Mafia MetaMafia ~ Game Over!

[Magua]

P-edit: @VP, @Magua: Nobody having Solism is probably a point for SK-Solism theory of mine.

Although it's aesthetically appealing, it's inconclusive with the number of dead players.

I agree with sottyrulez, for what it's worth. Not interested in lynching VPB. Let scum shoot him. Scum can take the risk that he's going to gun for town, but there's no way that hito was in the confirmed-town camp at the end of D2, so I'm comfortable with letting them take that risk.

[Demonic Angel]

How many scum have you been responsible for the death of, MoI? Thought so.

Well had I been handed a killing role probably more ... but I got weeeeeeeeeeee balanced blandness.

But continue to flail around. You are losing this game as SK VPB. Just accept it.

Considering your reads this game, LOLNO. Which leads us to believe you're scum.

The role that you had been handed is completely anti-town. Each player has multiple casts, so scum powers would have to be great to counter this. Your choice to globally block all powerful casts (3 Faith+) is scummy as hell. I'm guessing we got lucky with a town RB or enabler redirect or something, but Kats and I have decided they shouldn't claim just to verify that you indeed have this scum power.

VP is not the play today, nor tomorrow. Plum is the only other wagon I would accept besides MoI, but even MoI doesn't want to bus her yet so I guess we'll just have to remove him, go with the faith plan, and see what happens.

-Demon

[Demonic Angel]

Also, I would have a fake claim better than Solism. derp. Trust the people who have played Vi games before.

What's so bad about a Solism fake-claim?

Tar's got to have some domain...

[ooba]

Again, I reiterate, whether you think I'm SK or not is irrelevant. If I am, then you're simply going to have an easier time winning as town. I can't win if I was, and I have demonstrated I'm out to kill scum. Use common sense.

I'm not voting you for the lynch am I?

In a game where 6 faith gives me a great cast, not powering up someone I think is scum to 7-10 cast is common sense.

[VP Baltar]

ooba, I only need two worships to get a double vig. it's not like I'm redirecting people away from powering you up. I'm not saying you're trying to lynch me. I'm saying you're trying to divert from me doing my job, which is killing scum.

[Plum]

you are lolflailscum and have been all game? Your play here is basically identical to your scum play in Mafia Holographica. The idea of VPB will kill anyone he can get away with is dumb. Even if I managed to gain my triple vig tonight (which I wouldn't and suggested I only take the double to out more scumz), I'd never have the numbers to win. How are you incapable of understanding that?

I don't trust you. As SK you will kill whomever you can get away with killing however you can. You may well be able to manipulate the numbers better than most players can expect at this point, you may have powers which will help keep you alive when PoE finally comes around, you may claim you were Redirected, you may kill enough Townies that Town has to worry about TIGERs again. Are all of these true? Probably not. It's not paranoia not to trust a liar who is extremely likely to be the SK even if you can't predict which tactics he will use. The argument that I ought to trust you because if you were scum no one would trust you long enough to allow you to win is not the sort I will stand for or buy into.

My play this game resembles Holographica? Refresh my memory because I'm not seeing it.

As for redirects and being redirected. Is that really a possibility that you want to sell us on as a legitimate theory with no evidence that redirection exists thus far? Claims like this only make us like our vote on you more.

The fears, I am not buying into them.

I am giving an example of one of the many ways VPB-SK may try to excuse the number of Townies he hits and the players he chooses to shoot. I am merely warning everyone who doesn't believe he's SK - like you - to be aware that he is liable to use various tactics to try to stay Town in your eyes as he makes kills that benefit him, not the Town (and that will be Towndeaths, not scumdeaths, and the less viable lynch is a better kill for him).

The idea of a botched claim is stupid. I claimed what I did. Turns out I messed up...it's not unheard of, nor would it have mattered for my abilities anyhow. Re: 1v1 - I've told you why I disagree on that. Finally, my point was that I do think you're getting confused because you don't like how I play. I understand I can be a bit rough around the edges when I'm trying to get people to wise up and make smart choices, but being aggressive and trying to win =/= scum traits necessarily.

