I'm going to look @ both kdub's & other recruit's posts...
Based on kdub's post, I'm fairly certain: Toasty & Ludi aren't recruiter. I would add Kast to this list, except I find it highly odd that he kdub randomly lists Kast as a suspect. Regardless, the first 2 recruits were revealed and non-mafia so I think it'd be IMPOSSIBLE for Kast-as-CR to fake a vanilliazed claim.
Looking at whoever the first guy was whose name I can't remember but he was a lover XD.
hmmm. Reading over Kdub in ISO, I think it's likely we're looking at a single CR (no backup). Although I could be WIFOMing myself here.
Why do you think Kdub's posts clear Ludi?
If Ludi is the CR, Kdub's play makes perfect sense. He came into the game, realised in #2600 that most people in the game had been 'cleared' via night actions / claims, and proceeded to bus. When more possibilities opened up, he retracted his vote, realising that he didn't actually need to bus, and so never again put his vote on Ludi (despite keeping Ludi at the top of his CR-suspect list).
I don't quite understand why Kdub was so eager to hear claims from hiplop/Nikanor/myself. It makes me think that none of the claimed WLs are the CR, but this comment by Kdub is also making me doubt myself:
Kdub wrote:If one of the claimed WLs is actually the recruiter, well we can blame a loss on them for being stupid and leading us to believe otherwise.
I'll stop here until something that resembles common sense comes into the thread.
Right now you are just voting seven different persons.
And I think I know why. The scums think they know the cult so they force us to lynch someone. The cult just want us to mis lynch and the town is confused.
I have a deal scum: If there is more than one out there and you are sure you found the cult recruiter please come forward and claim. It will help us both
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I have a deal scum: If there is more than one out there and you are sure you found the cult recruiter please come forward and claim. It will help us both
I concur with this! ^^ I also offer you immunity from being lynched today, I will instead hunt for the recruitee.
...
But I think you & Muffin are distracting from Nikanor claiming his info. ^_^
Is it intentional that NPIAU's 1-Shot BP has a strike through but Kdub's 1-Shot PGO does not have a strike through (or is that just a result of different mods writing the death scenes)?
@OS-
As far as lynching Ludi first and you second or you first and Ludi second; either way is acceptable, however there is support for a Ludi lynch and not enough support for your lynch. It's not at all a parallel situation to yours (nice try asking me to give you a defense you could parrot ). For that matter, your claim to want Ludi lynched after Nikanor flips CR makes no sense except as the empty throwaway post it is. If you genuinely believed that Nik is CR and Ludi is his last recruit, then a Nik lynch would effectively neuter the cult and you
should
move on to focus on scum. The fact you
claim
to still suspect Ludi and
claim
he should be lynched after is an obvious slip admitting you know he is cult but you aren't thinking about things from a town perspective.
PEDIT-
@Andy-
You are already voting Nikanor. No surprise that you won't lynch obv CR Ludi. Btw, the tone of your post indicates you don't really care which is lynched, which is inconsistent with your insistence on voting Nikanor over Ludi. Also, you missed the request from Vezok and BB.
@Vezok/BB-
Nice try, but at the moment scum don't want to lynch CR. This is pretty clear from Andy waffling about lynching Ludi but ultimately refusing to place a vote. Scum knows if we lynch CR today, then they come under the axe tomorrow (or potentially even second lynch today).
Btw, this raises further evidence that Ludi is CR; if he wasn't CR then CR plus any cultee should and could have easily jumped aboard and lynched him (for that matter, Kdub would have had ZERO REASON to not hammer and TONS of reason to eliminate a claimed ROLE COP who could investigate/out the recruiter). Mafia too should have no reason to avoid a Ludi lynch (again a claimed town ROLE COP is a threat to both mafia AND cult). The only explanation for mafia avoiding a Ludi mislynch is if they believe it is
NOT
a mislynch. If mafia know that Ludi is CR (which is likely given Andy's reactions), they're going to leave him alive for a later lynch while knowing he isn't actually a role cop.
Know what.
I'm fine with Ludi.
Because we've got two lynches thanks to broken game.
We really need a flip from Nik/Ludi and I'll throw in my hat to whichever wagon at this point.
