Cold War Mafia - GAME OVER!!

[Furcolow]

I am, in fact, a doctor

[ThAdmiral]

targets?

[The Fonz]

ThAd, do you agree with this statement?

There is fairly obviously an American Mafioso hidden in the claimed Soviets. You can say what you want about outguessing the mod, but it is simply not fair to have two more soviet town than American town for the Soviet scum to hide in.

This is probably right. Unless there are 4 soviet and 3 us.

In which case, since bvoigt is my strongest town read, I really feel like you've invited at least one and probably two scum into your voting bloc. There's at most two scum in the claimed capitalists (I think Smarg, Enigma or Beasts, in that order- interestingly, though Smarg is by far the individually scummiest, the other two are more connected).

That means, to my mind, unless Sathoris is scum (and that, to be fair, isn't unlikely) half the scum are in your little bloc.

Furc, could you explain 'interactions regarding Janos Kadar?' Do you mean his behaviour around the time Gonnano claimed, or his trying to play up the soviet mafia flip over the actual rolename to try to paint the claimed Americans as scummy?

[Sathoris]

@Sathoris- Can you provide your thoughts on the final breakdown of scum remaining and list where you believe each player to be?

1

Beasts of the Sea

- We know there are european nationalities in this game, I doubt the british are the sole representative. I believe he's french, but that doesn't absolve him from being USA scum. If a vietnamese was in the Soviet scum team than a british or french guy can certainly be so aswell.

US Scum

4

Enigma

- We've got six confirmed dead US townies. With a probably 4 extra as scum that leaves 1 US townie left and as I think that belongs to ThAd I'm gonna say

US Scum

6

PeregrineV

- Posted his voting tables but the promises analysis hasn't been delivered. Claimed soviet, which is suspicious in it's own.

Soviet scum

8

ThAdmiral

- Appeared town in my eyes since his first claim.

US townie

10

Furcolow

- Lying all throughout the whole game. Now he's claiming doctor again. I don't buy it. I'm with the Fonz on this one. Lynch the liars.

Soviet scum

11

Lowell

- Soviet claim again isn't telling us a lot but since there is only one contender for a soviet scum and he's been playing town in my eyes he's lowest on that list, so

Soviet townie

13

smargaret

- Depending on the nationality of the last Soviet scum this could be an interesting lynch. If the last soviet scum flipped a nationality different than soviet. (i.e. Vietnamese or Chinese) Then we can assume the US scum have two US players and two of different nationalities aswell. Smarg and BotS then stand out. But the whole neighbour thing makes me uncertain whether she would be US scum.

West German Townie

18

bvoigt

- I don't think he's soviet and I don't think he's Soviet scum either.

US Scum

22

The Fonz

- He's on the right track

Polish townie

I have two Soviet scum even though there only is one spot left. (If any, but I think so) My heart tells me it's furcolow because he's been lying all the time and my brain says PeregrineV.

[Sathoris]

I am, in fact, a doctor

No you're not. I'm still fine with a lynch on you, you can't seem to stop lying.

perhaps we should doctor her neighbor

assuming we have one

[The Fonz]

Sathoris. You are still voting PV, correct me if I'm wrong. Does this mean you think he's a superior lynch to Furc or Enigma?

[Sathoris]

I actually have my vote on Bvoight now but I'm going to UNVOTE: Bvoigt and VOTE: Engima because we're nearing the day's deadline and after I've made my post and organized my thoughts I think he's a better lynch.

It's tricky to have a priority between furc, PV and Enigma, but I think I have it like this: 1) Engima 2) Furc, 3) PV

[The Fonz]

I believe that's L-1, and I would therefore like to ask for a fullclaim from Enigma.

[Sotty7]

14th vote count of day 5

PeregrineV - 3 -

smargaret, Beasts of the Sea, Lowell

bvoigt - 1 -

Enigma

Enigma - 5 -

Furcolow, ThAdmiral, bvoigt, The Fonz, Sathoris

Beasts of the sea - 1 -

PeregrineV

Not voting - 0 -

No one

• With
  10
  players alive, it takes
  6
  to lynch
  
• Deadline for the end of day five is Wednesday 11th May @ 8am CST

[Enigma]

Lol well it looks like I'm about to be lynched.

Let me tell you I'm going to flip US Townie, and that my lynch is likely driven by one, if not both of the US scum. So get them tomorrow.

The fact stands, the US scum are claiming Soviet. If I was US scum I would be claiming Soviet, considering I claimed first and pushed the claim to occur, you would need to be mentally deficient as scum not to. If I was US scum, I assure you I would not be encouraging nationality claim, nor would I have taken the initiative to claim first. I would have nicely let the game rot and stagnate with the pathetic discussion the rest of you are achieving.

One extra person who has lately jumped up my scumdar is Thad.

