Double-Dip Mafia, Game Over

[smallpeoples343]

@Ran:

1) He claimed VT
2) He is a guaranteed LYLO risk whether scum or not
3) Even though I don't believe this, he MIGHT actually be scum

Nobody believes like this any more so its useless for me to try.

All good reasons to vote him, but are you still going to work on an alternative wagon?

Some quick comments: Ranmaru and LK is probably town on town (although Empking's ideas have me scratching my chin). I have no problem with Hiraki earning some votes. WLC is a bad wagon. My first vote will most likely not be leaving smalls due in large part to his premature claim.

1) The above with LK 229, is that about me?

Quite frankly, I don't believe I'll even make it to LYLO. With Hiraki and [Low Key], and a bunch of others that seem to want to just lynch me ASAP, I'll be really amazed if I even make it to Day 3.

2) OMG, this game is so full of wagons.

3) In response to quick comments:

Rarnmaru and LK are talking a lot and scumhunting, but all I can say is don't rule out the chance that they could be scum, although it seems unlikely that both are scum. WLC just seems like he's annoying everyone. Ehh... I do see that my claim was premature, but I was at L-1 at the time. Forgive me for being a little desperate.

[smallpeoples343]

Also, from that question about confirming in-thread.

Mafia Game 57
Mafia Game 64 (a little different as the confirm is shown by saying

2of4

)
Mafia Game 63 (same as 64 above)

The above 3 are examples are Newbie Games.

Impossibly Entangled (Mafia Game 62)
Mafia Game 56 (the beginning where everyone says "--Nuked--" was a joke)
Mafia Game 52 (Mod Abandoned)

The 3 above are Mafia Games (we don't have a division between Large and Mini. We're trying to implement one though)

[smallpeoples343]

Note: Why does it seem the only time I'm active, is when everyone is not posting?

[Empking]

Small: When did you claim?

[smallpeoples343]

When I was in L-1, I just said that once you guys killed me, you would find out that I was just a townie.

[imaginality]

Only skimmed the last few pages. Hiraki seems town to me though, all the 'was it 2 or 3 scumreads on the wagon' stuff seemed like the typical 'townie's confusing explanation gets painted to look scummy' situation that comes up every game.

Of the people on Hiraki's wagon:

I buy small's play and claim as having that town scent to it. Sadly.

I have a gut town read on Amrun but want to hear her reason for calling WLC scum in such strong terms. (If it's just gut, come join the Pom wagon instead Amrun like you were considering.)

I found [Low Key] hard to read at first but looking through his iso I get a townread now.

iamausername, hmm, keeping an eye on him for now. Expect to have a clear read after his next few posts.

As for Pom:

The way she said "My RVS vote on Hiraki is now a serious vote. Scummmy" without going into any more detail seemed a lazy-scummy act.
"In regard to Elli's question, realize that I was protown enough to respond to it" rang badly in iso#2 (the 'I was protown' bit).
"Seriously considering joining smallwagon-- just considering whether L-1 makes sense now" in iso#3 is also bad. "I don't think L-1 makes sense now" would have been a legitimate reason to not vote him, but "just considering" sounds like a convenient excuse to stay on the sidelines.

I'm keeping my vote on her, on her.

(Though I accept the 'random vote' thing was a null-tell in her case.)


Crazy's looked a bit better since earlier, which leads me to reinterpret his jumping on Ellibereth's question as blundering town rather than scum.

Unvote: Crazy

Vote: Ameliaslay

until we get that promised 'further comment on content'.

[smallpeoples343]

Why sadly?

[Ameliaslay]

unvote

vote: Hiraki, Ranmaru

To answer the questions asked of my votes, by Empking. I initially placed only one vote and randomly to give myself the opportunity to look over the thread. I hadn't yet decided how I wanted to use both votes, although I thought in tandem is a little strange, as second votes might be more useful to place pressure.

To comment on one of the wagons, I was initially a bit confused by the smalls wagon-- to me he reads very newb, but not necessarily newb scum. But as the latter end of the thread progresses he seems very willing-- almost falling over himself to accomodate requests for outside of game activity on other sites. That over-eager to please mentality strikes me wrong. I also really didn't like the comment in post #198, where he mentions that we should look tomorrow for those attacking him hardest. That being said, I don't know that this sways my balance toward a vote.

As to reasons for my current votes, I haven't really been fond of the tone of Hiraki's posts.. he seems pretty excitable early game. However, I really haven't liked either Lowkey or Ranmaru's method of scum-hunting. Both of them seem to rely on a form of metagaming, that forgive me as I haven't played in a while seems like going beyond the pale. As in this post by Ranmaru:

Actually, I was asking because before he has been set to visible. I told him I would be checking his recent posts to make sure he is following up with the game, but I didn't want to sound like a creeper. He usually jokes around and I'm fine with throwing some sillyness toward him. He knows that I have called him out and multiple others and still do. I am sad at him being invisible.

