't understand your games question. also as for a language it is tied for my first.

[leviathan93]

@mala it wasn't being a kiss up. it was being truthful. borky made valid points. I agree with those points and thought they were logical. I like logic and reason. especially in this game because why would scum want to use logic and reason other then to throw people off their trail. the more logic someone uses the more it can be torn apart and figured out to see if it is true or not. I believe scum can be found that way.

and i know how you feel about my claim. whether its helpful or not I want to find this out for myself. plus I also don't understand your fact that if I claimed why doesn't everyone believe me? huh? it could have been pointless and it just gives you a little bit to go off of. i feel that I will either get killed during the night now or kept alive to try to maybe throw you guys off the trail and lynch me yourselves while they kill y'all other innocents during the night.

[Malakittens]

Okay first off scum can use logic just as much as town.

It's not helpful. I can tell you right now it's not helpful. Take that one piece of advice from someone who has been playing mafia for years. It's one of the worst things you can do in a role game. People can believe you, but you don't understand how it hurt more than it helped. No, it gives scum more to go off of not town which is why it's not helpful. The more I'm reading your posts I'm Thinking scum slips. I love how you are so confident that you'll get NK just because you claimed.

Do you think I'm scum?

[leviathan93]

yes, thats why i said they would use logic to try to throw others off their trail. but they have to be good with that logic or they will make a scumslip. and ok ok, i get it. you are making your point. you don't believe in claiming. well, I'm trying something here thats my own little strategy of sorts and so I want to really see what will happen and how it will go. if you by i don't understand how much it can hurt you mean making it easier for the scum to target the pr's then i get it. and ok, you get slips? i don't understand how. but ok then. and i'm not so much as confident that I will get night killed as in that i'm more confident that if that doesn't happen then i feel you guys will decide to lynch me in oncoming days.

and honestly, no i don't think you're scum. I think you have been very helpful in this game. this could be that you can easily deceive me, me being new and all, but i personally believe this time i'm not wrong about someone. i believe you and adam to be the biggest town reads I have at the moment. prohawk coming in third, but still little iffy on that.

[Malakittens]

"Can you take this lonely girl?
I pick her up from off the ground
'cause theres no pride, to be found
When you follow sheep around
And no future here, no future
For us in this town"

vote: Levi

Reason: inconsistent reads. Called me town in this post.
Yet the way I'm reading the end of this posthe has me clearly labeled in a scum mindset.

So:

Anti-town behavior. Claiming early. Helps scum out more than town.
Inconsistencies. (Oh man coming from me this is so

not

funny)
Labeling things in a scum mindset.

[leviathan93]

you're really confusing me here. =/ i have called you town all game minus one or two posts claiming that either you are really good at fooling me or you are town like I feel you are. labeling things in a scum mindset? what does that mean? that I am cautious and trying to think things through and trying to think how scum would act so we can best monitor their movements and see who they are? thats like total pro town behavior or maybe i'm just stupid. how do i clearly label you as scum? FOR THE LAST TIME I DO NOT THINK YOU"RE SCUM!

[Malakittens]

Okay. Just because you have me as a town read doesn't mean I see you in the same light. Labeling things in a scum mindset means that your word choice to me has your mind made up I'm scum.

[Adam-12]

k.

remember the post where you said that scum might boil down to levi and guille

.

and then i agreed with you.. and shouted out to adam that he should vote one of those 2.

later on, i got to thinking that levi and guille were both somewhat inactive at that point, and i retracted my comment about both them being scum, since it seems as though at least one scum member would probably be putting in more effort. in other words, i got thinking that

both

were somewhat easy lynches[/u].

do you agree with me on this?

erm,

I entertained the idea that guille was town

a while ago did you not read my posts I was badgering hawk boy about how likely it was that scum would look back on previous games. he said yeah they would but when have we ever seen scum do this.

I seriously don't like this post at all.

Notice how she selectively answered Mantis' question (underlined), clearly avoiding mentioning Levi at all; notice that Mantis' question was about

easy lynches

(bolded).

Why didn't she mention Levi? Why didn't she answer the question completely? She didn't mention Levi because he

IS

an easy lynch.

When I examine the rest of what she

does

say and I see the following formula:

Selective Answer

(I said Guille was townie looking) +

Accusation/Misrep

(You haven't been reading my posts = scummy) +

Buddying

(When have WE ever seen scum look up posts) =

SCUMMY MANIPULATION

So far while catching up I have found other things that I didn't like about Mollie's defense & posts (e.g. inadequate scum perfume defense) which I will compile after my catch-up but I can see that she is far scummier than anyone else in this room.

I am watching Code-Bork & I find it absolutely bizarre that he is pulling off a "starting the game where he lands" move like he is but, he does seem to be doing it. So, good at least he has a heartbeat.

I will be posting my analysis of all players once I am done catching up; I am only 3 pages back now.

Unvote, Vote Mollie

[leviathan93]

I never argued that it didn't. what i'm arguing about is the fact that you think i have a scum read on you. I don't. I never did. I'm not throwing out the possibility but i'm trying to trust my gut here and it says you are innocent. think of me as scum all you want. that's not really my concern. my concern is catching actual scum and I see no point in arguing with you since I already made my claim and don't have much else to say on the matter.