I'll have you know, however, I don't expect him to flip CR. The OLRolecop deal is def. sketch though, but ehhh
How about playing with what is ACTUALLY POSTED instead looking at things out of context and pretending you just "made a mistake".
You are literally flipflopping on everything you said yesterday and are opportunistic scum.
That means either Andrius targetted Ludi or Ludi is lieing about being roleblocked.
Probably going to go with Andrius targetted Ludi and violated his own plan of action which makes absolutely no sense because Andrius supported Ludi yesterday. I think we just found the CR and his recruit, guys.
You very clearly understood that Andy is a roleblocker and thus is NOT the CR. You offered two possibilities, one being Andy blocked Ludi or Ludi is lying. You state that you
WOULD
believe Andy blocked Ludi
EXCEPT THAT
it goes against Andy's behavior which means the latter; Ludi is lying and thus Andy's claim to block Ludi is a result of him being recruited. Your revisionist claim that "Oh I forgot Andy is a roleblocker" is BS since IN THE EXACT SAME POST you discuss Andy as a roleblocker.
More like I stopped buddying you and you are now pushing me.
Check your isos again. I've pushed you as backup CR since our confirmed townie revealed info from his ROLE PM that said YOU ARE A BLACK LANTERN. You tried buddying to get me to drop it and I called you on it. You only "stopped buddying" AFTER I explicitly stated that your buddying is scummy; at which point you joined Ludi's OMGUS and claimed Kast is suddenly rising in your suspicion.
You aren't going to believe so I don't even know why I am posting this to begin with. I said probably. There are obviously numerous other situations that could have caused Ludi to be roleblocked and you are blowing a simple brainfart out of proportion. Once I remembered that Andrius could not be the CR and that the only logical way for Ludi to be roleblocked was a recruit/Andrius telling the truth I started pushing Nikanor as he was the only that was basically unaccounted for at all (that and Hiplop, who why the fuck hasn't he claimed yet? Oh right. Because the scum have horrible fakeclaims just like Andrius said). Andrius is scum regardless and the fact that I outted his "oops forgot to change my target guise" is evidence enough.
His role PM said that I was a Black Lantern? Really? Have you read his role PM? Did you even read his words about the role PM? Do you even know this flavor? Several super heroes like Deadman, Aquaman, Hawkman, Hawkgirl, Hawk, Firestorm, Maxwell Lord, Ice, etc were Black Lanterns that were brought back to life by the White Entity. My role PM states my former Black Lantern ability (speaking to dead sea organisms) just as Mera's states the same. In the comics, our marriage almost failed because I was so haunted by the fact that all these dead things were talking to me. You are clinging to anything that you can spin as scummy in the hopes that some of it will stick. My half baked opinions? Clearly labeled that they are such and should be taken with a grain of salt. The fact that you are taking them seriously shows either some merit in them, or you are just flailing scum. And hypocritical.
I've been going after Ludi since yesterday; notice who was pushing for Ludi's lynch and against Subliminal's lynch yesterday (hint it was Subliminal, Kast, and Muffin, the three townies who are actually trying to figure things out instead of playing by emotions (BB/Nik) or just sheeping (Tans/Vezok)). Ludi is the obvious CR; this remains as true now as before.
You are also scum and Subliminal supporting himself is a stupid thing to be used in your defense. The only thing giving credit to your opinion is zMuffinMan who I happen to find the most towny player in this game at the moment. You were were pretty towny until you decided to completely change your opinions on several players and decide to uber cult hunt (sign of the mafia).
Spoiler: Repeating lies does not make them true. You and Ludi seem to have the same mindset
I can't be the CR or the CR backup because I have results.
The only "result" that you have is that TT didn't target anyone; except that TT claims to have targeted someone. Aside from that you have a claimed track on CJ from N1 which in your own words should give an "indication from [your] target that [your] ability succeeded or failed". Even more explicitly, you stated "I was looking for crumbs in CJ's posting and I didn't see any which is why I said "any indication"", which is absolutely ridiculous to claim if you are a tracker/watcher since CJ would have no reason for crumbing ANYTHING about your attempted track on him.
