Double-Dip Mafia, Game Over

[RedCoyote]

Oh, no, that's not for a couple of weeks yet. I'm just posting from work now.

[Ranmaru]

@

LK

:

Actually, I was asking because before he has been set to visible. I told him I would be checking his recent posts to make sure he is following up with the game, but I didn't want to sound like a creeper. He usually jokes around and I'm fine with throwing some sillyness toward him. He knows that I have called him out and multiple others and still do. I am sad at him being invisible. ;-;

Ah, well I see. You think Iam was faking concern with his vote on RC? Do you think it could have been a coincidence? (Besides his Small vote which would make sense because of the minimal reasoning on smalls?)

"So, what to do..." Implies he doesn't know what to talk about in the sign up thread, or that he HAS something to do but just doesn't know what. This is why I say you should ask him why he said that to garner a reaction, that would be a good direction to go with your theory. I just don't think that's a statement that would make someone appear pro-town.

LK, can you point out what you believe I have mis-understood? I have read it thoroughly.

@

Red

: Why exactly do you agree with LK's theory? What are your thoughts on it?

[RedCoyote]

I think it's a potentially a valid slip-up. I mean, it's a stretch, but I will go for that on a D1 lynch. Besides, that was my only real beef with LK. I think he cleared it up well enough. Plus he didn't get on my case for trying to frame him or something like that, which is always a positive. It shows me that he's more interested in understanding why I came to the conclusion that he was scum than he was attacking me for it.

[[Low Key]]

@

LK

:Ah, well I see. You think Iam was faking concern with his vote on RC? Do you think it could have been a coincidence? (Besides his Small vote which would make sense because of the minimal reasoning on smalls?)

I don't think Iam was faking anything but I will let him respond to that; I have my own theory.

LK, can you point out what you believe I have mis-understood? I have read it thoroughly.

Each of your questions revolve around my leaning town read on Iam, inactive players and "other reasons". They are all explained in post #161.

[petroleumjelly]

Day One: Vote Count #9

7 smallpeoples343 (iamausername, [Low Key], Crazy, Ellibereth, Empking, Amrun, RedCoyote)
3 Crazy (imaginality, Ellibereth, smallpeoples343)
3 Hiraki (Pomegranate, iamausername, smallpeoples343)
2 imaginality (Pomegranate, Hiraki)
2 Pomegranate (Empking, imaginality)
1 [Low Key] (Ranmaru)
1 Ameliaslay (Ranmaru)
1 Amrun (WeyounsLastClone)
1 Ellibereth (Ameliaslay)
1 iamausername (Hiraki)
1 kunkstar7 (WeyounsLastClone)
1 Ranmaru ([Low Key])
1 WeyounsLastClone (Amrun)

With

15

alive, it takes

8

to lynch. Deadline is July 15 at 4:00 PM PDT.

Not Voting – 1 – kunkstar7

Mod Note:

Post #172 was treated as a complete unvote, in accordance with Special Rule #4(a) – I will

always

consider a simple

Unvote

that does not specify a target as unvoting

every player you are voting

.

To explain: I do not want to be put in a situation where somebody asks me to “fix” a voting mistake, while another player (or perhaps the same player) covertly asks for the mistake to be enforced according to the rules. If you make a mistake, fix it the right way. When in doubt, the rules will

always

control.

Thanks!

[[Low Key]]

SMALLS IS AT L-1. Please do not hammer without a claim.

[[Low Key]]

I am of the opinion that since we have two votes that we should have a competing wagon with Smalls. Also it is too early to end the day.

Several people have low content levels, only RVS votes or only one vote even.

[Ranmaru]

Ah ok, that's fine.

I thought you were being sarcastic because at the time Iam was the first to post but wasn't the only one who was inactive.

Also, why don't you respond to this part of my post?

"So, what to do..." Implies he doesn't know what to talk about in the sign up thread, or that he HAS something to do but just doesn't know what. This is why I say you should ask him why he said that to garner a reaction, that would be a good direction to go with your theory. I just don't think that's a statement that would make someone appear pro-town.

I do think you should ask questions, LK. You can't just post an accusation without asking questions to the suspect. It makes it seem like you don't care about finding that persons alignment, and rather just care to ACCUSE people and let it sit for reactions.

Unvote Unvote

Vote: KunkStar

Why aren't you voting yet, KunkStar?

Vote: Amiliaslay

Psst, Lk. All you have to do is say "He's at l-1".

[Ranmaru]

Hmm... no clue why RVS applied to me

Vote: iamausername

Vote: Pom

because Pom have tasty seeds, but make terrible juice.

Err now that i'm re-reading, do you think Small is feigning ignorance to what he posted in the sign up thread, LK?

[Ranmaru]

My other vote will go towards imaginality/Ellibereth at some point, unless they can convince me that the question "Who knew Furry?" actually did have some potently awesome scum-hunting power behind it.

