Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Legacy (Game Over)

[Yates]

Fun fact: Tammy was scum.

Incorrect. Tammy was NOT scum. Tammy was 3rd party. There *IS* a difference. Scum wouldn't target themselves [barring multiball] whereas 3rd party HAS to target scum to win. Therefore, 3rd party has as much information as Town and is almost equally committed to finding scum - effectively making them more like Town than Scum. So your argument that Zab is scum because Tammy was "scum" is not only baseless but flat out wrong.

I'll just assume your super mature posted image on this topic is equally well thought out:

OK, then I won't respond to your semantic argument.

So you have no rational response for explaining why you said "I am PGO" "Don't call me PGO" "Thanks for verifying I am PGO?" That's cool. You understand why this isn't a semantic argument, right? And you understand that being squirrely about your claim like this makes you less likely to be Town, right?

You could always just, you know, conventionally scum-hunt. Like for example – do you think every single person on the Day 1 mislynch was Town?

Was there some portion of this post from early in the day that was unclear or confusing?

I don't think being right or wrong about Tammy flipping SK is an alignment tell nor do I think scum were all on or off of a certain wagon. If anything, with the division being the way it was, I would expect roughly half the team to be on and half to be off in order to avoid guilt by wagon analysis.

I'm also not seeing how Yates can avoid the DBZ logic of badplayYates = scumYates.

What exactly has been "bad play?" I understand you not being down for being the lynch target yesterday - self preservation and all. Outside of that, you haven't got a leg to stand on. My only "bad play" was not being able to rally enough support for an Acosmist lynch late in the day. And, to be frank, that is just as easily symptomatic of the activity level of certain people in this game coupled with replacements.

Maybe I'm just cranky today but all three of you are pissing me off and posting like you have never played this game before.

PE: Okay, I do agree that 1v1 is stupid and this thread needs to die.

[mykonian]

Why is the 1v1 a good thing? Please elaborate on your position and reasoning.

I don't speak about the fact that a 1v1 is good or bad.

Of course it's dumb

Come on. I make a point about doing short post, you can try to read them.

I have no clue about the mykonian case and i don't have the time nor the will to read enough to get a good opinion on it.

Now answer my question.

I can give you the short lines. The time after the claim of benmage, I posted a lot and was of the opinion that tammy was the town of the two. I stood out because of that. After the claim, I was the only one taking the position that it really didn't matter that much in general if you keep a SK alive or not: regardless of it, you gain lynches just because you cought her. When tammy pointed out I had made a counting error for some theory stuff, people didn't understand the numbers, and hence didn't understand my final shift off the wagon.

And obviously, it's nice if someone is so clearly odd, to abuse that. I won't go so far to call everybody on my wagon scum. Experience rather suggests there are town there. Because, it's hardly the first time I stand out in a game. MoI goes a step beyond that though, and goes straight for rhetoric, so I'm rather confident in calling him scum for that.

[Elscouta]

MoI, you claimed you'd 1v1 mastin tomorrow, but you are ignoring him now. Why?

I don't speak about the fact that a 1v1 is good or bad. Of course it's dumb. But claiming you'll go in a 1v1 then retracting your statement is the whole different thing.

Why did you claim you'd go in 1v1 THEN retract your statement.

I'd lose less time if you stopped dodging my question and blatantly misreading my posts.

[Yates]

And today, he's followed through, doing everything he can to avoid the 1V1.

Why?

Because he doesn't want to be lynched, which if he took the 1V1, he would, because I'm town and he's not.

Can you drop this, please? Not wanting to be lynched is a null tell. Why don't people understand this? This could be an argument if you KNEW MoI was scum, sure. But what if MoI is Town? Even if Town-MoI *THINKS* you are scum, he wouldn't know, right? So why would Town-MoI want to be on the hook for the next lynch simply for being wrong? That's anti-Town bs. Period.

If you want to lynch MoI, find a case built in actual logic and drop the 1v1 stuff.

[mykonian]

MoI, you claimed you'd 1v1 mastin tomorrow, but you are ignoring him now. Why?

