Double-Dip Mafia, Game Over

[imaginality]

Pomegranate, why do you think Hiraki is scummy? Do you agree with everything that's been thrown at him? If not, which reasons in particular are you voting him for?

[petroleumjelly]

Day One: Vote Count #12

6 Hiraki (Pomegranate, iamausername, smallpeoples343, [Low Key], Amrun, Ameliaslay)
3 kunkstar7 (WeyounsLastClone, Ranmaru, RedCoyote)
3 Ranmaru ([Low Key], Ameliaslay, Empking)
3 WeyounsLastClone (Amrun, Empking, Pomegranate)
2 Ameliaslay (Ranmaru, imaginality)
2 iamausername (Hiraki, Ellibereth)
2 smallpeoples343 (Crazy, RedCoyote)
1 Amrun (WeyounsLastClone)
1 Crazy (Ellibereth)
1 Empking (iamausername)
1 imaginality (Hiraki)
1 Pomegranate (imaginality)

With

15

alive, it takes

8

to lynch. Deadline is July 15 at 4:00 PM PDT.

Not Voting – 1 – kunkstar7

[Ranmaru]

unvote

vote: Hiraki, Ranmaru

To answer the questions asked of my votes, by Empking. I initially placed only one vote and randomly to give myself the opportunity to look over the thread. I hadn't yet decided how I wanted to use both votes, although I thought in tandem is a little strange, as second votes might be more useful to place pressure.

To comment on one of the wagons, I was initially a bit confused by the smalls wagon-- to me he reads very newb, but not necessarily newb scum. But as the latter end of the thread progresses he seems very willing-- almost falling over himself to accomodate requests for outside of game activity on other sites.

That over-eager to please mentality strikes me wrong. I also really didn't like the comment in post #198, where he mentions that we should look tomorrow for those attacking him hardest. That being said, I don't know that this sways my balance toward a vote.

As to reasons for my current votes, I haven't really been fond of the tone of Hiraki's posts..

he seems pretty excitable early game

. However, I really haven't liked either Lowkey or Ranmaru's

method of scum-hunting

. Both of them seem to rely on a form of metagaming, that forgive me as I haven't played in a while seems like going beyond the pale. As in this post by Ranmaru:

Actually, I was asking because before he has been set to visible. I told him I would be checking his recent posts to make sure he is following up with the game, but I didn't want to sound like a creeper. He usually jokes around and I'm fine with throwing some sillyness toward him. He knows that I have called him out and multiple others and still do. I am sad at him being invisible.

The only time I remember ever watching who's visible/not-- timestamps, etc. was as scum looking for justifications to point fingers at other players. Lowkey and Ranmaru seem to use similar logic to point fingers at smalls and redcoyote, on what I think of as weak cases, especially given my preference towards only looking in game at in game behavior.

Purple text I agree with. He was never scummy to me. *To Hiraki, I posted that quote to ask for thoughts on Smalls to see if he was doing the same or not.

Your Hiraki vote, is based on how he was excited to play? That is not good, at all. Why does that make you think he is scum?

The quote you bring up is not scum hunting, it's a clarification.

If you don't like meta-ing, why haven't you spoken of Crazy? Here is a quote:

VOTE: Ranmaru

Not really a first post I'd expect from you... I thought you'd come out guns blazing, especially with all this NK-WIFOM talk. What's up?

@Amrun - A-ight, I can believe the cell phone thing. UNVOTE: Amrun

He used it for scum hunting.

I also call out activity all the time, so I don't see how that makes me scum. (It's a null tell)

Anyways, my scumhunting isn't heavily based on meta. Currently i'm voting you and Kunkstar, both of which I have never played with. How is this meta-ing?

I never pointed fingers at RC nor Smalls. If I say "Hey RC, I see you there!" It doesn't mean I think he's scum for it, it means I want him to post.

Why did you vote Elli?

[Ranmaru]

Unvote Small, vote iam

y u vote iam

[Ranmaru]

Voting on gut with 12 pages of content means there's seriously something wrong.

Seriously, looking at everything from a negative angle? Unless I've missed a post from someone saying 'hello, I'm actually mafia in this game!', gut feels based on people's performances isn't too strange in my opinion.

What did you think of Slay's reasoning for his votes?

[Ranmaru]

Why sadly?

Imaginality, Smalls makes a good point here. Answer his question please.

[Ranmaru]

Voting on gut with 12 pages of content means there's seriously something wrong.

Voting with gut is fine if you are a gut player, but Slay doesn't seem to be the gut player. A gut player would say "I feel that..." and "You are way off" etc.

Slay just used bad reasoning and justified it with GUT.

[Ranmaru]

I may be wrong, though. Since he does say "Oh it strikes me wrong" etc. His reasons are still bad and it seems like he is trying to justify it with gut when called out for it.

[imaginality]

Sadly because he's claimed.

[Crazy]

All right, time to catch up here.

Firstly, UNVOTE: Smalls. My vote for Smalls was based on what I perceived to be a breadcrumb from LK in Post #32. I thought LK was a power role that got some sort of guilty result on Smalls N0. Apparently it wasn't, oops. Apart from that, Smalls' reaction to his wagon gives a slight newb-town vibe for me at first glance. I will look more in on this issue later.

As for my "overreacting" to Ellibereth's question about "who knew Furry," I still stand by that. Look at Ellibereth's posts. Has he even pressed on that issue at all? Has he called out the people that never answered his question? Has he made any analysis based off of people's answers. Why? Because the question

was

indeed largely pointless, and Ellibereth

was indeed

just spouting hot air.