His insistence for a voting bloc, totally unnecessary. Town isn't stupid enough to let a No Lynch pass, he is just trying to appear pro town while trying to dictate how votes move around.
His reluctance to make a case for the majority of the game, claiming just being lazy, and just mindlessly chucking his vote on players with only a few petty excuses as to why when questioned.
His case to vote me, after he realized that he could not longer skate along on votes. Out of a nearly 100 page games he pulls out a handful of vote counts to present his reasons as most incriminating. Considering 24 players and the assumption of only 6 scum, I will tell you again, it is entirely possible that a wagon on him (which he refers to as him being town, when for all we know he is scum) consists of only townies.

So add Thad to the likely scum of Bvoigt and Sathoris.

So if I'm going to be lynched today I don't care. I'm just sorry I came into this game and put in effort when no one is prepared to.

[The Fonz]

Uh, Enigma, you did not 'put in effort where no one else was prepared to.' I, and Peregrine, for starters, have put in more effort today than you have. In many ways, it was your predecessor's lack of effort that makes you look scummy to begin with.

[Enigma]

Compared to the 9 other people alive, and considering I had to read 70 pages I feel I put in more effort than them.

It's curious though, are other people who are not putting in much effort and only posting to prod avoid not scummy for you?

[The Fonz]

Yes, posting once per prod period over a prolonged period of time is a scumtell. Hence me flagging up Sathoris as someone who was lurking and not getting called on it. My town read on Lowell has also slightly weakened as a result of his having started to lurk again recently. And I'd prefer a smarg lynch to yours, because she set up that 1-1, and has been lurking and not scumhunting today. I'd be equally happy lynching Sath as you.

But the fact is, there were two viable wagons. And yours was pushed by people like ThAd and Bvoigt, who I think are town, while Beasts, Smarg, and Sath were all on Peregrine, and in particular, Beasts attacked me in a particularly scummy way that made me think he might well be scum with you. If he was town who thought I was scum with you, why didn't he call my bluff and vote you? Instead, he made sure he said that you were scummy, but took the one course of action (pushing Peregrine) most likely to ensure your survival today.

[Lowell]

15 bunnylover Che Guevara - Cuban Roleblocker.
3 RedCoyote John Glenn, US Odd-Night Vigilante.
20 LlamaFluff John F Kennedy, US Townie
23 hohum Harold Wilson, British Townie
16 Amrun Joseph McCarthy - US Blacklister
2 Debonair Danny DiPietro Edward R Murrow - US Townie

9 VP Baltar Ho Chi Minh - Vietnamese Soviet Mafia Goon
21 nachomma8 Josep Broz Tito - Yugoslavian Townie
17 gonnano Janos Kadar - Soviet Mafia Goon
12 XScorpion Leonid Brezhnev, Soviet Townie
5 Feysal Erich Honecker - Soviet Neighbour

14 Scott Brosius J Edgar Hoover - US Mafia Jailkeeper

7 LynchMePls Nikita Kruschev - Sovier Watcher
19 Stephoscope Andrei Gromyko - Soviet Mafia Rolecop

Full player/nationality claim list:

Americans:

ThAdmiral
Enigma

Other Free World:

Beasts of the Sea - French
Smargaret - West German

Soviets:

Bvoigt
Lowell
Furcolow
PeregrineV

Other Communist:

Myself - Polish
Sathoris - Albanian

11 US and 13 Soviet. One of the Soviets is lying.

Some of notes.
1)

enigma

didn't seem particularly scummy-- until his last "give up" post. When someone is about to die and all of a sudden has tons of 'obvreads' to share, that's a sign they were holding back. Which to me smells like scum. I'll lynch him if we need, but not right now.
2) I'm still not sold on the 12v12 mechanic. It would be nice if it is, but surely the mod considered massclaims would happen at some point so we shouldn't throw away reads b/c we think we have the setup figured out.
3) Among the american side, the scummiest are enigma and

ThAd

. I fear I have been blinded by flattery. All his "voting bloc" posts don't serve much purpose other than to solidify a group of friends. Also enigma, in his 'whoa is me' post, named ThAd as scum, seemingly out of nowhere. This looks like it could be last-minute distancing, and both could be US-aligned scum.
4) Among the soviet side,

pere

stands out the most. He's been heavy-handed (overly so) with his 12v12 theory, as well as the importance of determining the exact number of scum left. If there's a US hiding among the soviets, I think pere is the most likely and that he's trying shape the debate on his terms. Look back at how quickly the nationality debate has dominated discussion. Clearly some people have things to gain by focusing on this.

[The Fonz]

Lowell, if peregrine is American, who is most likely to be a partner?

I really, really, really, don't think that both claimed Americans are scum. That would mean there was no 'other country' American goon who thought it was safe to claim his own nationality, AND that the numbers of capitalist/communist townies are asymmetric. Either on its own, I could buy, but both?

