Brightest Day Mafia, Part 1 - GAME OVER

[Nikanor]

No, CJ's unvote wasn't counted, and I was able to unvote Apok, so something is up with CJ's vote. I don't think it has to do with CJ's role, because otherwise ML wouldn't have tried to hammer like that. Someone must have glued CJ's vote in place. Does anyone want to claim that?

[The Book of Oa]

zMuffinMan's back in the game!

Continue.

[mastin2]

mastin's stretching would be scummy if he weren't mastin.

Remind me to sig that.
(Not really. My signature is perfect as it is, since it describes "essence of Mastin" perfectly. But I have a quotes section on my wiki page which is almost entirely empty. And when I say "sig that", this is what I mean. It's something I don't do very often.)

Candle did indeed claim scum with Candle's intended hammer--ooba promised thoughts one more time. What pro-town reason was there to hammer before then? (Additionally, this is the exact same type of Hydra Dissonance I'd expect from scum. It reminds me of a more confused version of Two-Headed Boy, in TWBBS.) That said,

Vezok:

You wouldn't have happened to have targeted Candle, would you? (Remember, Vezok's role is "Freezer". That can mean, "vote freezer".)

If it's not Vezok, then the fact that the ability is unclaimed is a fair sign that it's an anti-town ability in nature.

[mastin2]

Additionally,

Sorry, picked up my prod. Relatively caught up. Actually not sure what took so long for the Ooba lynch to reach this point. Probably has something to do with all that pointless LLD suspicion being thrown around, despite the fact that she's damn near confirmed town based on some of her earliest posts. Also, just to see if I understand this, I'm scum because I assumed people were taking what I had also assumed was a mod error (what with me getting a deleted PM from the mod and such) to be mod-confirmation of town status? A status that several people are now challenging? Before the messages went out, I had a scummy read on Friend. But, no, he got a message, he's tots safe though no one knows what the message said. However it's cool to suspect CJ after finding out he got the same message? Seems hypocritical to me.

But speaking of CJ, I'm assuming we're waiting to see what the heck is going on with his vote not going through?

You're not scum for...whatever the heck your reasoning in the above is. You're scum for thinking people think you're scum for the above.

[Apokalyptika]

...well, that's odd. Definitely seems to be something on CJ's end.

P-Edit: Oho. That's a distinct possibility, there.

[ToastyToast]

Why would CJ have an inability to change votes as his role. Someone did this to him. A vote freeze is scummy/probably a scum power.

[mastin2]

Hence, why if it wasn't Vezok, it's likely an anti-town power. If it is Vezok, it's a town power, since Vezok's confirmed-town as far as I'm concerned. If it's not Vezok, the fact that nobody is claiming responsibility makes it a scum power.


Additionally, the thought of two scumteams is beginning to grow on me. Related to the above, combined with nopoint's slip. Scum-targetting-scum would make sense to me.

Someone, if you disagree strongly about there being two scumteams (by which, I mean, two separate mafia teams), please shoot it down. Now. Ideas grow like a parasite when left unchecked.

[mastin2]

Hold on a sec--

I just realized something.

If the vote-freeze is a scum ability, they think Apok is town.

Think it through, and I think you'll see why.

[Kast]

because otherwise ML wouldn't have tried to hammer like that.

Not necessarily the case. It's entirely possible that this is some sort of gambit by CJ. It seems unlikely that scum would single out CJ's vote on Apok when Ooba had and has so much attention and CJ's participation in the lynch is unnecessary and could easily have gone completely unnoticed. (Should go without saying, but it's just as unlikely if not more so that a townie would randomly freeze CJ's vote and not claim it; though it's possible it was a townie who has not posted since this came to light).

I did not previously think CJ is/was scummy, but it's hard to believe he doesn't know what's going on. Whether this is some kind of town gambit, or some kind of scum ploy; it's hard to determine with the information at hand. It doesn't seem at all plausible to me that scum would arbitrarily freeze CJ or that they would arbitrarily freeze a player voting Apok. Neither seems even remotely relevant to today's lynch in any way.

@Mod Re:Two scum teams-

You know that there is

a

cult (the Black Lanterns).

You know that there is

a

mafia faction in this game.

Does the "a" in either of the two quoted special rules indicate that there is a single cult and a single mafia faction, or does it just indicate "at least one" of either?

[ToastyToast]

Someone, if you disagree strongly about there being two scumteams (by which, I mean, two separate mafia teams), please shoot it down. Now. Ideas grow like a parasite when left unchecked.

I say we wait to see what happens during night before we speculate on this. Having two scum teams means we have to take out the cult FAST as well.

@Kast: why is it so hard to believe that CJ doesn't know what's going on? You think he froze his own vote? Makes no logical sense. If anything, what just happened makes him significantly MORE town.

[Nikanor]

If anything, what just happened makes him significantly MORE town.

