Outwitted - Mini 1254 (Game Over)

[Zang]

Why did you claim?

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Why did you claim?

Because I was gonna murdalize him tonight/today.

Unvote; Vote: Llmarble

[Yosarian2]

Why did you claim?

Because not only was I at lynch -1, but the other wagon was going to collapse, AND the vig wanted to kill me.

I was really hoping I was going to be able to avoid being lynched without claiming, but it suddenly became impossible.

[Lurconis]

Motherfucker.

Well, isn't that awesome. The town is now 3 for 3 for wagons that out town power roles, since I am the tracker, and probably the only living town info role.

unvote

We are so fucked.

Only information I have is that either CES didn't do anything night 1, or else he is a scum who outbid me. Since I only used 1 point, that wouldn't have been hard. The way the tracker role works is that if I use any points, I find out what my target did if they were a town power role, but I have to spend more points then the scum do to see if they killed anyone.

Also, my role PM only talks about the scum nightkill and town power roles, so I'm pretty sure there aren't any scum power roles like scum doctor.

How long did that botched fake claim take?

Your role pm says you have to spend more points than the scum to see if they killed anyone? It doesn't say to track them? Since when does tracker see if someone killed someone, you see if they visited someone not what their power is. Unless you are suggesting Zoraster is modifying basic roles in addition to his special mechanics in which case can either of the other claimed town powerroles verify that?

[Yosarian2]

How long did that botched fake claim take?

Your role pm says you have to spend more points than the scum to see if they killed anyone? It doesn't say to track them? Since when does tracker see if someone killed someone, you see if they visited someone not what their power is. Unless you are suggesting Zoraster is modifying basic roles in addition to his special mechanics in which case can either of the other claimed town powerroles verify that?

Of course I have to track them. Duh. I did say that I tracked CES last night.

If I track the scum who is making the kill and spend less points then the scum do, I see nothing. If I track the scum who is making the kill and spend more points then them, I see who they're targeting. On the other hand, if I track a town power role who's doing something and spend any points at all, then I see what they're doing.

[Darox]

Duur, ok.

If the scum are doing anything, it's a pretty good bet that it is murder.

Given everything else Yos has said, it's not a stretch to realize he's been assuming a powerless (in the traditional sense) scumteam.

[Zang]

I hate how much claiming we're doing today but it is understandable.

My vote is going to stay on GreyICE who still has not answered my question.

[Darox]

P.S. If you track X to Y and Y died that night, it's a pretty good assumption that X killed Y.

[SpyreX]

And nothing about other scum prs?

rittteeeeeeeee

The chances of this lottery coming up PR PR is sooo nannas

[Yosarian2]

If you want my reasoning for why I did it that way:

The tracker has a very low chance of targeting the scum night zero. That would not have been a good time to waste a lot of points.

Also, the scum have a LOT of points to spend. Assuming 3 scum, and assuming each scum has the full 55 points, the scum have 165 points to spend, and apparently the ability to steal MORE points. The scum are likely spending 20+ points on the kill every night. I can only do that twice at most, and I was saving that for later in the game when I'd have a better chance of actually catching a scum.

I did want to see if CES specifically was a pro-town power role targeting anyone night zero, because last game I played with him he made a scummy-nominated brilliant doc fakeclaim, and I wanted to be able to at least catch him in a lie if he faked a doctor claim this game. That's also why I voted for him in my first post; the fact that I knew he wasn't a town power role who targeted someone night zero made him a *slightly* better then random lynch.

[Lurconis]

The example scum pm specifically points out personal ablities there is no reason to assume that.

Also vig's can't normally see the powerrole if they follow a townmember. That is giving the tracker an extra ability. If that is the case can the doc see who he protected the victim from in this game?

[Yosarian2]

And nothing about other scum prs?

rittteeeeeeeee

The chances of this lottery coming up PR PR is sooo nannas

Do you really think it's random? I think there's a pretty good chance GreyICE is looking for town power roles to wagon to a claim quite deliberately here.

[Yosarian2]

The example scum pm specifically points out personal ablities there is no reason to assume that.

Also vig's can't normally see the powerrole if they follow a townmember.

That is giving the tracker an extra ability. If that is the case can the doc see who he protected the victim from in this game?

...what?

If a tracker targets a town doctor, and the town doctor targets someone, the tracker sees who the town doctor targets. That part of it works just like a normal tracker. What "extra ability" are you talking about?

