Mafia MetaMafia ~ Game Over!

[Seraphim]

You know, if mothrax had been acting like this up until this point, and NOW you announced the policy lynch thing, I probably would have been all over that. I would have been wary but now that this argument and shit has gone through, you look WAY more like a lyncher than someone who is honestly trying to aid the town.

[AlmasterGM]

I'm kind recoiling at how scummy that post was. Are you actually trying to twist my wanting the free policy lynch into looking scummy? It's like saying, "You seem to be trying really hard to use your N0 Vig shot. Aside from the fact that mothrax was a great N0 Vig shot, do you have any other reasons for this?"

And Faraday: Wrong. Please try again.

[AlmasterGM]

You know, if mothrax had been acting like this up until this point, and NOW you announced the policy lynch thing, I probably would have been all over that. I would have been wary but now that this argument and shit has gone through, you look WAY more

like a lyncher

than someone who is honestly trying to aid the town.

...

Please tell me this is a joke.

[singersigner]

EBWOP:
With regards to using a hydra account along with the first ~16 posts being from the only person who's actually using that hydra account.

How is that, in any way, shape, or form, trying to make it a scumtell? (hint: read, it isn't ) I'm just frustrated that you had to make a big deal out of switching to another account that you seem to be the only one using. The POINT I was

trying

to get at was why they having even read their role PMs yet. That's playing against their wincon, in my opinion, and THAT'S the scum tell I was trying to feel out (if that was the case or not).

Preview Edit:
To be fair, Seraphim, the last few posts by quadz have been fairly "flipping out" for him. That's a null tell. Seraphim, can you link me to times where you've consistently "flipped out" as town, as well as times where that's identical to times everyone else "flips out" as town?

Awful, AWFUL, tell.

[Demonic Angel]

I didn't make a big deal out of switching. You did.

And certain people (coughquadzcough) try to use the replacing thing to label me as "not playing the game".

[AlmasterGM]

You know, if mothrax had been acting like this up until this point, and NOW you announced the policy lynch thing, I probably would have been all over that. I would have been wary but now that this argument and shit has gone through, you look WAY more like a lyncher than someone who is honestly trying to aid the town.

This post is actually HORRIBLE the more I look at it.

It essentially says, "well, a free mothrax lynch would be awesome, but because AGM

might be a lyncher

, I'm going to be really vague and fence-sit about it instead."

This sort of attitude has permeated throughout the game. I'm betting cash money that if mothrax flips scum, these sorts of people are his buddies.

[Demonic Angel]

EBWOP: And certain people (coughquadzcough) try to use the replacing thing to label me as "not playing the game"

to call me scum

.

[Vi]

Vote Count III

- Lack of amusement
quadz08 (L-2) ~ mothrax, Debonair Danny DiPietro, VP Baltar, Seraphim, Gammagooey, Katsuki, Faraday, singersigner, Parama, ooba
Parama (L-9) ~ Magua, hitogoroshi, Plum
VasudeVa (L-10) ~ MagnaofIllusion, sottyrulez
mothrax (L-11) ~ AlmasterGM
Plum (L-11) ~ Nicki Minaj
VP Baltar (L-11) ~ Duplicity
MagnaofIllusion (L-11) ~ VasudeVa
Debonair Danny DiPietro (L-11) ~ quadz08

hitogoroshi (L-12) ~

ooba

Minimum (L-12)

Not Voting:

Nobody Special, RayFrost, Equinox

-RayFrost is being prodded with a torch.

-One account per player slot please.

Battery power:

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(80%)

[Gammagooey]

Faraday You're done modding that game how did you even.

'look my Imma leave my random vote there because I think he's scummy now woooooo.'

I enjoyed reading this. Mostly because I might actually say it if you replaced my with 'guyz'

quadz getting all mad at DA for not posting much before the hydra got in seems overstated.
Aside from that I don't think quadz's most recent posts are that scummy but his earlier ones were lynchworthy enough plus Seraphim is saying lynch him and he's preeeeetty clearly town.

