Well, I reread the thread, and then I reread the thread again, and then a third time.
Overall thoughts:
Jack, Lowell, Slaking Master: When people mentioned you two, I thought "Who?" Please lend us your thoughts as to who is mafia as of now.
Sailor Jerry: Seems too defensive for me (FOS: Sailor Jerry). Won't vote on you due to cop claim, but please calm down.
Bird11111: I don't know, he's starting to look suspicious to me now, he's posting a lot but his posts don't have much of a substance to it - and by substance I mean who he thinks looks suspicious to him - on page 6 all he's done is state and ask the obvious about the cop claim as though he really, really needed to make sure. Oh, and there's that nice post Mert made that seems to implicate him a bit.
That's all.
Vote: Bird11111
...whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.
SJ, sorry if I'm the one who caused that bandwagon on you (that is, I'm sorry if you're telling the truth). I liked my reason, though.
What I
don't
like is the bandwagonning idiocy that has carried the entire action of this game. Twice now people have blindly followed my votes. Somehow I get the blame for this? Stupid.
unvote, VOTE JACK
Yeah, I voted SJ for lurking in plain sight. It is what scum tend to do. I don't believe it is what I've done, as clearly I've twice been the first person on an ill-directed "bandwagon." My reason was legitimate, Jack's scapegoating is not.
I'm always suspicious of people who backlash against a bandwagon on a cop. The cop, probably, is going to investigate one of the idiots on his wagon, so I find it curious that Jack is so eager to win back SJ's favor by assaulting his accusers.
You're not definately guilty, but it's certainly enough to earn you a vote.
Eh, I don't have much opinion on bird, boo, or any of the other frequent posters. I can read again if you really think I'm going to find anything.
For the record, I believe SJ's claim. I think it would be dumb to claim cop as a scum day 1. More logical would be to claim doc if that were the case. A false cop claim can be counterclaimed. If we then lynch the right scum, the cop is essentially verified, ensured protection from the doc, and the scum are down a member and on their way to being routed. Not likely to happen.
I was merely pointing out that you were acting the same as SJ and by suspecting him you were saying that you yourself were acting guilty.
Also, what's with the bandwagon hating? Votes being piled up on certain people making you anxious? Lurking is what's bad, bandwagoning gives us information. Too much information in the case of SJ, personally I think he should have kept his mouth shut. If people are voting you for lurking then start posting more, don't claim.
To state myself more clearly: Lowell, I voted you to get you to post more. Lurking isn't inherently suspicious, it's just bad for the town because no one can get a read on you. Now that you are posting I find what your saying to be suspicious so I'm keeping my vote.
To me, protesting the "bandwagoning idiocy" that has generated all the posts in this game sounds an awful lot like one of your scumbuddies is on one of the wagons and you want him off. Perhaps
bird111
since you said his early wagon was bogus and are passively defending him in the post above.
Me'h, I'm not that great with logic. Shoot first and ask questions later, I say.
Seriously, though, I don't think its that illogical. Not the most impressive reason anyone has ever voted for anyone else, perhaps, but good enough for me at this stage. Of course, feel free to blame me again if a bandwagon forms in the next 30 minutes.
Actually it's not as bad as I thought; this is a different format from newbie game, is their a guaranteed doctor? My thinking was that the mafia would just kill jerry and not care who he investigated.
I'm curious what you think about the rest of my post.
Wacky wrote:Well, I reread the thread, and then I reread the thread again, and then a third time.
Overall thoughts:
Bird11111: I don't know, he's starting to look suspicious to me now, he's posting a lot but his posts don't have much of a substance to it - and by substance I mean who he thinks looks suspicious to him - on page 6 all he's done is state and ask the obvious about the cop claim as though he really, really needed to make sure. Oh, and there's that nice post Mert made that seems to implicate him a bit.
You want to know whether you can kill me tonight right?
With regards post 148, it was an attack on Eon, not Lowell.
With regards post 149, rest assured that I expect a good result on you
M4yhem - "IH loves donking his splourney in public places. He likes it most when little old ladies and school children are nearby, because then he also show off his crot."
Ok, at the risk of stating the obvious and being accused of "directing the doc", the doc NEEDS to protect SJ tonight.
@Jack- to answer your other question, I don't really care one way or the other about Bird, Boo, or whoever else. I said that all the wagons were started for more or less bogus reasons, and I still believe that's the case. Just as they're not all guilty, I find it improbable that they're all innocent. If you want to tell me why you think I'm wrong instead of trying to lure out the power roles, be my guest.
pff I don't know what you're talking about. I was explaining why I thought Lowell's reason for voting me was bogus. After saying that, I realized I might have made an incorrect assumption about roles and asked a question. Role fishing = nonsense. What, was I supposed to be hoping that someone would say "Yup! I'm the doctor!"? Give me a break.
I would like to say that after rereading all the posts, I now realise that Wacky was being a smartass, so I want to apologise for getting that wagon started in the first place.
Now I would like someone to educate me on this claiming nonsense, since I can't make sense of it.
First people pile on the bandwagon on Wacky and once he hits five votes he "claims" to be vanilla townie. What has that accomplished? Well, it seems that people no longer consider him a target except for Boo, who thinks that lynching vanilla townie is better than lynching super townies.
Next, we get Sailor Jerry up to five votes and he "claims" to be a cop. Now everyone piles off of the bandwagon on Jerry and we're off to the next suspect.
Now I ask, what have we accomplished by forcing "claims"?
We "know" that Wacky is vanilla townie. But, he could be lying. Maybe he didn't want to admit that he's really mafia or maybe he didn't want to admit to any special powers to avoid being targeted by the mafia.
