New York 146 Zach's Insane Mafia World (OVER)

[Magua]

Theory point: SK could have investigation immunity when not killing.

If I've assessed the situation correctly, then I don't mind a quicklynch personally. RedFF's flip would be useful in assessing things and I'll catch up overnight.

Magua what are your thoughts on the issue?

RedFF is scum who needs to die. The only reason for him to live was to keep Alice alive.

An SK who only shows up as guilty on Nights he kills is right out the window as far as I'm concerned, because any SK in that position would not have killed Yoshi last Night when several people thought he was a viable lynch.

I'm really hoping that redFF is simply the worst SK ever with his bodyguard claim, because that simplifies a lot for me. If he flips Mafia, then it's between you and Tammy and neither one of those positions makes much sense.

I'm fine with letting CES get caught up, but we're lynching redFF full stop.

[Magua]

So a further outline of my thoughts: if redFF is SK, hooray, fun happy times, etc, etc.

If redFF is Mafia, then it's either one of you.
On the one side, again I can't see Magna failing to kill three times, and I can't see him failing to kill Yoshi once Yoshi's role was known because Magna would be a high-priority investigation target.
On the other side, though I can see Snake flaking out from kills, it's mod-confirmed that Snake got a PM and responded to it during N...3?, so yeah.
If redFF does flip Mafia, I would probably lynch Magna before Tammy as the SK, but at least half of that is burden of proficiency on Magna's part.

As far as Mafia goes, if redFF is the SK, Nobody Special's slot is currently my top scumread. I have Jon_h61's replace-out as a slight towntell (Magna disagrees).

The more I think about it, the more I think MagnaofIllusion is SK. But it's academic, because red simply has to die, and if he flips SK then I'm happy to eat crow, and if he flips Mafia then I'm happy to give Magna the game in the prisoner's dilemma situation.

[Magua]

EBWOP: "either one of you" => "either one of MagnaofIllusion or Tammy"

[Nobody Special]

Magua: What if redFF flips town?

[Tammy]

If Red flips town we lose. If Red was town and knew that would happen, he'd be doing something today besides saying he'd give reads in a sec and not doing anything else. But town Red wouldn't have a reason not to protect Alice.

[havingfitz]

If Red flips town we lose. If Red was town and knew that would happen, he'd be doing something today besides saying he'd give reads in a sec and not doing anything else. But town Red wouldn't have a reason not to protect Alice.

Well we finally have confirmation that there is a SK with the 2nd kill last so if redFF by some unbelievable stroke of bad luck/circumstance happens to be town...I do not think we lose because there would still be two opposing anti town factions...and who knows what would happen with the potential for cross kills, etc.

Town can still win this.

But redFF has got to be the *#^@! SK so it's a non-issue.

If it isn't red and turns out to be MOI my jaw will hit the floor.

[Tammy]

A cross kill, or a dual-targeted kill would be the only way we could win this if Red's town by some chance. If there are two town kills tonight, we're down to four tomorrow. Say we hit the serial killer tomorrow, there's still one kill tomorrow night and that leaves two people on the final day. Town loses.

But, yeah, I really don't see a way that Red's town. I'll be pretty shocked too if he's not the serial killer.

[Tammy]

And redFF's flip seems like a prime source of information - the notion that MoI/redFF contains exactly one scum seems plausible to me, potential redFFSK implications on

DY's

alignment and there's a massive difference between redFFSK and redFFmafia in terms of what kind of outlook on the game mafia is likely to have.

Do you mean someone else there or am I misreading?

Nope! DY might be dead now but the SKflip->DYtown implication can still have influenced people's stances in the past.

Oh OK this makes sense *really slow sometimes*. Do you have any first impressions?

[Magua]

Magua: What if redFF flips town?

Then we lose, and postgame I can unequivocally blame redFF for the loss.

[Nobody Special]

So is red at L-1 now?

Are we ready to hammer, then?

[MagnaofIllusion]

I protected magua because I thought I could outWIFOM scum and they wouldn't risk killing me over alice. Eh fair enough If i get lynched. Who was DY gonna inspect, MoI? That's my bet for SK then.

VOTE: MagnaofIllusion

For those of you ruminating about redFF flipping Town let me show you the above -

That post NEVER, EVER comes from Town ...

VOTE: redFF

Yes we are NS ....

[MagnaofIllusion]

For the record if I bite it overnight hang either having or NS and if that doesn't end the game right there hang the other ...

[Nobody Special]

You won't. You're scum of some flavor. I just know it.

[MagnaofIllusion]

You won't. You're scum of some flavor. I just know it.

If I live we can certainly discuss tomorrow. I know 100% that you will be living to see Dawn since you are either scum or your regular VI self ...

[Tammy]

Can I hammer?

[MagnaofIllusion]

Can I hammer?

If he isn't already throw it.

CES has already said he doesn't care and will catch up overnight.

Magua, I and our mystery guest in the QT can hash things out post-flip.

[Tammy]

vote: CES

For OMGUS purposes...