And I'm getting super ninjaed so reading stuff in a minute.

[Faraday]

mothrax is literally an obvtown townie. take your focus elsewhere pikachu.

[Faraday]

i was searching for an old pm gamma! sorry vi

[AlmasterGM]

mothrax is literally an obvtown townie.

And why is that?

[Gammagooey]

AGM I get that you want moth dead because you think that his posts aren't nearly enough to put him as solid town.

But you tunnelling on him and not talking about anything else is seriously not helping you right now. Can you give some other reads please?

[AlmasterGM]

1) I just gave you a nice, fresh scumread on Seraphim.

2) I have 15 pages to go through, give me a little time, please?

[Faraday]

mothrax is literally an obvtown townie.

And why is that?

i said so.

[Nicki Minaj]

Vi: please prod RayFrost.

I've been terrible this game. Thank God Nikanor has been making us look obvtown while I've been slacking off.

Also, thank God I'm not 100% sober right now, so I don't feel like overthinking this post.

I'm not going to bother commenting on every little thing I've missed, but these are my reads (sorry, singersigner, but I won't even bother making sure that OMG WE'RE A HYDRA AND NOT CONTRADICTING EACH OTHER, because he's not on AIM and we're never going to agree 100% anyway):

[

b]Town:[/b]

Gammagooey: Too lazy to explain this one, because duh.
Equinox: she's soooooo town. Like, she drops a hundred towntells in every post.
Magua: This feels a lot like ASOS Magua. Only reservation is that he accused me of only suspecting him when he voted for us in ASOS, so I should probably be suspicious of him for calling us the towniest townie ever. But then again, it was

Nikanor

he found townie, not me.
sottyrulez: My one stab of paranoia is that I haven't agreed with all her observations (for example, feel like Plum has been far from the most opportunistic player in this game--a quadz vote would've been MUCH more opportunistic than a Parama one at that moment). Also, Sotty thinks that I'm a reactive lunatic who suspects everyone who votes for me, so her calling me town and chainsawing me should probably make me paranoid. But their miller claim still is consistent with Gammagooey's, and her scumhunting has felt genuine. By the way, Sotty, why do you suspect hitogoroshi?

Leaning Town

AGM: his power is real, I'm sure of it, but also his frustration reads as townish.
ooba: I agree that town is more likely to ask people to worship his faction. Still would like to see him take a more active scumhunting role.
Faraday: Some of his posts and thought processes come across as very townish. One problem is that a few of his reads seem to come out of nowhere. Where is the Katsuki-town read coming from? How the fuck are you so confident in MoI-town when I

know

you've said multiple times that you find MoI's town play and scum play hard to distinguish?
singersigner: Got the same vibes Equinox did, that her catch-up post felt very open and honest. I didn't like her finding quadz scummy and voting him

after

everyone else put pressure on her to do so, as well as her out-of-the-blue supporting the policy lynch on mothrax, though. I also agree that her saying she'd probably vote Nobody Special on policy after a reread is off (who pointed this out? I forget). Meh, she's in this category mostly on gut. Logic says there are problems with her posts.
Plum: Nikanor will kill me for this one. I didn't like her initial bloated frame-case on us, but I kind of liked her later catch-up post. I think it's always Plum's modus operandi as either alignment to post catch-up walls. I mean, Nikanor's reasons for suspecting her were that she was playing like she did in

Of Gods and Men

.

She was a survivor, not Mafia, in

Of Gods and Men

. By the way, I don't know if she still wants a response to that case of hers, since the conversation has moved on.
Seraphim: moved him to this category because his catch-up posts feel fairly honest. That said, I don't like how he went from thinking we were scummy (when we were under heat) to "omg, that quadz is SO scummy for placing such a crappy vote on poor, innocent Nicki Minaj" (when we were treated as town and quadz was the leading wagon. (Faraday's reasons for thinking he's sooooo town are crap, because we're town so Seraphim getting "bad vibes" from our first post isn't a town tell.)