The only time I remember ever watching who's visible/not-- timestamps, etc. was as scum looking for justifications to point fingers at other players. Lowkey and Ranmaru seem to use similar logic to point fingers at smalls and redcoyote, on what I think of as weak cases, especially given my preference towards only looking in game at in game behavior.

[Empking]

Unvote: LK
Vote: Ran

[Ellibereth]

Crazy's looked a bit better since earlier

Hmmma? I think he had only 3 posts or so since your last? What changed.

[Ellibereth]

Unvote Small, vote iam

[Hiraki]

As to reasons for my current votes, I haven't really been fond of the tone of Hiraki's posts.. he seems pretty excitable early game.

This is your reasoning for a vote?

Why me amci. Why are you so scummy?

[smallpeoples343]

As to reasons for my current votes, I haven't really been fond of the tone of Hiraki's posts.. he seems pretty excitable early game.

This is your reasoning for a vote?

Why me amci. Why are you so scummy?

At this point, it just seems like you're calling everyone who votes for you scummy.

[Hiraki]

As to reasons for my current votes, I haven't really been fond of the tone of Hiraki's posts.. he seems pretty excitable early game.

This is your reasoning for a vote?

Why me amci. Why are you so scummy?

At this point, it just seems like you're calling everyone who votes for you scummy.

And?

Not to mention that you totally dodged that misrep you pulled on me without daring to comment on it, but I've called 2 people on my wagon now scum, only one before that.

I can't say much about Amrun but he's using shit logic with his vote.

You've voted me for no big reason, which is honestly pissing me off because I have a pretty strong town read on you but you won't give a decent scumtell on why I'm scum, and I'm pissed off for the above misrep.

Pomegrante has a vote on me from RVS.

And [Low Key] has decided to ignore my defense on his vote, which also has horrible reasoning like Amrun. Therefore, smalls, I'm giving you one last chance. I'm starting to really think that I might be wrong on some of my newbie tells with your actions.

I want you after this post to check your facts, because you keep making things up, and even though that's more of what a newbie would do, a newbie would also apologize for their mistakes or acknowledge his or her mistakes. You have not done this, nor have you even backed down on me when I have proven you clearly wrong.

[WeyounsLastClone]

Pom, explain your WLC vote.

Pot, kettle.

[Hiraki]

I'm sick of fucking Pot, kettle. It's a broken tell unless someone flips scum.

And yes, I am particularly pissed off at this game.

[WeyounsLastClone]

I'm sick of fucking Pot, kettle. It's a broken tell unless someone flips scum.

And yes, I am particularly pissed off at this game.

We're not even playing for five days. What exactly pisses you off? If it's the votes on you, that's part of the game. I think smalls has a point, you calling everyone voting you scummy, but I do feel that's kind of a towntell.

The speed of voting/unvoting kind of catched myself off guard, but I suppose it was expected with everyone having two posts.

[Hiraki]

Considering that I've already addressed that point where I've only called 2 people on my wagon, scum, thanks for reading.

[Amrun]

Pom, explain your WLC vote.

Pot, kettle.

This is me:



I like it that way.


RC, STOP INSULTING MY WAGON!

[Ameliaslay]

As to reasons for my current votes, I haven't really been fond of the tone of Hiraki's posts.. he seems pretty excitable early game.

This is your reasoning for a vote?

Why me amci. Why are you so scummy?

If the latter is directed at me, I'm confused as to the amci part. As to the former, yes... you've been very angry early on at any votes and in general in tone-- or on the defensive it seems. While some might read that as pro-town, I don't necessarily.

Also, could I get clarification from you as to what you meant by this post?

Damn.

Damn Empking.

You voted on both sides of the argument.

[Hiraki]

If the latter is directed at me, I'm confused as to the amci part. As to the former, yes... you've been very angry early on at any votes and in general in tone-- or on the defensive it seems. While some might read that as pro-town, I don't necessarily.

That's not a definite scumtell. Who else is scum?

The second quote is that Empking wasn't taking a firm stance and trying to pressure both. I know see what he means, but ergle. I don't see the real potential in finding scum using that method. It's more of a disagreement rather than something that's not good.

[Ameliaslay]

Well, I do tend to put my votes where my mouth is. I'm on you and Ranmaru.

And as to "definite scum-tell".. that's rather a subjective thing, isn't it? I go on my gut-- if I don't like tone, that's where I put my vote.

[Hiraki]

Voting on gut with 12 pages of content means there's seriously something wrong.

[WeyounsLastClone]

Voting on gut with 12 pages of content means there's seriously something wrong.

Seriously, looking at everything from a negative angle? Unless I've missed a post from someone saying 'hello, I'm actually mafia in this game!', gut feels based on people's performances isn't too strange in my opinion.

[Pomegranate]

Pomegrante has a vote on me from RVS.

Well, yeah, it is

from

RVS, but I stated explicitly that it's no longer an RVS vote, but rather a serious one.