We "know" that Jerry is a cop. Now he's a big target for the mafia and if he dies tonight, he won't be able to do anything for us. He could also be lying. Maybe he's mafia or maybe he's a martyr and is willing to take one for the team so that the real cop stays alive longer.
Sorry for the long post, but I don't think I really learned anything of value from their claims.
Lowell wrote: think it would be dumb to claim cop as a scum day 1. More logical would be to claim doc if that were the case. A false cop claim can be counterclaimed. If we then lynch the right scum, the cop is essentially verified, ensured protection from the doc, and the scum are down a member and on their way to being routed.
The cop has to investigate real scum for a counterclaim in the way you describe. That's not the only problem with your assertion. There are some easy ways to avoid detection.
Let's assume SJ is scum. All he has to do is "investigate" a mafia buddy as vanilla townie. We'll believe the cop and not lynch his buddy. We lynch a townie and that night another townie bites the dust. We've now lost two townies and we still have no reason to doubt our cop friend. All the while, whichever doc we have is still wasting his time "saving" the good cop. If the next day he decides to call a townie mafia, we lynch the townie, realise our mistake and suffer another night with a death. Now we're down four townies in two days/nights before we finally get our 'cop' and then we're back into another night. 5:1 is not a bad ratio for the scum...
I'm not trying to assail Jerry here. I just want to make it clear that just because it's day one, it doesn't mean he's telling the truth.
I still think that Boo has pushed aggressively for a couple of lynches, but his demeanor has softened with the last few posts. I'm still going to keep my
FoS
on
Boo
.
Lowell seemed concerned about the wagons growing rapidly and fizzling out just as quickly. I didn't see that anything came of his "investigation."
HackerHuck wrote:I would like to say that after rereading all the posts, I now realise that Wacky was being a smartass, so I want to apologise for getting that wagon started in the first place.
Now I would like someone to educate me on this claiming nonsense, since I can't make sense of it.
First people pile on the bandwagon on Wacky and once he hits five votes he "claims" to be vanilla townie. What has that accomplished? Well, it seems that people no longer consider him a target except for Boo, who thinks that lynching vanilla townie is better than lynching super townies.
Next, we get Sailor Jerry up to five votes and he "claims" to be a cop. Now everyone piles off of the bandwagon on Jerry and we're off to the next suspect.
Now I ask, what have we accomplished by forcing "claims"?
We "know" that Wacky is vanilla townie. But, he could be lying. Maybe he didn't want to admit that he's really mafia or maybe he didn't want to admit to any special powers to avoid being targeted by the mafia.
We "know" that Jerry is a cop. Now he's a big target for the mafia and if he dies tonight, he won't be able to do anything for us. He could also be lying. Maybe he's mafia or maybe he's a martyr and is willing to take one for the team so that the real cop stays alive longer.
Sorry for the long post, but I don't think I really learned anything of value from their claims.
Both of you claimed rather quickly without having been asked by anyone to do so. To refresh your memories, Wacky, you had five votes on you, SJ, you had four. I think Hacker has a point somewhere along the line. You've both claimed and you've both had your wagons dropped for the time being but nobody's really given you a grilling on what prompted you to claim in the first place.
So, a direct question to both of you - why did you feel the need to claim when you did? Please go into detail about your thought process that led to the claim and what your feelings are now that you have claimed.
Okay so in that post there are very interesting words
Now I would like someone to educate me on this claiming nonsense, since I can't make sense of it.
Next, we get Sailor Jerry up to five votes and he "claims" to be a cop. Now everyone piles off of the bandwagon on Jerry and we're off to the next suspect.
So wait cop had to stay silent after getting 5 votes? People joined to vote against him because he was tasty at that moment but now he is even more interesting victim for night. Maybe he told that because we have 2 cops but you never know.
Maybe its me but that post looked so, "Wolf in Sheep's Hide" I never looked at Wacky being scummy and even after that his claim i dont think he is suspicios. Yet you try to get attention back on him. Maybe its me and you simply try to get this case solved. But note i didnt put vote on hacker, i dont know who it is just all that sounded weird
I claimed because that's the way Day 1 mafia bandwagons worked. Weak bandwagon on someone, if it gets close to lynch they claim, unless they are mafia and claim something really stupid the bandwagon evaporates. If you don't claim, town or mafia you'll get pressured, look suspicious, and might get lynched. Being lynched will reveal your role anyway, and is always disadvantageous to your side. Therefore, I always claim when close to a lynch, regardless of the strength of the case against me, and regardless of my alignment. Which in this case is town, but I'm also talking about Sailor Jerry here, who I find just a little suspicious.
And it's not like I'm a doctor or anything, so harm in claiming minimal.
But I haven't played mafia in 8 months, so things might have changed, but that's just the way day 1 informational bandwagons work.
HackerHuck: You are wrong. You are right about how the claims do not mean much at this stage because people can and do lie. But you are wrong that there is nothing to learn of value. A day, two days from now, you should find Day 1 to be an absolute goldmine. Pretty much half the mistakes mafia make (that I have noticed) in a mini-game happen on day 1. I think it has something to do with how they're still settling into their role.
...whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.
So did you feel pressured into claiming or was it more that claiming is just the done thing so you did so? Or was it more that you thought "meh, I'm just vanilla so there's not going to be any real harm?"
What do you think about Jerry's claim, anyway? Do you think that four votes was too early for a power-role to claim when he wasn't asked to or do you think it's similar to your own reasoning?
Wacky wrote:A day, two days from now, you should find Day 1 to be an absolute goldmine.
Sorry for the double post, but I agree with the above. I'm a big fan of long first days, personally (although I know not everybody agrees with me). You may go around in circles a bit and it may seem like nothing's really getting achieved but when it comes to a few days from now, the information from nightkills all suddenly starts to make some sense when referenced back to Day One.