You are taking things out of context, which you directly accused me of doing in this very same post. I was going to Track CJ that night regardless because I thought it might have been a reflexive roleblock, or he was maybe untargettable for whatever reason. I wanted to look for crumbs to see if he is was either going to crumb who he targetted last night, or who he was going to target the next night. Vezok claimed that he delayed me and that my action would resolve tonight, which made me look for his crumbs even harder seeing as I would get to see where he went. I thought that the delay would show where my target when the first night, but after asking the mod about it and him stating that I could be roleblocked again, I doubted that I would learn what he did the first night. You supported me for this yesterday and now you are vehemently going against it. What changed your mind during the night? Any new information you are not telling us about? Since you knew that Ludi was the CR yesterday before the Subliminal lynch you would have pushed me for "obv protecting my CR" like you are today. But you aren't. Cognitive dissonance.
You obviously have motive for lying about TT; Ludi is going to be lynched. If TT actually JKed Ludi and stopped the recruit last night, then cult is likely down to 2 members. Ludi being lynched would drop cult down to just yourself. TT or Andy would pretty obviously JK or RB you as the pretty damn certain last cult member. You only have a shot anymore if you can swing mislynches of people other than Ludi (ie. your Nikanor and TT schemes).
What? This is crazy talk. How does me lieing about TT go to me being roleblocked by Andrius or TT? That makes no sense and you are again making assumptions out of information that you are not sharing with us. I don't want TT to die, and that somehow makes me look for mislynches in other players? That makes no sense.
I could give a whole bunch of half baked reasons why you are mafia
And can you give any full baked reasons for why I am mafia? Your post is overflowing with lulz.
You clearly do not know how to read between the lines or take things with a grain of salt that are labeled clearly as something hypothetical and me just hashing out all the possibilities, which you seem content to not do in the hopes you can restrict town's information even more.
Spoiler: Did you just decide to start slinging crap and hoping something sticks?
And if I was the CR backup and Ludi is my CR why wouldn't I buss the shit out of Ludi especially after yesterday?
Seeing as Cult almost certainly loses if we lynch the CR AND the backup CR, then I would think it obvious why you would avoid doing something that directly would lead to your loss.
You can't go around assuming shit like that. you need to explain your reasoning and your thought processes. You are still acting on your assumption that TT and Andrius would roleblock me when it would be stupid to do that as I am a tracker.
If I was regular recruitee why wouldn't I be joining Ludi on the Toasty wagon especially with a claim that could have damned him?
Straw man.
Scum who have no real come back like to use wiki tells just like this. And you are using strawmans just as much as that one was. Regardless, actually comment on the damn sentence instead of immediately dismissing it.
Kast does not want to lynch Nikanor because that would directly implicate Hiplop and shred Mafia's last chance at winning the game. THe problem? White Lanterns.
Are you reading what you're posting? Subliminal and Muffin are vouching for Hiplop as a WL. How does anything I've posted relate to Nikanor clearing Hiplop (or anything clearing Hiplop for that matter)?
Due to the duality of the roles in this game
Hiplop is likely the Dayvig,
WTF?! Are you even trying? Hiplop is town or hiplop is mafia? Make up your mind.
I think he reversed it so as to cut ties when scum Andy flips scum. Problems?
Ok, how do you explain the three additional breadcrumbs that all indicated a track result of Tans targeting Andy? That right there is a bigger problem than "My word against his"
I honestly did not read your additional breadcrumbs other than "I am going to track BB" and "Jade Andy Tans". If you could link me to them (I am sorry I know you linked them but I can't find them at this moment >_>) I might let this go, as it stands though, the crumbing could be ambiguous so I don't know what to say for certain.
Toasty has claimed to have blocked him the first night, and Toasty isn't lieing about his ability
How do you explain Toasty's lack of JK despite you yourself knowing TT is a JKer? Are you claiming Andy roleblocked TT? Why would Andy lie about blocking Ludi; unless he was recruited by Ludi last night? Your story doesn't hold up.
Again. I am putting everything out there. Toasty could have been vanillalized (as you yourself indicated renders an action null and void since you didn't receive your result when you should have) and that could have prevented his action from going through, Vezok could have lied. TT could be a recruit, but I highly doubt that. There are numerous possibilities and me pointing out my thoughts doesn't make me scummy. Your insistence that something has to be a scum tell is scummy though.