Actually, I just realised something.
Ludi's hammer attempt makes him very likely to be scum.
ooba is likely mafia.
The vote-freezing ability is likely from mafia.
10000 points to the guy who figures out what that makes CJ.

Unvote. Vote: CandleJack.

[ToastyToast]

If ooba is likely mafia, why not VOTE HIM WHEN HE"S ONE AWAY FROM GETTING LYNCHED!

Also, It makes him town.

[Kast]

@Toast-
I thought that was pretty clear; I can't see any reason why scum would:
1) Freeze CJ's vote
2) Freeze a vote on Apok

Additionally, none of this distraction and aimless speculation would be happening if CJ hadn't posted an apparent hammer vote on Ooba. The vote itself is odd since:
-CJ had very explicitly stated unwillingness to lynch Ooba today.
-Ooba has very explicitly requested a chance to post final thoughts before anyone hammers.

Game play wise it doesn't make sense. Game mechanics wise it is at best a complete waste of a vote freeze (if that is what it is).

Beyond that, if CJ/Tar decided to gambit, there's LOTS of plausible explanations for why "he froze his own vote", whereas there's really NONE for why someone else would do so.

[mastin2]

If anything, what just happened makes him significantly MORE town.

Actually, I just realised something.
Ludi's hammer attempt makes him very likely to be scum.
ooba is likely mafia.
The vote-freezing ability is likely from mafia.
10000 points to the guy who figures out what that makes CJ.

Unvote. Vote: CandleJack.

Unvote, Vote: Candle Jack

.

[ToastyToast]

It could be a passive ability, which is what I was thinking. Like, placing a vote on said person freezes it. Most day-powers require sending a PM before something happens. If said person felt that CJ was likely to move his vote, it makes sense for them to freeze it.

[Nikanor]

Also, It makes him town.

No, it just makes him not-mafia.
See where I'm going yet?

It could be a passive ability, which is what I was thinking. Like, placing a vote on said person freezes it.

That would be a terrible role.

[ToastyToast]

Yes, I see where your going. But what makes him more likely cult than town? thats what I don't get.

[Kast]

@Nik-
-Are you running with Mastin's speculation that there are two scum teams, one of whom froze CJ's vote, the other of whom contains CJ/Ooba, AND that CJ just got caught when he attempted a hammer-bus?
-Are you proposing something similar, only calling CJ a BL who got caught by an unexpected scum ability?

I do not see a scum motivation for scum to freeze CJ's vote. Since it seems other players are unaffected, it's a very ineffective way to protect Ooba. It potentially buys town-cred for CJ if he's seen as a victim of a scum ability; but that also seems unnecessary.

@Toast-
A passive mechanic would be more plausible than randomly targetting CJ/Apok, ie. some scum ability that freezes the vote of first person to try hammering Ooba. But that still seems unlikely. If it were true is says NOTHING AT ALL about CJ being town; and it still allows the possibility that CJ's vote was a gambit/scum-ploy.

[Nikanor]

What will make you understand? Look at it this way:
Under the assumption that cj is town, would he have tried to hammer ooba while ooba was v/la? No. Can you get that? Understand that it's still possible that he's of a different mafia faction from ooba, but that's unlikely. Like as not he's cult recruiter. That's what I'm saying. A possibility still exists for him to be othermafia, but again, I doubt that there is more than one mafia team because then the mafia teams would be too small to deal with cult effectively. By this logic, cj is cult.
Let's vote cj now, okay? Excellent.

[The Book of Oa]

@Mod Re:Two scum teams-

You know that there is

a

cult (the Black Lanterns).

You know that there is

a

mafia faction in this game.

Does the "a" in either of the two quoted special rules indicate that there is a single cult and a single mafia faction, or does it just indicate "at least one" of either?

There is at least one cult and there is at least one mafia faction in this game.

[Mr Subliminal]

It's fun being the first person to call someone scum (sorry mastin, but it's

my

reason that CJ is scum ).
So we getting CJ first or can he be after ooba?

[Nikanor]

CJ is probcult so we're lynching him first.
I'd like if we lynched CJ before ooba gets back on the off-chance that ooba is a cult governor, but it's not really THAT big a deal.

[Mr Subliminal]

FOLLOW THE JUSTICE LEAGUE CHOO CHOO
UNVOTE:
VOTE: CJ

[The Book of Oa]

As the battle continues, a bright Indigo light lances out, mingling with various Green, Red, and Orange lights in the area, before hitting a target. Though meant to kill, the beam is stopped short, shredding the protection of its target. Though alive, this hero now lacks protection from death.

[mastin2]

Okay, so someone daykilled a one-shot BP. Who was the shooter (they should be town), and who was the shot? (The very well may be scum and/or cult--see the discussion about making the cult one-shot BP rather than full BP that Dana had last game.)