Team Mafia: Pick Your Power (Game Over)

[SpyreX]

My only worry about massclaim is if scum have the N2 vig or the Roleblocker - we stand to lose out in the long run if that is the case, because giving scum the keys to the game with those two powers out there that can completely shut the down the town power. Locking claims in is good though - it keeps the vigs honest. Thoughts on voting for the vig's shot, so scum have to play it straight? Or we assess its alignment based on its shot?

Vigs on a leash, RB's on a quasi-leash.

Problem solved.

I mean Kise who beats his head against this wall STILL keeps going "Well, don't claim BUT (all this would be done in claiming).

I'm tired and I'm being berated by my compatriots for thinking top-down was a good idea. Someone educate me on the bottom-up / top-down?

[Hoopla]

I think we should have the Roleblocker claim, and if we think it's town (there are a couple of players/positions/reasons where I think it will look town) then we should arrange some kind of massclaim. I'm not massclaiming if I think a scum 3-shot-roleblocker can shut down the entire night. All it takes is a Scum RB hidden somewhere in the middle to claim VT (or even role-swap with a buddy - especially more easy if scum have the Role Cop) and scum can do whatever the hell they want tonight.

[SpyreX]

I'm looking at it this way.

Lets say I claim N2 Vig.

You claim roleblocker.

We say clearly, DO NOT ROLEBLOCK ME.

I get roleblocked. You are now up the creek and scum (even if not the RB).

[SpyreX]

Anywho bedtime.

[Hoopla]

Look at it this way - if we went ahead with a bottom-up massclaim and nobody claimed roleblocker, we're screwed. Scum doesn't have to claim the RB, and we've just given them complete information. And if it's in the hands of anyone halfway competent who's not in the limelight today, you've lost tonight's actions (and a town PR), and possibly more the next night.

[quadz08]

Hey everyone. Post will come soon. I was visiting my parents, and was much busier than expected. My apologies.

[PranaDevil]

Specifically the bolded. I don't believe I've ever had a town read on Quadz. Never had a town read on GreyICE, but didn't have a scum read on him either, and Kise I had felt was town. Also the post you linked to states that I didn't have a town read on Quadz. So you claiming I did isn't just wrong, but blatantly false. Don't make me have to change my town read on you Hoopla.

Ugh, please forgive me. I went back and full reread the posts I was getting this info from - you said you thought the top 3 were town, not top 4. I misread this somehow. That was sloppy of me.

I still think my point on GreyICE's wagon having no unique numbered players on it is relevant, but I withdraw the logic I built based on false information. Would you be up for a quadz lynch today still?

Just had a nice look at Quadz in ISO. The one and only thing that makes me second guess him being scum is the second number. 13 is damned high after all. But it could also be scum WIFOM, as there wouldn't have been so many doubled up first numbers in theory (in practice, 4 people picking 6, and 3 picking 1 was a shocker, but a beauty for town).

So yeah, I'm up for a Quadz lynch.

SSBF in ISO looks bad, after his joke vote on me he does a large post which really doesn't do much but agree and disagree with people, even agreeing that LLD is right against GI and Amrun only to vote her still, which stinks of keeping his options open "in case he was wrong". Then some "I can't post yet" posts, bit of buddying with me after Zito's vote on me (top marks for putting it there again Zito, when you want to join in the game, let us know). His last post just reads like he's trying to convince everyone else that his vote for LLD is coming from town.

So I'll favour the Quadz lynch, but will be happy with an SSBF (Quadz should go first though, as high placing scum is the biggest danger to town, the lower the scum are, the more likely they'll be a goon).

vote: Quadz

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I'm actually rather uneasy about a quadz lynch right now.

I REALLY don't like the people on his wagon.

[Kise]

You all must want me to become indecent......Why are votes being spread? Prana, there was already something going on SSBF.

[PranaDevil]

SSBF is a good secondary lynch, but he's 7th in the draft. There's absolutely no chance he's the highest ranked scum (and that's without the fact that for that to be the case the scum have to have picked the same first number at least twice).

Ergo, finding the scum ABOVE him is much more important, and that's either Quadz or you Kise. (Hoopla at a very slim push, but I've no reason not to believe her at the moment). Of the two of you, Quadz is most likely scum. Thus we lynch Quadz.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

SSBF is a good secondary lynch, but he's 7th in the draft. There's absolutely no chance he's the highest ranked scum (and that's without the fact that for that to be the case the scum have to have picked the same first number at least twice).

Ergo, finding the scum ABOVE him is much more important, and that's either Quadz or you Kise. (Hoopla at a very slim push, but I've no reason not to believe her at the moment). Of the two of you, Quadz is most likely scum. Thus we lynch Quadz.

But I don't like how the Quadz wagon is being used to draw attention away from SSBF.

So, no. SSBF dies today.

[Kise]

I don't understand this obsession you and SpyreX have to eliminate power roles. Primary, secondary, smeckondary! Two town down, no scum. Goon or no goon, a secondary suspect is still a good choice to lynch. It's not like SSBF is at the bottom of your scumlist. With no jailer, scum can kill whoever they want anyway...

[PranaDevil]

Quadz is still the better lynch.

Kise, LLD, how many PYP games have you played thus far?

Now how many have I played? How many has Hoopla played? How many has Spyrex modded?

Now, how many times have scum won?

I'd say advantage to the old guard on this one.