Neutral

mothrax: yes, when Nikanor prompted me to look at his posts, I kinda saw where his town vibe was coming from. That said, WHY THE FUCK IS HE ALL OF A SUDDEN CONFIRMED TOWN JUST BECAUSE HE SENT AN ANGRY PM. Couldn't he be angry at being chosen as a policy lynch, but still scum? I almost AM leaning toward taking advantage of the free lynch on him, come to think of it. His vote for quadz felt opportunistic. Too bad Nikanor would kill me if I did (omg,

hydra fence-sitting

. Lynch us!)
Duplicity: I'm dropping him to neutral both in deference to Nikanor's scum read on him, and because on an ISO read, I'm not really sure where I got those strong town vibes. He doesn't really say much in his posts. A few comment from the Regfan head rang as townish, though, and I agreed with most of his reads in that big list. It was this quote that gave me the town read, FTR:

Spoiler:

I have a lot of town reads but G thinks it's better to withold them for now so I'll do so. I don't like the VV votes, intially I did but his last few posts scream town. I've played with him before when he was scum, he tends to avoid the case against him rather than full on confront it. I can understand the Quadz votes, leaning scum on him though I think there's too much focus on him right now, he's likely to become easier to read later into the game. Paramas arrogance and rage is a town-tell, Magua you should know better than to vote him here.

Don't like how quickly he backed down from the "I'm not giving town reads" thing, in retrospect. Felt like he wanted more protown points by showing he had a suspect list.
VV: haha, I have to admit, I've kind of done the same thing Nikanor has done and sort of skimmed his posts. But from what I have read of him, he's given me REALLY mixed towntells and scumtells. His first posts were pretty terrible, particularly the whole "Why are you paying attention to me instead of someone else?" thing. But then his aggressive OMGUS-ing on MoI felt townish. He may drop to the scum category when I have time to ISO him.
MoI: In all honesty, I haven't reread him closely enough. I got town vibes from his first post (maybe it's how he cleared Katsuki), but since then I feel as though he's been very passive. His back-and-forth with VP Baltar felt kind of nitpicky.
Katsuki/Demonic Angel: I really don't get where all the town reads on him are coming from, because his posts have been utter fluff. But I can't read Katsuki for beans.
Nobody Special: Congratulations for being completely fucking unreadable.
hitogoroshi: Nice try, hito. If you think you're going to fool me by going, "Omigod, I'm going to be all protown by making a strategy for domain worshipping,

just like I did in Stars Aligned

, so guys, isn't that so townie?" you've got another thing coming. You've discussed your scum meta for far too long with me on AIM. Why don't you devote your effort toward an ISO extravaganza rather than a worshipping plan? I've disagreed with much of what hito has said this game.

Almost

put him in the Scummy category, but his ISO 11 is good. His finding a towntell from NS also felt genuine. I'd rather give him a day or so to breathe, because if he's town, it'll become apparent soon enough.

Hey, Faraday, what do you think of hitogoroshi?

Scummy (it's too hard to distinguish between "Leaning Scum" and "Scum" so early in the game, so decided to group them together)

DDD: his posts have all been fluffy active lurking and buddying. Has he actually provided a concrete opinion this game? That said, I doubt he's Baltar's buddy based on his first post claiming he'd sheep Baltar.
quadz: To answer Faraday's question from way back, I was okay with his wagon in principle simply because I had no reason to think he was town at this point. I wasn't fond of his vote for us or his "is this vote serious reaction", but he wasn't my top suspect. Almost had him at only a mild scum read after his catch-up post, but his most recent defence posts feel off. I'll also trust that singersigner has the magic touch at reading you. I don't want to vote for him just yet when he's so close to a lynch, though.
Parama: Nikanor actually wanted to vote Parama, IIRC. I'm still a horrible slacker and haven't read the scum meta game Nik linked me to. I just suck at reading players like Parama, but Nik's argument was that Parama's tunneling is an excuse to mask his lack of scumhunting. At this point, there's no way Parama should be