But you didn't mention it. When asked, you completely didn't realize that Worshipping your own Domain Night 1 was a mistake, which you wold have if you honestly as Town made that mistake. I'm not voting you for the mistake in actions. Your claimed actions and the way you made your claims and responded to my question don't line up at all. That's a damn good reason to call you scum. SK in this case. The fact that I know your kills will benefit you and scum more than Town at this point makes me want you dead and definitely not boosted with Worships. It also makes me not trust to the notion that you don't have a viable win left in you as SK. Whatever you do will be harming us, given the number of dead TIGERs. It will be to our detriment and hurt our wincon.

Also, I would have a fake claim better than Solism. derp. Trust the people who have played Vi games before.

WTH is this WIFOM.

[VP Baltar]

Plum, what exactly would be my motivation for killing townies over tigers at this point? That's what you completely fail to address in your fearmongering wall posts. You can repeat yourself all you like, it doesn't make sense.

Your play here resembles holographica because you've been lurky and when you've posted it's been weaksauce malarky. It's your scum meta.

re: fakeclaims - p. much every Vi game I've ever been in with flavor, she writes a fakeclaim for you upon request. Which you should know having been scum in her games before.

Wall posts are unnecessary.

[Plum]

Plum, what exactly would be my motivation for killing townies over tigers at this point? That's what you completely fail to address in your fearmongering wall posts. You can repeat yourself all you like, it doesn't make sense.

Your play here resembles holographica because you've been lurky and when you've posted it's been weaksauce malarky. It's your scum meta.

re: fakeclaims - p. much every Vi game I've ever been in with flavor, she writes a fakeclaim for you upon request. Which you should know having been scum in her games before.

Wall posts are unnecessary.

You'd kill Townies over Tigers because when you run out of Tigers to kill your game's up. If there's the threat of Tigers there's the possibility of arguing that you're needed to kill them, and that the game's not over because there are Tigers left, not just because you're the living SK. With so many Tigers dead already, now's the time for an SK to kill Town.

I haven't been lurky and I haven't posted 'weaksauce malarky'. You certainly haven't argued that I have. You've just said so over and over and over again. So please. Holographica was an abortion almost as soon as it happened. Give me a few minutes and I'll show why any comparisons are weaksauce malarky.

What's your point about Fakeclaims? I can't tell.

[VP Baltar]

I don't need a wall post on your opinions of Holographica, so you can spare yourself the trouble.

Re: Tigers - if I don't shoot Tigers the following night, then lynch me. Problem (that never existed) solved.

Re: fakeclaims - if Vi wrote me a fakeclaim, I'm sure it's be better than to give me a domain that sounds like a SK. Yeah?

[Magua]

@Plum:

Who are the tigers?

[sottyrulez]

More Plum votes for great justice.

Seriously needs to happen.

[Plum]

Uh huh, because you couldn't give a damn about whether or not you're right about me being scum. You don't give a damn about scumhunting.

If you kill anything but Tiger tonight you get lynched? No excuses? I'd say I believe it when I see it but I happen not to trust anything that comes out of your mouth in the form of a promise or guarantee.

I have no opinion about the fakeclaim-Domain thing. It's WIFOM either way; Soloism or not I'd believe you're SK.

Magua: Very possibly RayFrost. Alm somewhat less likely given the arguments with Hito and the claimed power but certain things stick out (like ragging on Quadz 'nobody to Doctor' thing because of the playerlist, not because of Nicki Minaj's claim and such) as off, Sotty on review looks soft-then-hard-when-quadz-is-under-pressure on Quadz in ISO but I need to take a break, try to wash my mind out of the biases and counter-biases I have with Sotty (biased by his attacks on me, though many seem legitimate, biased back by his play Day 2 against Quadz and by my own backlash against getting buddied at after the thing with Hito) and read through context.

I have Town or null-Town reads on most of the rest of the players, and most all of them have done something to give me pause before considering them as likely scum.

[VP Baltar]

I don't give a damn about scumhunting...after I called 3 scum and killed 2. I can't be trusted clearly.

[ooba]

I don't give a damn about scumhunting...after I called 3 scum and

killed 2

. I can't be trusted clearly.

Killed 2?

[VP Baltar]

quadz and hito. As much as you guys want to say VP parked his vote and did nothing, I was actively calling for quadz' death from the start.

[Seraphim]

Seraphim - can you make sure your PGO ability would be active on me the same night you grant it. Want to make sure.