[Enigma]

Fonz what do you think about Thad.
The reasons which i just said, and Lowell conveniently rephrased to make it look like he is scum hunting as well. Nice try the Lowell.

@Lowell,
Thad was neutral for most the game for me, he only really caught my attention was his thing about the voting bloc yesterday, (this is with me at L-2, makes you think is it really necessary??) that caused me to go and review his play. And on reviewing it, I noted things I found scummy about it.

[The Fonz]

Fonz what do you think about Thad.
The reasons which i just said, and Lowell conveniently rephrased to make it look like he is scum hunting as well. Nice try the Lowell.

Cannot be scum if you are. We can reasonably surmise from numbers that the American scumbag who has claimed Soviet is an actual American American. That means that if it's 2-2 (yank scum with American names/other nationalities) then both of you are town, and the remaining Americans (non-Soviet claimants) are in (Me), Smarg, Beasts, Sathoris. If it's 3-1, precisely one of you is scum. To be honest, ThAd is my lowest suspect out of the four claimed capitalists. I'd rank them Smarg, you, Beasts, ThAd, in order of scumminess.

His activity today hasn't been as good as previous days, but he is taking firm positions. He hasn't lied about his role. Etc.

@Lowell,
Thad was neutral for most the game for me, he only really caught my attention was his thing about the voting bloc yesterday, (this is with me at L-2, makes you think is it really necessary??) that caused me to go and review his play. And on reviewing it, I noted things I found scummy about it.

This kind of thing always seems to result in the player, scum or town, finding what he was looking for. Generally, if you go back and laser in on one particular slot, with the mindset of 'Let's see if I can find anything scummy here' you will, because you wouldn't do the iso unless, subconsciously, you wanted to find that player scummy.

I will not at this stage accept any other lynch but Enigma or Smarg.

Btw, for people WIFOMing about 'Why would a scum set up a 1-1?'

It's not a 1-1 if the town isn't willing to lynch the accuser if the accused comes up town. Given that town has already let two players who lied about their roles off the hook, and that, if scott hadn't died overnight, we'd have been at the stage where American scum need only one vote to secure majority, then it makes sense that Smarg would have thought she could get one townie to bite on 'Well scum wouldn't do that because it's suicidal' type wifom. Especially since THE AMERICANS (presumably) KILLED OVERNIGHT SOMEONE WHO HAD PROMISED TO VOTE SMARG TODAY.

[Enigma]

This kind of thing always seems to result in the player, scum or town, finding what he was looking for. Generally, if you go back and laser in on one particular slot, with the mindset of 'Let's see if I can find anything scummy here' you will, because you wouldn't do the iso unless, subconsciously, you wanted to find that player scummy.

Isn't this how mafia is supposed to be played? My brain isn't a super computer sorry, and not everyone likes to mindlessly bandwagon what other people say you know.

[The Fonz]

The point is, enigma, I don't think I've ever seen someone go "I was getting scummy vibes off him/he was sliding under my radar, so I went back and looked over him in detail, but I realised there wasn't actually anything scummy about him and I was just being paranoid."

[Enigma]

The point is, enigma, I don't think I've ever seen someone go "I was getting scummy vibes off him/he was sliding under my radar, so I went back and looked over him in detail, but I realised there wasn't actually anything scummy about him and I was just being paranoid."

I do that all the time... I just don't tell anyone when I do that

[bvoigt]

{PeregrineV, Furcolow, Lowell, bvoigt, The Fonz, Sathoris}

Looking at this list of Communist claims, I feel that Sathoris is almost certainly scum. And Enigma's reactions on the past page just don't seem all that scummy. Do we have time for this?

UNVOTE: Enigma
VOTE: Sathoris

[ThAdmiral]

unvote

I believe enigma. Sounds genuine.

We have three or so days.

I still believe in my votecount analysis.

vote: smarg

[Lowell]

@fonz- yeah, that they're the only two "plain" americans gives me pause a bit, but like I said I think the reads are going to be more important than setup-guessing.

[smargaret]

I actually would like to take a closer look at ThAd. The only reason he's remained clear in my mind is DP's "role related information" which was a lie, wasn't it? :-/ I need to actually reread him and make sure that townread is warranted. Is that kind of stunt something DP would pull for a scumbuddy?

I'm also suspicious of Fonz. He's completely abandoned his "You must be scum because Feysal flipped town" and his "LAL => Lynch Furc" and those are starting to look like scum going for the easy mislynch dropped for lack of interest.

Other scum - Peregrine for reasons explained previously and one of EGL/Bvoigt. Others are town.

I'm having computer trouble and will be limited in my ability to post until it's resolved. I will post at least once per day.

[ThAdmiral]

Whatever happened to your "we should lynch one person from this group, even if it's me"?