Scum have 6 members. 3 red and 3 yellow. We already have Atrocitus, and 2 yellow, but no Sinestro. Sinestro is going to be in this game. Vanillalizer (paralyzing fear) makes sense for Sinestro (Kast *was* yellow mafia last game, and Tans was given the same role he had, so not entirely inconceivable), plus the other 2 Red scum members. Problems? major flavor guessing and outguessing the mod
Other problems, mods already confirmed they assigned roles randomly, so odds of Kast getting Sinestro AGAIN are extremely low (not to mention others who played in both games and flipped have not been the same roles as before...plus it would just be idiotic game design). Aside from that, a 6 man scum team (+/-1) is fairly likely and has been posited for quite some time...padding your post with IIoA?
LOLED at this. I don't know what everyone else thought, but when I saw the flips I thought it would be a 2 red 2 yellow scum team. Show me where people have explicitly stated a 6 man scum team? Oh wait. That was cognitive dissonance on your part again. You again take my half baked opinions as actual opinions and proceed to use that as scummunition against me.
Tans, if everything goes to plan, Kast can wait until tomorrow.
Nikanor and Ludi, the CR and the Cultee can die today.
Here is where you show your true colors once again. If you honestly think our lynches today should be used on Nikanor and Ludi, then there's absolutely zero reason for your strong opposition to lynching Ludi first and Nikanor second.
The same could be said for you, but apparently I would parrot a defense. You have no defense. I want Nikanor dead to prove that A) Hiplop is scum, B) that Ludi is scum, and C) to show that Toasty is genuine. You on the other hand? You just know that Ludi is CR because of your PoE scumnalysis by excluding all the claimed roles and your scumbuddies.
-In your scenario, Ludi flips recruit, it confirms that you are right about TT getting somehow blocked, and combined with your knowledge that TT is really a JK, you've narrowed down CR to someone who has no confirmed night actions (Nik/Hiplop/Vezok/Muffin), which almost certainly would mean Nikanor hangs. Your refusal to go with this shows you aren't honest about a Ludi lynch. You just want to mislynch a WL. If Nik got lynched and flipped WL, you'd likely go back to claiming Toast as cult recruit or some crap like that
You assume things and then use them as the basis for argument. Normally people assume actions and happenings *after* they happen, but you are going beyond that and trying to assert your opinion before it happens. If you were that worried you wouldn't have mentioned that and just called me out on it later, but no, you are trying to use everything in your power to paint me as cult because you know that you and your little buddies are going down in a blaze of red and yellow fury and you want to take as many townies with you. Andrius would have been confirmed LIEING about his roleblock as it was convienent that he claimed Ludi who already claimed roleblocked and looked scummy so no one would question it. Funny how you convienently forgot that.
I buddied you because I considered you a beacon of towniness. When I realized that you were viewing the game through yellow tinted glass I knew that you couldn't be town and so I withdrew my support of you, which you then promptly started pushing as scummy because you were "hot on my tail".
@Peregrine motivating Kast-
Peregrine targeting Kast is a reasonable supposition; but there are two problems. First, Peregrine did state agreement with my brother's posts and trust of my slot. However, as he posted in his notes before D2 ended, he didn't pick up on my brother's Tracker claim. That's the problem with piggybacking the guy who wasn't really reading the first half of the game; BB didn't notice that Peregrine
didn't realize
Kast had claimed tracker. Actually BB was one of the ONLY PEOPLE who realized my brother's Tracker soft claim (probably since my brother stated intent to TRACK BB).
Second, and pretty damn definitive, Vezok delayed me on N2, so that blows the whole Kast vanilla'd Tans/WLC on N2 out of the water.