that

confident that Magua is scum.
VP Baltar: His first post was okay. But god, his responses to Magua were soooooo bad. I actually feel like Magua said much of what I wanted to say about how terrible his "why are you looking at

me

" response is. He's

way

too jumpy every time someone looks at him sideways. I think what initially made me want to vote him was his making a big deal of how singer OMG, DIDN'T VOTE QUADZ IMMEDIATELY. If the dinner I was supposed to be at hadn't started half an hour ago, I'd make an actual concrete case on him. Put that on the to-do list.

Insufficient Data:

RayFrost

VOTE: VP Baltar

In all honesty, many of these reads are in flux. I'm too lazy to reread anyone in ISO right now, and I'm running late, so maybe I've missed a smoking gun somewhere.

~Mina

[Gammagooey]

@agm-Seraphim is seriously my strongest town read.
Give me some reads that aren't functionally retarded.

[Faraday]

no srsly, the pm is the most fucking obvious biggest massive fucking obvious town tell ever. it's literally GLARING IN YOUR FACE.

[AlmasterGM]

@agm-Seraphim is seriously my strongest town read.

Why?

no srsly, the pm is the most fucking obvious biggest massive fucking obvious town tell ever. it's literally GLARING IN YOUR FACE.

Yeah, because scum wouldn't be angry about getting Night 0 vigged.

[Seraphim]

Please tell me this is a joke.

Do I look like a comedian?

I am NOT fencesitting. You fucked up the delivery. If you had let mothrax come out normally, play like he normally would, allow some time for reads, you might have gotten a lynch. But now all of his posts, at least today, have that specter of YOUR POLICY LYNCH ABILITY on them. town or scum, he's not going to post a lot, because he's worried it will be misconstrued as scummy and he will be run up for it. mothrax looks town because of how you fucked up that delivery and the fact that you're continued to push it looks like you're a lyncher who is either ignorant of your effect on mothrax's posting or you're well aware and now you're trying to construe it as scummy. It's plain and clear for the entire town to see.

and now you're calling me scum because I'm calling you out on what is, effectively, tunneling. I have to admit, you're pretty gutsy.

To be fair, Seraphim, the last few posts by quadz have been fairly "flipping out" for him. That's a null tell. Seraphim, can you link me to times where you've consistently "flipped out" as town, as well as times where that's identical to times everyone else "flips out" as town?

Well, I don't know his meta. He just seems strangely calm and isn't fending off the attacks well. He doesn't seem to be changing his posting at all. He's not acting like he's under pressure, is what I'm saying.

I would be happy to point out times I have flipped out BTW, I just need to dig them out.

Holy fuck ninja.

LEMME FUCKING POST.

[Faraday]

nicki minaj wtf? katsuki is obvtown from all their posts. i've only see moitown once, this isn't moiscum, thus must be moitown.

[AlmasterGM]

Hellooooo overreaction from Seraphim.

[Gammagooey]

@AGM- his isos 5-9 look super town to me because it's legit town thinking and scum hunting.

[Seraphim]

lol at AGM's last post. I am literally laughing right now. Are you claiming that "overreaction" is a scumtell?

I can't say I agree on MoI-town unfortunately but we'll cross that bridge when we get to it aka when quadz is dead.

HEY MOTHRAX POST SOMETHING!!! I SEE YOU ONLINE!

[Faraday]

i could totally see hito and quadz as scum together for the post where he says i'm town and doesn't vote town. not obvscum like court though, but not his usual obvtownie self (although i felt the same about his play as ts in storm so eh). would lynch. ++