Mini 1372 - Over

[N]

Oh, I missed that bit. Whoops.

[Sable Tip]

Wow, that’s a lot of craplogic from Dunham.

Okay, well in that case.

It seems disadvantageous to me for Sable to bother making another kill in this game. Especially since whoever he claims to be JKing that night will then be confirmed town.

So. Here are some reasons why Sable is the last scum.

Let’s look at each of these in turn:

1. Bussed Guppy hard at the start of D1.

So your first point against me is that I voted someone I found scummy?

For the record, the “hard bussing” consisted of:

Prof Guppy definitely seems off to me – second post is way too early for a claim, especially one like VT. Benmage has already covered most of this, but it’s worth mentioning that Guppy seems almost antagonistic to me in how he’s talking about his claim.

Vote: Prof Guppy

You seem a little too on-edge here for my liking.

If that's hard bussing, I figure basically any vote ever (aside from one explicitly described as random) is hard bussing.

2. Easily the least active player alive.
3. Posts mainly in walls and makes those nuisance-y lists.

So… You’re annoyed at me for not posting much and for posting as much as I do? I can only reliably make one or two posts per day, so I make sure they count by looking at a number of different things simultaneously or considering a particular issue in detail.

I can only presume that you want me to post more in a given day (which I cannot reliably do, anyways) but when I do, to post a less thorough analysis and to not explain myself clearly. I wonder why a townie would want me to do that.

4. Has thusly managed to avoid the attention of the very slapfight-prone townies, alive and dead.

This one actually made me laugh. You’re saying the fact that no-one seemed to find me scummy for most of the game is evidence that I’m scum?

Set-Up-Based

: 1. I cannot think of a scum PR that would single-handedly balance the game against a Tracker, Jailkeeper, and Neighborizer. It simply doesn't exist.

This I can’t argue. Certainly the game seems skewed quite a bit towards town. This doesn’t actually say anything about me, though, only about the mod. Unless you can provide a reason why it would have made sense for me to fakeclaim Jailkeeper there?

WIFOM Based

: 1. Spent the latter part of yesterday "confirming" N as town and

then accusing Slandaar of being the scummiest player to the point of requesting that he claim before me

. After learning that I considered Slandaar to be obvtown, decides to JK me instead of Slandaar without giving any justification. Note especially that he selected a formerly scummy player to clear that we weren't likely to lynch on the heels of his (N's) involvement in the Guppy lynch. (Clearing Robb, for instance, doesn't necessarily lead to N's lynch the way that clearing N more or less directly led to Robb's.)

This is false. I did not actually accuse Slandaar of being scummier than you; I made my reason for wanting Slandaar to claim first perfectly clear:

I don't like it when people ask for a massclaim and put themselves at the bottom of the list unless they're effectively confirmed innocent.

My logic for jailkeeping you instead of Slandaar is equivalent – at that point, N was cleared, so it came down to you or Slandaar to jail. You wanted me to jail Slandaar:

If he flips town jail Sland. That is all.

And Slandaar wanted me to jail him:

Jail me Sable.

So I said to myself “One of Dunham and Slandaar is scum, the other is (presumably) telling the truth about being a VT. Both want me to jail Slandaar. If I do, I am doing what the scum wants, and presumably there is a reason they want that, so I should go against the scum’s wishes and jail Dunham instead.”

I would still no-lynch for a night to see what kind of staring contest we could get in to. But the chances that N is a permanent strongman/used his 1-shot strongman on N2 for whatever reason or that Slandaar would have no-killed last night seem so infinitesimally small compared to the case against Sable that I can't imagine voting for anybody else.

I agree that N is almost certainly not a strongman of any sort, and I consider him confirmed at this point, but I find it surprising that you’re so dead-set against the possibility that Slandaar is scum. I figure either you’re town who’s got heavy tunnel-vision and is using craplogic to support said tunnel-vision, or you’re scum trying to make me out to be scummier than I am because you can’t simply kill me and think that I’m a comparatively easy lynch.

And frankly, I’ve been leaning to you being scum for a while. After that post, I’m almost certain of it.

VOTE: Dunhamganger

Sable, who do you plan on jailkeeping tonight?

Dunham. I think that the reason we haven't had a nightkill is that I've stopped Dunham from killing, and I see no reason to change that policy.

[Dunhamganger]

See, if you were actually the town JK, I would have expected you to advance that theory much earlier today. This is actually the first time you've even put it so simply. The only motivation not to at least bring up the possibility is to play politics, which is solely a scum motivation in lylo.

(By "hard bussing" I meant that you appear to cut ties with Guppy very early, not that you pushed incredibly hard for his lynch. Your posts at the beginning of D2 advance this theory, a la 166, where you posit three different possible scum groups, take pains to call Guppy "dumb" over and over, and then vote him.)

[Slandaar]

I guess Ben didn't neighbour anyone then

N want to conf town me?

[N]

How?

[Slandaar]

Nevermind it doesn't actually work

Forgot from your POV Sable could be town and jail me if I lynched Dunham and he flipped town hence I as scum don't hammer Dunham anyway.