I don't speak about the fact that a 1v1 is good or bad. Of course it's dumb. But claiming you'll go in a 1v1 then retracting your statement is the whole different thing.

Why did you claim you'd go in 1v1 THEN retract your statement.

I'd lose less time if you stopped dodging my question and blatantly misreading my posts.

You'd fucking win time if you stopped giving him more opportunities. Just vote the scum and be done with it.

[mykonian]

Short MoI case Yates.

I'm not so much into the insulting thing. I think he made himself rather obvious as scum the way he played. He discredited people (benmage, KK) for no reason, based on stuff they had done. He "cleverly" inserted this at points where saying such a thing might have an effect. And I guess you could call it OMGUS, but the way he argued towards me was decidedly scummy. I know how I used to play scum, and picking apart every post of a person and saying something scummy about each sentence does tend to get someone lynched in time. It's just not something a town would ever do, because it's completely unbelievable that scum would show themselves with every single sentence they make.

[AngryPidgeon]

Mastin...you scum?

This you v MoI back and forth is awfully waffly (even for you) and Im having trouble believing that town you would be 100% unwilling to compromise on the lynch right now.

Opinion on my Zab case? (Oh right, he was

buddying you, lurking and taking a waffly-as-shit stance on the Tammy wagon, buddying KK, actively doing something that might look less scummy,

obviously town for not voting Tammy). Now please ISO him (or read my case) and tell me you see town motivation in his D2 play.

P-edit: I hate you guys for walling during weekdays.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Why did you claim you'd go in 1v1 THEN retract your statement.

Learn to read for comprehension then because this was

ALREADY

answered. Here – I’ll be nice and quote it for you

Because I don't really care about a mastin and his 1v1. I basically humored him enough to get the Tammy lynch actually accomplished yesterday. I've already linked to another game where Klick wanted to go 1v1 with me.

.

So now that you have that (again) let’s get to answering some of these –

How does this conversation help you find scum?
What is your read on Mykonian?
Is this whole exchange just some cobbled together buzzword fest (I notice dodging thrown in when I clearly already had answered your question) that you are going to use as an excuse to vote me since you need some ‘justification’ otherwise it will look very scummy?

[AngryPidgeon]

Ya Elscouta is scum. Propagating this 1v1 and pushing MoI on a derp technicality is really awful. Especially since he said MoI is null / Mastin is scum just a few posts ago.

Elscouta, top 3 scumreads? If Mastin/MoI flip town today, would you push the other Tomorrow?

[Elscouta]

That's not a derp technicality. That's a fucking lie. Humoring? Since when did MoI need to humor Mastin to get the Tammy lynch done? Nothing that he could have told Mastin would have changed the outcome. The link is totally unrelated to changing stance. I don't care about whether a 1v1 is good or bad.

Guess what i was doing right now? Trying to turn my null read into a non-null read. And I have done so. Yeah i consider *both* scummy.

And can't you just iso me? I already posted my scumlist. Ascomists, snifit, mastin. You can add MoI now. Top3? I guess snifit gets 4th place.

[AngryPidgeon]

You honestly think that MoI/Mastin could both be scum?

[Elscouta]

No.

[mastin2]

Can you drop this, please? Not wanting to be lynched is a null tell.

1: Like hell it is.
As town, especially as a VT, sure, not being lynched is better than being lynched, but there's absolutely nothing which makes them unwilling to sacrifice themselves if they think they are contributing to a greater cause. Ergo, they have (or should have) zero fear of being mislynched outside of lylo, since their lynch gives information, cleans up the thread, makes them conftown and people can use the stances of the dead person. (This is much how I got Khan lynched in Desert Mafia--I lynched myself to lynch him. It makes sense in context.)

2: But this wasn't really the point of that post. MoI's showing a survivalistic attitude--again, very uncharacteristic of town. Town mentality is basically summed up as, "Well, I know I'm town, so I would

prefer

not to be lynched, but it's okay; the town can recover from my death, and it gives good info." MoI is showing quite the opposite, trying to avoid the lynch at all costs.