Now that Elli has claimed, what are your thoughts on him now? Do agree with his theory?

[Ranmaru]

Why was the response to Elli overcompensating?

It was a scum hunting probe. Your reaction was not from a pro-town mindset; it was more defensive and appears as an attempt to discourage it rather than allow it to go forward to see what reactions are garnered. This is bad.

And the fact that Plum's my older sister is entirely irrelevant to the game; why even mention it? I find that scummy.

Its more of a bit of trivia and a joke than anything else. I don't see any scum motivation for it at all.

Link Request

Please link to us at least two games where, as town, you have used the stated "random voting" in RVS.

---

Links requested:
Science Mafia
Twitter Mafia

--

In regard to Elli's question, realize that I was protown enough to respond to it. Had I not wanted it to go forward I wouldn't have answered.
In regard to the mention of Plum, I take back my comment saying it was scummy; it wasn't really scummy rather than irrelevant and out of place.

LK WHY HAVEN'T YOU FOLLOWED UP WITH THIS? WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF ASKING HER FOR LINKS IF YOU DON'T EVEN SAY ANYTHING ABOUT IT LATER?

[[Low Key]]

3 Crazy (imaginality, Ellibereth, smallpeoples343)

-- I think his reaction was over the top on Eli's questrion. I think this has some merit as scum could be defensive about their decision to off Furry. I would like to see Crazy weigh in more and give his game views.

3 Hiraki (Pomegranate, iamausername, smallpeoples343)

-- I think Iam definitely caught cog-dis here but I am not sure if Hiraki has almost defended it well enough. I would like to see this case fleshed out and Hiraki clarify his voting stances. I disagree entirely with his defense of smalls.

2 imaginality (Pomegranate, Hiraki)

-- I see no merit in this wagon whatsoever.

2 Pomegranate (Empking, imaginality)

-- She needs to post more, and come up with non-RVS voting suspects. I think her defense has been good even if her resposnse to Eli was ott and am willing to give her slack.

1 [Low Key] (Ranmaru)

-- I don't like how this vote occurred; again I am seeing disingenuous and manufactured thought processes in-thread that indicate nervous scum in my eyes.

1 Ameliaslay (Ranmaru)

-- I disagree with this vote and entry post analysis. She said she will be giving input soon.

1 Amrun (WeyounsLastClone)

-- I disagree here and am holding Amrun as a town read for town thought processes.

1 Ellibereth (Ameliaslay)

-- This is a meaningless RVS vote

1 iamausername (Hiraki)

-- I completely disagree here 100%.

1 kunkstar7 (WeyounsLastClone)

-- I can understand this but in reading his analysis of the Furry kill, I am leaning town on kunkstar here. He does need to vote and post game reads though.

1 Ranmaru ([Low Key])

-- I think this wagon has merit. I have seen alot of non-town-like thought processes and bad analysis/voting from this slot.

1 WeyounsLastClone (Amrun)

-- I do not understand this read or vote. I think Wey has defended well but he needs to have a second vote and game reads too.

[[Low Key]]

Hmm... no clue why RVS applied to me

Vote: iamausername

Vote: Pom

because Pom have tasty seeds, but make terrible juice.

Err now that i'm re-reading, do you think Small is feigning ignorance to what he posted in the sign up thread, LK?

I think his response there reinforces him as scum; "who/why me" is perfectly in line with "oh I have nothing to do" while chatting it up in the scum QT. Even if that wasn't true it is still a bad post on its own merits.

[[Low Key]]

LK WHY HAVEN'T YOU FOLLOWED UP WITH THIS? WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF ASKING HER FOR LINKS IF YOU DON'T EVEN SAY ANYTHING ABOUT IT LATER?

Dear goodness, if you don't mind I read her reponse and have posted a little on it above. See my votecount analysis on her wagon.

[Ranmaru]

If it wasn't true, why exactly is his post still bad? I mean it's like you are saying "Well if I'm wrong about it, it's still bad so it's ok to be suspicious of it", essentially having a fall back.

Yes but did you read the games then? Why exactly did you ask for links?

Why do you disagree with my Slay vote?

What are your reads on: Elli, Slay, and Imaginality, and Pom?

Why exactly do you lean town with Kunkstar?

What essentially did you think was bad analysis from me?

[[Low Key]]

1) There is no reason to read the games, she voted "random" in the RVS as town. That nullifies that scum tell. What more do you want??

2) She said she was going to post analysis soon. She obviously has a reason to vote Eli even though I don't and I see no reason to vote her before that unless she doesn't follow through and starts lurking.

3)

Eli, Imagine

leaning town.

Slay, Pom

null.

4) Kunkstar's analysis of the NK wes stellar, pro-town goodness. He doesn't need to be a D1 lynch based on the merits of that UNLESS he fails to follow through with game reads and votes and such like that. He mentioned R/L issues, give the guy a break for the moment??