Checking this now.

Alternate win con: Cast of 7 power - win the game. (or) In other words, get 2 people to worship Solism and you win.

This is stupid...he would HAVE to claim in order that faith if he's the only person with Solism.

I do not have Solism.

We aren't lynching VP today. This argument is fucking retarded.

I have an idea that should please all parties involved and should net us scum no matter what, but first I need to check something.

Did anyone worship Asceticism on N1? If you have, CLAIM IT NOW.

[Seraphim]

I mean Austerity sorry.

[Magua]

Not I. Are you sure you don't mean N2, though?

[Seraphim]

No, I mean Night 1.

Also, my PGO would take effect that night. Scum would end up biting the bullet.

[VP Baltar]

[RayFrost]

Someone said that I somehow benefit from VP dying (sotty, I think?).

If this were the case, can anybody give me the reason that I CC'd MoI here rather than backing him up or simply not saying anything? If I really benefited that much from VP's death, I could have easily lied about what I did / what happened instead of claiming something that

supports VP's side on the claim conflict

.

By the way, I already said both of my domains. Neither of them being solism.

We shouldn't be lynching VP today regardless of whether he is SK. Also: regardless of sotty's stuff about singer-justice-worship, worshiping justice gives both myself and ooba our 6 faith abilities. This. Is. Worth. It. 100% worth it. Provided ooba's town, which I think he is, that makes two for sure good-pro-town-awesome-casts available. And mine can't even be prevented by killing me the night before.

[RayFrost]

I didn't worship Austerity.

[RayFrost]

Town (no particular order)–

Faraday – Gut read based on his lack of (KEKEKEK) play which I see out of him as scum. Also his correct meta read on me.
Magua – Play is consistent with Magua as Town, plus hito’s buddying to him.
Nobody Special – Day 1 play.
ooba – His call of Justice plus Balance along with low Balance worships N0 and N1.
sottyrulez (Sotty7+zachrulez) – Meta read on Sotty and Zach. Both heads playing as I expect as Town. Further I feel their reads Day 1 were in line with mine.

Scum (Decending order of scumminess) –

VPB – pretty much explained already. Read my ISO.
DA – General meta read and play which involves coasting on Quadz wagon.
AGM / Rayfrost – Recent play and reactions as noted. Weakest as I haven’t ISOed either for interactions.

What makes you believe nobody special's D1 play was particularly townish? It was a net null to me. Speaking of NS.

Mod: Prod Nobody Special please? Preferably with a pointed stick.

I have a feeling he's trying the "lurk to victory" style.

[RayFrost]

MoI: You mean I thought you were town when quadz had yet to flip and I thought he was town and felt you were seeing the same thing. And now that quadz has flipped scum I have a different opinion on the matter that makes me feel slightly suspicious of you.

Here’s why I’m finding this a suspect response Rayfrost.

1. Yesterday you were in the Quadz is not scum camp.
2. My read on Quadz was similar.
3. Quadz’s flip happens.
4. Suddenly you suspect me for not suspecting Quadz.

Step four is where you lose me. If you are of a Town mindset and didn’t suspect that Quadz was scum then it does not follow that after his flip you look at other players who didn’t suspect Quadz and are suspicious of that one element. I am not looking at Plum, DDD or whoever else didn’t vote Quadz and saying “You are likely scum for not voting him” because I didn’t vote him either. That was my Town perspective read. I can understand others of possibly having the same Town perspective read on Quadz also.

1. Yes.
2. Yes.
3. Yes.
4. No.

This isn't sudden. This is my saying my feel of your posts in the first ten pages of the game was not-good-feelings. Although you had the same read for quadz as I did, what I saw in the first ten pages of posts was not any real defense of him: saying you think he's town but then not arguing to prevent his lynch. You might o it later in the thread, but I didn't see any up 'till then, and I find that suspect as it's proper for town to defend people they think are town.

Having a town-read on quadz isn't an instant pass from having scummy posts surrounding the circumstances, which is what I was pointing out. The issue isn't the fact you failed to vote quadz so much as the method in which you avoided it. Again, from my read through of the first ten pages of the game.

[RayFrost]

Can we save plum from dying and carry her over to be killed by VP? I have a not-really-game-related reason for this.