Mastin...you scum?

Not in a million years. MoI, however, is. And I refuse to drop my push on him. Over my dead body, in fact. Sure, I'll also vote for those who I think are his scumbuddies (Aco and Kise for a start), but I'm not going to push for their lynch; I'm not dropping MoI. I guarantee it; you can count on me to consistently push this through.

MoI is scum, who knows that I'm town. I know I'm on the right track with him, with Kise, with Aco.
You know I'm stubborn. I do not compromise unless it's on someone I also think is scum. (Okay, so I will even if I don't think they're scum, under one circumstance: if the dominant wagon is on someone I strongly believe to be town and/or useful to the town. As with Tammy yesterday.) I'm not backing down now. I'm not changing my reads.
(By the way, I'm absolutely convinced the messenger is town. I kinda got the impression they assumed their name would be sent with the message, even though it's anonymous. Their list of reads to me does look like town as well, so when the messenger does claim, they're conftown. And as a hint, they're not anybody I've been pushing.)

[AngryPidgeon]

(By the way, I'm absolutely convinced the messenger is town. I kinda got the impression they assumed their name would be sent with the message, even though it's anonymous. Their list of reads to me does look like town as well, so when the messenger does claim, they're conftown. And as a hint, they're not anybody I've been pushing.)

inb4 messenger is MoI. that would be sweet sweet sugary lolz.

How is MoI being survivalistic? He is shoving a scum read wagon. I mean...I GUESS that could be a way to divert attention as scum, but its also a way for town to get their scumreads lynched. So that is a poor argument if it is your argument.

[AngryPidgeon]

Wait who got the message last night? It was MoI wasnt it? derp. Oh well, would have been hilarious.

[Acosmist]

...no. Pay attention.

[AngryPidgeon]

Oh. Right it was Mastin.

In fact, he narrowed the messenger pool down really hardcore with is post just now. Lol.

[pappums rat]

Votecount 3.2

"As I told you, Mr. Potter, naughty children deserve to be punished." -Dolores Umbridge, Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix

mykonian - 3 (Kise, MagnaofIllusion, AngryPidgeon)
MagnaofIllusion - 2 (mykonian, mastin2)
zabriel - 1 (Acosmist)

Not voting - zabriel, WrathChild, PeregrineV, pidgey, Yates, jasonT1981, snifit, Elscouta, Nero Cain, Kublai Khan

Nero Cain, mastin2, and PeregrineV are V/LA.
Kublai Khan is V/LA until Thursday.

Searching for a replacement for snifit.

With 16 alive it takes 9 to lynch.

The deadline for Day 3 is 9 PM EST on November 30, 2012.

[jasonT1981]

I am going to go with what I have been thinking for a good part of this game

vote:Zab

Yates 2400 was pretty interesting, I still maintain Zab/Acos could have a link due to Zebs soft defending early in the game.

[pidgey]

This game is fkn hard to get a read on. TWO SCUM THEORY is pretty much out of the window with 1 kill in 2 nights and the only scum not flipping with a name besides "scum".

Jason: Still yet to aknowledge that he casually voted me yesterday because of meta that HE KNOWS IS FALSE WAT? He voted me cause i raged a lot yet he has moded me in two town games where, if you see for yourself, you'd see just how ridiculous his vote is.

Moi/Mastin: I've come to convince myself that mastin is probably town. I've seen scum mastin and he was never this.... i dont want to say Pushy because its more than that, but yeah. His claim was stupid too. MoI im still not sure but his case on myk makes so much sense and its what ive been pointing out for a while. I've gone for 1v1s challenges a lot of my town mafia career so i dont know what to take of it, since this is mostly a thing done as a resource. I dunno, I dont like that you both keep tunneling each other. Scum might be elsewhere.

Myk: Still scummy and the fact that he is now not as loud as d2 seems to me as if he wants to go unnoticed.

Elscouta: Still think that one of him or myk is scum. Still leaning on myk right now. At least he realized he was dumb on his magical read on me.

Yates: The Most Townie In The Game.