Umm.. No it doesn't. Who did Andrius claim to have blocked Night 2? Oh right. Subliminal, who as we have already confirmed, used his power on Night 1. We have already proven that Andrius is a bold face liar when it comes to that plan and he is probably lieing about Subliminal Roleblock here especially given that he could delay a nightkill which could then be subject to additional power roles. Ya. Roleblocking Vezok would have been a very smart move for Mafia. Also, this just reminded me of something in my notes. You and Tans claimed vanillalized on D3, which I basically gave immediate town cred for because it wouldn't make sense for the scum to do that. However, when WLC flipped that he was vanillalized that put a whole lot of doubt into the equation as to whether or not it was really possible that 3 people could be vanillalized in one night. Tans has actions to prove that he is town. Scum targetting Tans for a vanillalize is also a very good choice as he acts as a pseudo rolecop and could easily turn the tables on scum in late game. You.. since you yourself stated that no one saw your soft claim do not make a good choice at all for scum to vanillalize.
@OS-
As far as lynching Ludi first and you second or you first and Ludi second; either way is acceptable, however there is support for a Ludi lynch and not enough support for your lynch. It's not at all a parallel situation to yours (nice try asking me to give you a defense you could parrot ). For that matter, your claim to want Ludi lynched after Nikanor flips CR makes no sense except as the empty throwaway post it is. If you genuinely believed that Nik is CR and Ludi is his last recruit, then a Nik lynch would effectively neuter the cult and you
should
move on to focus on scum. The fact you
claim
to still suspect Ludi and
claim
he should be lynched after is an obvious slip admitting you know he is cult but you aren't thinking about things from a town perspective.
PEDIT-
@Andy-
You are already voting Nikanor. No surprise that you won't lynch obv CR Ludi. Btw, the tone of your post indicates you don't really care which is lynched, which is inconsistent with your insistence on voting Nikanor over Ludi. Also, you missed the request from Vezok and BB.
Kast, now you are just being thick. The situations are the same and your refusal to hash out the possibility just shows that you don't have any real case.
How am I not going after scum? Did you not see my scum grouping which includes you? We have more than enough town PRs to completely BLOCK all 3 of your night actions as well as the ability to slowly verify one of you each night.
About my "slip", if anything, suggests that I would be Mafia since you claimed that Mafia would be willing to go fully after cult in order to reduce the potential for a lynch on their own heads. You just slipped implying that you know I am not Mafia and instead I am cult for "knowing" that Ludi is cult (when I said it is likely he is the cultee a billion times) because you know that I am not on your Mafia team. Nice job.
Also, how does his tone implying he doesn't care who is lynched make it inconsistent with his vote on Nikanor when Nikanor and Ludi have had a parallel wagon all game? You are trying to coach Andrius into voting with you and it is blatant scumbuddying.
Kast should not live to see the light of LyLo and neither should Andrius. Nikanor and Ludi should be our lynches today. With a concentrated focus of all our remaining town powers on Kast, Andrius, and Hiplop.
Andrius. I am going to be that guy. Only because you are scum though. Hammer your own beacon of hope and life guide. You've already embraced the rage and fear so this should be easy.
Kast, see this, right here? Ya. To prove to you that I am not Cult and to show that you are Mafia
UNVOTE: VOTE: Ludi
Nikanor is still the fucking CR and people should finally realize this.
Ok what the hell OS if you think Nik is CR you vote him.
At this point I'm just waffling between sticking with my guns and voting Nik or doing LE COMPROMISE and voting Ludi.
We get two lynches, does it matter the order if we're convinced they HAVE to be in these two?
). For that matter, your claim to want Ludi lynched after Nikanor flips CR makes no sense except as the empty throwaway post it is. If you genuinely believed that Nik is CR and Ludi is his last recruit, then a Nik lynch would effectively neuter the cult and you shouldmove on to focus on scum. The fact youclaimto still suspect Ludi andclaimhe should be lynched after is an obvious slip admitting you know he is cult but you aren't thinking about things from a town perspective.
I said probably. There are obviously numerous other situations that could have caused Ludi to be roleblocked and you are blowing a simple brainfart out of proportion. Once I remembered that Andrius could not be the CR and that the only logical way for Ludi to be roleblocked was a recruit/Andrius telling the truth I started pushing Nikanor as he was the only that was basically unaccounted for at all (that and Hiplop, who why the fuck hasn't he claimed yet? Oh right. Because the scum have horrible fakeclaims just like Andrius said). Andrius is scum regardless and the fact that I outted his "oops forgot to change my target guise" is evidence enough. 