5) Both your Amelia and Kunkstar votes were whey over the top overcompensating and read as disingenuous grasping at straws.

[Ranmaru]

If it wasn't true, why exactly is his post still bad? I mean it's like you are saying "Well if I'm wrong about it, it's still bad so it's ok to be suspicious of it", essentially having a fall back.

[[Low Key]]

You can't be serious. I have stated clearly what I have thought in this thread of both his sign-up thread role PM post and his entry post. That's how I feel about it. I see them as straight forward scum tells.

His subsequent posts in this thread have been terribly underwhelming.

My posts on the matter are self-explanatory.

[[Low Key]]

That being said, we need a competing wagon and I would like to see cases for such fleshed out itt and a second person run up.

[Ranmaru]

I was referring to the specific post I quoted. Why are you deflecting to his WHOLE play when I'm asking about

one minor

detail? Chill.

That was his FIRST post into the game. It isn't particularly bad because he at least participates and votes in the RVS (with reasons too). You say that post is bad but you like Slay's entry post?

Fair enough on the links thing. Btw, what did you think of Pom's responses?

I do see a reason to vote her.

Why exactly are you leaning town on Elli and Imaginality?

Why exactly was it pro town goodness?

He said he had R/L issues to attend to at the time, but he didn't say he would have be away for some time DUE TO R/L ISSUES. I'm not going to unvote for that, LK. :/ (Unless he goes V/la or is inactive to the point of needing prods or replacement, then I'd vote else where because my vote wouldn't do much at that time)

I disagree that my votes were whey ovah da top.

[[Low Key]]

That was his FIRST post into the game. It isn't particularly bad because he at least participates and votes in the RVS (with reasons too). You say that post is bad but you like Slay's entry post?

Amelia has no scum tells in her entry post. You either did not read or have conveniently forgotten my case on Smalls. He posted a "who/why me" post (which is a scum tell in itself) and that in combination with his RVS votes in a content full thread demonstrate a desire to fit in while avoiding suspicion for any stances. There is plenty of scum motivation in that post. You can't point to any such thing in Amelia's post. You jumped on her for saying she was busy and would catch up soon: read disingenuous grasping at straws.

Why exactly are you leaning town on Elli and Imaginality?

Eli has shown a pro-town mindset in calling out the scum NK. He has also made good votes with pro-town reasoning that I agree with. Imagine's stance on Eli's question is pro-town and his suspect list is one that I agree with.

Why exactly was it pro town goodness?

You don't understand this? I think you should ask Eli. Kunkstar has made a clear case, using his own well thought out logic, for how the Furry NK must have a scum connection. Actually though, I just realized something. In all the flurry of posting I failed to read my notes where I didn't like Kunkstar's entry post; but I liked his last post so much it kind of made up for that. He also posted some reads which was nice and demonstrated a town-wide read by pointing out vote switching. Granted, he does need to post more, come up with scum suspects and actually vote.

Maybe I can give you some merit for the Kunkstar vote but with his latest post I disagree and think he deserves some slack and the ability to further catch up.

[[Low Key]]

I did disagree with your analysis of Kunkstar's entry post though and I read it as reaching.

[Empking]

Unvote

Vote: Low Key
Vote: Ran

[smallpeoples343]

Wow. All this conversation about me acting a lot smarter than I actually am

Seriously guys, it was just some random bandwagonning.

Small seems like a person who plays on Smogon type mafia. They seem to rely on roles and pm-ing people instead of actually talking in thread. Rather, I have played mafia on RaymanPC and that's how they played. Their meta for mafia is that people who PUSH for wagons are usually the mafia. I take it as a newb town tell.

I'm assuming Smogon is a website, but no, I don't rely on PM's, I just thought of that as more of a question about me, than rather about my involvement in this game. I see my mistake.

I know from seeing that I'm at L-1 that I'm dead anyways, so I urge town to look for the people who've been attacking me the hardest.

Hmm... anything I say otherwise is probably going to be countered by some mafia person who hammers me, so I guess that's it.

I might post an analysis of some players later today.

[smallpeoples343]

"So, what to do..." Implies he doesn't know what to talk about in the sign up thread, or that he HAS something to do but just doesn't know what. This is why I say you should ask him why he said that to garner a reaction, that would be a good direction to go with your theory. I just don't think that's a statement that would make someone appear pro-town.

In response to that:

1) I didn't see in my role PM the "Confirm by PM", and on the site where I normally play, we confirm in-thread. That's why I was the last to confirm.

2) I didn't know that games would be transferred to Theme Park (which now seems obvious) so I thought the game was still being played in the "Queue" section. At that time, it seemed that no one was posting and I just simply put "So, what to do..." as a way to spark conversation.