VOTE: Ellibereth

So, Ellibereth, tell me why you asked the question in the first place and then never followed up on it? Was my prediction that it wouldn't lead to any great analysis correct?

My suspicion of imaginality, which I was delaying, was that his first post just had a large degree of passiveness to it. His two votes were both for mild reasons, he asked no questions, and really didn't express any degree of assertiveness over his suspicions, just a "That's scummy. Vote: Scummy person." His second post was even worse, since it was a load of air that accomplished nothing. His third post was the same thing and then he pinned an uncontroversial vote on Ameliaslay.

So yeah, imaginality just really isn't stepping off the sidelines at this point, and I take that to be a general scum-tell.

VOTE: imaginality

Imaginality, you also need to answer my question in my Post #56.

***
,
Sorry for coming in and throwing two votes on non-leading wagons. I've read Hiraki's "scum-slip" thing a couple times but I still don't have a grasp on it. I will have to look more into that.

[Crazy]

Hiraki smells a little bit like scum defending a mislynch for towncred.

Assuming Smalls was to flip town, what makes Hiraki more likely to be scum defending that wagon instead of town defending that wagon?

[Hiraki]

Pomegranate, why do you think Hiraki is scummy? Do you agree with everything that's been thrown at him? If not, which reasons in particular are you voting him for?

Yes, answer that.

I don't know why you couldn't answer that before...

Slay just used bad reasoning and justified it with GUT.

Which means there's something wrong. I'm glad you inadvertently agree.

[Amrun]

Hiraki smells a little bit like scum defending a mislynch for towncred.

Assuming Smalls was to flip town, what makes Hiraki more likely to be scum defending that wagon instead of town defending that wagon?

The manner in which he did it, and now he seems to be a little outraged that smalls turned on him a bit. He just seems too sure.

I don't have a high amount of confidence in this, though.

[RedCoyote]

Where's my smalls wagon?

[RedCoyote]

And why are we calling him smalls? His name is smallpeoples.

[Hiraki]

Because smalls is so much easier to write out.

[Amrun]

Because we are all subconsciously adding "biggie" before it.

[Hiraki]

I was thinking smalls from Sandlot, but w/e.

[Ranmaru]

Actually LK started it. After reading his post we all typed in Smalls instead of Small.

[Ranmaru]

Sorry for coming in and throwing two votes on non-leading wagons

. I've read Hiraki's "scum-slip" thing a couple times but I still don't have a grasp on it. I will have to look more into that.

Why did you say this in the bold?

Hmmm. Crazy, how do you feel about the rest of Elli's play? Do you think it was possible Elli used that to start off RVS discussion?

Hmmm, Imaginality didn't really press much, I agree. He sort of gave some town reads and one other scum read.

---

@

Imaginality

: What are the reasons for your town reads? Why do you only find scum in Pom and not others? What are your thoughts on Elli, RC, Kunkstar, WLC, and Empking?
@

Amrun

: Thoughts on RC, Imag, Kunkstar, and Empking plz?
@

RedCoyote

: I need some more stances bro. Like, thoughts on Empking, Elli, Imag, and WLC?
@

Iam

: Same, I need some more stances. Thoughts on RC, Kunkstar, Empking, Elli, and WLC k thx.
@

Weyoun

: Ok. Why is Amrun scum? Why is Kunkstar scum? Give me thoughts on all the rest of the players plz. Ty.
@

Pom

: Hey. Thoughts on Elli, RC, Empking, Amrun, and Imag?
@

Slay

: I want you to give me thoughts on 5-6 other players besides me and Hiraki. Scum or town and why.
@

Kunkstar

: Hey. Can you expand on your thoughts with Empking and LK? Thoughts on Image, WLC, Elli, and Pom?

---

Pomegranate, why do you think Hiraki is scummy? Do you agree with everything that's been thrown at him? If not, which reasons in particular are you voting him for?

Yes, answer that.

I don't know why you couldn't answer that before...

Slay just used bad reasoning and justified it with GUT.

Which means there's something wrong. I'm glad you inadvertently agree.

Well it either means there is something newb scummy, or just newbie because it seems Slay is used to seeing scum being activity police, especially with seeing how Small's played in his scum game, it could be possible that was her site meta. Plus it seems Slay has offsite experience:

/in? I don't know if I have three games under my belt though....

Due to Petry stating that he knows Slay has ton of experience, it sounds like they have offsite experience together and has seen him play quite a bit. This is only a theory though.

Do you agree?

[Hiraki]

I disagree.

Ameliaslay probably is semi-newb, which is a good thing to bring up.

Nice catch though. Explains his shitty reads.

[Amrun]

Imag and Empking are town; RC is null; kunkstar is null leaning scum.

[Ranmaru]

@

Hiraki

: Thank you, and yes it does. Asking him for his thoughts on other players might help in reading him.

@

Amrun

: Why Imag and Empking town? I get the rest.

[[Low Key]]

Wow. Ran is :goodposting: now. Been following along. Not sure if I'm going back to sleep right now or staying up. One thing is for sure, I will be catching up. I"ve seen a ton of excellent content. Looking forward to wading through it. See you soon.

Love,

LK

[RedCoyote]

Because smalls is so much easier to write out.

I just mean, like, it should just be small. I don't know why that needed it's own post though, lol.

---

@RedCoyote

: I need some more stances bro. Like, thoughts on Empking, Elli, Imag, and WLC?

I've had no problems with any of these players so far. WLC seems rather town to me right now. I would not be interested in voting any of them right now.