NY135: Sexy Sedilla Semi-Open - Town Wins

[Empking]

Ohh my bad then.

Unvote then.

[T-Bone]

I believe that was sarcasm.

Sure aren't doing yourself any favors. There isn't a roleblocker or doctor in this set-up and we had 72 hours to submit night actions. Since you declared what you wanted to do, you should have sent in the shot immediately when the night phase started.

[Empking]

I believe that was sarcasm.

Sure aren't doing yourself any favors. There isn't a roleblocker or doctor in this set-up and we had 72 hours to submit night actions. Since you declared what you wanted to do, you should have sent in the shot immediately when the night phase started.

I forgot to. I think I got a PM after coming into the thread after it was locked.

[SpyreX]

Sorry I forgot to unvote.

My bad again.

[Untrod Tripod]

bah! bah I say!

[Yosarian2]

Sorry. Sorry. Sorry.

Forgot to send it. If you give me another chance then I can confirm myself tonight.

Empking, you do realize that even if you kill someone night 3, that dosn't confirm you of anything; 1 kill on night 2 and 2 kills night 3 could just as easily mean a mafia bookie.

[Empking]

Sorry. Sorry. Sorry.

Forgot to send it. If you give me another chance then I can confirm myself tonight.

Empking, you do realize that even if you kill someone night 3, that dosn't confirm you of anything; 1 kill on night 2 and 2 kills night 3 could just as easily mean a mafia bookie.

Its night two next night.

[Yosarian2]

You know what I mean.

[Îdher]

If there is a mafia bookie--and I think Reckoner was fascinated enough with the idea when he decided to run a Sedilla in the first place--then there is no way that it has not predicted Empking for the lynch. (Assuming he's not a traitor, or the bookie himself, I guess.)

I think it's safe to assume that Empking is confirmed scum and look elsewhere accordingly. There might still be a real vig out there, or we could lynch a bookie ourselves or something nice like that.

Having said that, I have still been putting off actually reading this thread. Sorry. Yosarian, can you sit next to me?

-Ether

[Knight of Cydonia]

Looks like you forgot a legitimate reason, too. "Hey, this is my one chance to confirm myself by using my vig powers... ehhh, never mind."
Looks like I'm forgetting to unvote too.

[kanyeknowsbest]

agreed with idher. if empking is scum (he is) its extremely likely hes bookied. id rather wait to lynch him due to that possibility.

Vote: chair

ill sum up the chair case again when i get home and am not on my phone

[T-Bone]

Vote: Kanye

That's the scum response I was waiting for.

Scum couldn't have predicted that Empking would not submit his kill.

But now that he's done so, you suggest that's exactly what the mafia did, so we should wait till tomorrow to lynch him. So we agree to lynch him tomorrow, you know what that means? The Bookie tags him tonight.

But Kanye as scum, that's exactly what he wants to happen. Ensure his team's bookie is successful.

Idher next as he essentially suggested we lynch Empking later as well, which would create the same scenario I just described. A Kanye or Idher lynch should be our lynch today.

[Îdher]

The above argument forgets the part where Empking is scum himself.

-Ether

[Îdher]

(If Empking were actually a vig, then there'd no use tagging him unless you think he's going to forget his kill a second time. But this point is moot.)

-Ether

[T-Bone]

To be fair, my point assumes he's town. That assumption doesn't make the theory invalid just because you think he's scum.

[T-Bone]

Frankly, I chose Kanye over you because Ethos felt Kanye was his top scum read. They thought you were town. I figured I'd include their reads too into my discussion.

[kanyeknowsbest]

Vote: Kanye

That's the scum response I was waiting for.

Scum couldn't have predicted that Empking would not submit his kill.

But now that he's done so, you suggest that's exactly what the mafia did, so we should wait till tomorrow to lynch him. So we agree to lynch him tomorrow, you know what that means? The Bookie tags him tonight.

But Kanye as scum, that's exactly what he wants to happen. Ensure his team's bookie is successful.

Idher next as he essentially suggested we lynch Empking later as well, which would create the same scenario I just described. A Kanye or Idher lynch should be our lynch today.

youre joking right? you honestly believe that empking just happened to "forget" his kill especially with his town confirmation depending on it? thats impossible. there are two possibilities: empking is town (not a vig) pulling some sort of gambit, or hes scum who thought his lynch was imminent and decided to guarantee his lynch the next day by fakeclaiming something he knew would get him lynched. further, it doesn't make any sense to me that scum would not have killed him last night if his claim had any chance of being true due to fear that he may have been fibbing about how many shots he had.

finally, consider

Ending night a bit early since I might not be here later.

yeah right reck would end the night early if there were outstanding night actions as important as a vig kill the vig had claimed he was going to commit.

im sorry t-bone, but ethos was wrong about me and you should analyze whether or not you think im scummy on your own rather than sheep him and jump on a really poor reason to attack me (a reason that i feel actually increases my town read on idher.)