Zabriel: Horrible player that had no problem to just come and Bandwaggon me with ANY sort of previouc comment before or DURING his stupid bandwagoning. For all i know he is a VI but i certainly wouldnt give a damn to lynch his ass.

AP: Still looks helpful and if he is scum then he will have to go down due to POE anyway at some point, since he is giving reads. Prob town! GO BIRDS.

Acomist: Ive honestly never seen a real PGO, only seen ok scum claim it and make it to lylo and TERRIBAD town claiming it as Vanilla to "Scumhunt for the win", with terrible results. Still, this slot gives me the creeps.

Snifit: Dunno, he looked kinda town before replacing out. We shall see.

Nero: Needs to play. V/La and all but i kinda have him as town so yeah.

Kise: Im puzzled with this slot and i honestly have not ISOed him like i said i would. I want to do that to get a better idea. Kinda like him just because he was the only one making sense when people wanted to lynch me for stupid reasons. And he clearly sees what's wrong with myk too.

WC: Skating kinda. Want to see more. GUYS ANSWER: Why did many had a scum read on BC?

KK: Kinda on the same category as Kise. Want to iso him to get a better idea, too.

[Yates]

As town,

especially as a VT

, sure, not being lynched is better than being lynched, but there's absolutely nothing which makes them unwilling to sacrifice themselves if they think they are contributing to a greater cause.

Which is exactly why you should drop it.

In other news - was there anything of value in the message you received? Are you able to post the message without putting anyone in danger?

[AngryPidgeon]

So your argument that Zab is scum because Tammy was "scum" is not only baseless but flat out wrong.

I wasn't making that argument. I was just being cheeky. But I do still want him to explain why he thinks that Acosmist needs to go before lylo. With original thought. I feel like hes just parroting a popular opinion. And I want him to explain why he believes it (other than Tammy holding the same opinion).

Wasn't it you QQing about people answering questions for others earlier this game?

And who gives a shit about Acosmist once saying that he isnt _technically_ an exact PGO. Do you honestly think that was a slip? If Acosmist corrected someone every time they called him a PGO, I'd policy lynch the shit out of him for being annoying.

[PeregrineV]

Acomist scum reads: Anyone that suspects him.

Mastin is intelligible and making sense, so most likely town. Also feel town on Elcouta, mykonian, maybe Yates (yes, still mad).

ISO Mastin today and point out where anything non-MoI is incorrect. Scum want a town dayvig dead all the time. Tammy offering to kill for town means scum want her dead.

Feel like town MoI would agree in a 1v1 with Mastin, while continuning to argue with anyone else about everything. I feel like that is his normal scumhunting style and right now he's phoning it in or faking it.
But, on the off-chance he is town, would prefer to keep him around another day or two, for now.

@Angry- Compare zab this game to Zab here. The play seems not the same, so first inclination is that alignment not the same.

Remember, BC is scum too.

Vote: WrathChild

[AngryPidgeon]

@Angry- Compare zab this game to Zab here. The play seems not the same, so first inclination is that alignment not the same.

Why so? And you know that I don't do meta cases. Or do you? I don't do meta cases.

And Mastin is not making sense >.>

His MoI push is 90% of what he has been posting and his MoI case is at the least desperate and at the most scum.

Read on Mykonian? Read on Acosmist?

[PeregrineV]

@Angry- Compare zab this game to Zab here. The play seems not the same, so first inclination is that alignment not the same.

Why so? And you know that I don't do meta cases. Or do you? I don't do meta cases.

And Mastin is not making sense >.>

His MoI push is 90% of what he has been posting and his MoI case is at the least desperate and at the most scum.

Read on Mykonian? Read on Acosmist?

No meta. Fine.

Scum motivation for scum-Mastin to carry on in an attempt to lynch town-MoI when he can focus all his juice on an easier target and just NK MoI. Doctor is obvious non-existent or complete moron.

Mykonian coming across as town, but haven't read his predessor recently.

Acomist could be town if he does any scumhunting. All his scumreads are people calling him scum and/or for his lynch.