Cowboy Bebop Remix [Endgame]


User avatar
Fate
Fate
:HAPPY:
User avatar
User avatar
Fate
:HAPPY:
:HAPPY:
Posts: 26090
Joined: January 23, 2010
Location: Eternity

Post Post #825 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:04 am

Post by Fate »



Vote Count

Cogito Ergo Sum (0):
Vi (3): Jahudo, Seraphim, GreyICE (L-4)
Rhinox (0):
UncertainKitten (0):
Jahudo (2): Nachomamma, CogitoES
Lady Lambdadelta (0):
GreyICE (1): ToastyToast
ToastyToast (1): Untrod Tripod
Antitown (0):
Kdub (0):
Untrod Tripod (1): Antitown
Seraphim (3): Kdub, Ladyλδ, UncertainKitten (L-4)
Nachomamma (0):

Not voting: Rhinox
Trying to go against the flow of all things:


With 13 alive it takes 7 to lynch.
Deadline: Thursday March 24th
Fate is absurdly beautiful. 運命に弄ばれる
"Fate you keep alternating between narratives of doing it for fun and doing it for the sake of winning"
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #826 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:29 am

Post by Seraphim »

Or I could very easily just shoot into the crowd out of spite.

I may also have other information that I have withheld up until this point.

You never know.
User avatar
GreyICE
GreyICE
Fifty Shades
User avatar
User avatar
GreyICE
Fifty Shades
Fifty Shades
Posts: 15455
Joined: December 15, 2010

Post Post #827 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:51 am

Post by GreyICE »

UncertainKitten wrote:@GI: You have completely failed to answer my question. Why?
That answered your question.

I have no pro-town reasons to wait until now to claim miller. Thus Occam's razor doesn't like any of this nonsense. It is okay.
Vi's claim makes balls zero sense at this point, and we should lynch.

Seraphim is doing his best to get himself killed but his entire story adds up.
1) He comes in here hostile and aggressive because he has the worst role of all time - or so he thinks. A lyncher who doesn't even know who his target is. Setup speculation, attempts to get claims, etc. ensue
2) It's revealed RDC is scum. Why his reaction? RDC know they're scum (look at Toasty's WIFOM approach - that's scummy). Seraphim just doesn't believe it. Lyncher on scum? Huh?
3) Math begins to add up. Lyncher on scum is not an anti-town role per se. Just one bad for the town in the same way as Beautiful princess (we randomly lose a vote and a player when we lynch Vincent or Vig him).
4) He claims venge kill and other cool shit because he's scared we'll kill him (which is anti his win condition).

Toasty is scum #2. #3 is... huh. Some theories, but it's obv not Seraphim.

I promise to explain on Jahudo tomorrow.
Show
That which is done out of love always takes place beyond good and evil


Official Visigoth

Read Mother Jones
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #828 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:54 am

Post by Seraphim »

Actually, fun fact: Fate has informed me that I stay in the game once I win, but I get to stick around with all of my abilities.

lol.
User avatar
Kdub
Kdub
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Kdub
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4220
Joined: March 3, 2009

Post Post #829 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 9:03 am

Post by Kdub »

I don't think a player like you would play against your win condition out of spite. Actually, there are very few players who I think would do so.

If you have other information to share with us that could possibly help you achieve your claimed win condition, you wouldn't have withheld it in the first place.

A lyncher that stays in the game with all of his abilities once he wins? That would be pretty bad setup design if true. Sounds like you need an excuse for still being in the game if somebody dies and flips as Vicious.
GreyICE wrote:3) Math begins to add up. Lyncher on scum is not an anti-town role per se. Just one bad for the town in the same way as Beautiful princess (we randomly lose a vote and a player when we lynch Vincent or Vig him).
Grey, in light of Seraphim's new claim (that he stays in the game when he "wins"), do you still think it's a good idea to leave him alive today? I think that pretty much seals it for me.
Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic Mafia - 17-player large theme, currently needs (0) replacements
User avatar
Nachomamma8
Nachomamma8
Devil in the Details
User avatar
User avatar
Nachomamma8
Devil in the Details
Devil in the Details
Posts: 38382
Joined: June 5, 2009
Location: Chicago

Post Post #830 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 9:07 am

Post by Nachomamma8 »

Unvote, Vote: Vi
"Playing with Nacho is like playing with a religious conservative." ~UncertainKitten

-- Fate, Vanilla Townie, was brutally stabbed by a throwing sword in endgame.
User avatar
ToastyToast
ToastyToast
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
ToastyToast
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 3227
Joined: February 11, 2011
Location: Los Angeles

Post Post #831 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 9:09 am

Post by ToastyToast »

Kdub wrote: A lyncher that stays in the game with all of his abilities once he wins? That would be pretty bad setup design if true. Sounds like you need an excuse for still being in the game if somebody dies and flips as Vicious.
Thats what I was thinking. It would make him confirmed town for the rest of the game, which seems odd. I've never played with a lyncher before--do they often have a scum target?