You have to remember scum can kill AND use their power role if they have one. Ergo, killing scum with power roles is better than killing scum with no roles. The higher the scum are in the pecking order, the more likely they are to have a role. In turn, it's also much better to lynch scum higher up.

It's not rocket science people.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Fuck this.

Unvote; Vote: Prana

The above post is terribad. "I HAVE MORE EXPERIENCE THAN YOU, SO YOU LISTEN TO ME HERP".

No.

[PranaDevil]

LLD, I'm saying, actually listen to EVERYONE who has more experience in this style of game than you. What you're saying is that the numbers are meaningless.

THIS IS KNOWN TO BE FALSE.

Either you are scum, or playing like shit as town.

You ballsed it up royally for us in CYS, don't do the same here by pretending you don't need to listen to those who have played PYP before.

[zoraster]

Day 2 Vote Count

Debonair Danny DiPietro ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

Faraday ( 1 ) SpyreX,

(L - 5 )

Hoopla ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

Kise ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

Lady LambdaDelta ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

Papa Zito ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

PranaDevil ( 2 ) Papa Zito, Lady LambdaDelta,

(L - 4 )

quadz08 ( 2 ) Hoopla, PranaDevil,

(L - 4 )

Slaxx ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

SpyreX ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

Super Smash Bros. Fan ( 3 ) Faraday, Slaxx, Kise,

(L - 3 )

No Lynch ( 0 )

(L - 6 )

Not Voting ( 3 ) Debonair Danny DiPietro, quadz08, Super Smash Bros. Fan,
Total Votes ( 11 )

Deadline: June 2nd at 23:00 EDT
7 Days Banked
With 11 able to vote, 6 needed to lynch.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

LLD, I'm saying, actually listen to EVERYONE who has more experience in this style of game than you.

What you're saying is that the numbers are meaningless.

THIS IS KNOWN TO BE FALSE.

Either you are scum, or playing like shit as town.

You ballsed it up royally for us in CYS, don't do the same here by pretending you don't need to listen to those who have played PYP before.

The Ad Hom is noted.

The bolded Misrepresentation is noted. I have never stated such a thing. They are important.

But lynching scum is more important.

And frankly, you haven't given a real case on Quadz yet. All it's been is "HERP HE'S HIGH ON THE LIST, LET'S LYNCH HIM".

Show me why he's scum based on gameplay, and I'll give it more credence.

But scumhunting > all.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Either you are scum, or playing like shit as town.

OOH.

I almost missed the false Dichotomy and deliberate attempt at discrediting me.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

And as a final note: You have no right to talk about CYS, considering your own play in that game.

[PranaDevil]

Okay, just went through LLD in ISO.

She distances from Quadz early on, but never once votes for him despite thinking he was scummy. Then calls him town because he defends her from an attack (huh?), proceeds to then push GI and SSBF heavily, and now decides to change her direction from SSBF (someone she's been pushing since middle of day 1) to me because she doesn't want to listen.

I'm wondering if SSBF is town, and is a good mislynch for scum here now.

In fact, I'm willing to suggest a scum team of:
Quadz, LLD, DDD

So... sorry, I'm no longer happy with an SSBF lynch, not after LLD's play, I don't see them as scum together, at all, and LLD's play screams more of scum than SSBF's after viewing it in ISO.

Vote will stay on Quadz, as there's no reason to lynch someone in the 6s just yet, she's too far down the pecking order, but the night 2 vig can take her out tonight.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

This is amusing.

Prana is perfectly content to go along with pseudo-supporting an SSBF lynch and call me town.

Until I start to attack him.

At which point he does a 360 and I'm now scum with Quadz(because he can't change that read, or he'd be TOO obvious scum) and DDD.

SSBF can be dealt with another day. Prana is scum.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Also, when did Quadz ever defend me from an attack?

He agreed that SSBF's case was bullshit... but in the same post continued to call me scum.

This is further misrepresentation of the facts on your part.

[Debonair Danny DiPietro]

Previously withheld meta-point

I think people who are trying to clear quadz based on meta-gaming are making a serious mistake. First, he’s almost certainly on a team with Singersinger who flipped scum in the completed game which already makes it more likely that he’d have to take a scum PM changing the dynamics of things significantly.

Laters, going golfing.

[PranaDevil]

LLD: They aren't Damn Near Identical. Period. No way, no how.

SSBF's post is bad. His point on GI has been made a jillion times, and his points on LLD are all poor. He gives decent reasoning for Amrun-scum, then backs off with "but I'm not certain about it." I agree with his conclusions, but his logic to get there was terribad.

Well... this is interesting.

Um, if Quadz was scum, why would he discredit the only real case that has been posted on me so far...

Heh. This post earns Quadz some town cred.

This is what I was talking about LLD, I had a quick look at your ISO. YOU said he discredited the only real case on you. Not me. Don't call me for misrepping something YOU posted. Fucksake.

And DDD, what the abba are you bleating about? Singer had a scum PM, therefore people on her team are more likely to have a scum PM? That makes no sense. An entire team doesn't get "you are all going to be scum". swift was on my team, does that mean it's more, or less likely I'd be scum? Or course it bloody doesn't. It's more likely, on average, for teams to have 1 scum and 3 town PMs, but we know, as fact, that at least one team would have all town PMs. So what the hell are you attempting to say? Because it's rubbish so far.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

He discredited the case=/= he defended me.

You'll note he calls me scum in the same post.