[N]

VOTE: no lynch

I don't except much more to happen today.

[Dunhamganger]

Vote: No lynch

. In case I'm not already.

[Papa Zito]

nagle nagle I'm tired of looking these things up

Second Votecount of Day 4

1. Slandaar (0):
4. Sable Tip (0):
5. N (0):
9. Dunhamganger (1): Sable Tip
x. No Lynch (2): Dunhamganger, N

Players not voting: Slandaar

With 4 players alive, it takes 3 votes to lynch.
Deadline: October 20th @ 11:59PM CST

[Slandaar]

I thought 2 nolynch would be hammer

VOTE: No Lynch

[Papa Zito]

Everyone goes to sleep.

HOW BORING

Final Votecount of Day 4

1. Slandaar (0):
4. Sable Tip (0):
5. N (0):
9. Dunhamganger (1): Sable Tip
x. No Lynch (3): Dunhamganger, N, Slandaar

Players not voting:

It is now Night 4. Actions are due by October 9 @ 11:59PM CST.

[Papa Zito]

Guess what happened last night?

I bet you can't guess.

That's right, nothing.

First Votecount of Day 5

1. Slandaar (0):
4. Sable Tip (0):
5. N (0):
9. Dunhamganger (0):

Players not voting: Slandaar, Sable Tip, N, Dunhamganger

With 4 players alive, it takes 3 votes to lynch.
Deadline: October 30th @ 11:59PM CST

[Dunhamganger]

Okay fine.

Hey Sable, who'd you JK?

[N]

And we're back where we were before.

I hope Sable jailed Slandaar, otherwise what was the point?

[Slandaar]

Sablescum; do you feel no embarassment for these lame tactics at all?

[Sable Tip]

I jailed Dunham, just like I said I would. I think he's the scum, and I don't see why I would do anything but jail him here.

[Slandaar]

You ignored me?

[Sable Tip]

You ignored me?

There didn't seem to be anything to respond to, unless you think it's a lame tactic for me to jail someone when I'm pretty much certain they're scum.

[Slandaar]

Why did you think it a good idea to jail N whenever it was?

[Sable Tip]

Why did you think it a good idea to jail N whenever it was?

At the time, I felt that something was going on with Robb - that there was a good chance that he was scum, but that if he wasn't, he was probably a power role. I considered jailing Robb, but figured that if he was a power role, it was too likely that the whole scenario would lead to bad times if he started talking about their being a mafia roleblocker. At the time, I didn't think about the balance issue; if I had, it would have been obvious that there simply wouldn't be another townie power role in addition to me and the other two.

So I decided not to jail Robb. I then considered who to jail. I looked at who I felt was scummy besides Robb, and decided that based on the posts, N felt the most likely to be vanilla town if he wasn't scum. So I jailed him, reasoning that if he was scum I would have him bang to rights, and if he wasn't it was very unlikely that the town would self-destruct.

In retrospect, it was a mistake; I should have jailed Robb that night, and not second-guessed myself into not jailing the most suspicious player.

[Dunhamganger]

Wait.

At the time, I felt that something was going on with Robb - that there was a good chance that he was scum, but that if he wasn't, he was probably a power role.

You thought that there was a good chance that a 9-player game had

4 town power roles

?

That oughta be the final nail.

Vote: Sable Tip

.

[Dunhamganger]

whenever it was

Night 2. After Guppy flipped plain ol' goon.

[Sable Tip]

Wait.

At the time, I felt that something was going on with Robb - that there was a good chance that he was scum, but that if he wasn't, he was probably a power role.

You thought that there was a good chance that a 9-player game had

4 town power roles

?

That oughta be the final nail.

Vote: Sable Tip

.

Um,

literally

the sentence after the one you quoted:

At the time, I didn't think about the balance issue; if I had, it would have been obvious that there simply wouldn't be another townie power role in addition to me and the other two.

I understand why you quoted me so selectively there, though; you want to make me look as bad as possible because you think I'm the easiest lynch and you know that I'm not going to give you a chance to get another nightkill in.

[Slandaar]

Why was N most likely to be VT based on posts?

[Dunhamganger]

Wait.

At the time, I felt that something was going on with Robb - that there was a good chance that he was scum, but that if he wasn't, he was probably a power role.

You thought that there was a good chance that a 9-player game had

4 town power roles

?

That oughta be the final nail.

Vote: Sable Tip

.

Um,

literally

the sentence after the one you quoted:

At the time, I didn't think about the balance issue; if I had, it would have been obvious that there simply wouldn't be another townie power role in addition to me and the other two.

I understand why you quoted me so selectively there, though; you want to make me look as bad as possible because you think I'm the easiest lynch and you know that I'm not going to give you a chance to get another nightkill in.

Sort of like how if you listen to the prevailing opinion of the town and change your target you lose access to your perceived "easiest lynch?"

There is no town motivation to have targeted me again. There is also no town motivation to ever have paid little enough attention to not immediately dismiss the possibility of Robb being a PR. You are trying, rather badly, to retcon your D2 pressure of Robb and random choice of N to save face on the fact that you then turned around and pressured Robb again D3.