[T-Bone]

Then why aren't you advocating his lynch right now? Because you're missing the entire argument as to why I called you scum. It has nothing to do with what Empking did, but what you did and what you suggested.

[Oversoul]

Frankly, I chose Kanye over you because Ethos felt Kanye was his top scum read. They thought you were town. I figured I'd include their reads too into my discussion.

Could you include their reads so everyone can see unless, of course, there are specifics that may aid the scum. I know Dramonic asked Ethos to post their reads predicting a mason kill, and from your post I am going to assume he followed through with the request, but please any information at this point is helpful.

Anyways....

This game just went to hell in handbasket...

Empking, if you are townie, and you legitimately forgot, which I doubt, you have probably secured a win for the scum. Howrever, I have this thought in the back of my mind that this is just one huge ass gambit.

If there is a bookie, this could be their attempt to gain the 2 nightkills. Empking "claiming" 1 vigkill can do two things. A) it outs the real vigilante, if there is one or B) sets up bookie fodder perfectly once the claim is proven fake.

For fear of the bookie and playing into the hands of the scum, I would hold off on killing Empking. We can save his lynch for later as well as give him time to "prove" his vig ability. It is highly unlikely that the Mafia would throw one of their power roles under the bus either, so it is safe to assume that Empking is either a (forgetful................. -.-) Vig 1-shot or a Mafia Goon.

I really don't have any reads from this game other than my failed Ythan read. However, I find it ironic how Hiraki has not posted back here again AND he was unphased when Empking stated he would shoot Hiraki...

I still don't see the scumminess of Kanye's actions. I guess I am a noob and don't realize some of the hidden nuances, but could someone point them out for me? :3

[T-Bone]

Alright Oversoul I'll break it down for you. First, my argument does work under the assumption that Empking isn't scum, or rather that the scum know he's town even if we don't.

From Town's point of view he is scum and should be lynched.

From the scum's point of view however, they could have not predicted the claimed Vig would 'forget' to make his night kill. So him being targeted for the Bookie shot is highly unlikely.

Now as a whole much like Spyrex and KoC did, they immediately went for the lynch, something I'd expect town in this situation to do. But remember scum have this extra knowledge.

On Night 1, assuming Empking is the Vig we could have only seen 2 night kills. The scum and vig kill. On Night 2 however that goes all at the window, as with the variable of the bookie, there could be between 1 and 3 kills.

So from scum point of view, keep Empking alive. Bookie him tonight. Re-address his lynch tomorrow. Get an extra kill. Use the uncertainly of Night 2's kills (plus Empking's unreliability) as a way to push his lynch. Suddenly we're down quite a bit.

Maybe that explains things better? That's what I'm seeing. And that's what Kanye didn't address in his last post. He pretended to defend himself by defending against arguments I wasn't making.

[SpyreX]

Did T-Bone just vote KKB for the same sentiment Idher expressed before? Bad T-Bone.

Empking is scum.

If he was town scum couldn't have risked the shot confirming him. Period.

IF there is a bookie, yea you damn well bet its on emp. That doesn't change anything. You don't leave scum alive to look for other scum.

[T-Bone]

I adressed that. I called Idher out on it too, but Ethos was arguing to me that Kanye was scum and Idher was town, so I went with that.

Funny. We have 10 days till deadline, and you want to quick lynch without scumhunting? Do you have a back-up plan if Empking flips town? No? Funny. I do.

[MrZepher]

ho shi---

I seemed to have forgotten about the existence of this game over the course of this night phase...
That being said, I feel like I can give Emp BoD in not submitting the kill.

As per my negligence to do so prior to the day I'll have to reread during my

V/LA: This weekend from Friday to Monday

catch the discounts while they're hot zzzzzz

[SpyreX]

Funny. We have 10 days till deadline, and you want to quick lynch without scumhunting? Do you have a back-up plan if Empking flips town? No? Funny. I do.

I do not need a backup plan for Empking flipping town.

That is not happening.

Again, unless you think the scumteam is multiple bookies or like 6 people deep no way in hell would they risk killing mason confirming the other two AND having a vig shot confirm the vig.

[Hiraki]

Hmm.

Kanye's point about Reck's ending night early is a valid point that I did not expect.

I'm going to place this for now though.

Vote: Knights of Cydonia

Btw. I can believe the Empking forgetfullness.

Give him one more night. Fuck it up then, and then there's a definite possibility.

I'd like something more than that for a lynch though.