Kidding.

unvote
vote:RedFF

[Magua]

Sneaking this in before twilight:

I said it before, and I'll say it again. The idea that the SK, who has to live to endgame, is going to claim bodyguard is just about the stupidest thing I've ever heard occurring in a Normal. Just about literally any other claim is better for an SK than bodyguard. Maybe Vengeful or Hated townie would be worse, but only barely.

Working in the redFF-as-SK favor is that two of the three Nights there was no SK kill redFF was jailed by Kamrun.

Working against it is...yeah, bodyguard claim. It just...doesn't...work.

So I hope that redFF flips SK. I really, really do, because it's the sanest of all the possibilities.

But if he doesn't, the remaining SK must be either Tammy or MagnaofIllusion, due to Yoshi's investigations, and I lean Magna in that case. Partner mafia would likely be Nobody Special or havingfitz, I believe.

If red does flip SK, I'm still looking at Nobody Special as mafia, with maybe Magna as partner, but it's jenky. Pretty certain that Tammy is town in the event that redFF flips SK -- that's really my strongest read in that case, and havingfitz would be my second strongest townread.

I expect to die tonight, so I neighborized Tammy last Night -- pretty much see no reason to hide that.

[havingfitz]

Yea! Scum flip, scum flip, scum flip.

Can I hammer?

Magua, I and our mystery guest in the QT can hash things out post-flip.

I forgot about the neighbor thing once Ghostlin was gone and Kamrum died. Was your participation in the ~neighborhood previously revealed? Does it matter who the mystery guest is? Anything of value for us non-neighbors to be made privy of?

Oh...and Yea! Scum flip, scum flip, scum flip.

[havingfitz]

Working in the redFF-as-SK favor is that two of the three Nights there was no SK kill redFF was jailed by Kamrun.

Working against it is...yeah, bodyguard claim. It just...doesn't...work.

So I hope that redFF flips SK. I really, really do, because it's the sanest of all the possibilities.

But if he doesn't, the remaining SK must be either Tammy or MagnaofIllusion, due to Yoshi's investigations, and I lean Magna in that case. Partner mafia would likely be Nobody Special or havingfitz, I believe.

If red does flip SK, I'm still looking at Nobody Special as mafia, with maybe Magna as partner, but it's jenky. Pretty certain that Tammy is town in the event that redFF flips SK -- that's really my strongest read in that case, and havingfitz would be my second strongest townread.

I expect to die tonight, so I neighborized Tammy last Night -- pretty much see no reason to hide that.

Hmm...sounds like a familiar tune. Too bad coming to this decision a day late cost us DY.

Why thank you.

I would agree...though I'm the only one considering you confirmed town so your potential NK is apparently no sure thing. In fact...what looks worse? You still being here tomorrow or the Almighty MOI (now that all the PRs are gone)?

[Magua]

Hmm...sounds like a familiar tune. Too bad coming to this decision a day late cost us DY.

I don't even want to get into a pissing match with you about why lynching redFF yesterday was the wrong move.

I would agree...though I'm the only one considering you confirmed town so your potential NK is apparently no sure thing. In fact...what looks worse? You still being here tomorrow or the Almighty MOI (now that all the PRs are gone)?

I'm all for not dying. I just don't expect that to occur, and who I neighborized didn't seem worth keeping secret.

[Magua]

More final thoughts:

If redFF flips SK: People who were trying to lynch DarthYoshi and/or discredit the idea that there was an SK are town. I remember MagnaofIllusion doing this specifically when I came in, so if redFF is the SK, MagnaofIllusion is almost assuredly town. Mafia knew that there was an SK from the N1 kill, and knew that they'd have to lynch that SK to win, and so they wouldn't be trying to do anything to dissuade that from occurring.

[Zachrulez]

Final vote count of day 6:

redFF - 4 (Magua, havingfitz, MagnaofIllusion, Tammy)
Tammy - 1 (Cogito Ergo Sum)
MagnaofIllusion - 1 (redFF)

Not Voting: (Nobody Special)

With 7 alive it's 4 to lynch.

Day 6 will end no later than Tuesday, May 1st at noon CST

[Zachrulez]

A blank stare comes over redff as the town quickly decides to lynch him. An ominous tone takes over the day as he accepts his fate without any struggle whatsoever. Even more surprising is that after it is done a search of his body yields a knife proving that redff was one of the bad guys you were looking for. But all is not what it seems. Then end draws ever closer and the town reluctantly retires to their homes for the long night ahead.

Redff

(Serial Killer)

lynched day 6.

Night 6 will end no later than Friday, April 20th at 10:30pm CST. Night actions not sent by then will be forfeited.

[Zachrulez]

So it was a bad night particularly for Magua, and it's not hard to figure that out when the townspeople gather to find a dozen or so gunshot wounds in him. It's really hard not to just throw up on the spot, as he seems to be more blood than man now. Have to put that behind you and find the rest of the bad guys though...

Magua

(Town Neighborizer)

killed night 6

Not voting: (havingfitz, MagnaofIllusion, Tammy, Cogito Ergo Sum, Nobody Special)

Day 7 shall end no later than Friday, May 4th at 11pm CST