[Lurconis]

The way the tracker role works is that if I use any points, I find out what my target did if they were a town power role, but I have to spend more points then the scum do to see if they killed anyone.

Also, my role PM only talks about the scum nightkill and town power roles, so I'm pretty sure there aren't any scum power roles like scum doctor.

You said if you spend any points on a townpower role you find out what they did. Not who they visited. Sounds like a rolecop more than a tracker.

[Yosarian2]

The way the tracker role works is that if I use any points, I find out what my target did if they were a town power role, but I have to spend more points then the scum do to see if they killed anyone.

Also, my role PM only talks about the scum nightkill and town power roles, so I'm pretty sure there aren't any scum power roles like scum doctor.

You said if you spend any points on a townpower role you find out what they did. Not who they visited. Sounds like a rolecop more than a tracker.

No, no. "what they did" was not a precise phrase, I just figured that you'd know what a tracker did.

It's not really that complicated. I send in a target, and a number of points I'm spending. If I target CES, either I get back a result either telling me who he targeted, or telling me that I didn't see him targeting anyone. However, if CES is scum making the nightkill, and he spends more points then I do, then I don't see him do anything. If I spend more points then he did, and he killed Fishy, then I would see "CES targeted Fishy."

Works just like any other tracker, only weaker.

[Yosarian2]

Anyway, mod's confirmed there's two information roles in this game, Lurc and SpyreX, so I really don't think you guys are going to get me mislynched today. It's time to cut your losses and help me bus your partner GreyICE.

[Llamarble]

Wow.

Unvote

Should we just massclaim (minus bulletproof)?
If everybody here is town then there probably isn't anything else of importance to reveal
And if not then we should get a correct lynch out of it.

LLD, if you're town then you're barking up the wrong orifice.

[Llamarble]

We are guaranteed an investigative role and a protective role in the setup.
Scum were given fakeclaims though.
We are also guaranteed a bulletproof townie and there's a dead cop.

Cop + Doctor + Tracker + EvenVig + Bulletproof is a hell of a lot of power.
Everything is weakened by the 'must outbid' mechanic.
2 shot cop + 2 shot doctor + 2 shot tracker + 2 shot Evenvig + 2 shot Bulletproof is still probably too much though.

[Yosarian2]

We are guaranteed an investigative role and a protective role in the setup.

Well, 2 investigative roles and a protective role, actually.

Scum were given fakeclaims though.
We are also guaranteed a bulletproof townie and there's a dead cop.

Cop + Doctor + Tracker + EvenVig + Bulletproof is a hell of a lot of power.
Everything is weakened by the 'must outbid' mechanic.
2 shot cop + 2 shot doctor + 2 shot tracker + 2 shot Evenvig + 2 shot Bulletproof is still probably too much though.

Well, the protective role has to be real. This vig claim could be fake, but we'll find that out tonight, so there's no sense worrying about it unless we only have one kill tonight.

Also, we don't know how the cop worked, but assuming there was some kind of point bidding system for that as well, then the cop probably couldn't reliably generate confirmed innocents, which weakens the role a lot.

[Darox]

2 shot cop + 2 shot doctor + 2 shot tracker + 2 shot Evenvig + 2 shot Bulletproof is still probably too much though.

But that's not the case.

The numbers only matter in a competition.
This makes the cop and vig stronger, and the doc + tracker weaker.

[Llamarble]

Actually considering the bulletproof is a "town bulletproof" and it's possible there's more than one and we have a claimed vig, I don't think the protective role is guaranteed to be town at all.

Yos' claim sounds town. As he described it, it would be a really weird role for scum. (Automatically gets results when targeting town but not when targeting scum)
And that bit about voting CES because of the tracking just sounded like something town would do.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Actually considering the bulletproof is a "town bulletproof" and it's possible there's more than one and we have a claimed vig, I don't think the protective role is guaranteed to be town at all.

^ scum trying to get credit when Andrius flips scum Doctor.

[Andrius]

lets just get yos to always claim tracks before prs
that way if he's faking we'll know
that should appease people
aslo i wont flip scum doc twitld

[GreyICE]

Nice flail, Yos.

'halp my scumbuddies counterwagon ended up on confirmed town guess it's time to do an ASS PULL'

Three fucking town power role claims on day one my fucking ass.

[Darox]

Unvote, Vote: GreyICE

Best vote.

And thus we come full circle.