@GreyICE: can you link the post in which I use WIFOM?
"A train robbery is where you take a train to your destination, make your move, and take a train back, right?"-Isaac

Town: 12-10 (I think)
Mafia: 1-1
Third Party: 1-0
Alive in:0
Dead in:0
Modded: 2
User avatar
Nachomamma8
Nachomamma8
Devil in the Details
User avatar
User avatar
Nachomamma8
Devil in the Details
Devil in the Details
Posts: 38382
Joined: June 5, 2009
Location: Chicago

Post Post #832 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:40 am

Post by Nachomamma8 »

Toasty what are you talking about with the lyncher comment?
"Playing with Nacho is like playing with a religious conservative." ~UncertainKitten

-- Fate, Vanilla Townie, was brutally stabbed by a throwing sword in endgame.
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #833 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 11:03 am

Post by Seraphim »

For those following along at home, we have four days until deadline. Let's make a Vi lynch happen, please thank you.
User avatar
Vi
Vi
Professor Paragon
User avatar
User avatar
Vi
Professor Paragon
Professor Paragon
Posts: 11768
Joined: June 29, 2008
Location: GMT-5

Post Post #834 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 2:18 pm

Post by Vi »

Fate and the bounty mechanics change - That was not at all clear from the original wording.
In that case, it seems like it's just a one-shot Hide. Thanks for confirming that the issue exists though~

---

Toasty 802 - If you're concerned with GreyICE being upset with you for your vote, not voting at all is not a better alternative. Take a stand.

---

Jahudo's claim looks like hastily-put-together crap. No role name, no reason why he would be a Miller, and considering I was told in plain English that I would investigate as Mafia I have no idea why he would not have the same.

Vote: Jahudo
(L-6)

Also, LLD is correct. There's a reason why you claim Miller in your first post, and it's so that it doesn't look like you came up with it at a convenient later time.

---

GreyICE's bias is obvious and not worth reasoning with at this stage, except for this.
GreyICE 814 wrote:I have run out of pro-town reasons
To wait until someone with an investigate claims
To claim miller
There are two schools of thought on Millers. One says to claim immediately, the other says not to claim at all and just accept your false Guilty if/when it comes. I tried to get the best of both worlds by crumbing Miller so I could claim if necessary. When someone claimed a credible investigation ability and it looked like I was going to be the target, "if" became "when". At the right time, I swung it like a power role. It worked; I found scum with it (see 811).

---
Spearophim 828 wrote:Actually, fun fact: Fate has informed me that I stay in the game once I win, but I get to stick around with all of my abilities.

lol.
STOP RIGHT THERE, CRIMINAL SCUM

This is either the worst modding
of all time
since Blackest Night or an outright lie. People who win midgame exit for a basic reason - keeping them in the game basically means they can troll if they want to, because no matter what happens, they've already won.

Originally I was meh-leaning-no on Kdub's plan (assuming Seraphim shoots a Miller Jahudo gets outed either way, but assuming Seraphim's previous claim was accurate there's no reason to lynch Sera in the first place), but I think Kdub nailed this as an excuse to stay in the game after "winning".

Unvote: Jahudo
Vote: Seraphim
(L-3)

Hey wait.
Seraphim 819 wrote:I win if Vicious dies either by my hand
or before I die.
lol and what
Some Lyncher role.

---

Nacho's Jahudo case is everything I expected it to be.

---

tl;dr Seraphim's claim is once again impossible. Jahudo's claim is highly improbable from any point of view, but particularly mine.
Both of them would be excellent lynches.
Everything you say and do matters. People will respond in ways you may never see. May those responses be what you intend.
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #835 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 2:36 pm

Post by Seraphim »

In that case, it seems like it's just a one-shot Hide. Thanks for confirming that the issue exists though~
Buuuuuullshiiiiit. Even look at the original rules:
There is no bonus for earning repeated bounty rewards
Either you really fucked up and you're town. I tend to believe Jahudo's claim because he claimed AFTER it was clarified that the Red Dragon Clan was the scum faction. What kind of scum motivation is that, to contradict what had already been stated? Then again, there's always the possibility that he also screwed up his fakeclaim, just like Vi did. Maybe they're scum together? I have no clue.

My flip will solve NOTHING. I can guarantee I will NOT shoot any of the claimed millers BTW because I think neither of them are Vicious. So you will still have that to deal with in the morning. So, killing me solves absolutely nothing in resolving these inconsistencies. Let's lynch a claimed miller and see what happens.
User avatar
UncertainKitten
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
User avatar
User avatar
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
Maid In Japan
Posts: 6339
Joined: December 1, 2009
Location: Virginia

Post Post #836 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 2:57 pm

Post by UncertainKitten »

Well, I'll be honestly surprised if there IS a vengeful kill, so whatev.

And again, I'm not sure I understand the logic between Jahudo and Vi having some AMAZING SUPER SECRET TECH PLAN TO GET...UH...ONE OF THEIR OWN SCUMBUDDIES LYNCHED INSTEAD OF THE CLAIMED THIRD PARTY! TOTES!

And yeah, Seraphim's claim is ludicrous.

@GI: No, actually, you haven't answered my question. I have, point by point, shown why your logic is bad. You have provided no answer OR no clarification on this. Why
Are
You
Dodging
The
Issue!?


Also, when did RDC become confirmed scum? Granted, it was my expectation but I didn't see a clarification.
"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug

Internet Mafia
is probably never going to happen. You all probably knew that.
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #837 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:01 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Check GI's iso. If you believe he is 100% totes confirmed super town, you probably would have read the part where he talks about his role being a one-shot alignment cop that discerns whether or not someone is in the RDC.
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #838 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:02 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Also, especially if I don't have a vengeful kill, you STILL have to deal with the millers tomorrow.
User avatar
Lady Lambdadelta
Lady Lambdadelta
She/Faer
Rise of the Phoenix
User avatar
User avatar
Lady Lambdadelta
She/Faer
Rise of the Phoenix
Rise of the Phoenix
Posts: 25201
Joined: August 31, 2010
Pronoun: She/Faer
Location: formerly in a Rage

Post Post #839 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:02 pm

Post by Lady Lambdadelta »

@UK: I think some people have confirmed it through flavor? I think that's bad to be honest, but let's roll with it for now.

@Vi: this needs to go in the "How not to claim" post you made.

Why is Seraphim still alive?
Yes my Lord, but questions are dangerous, for they have answers.

13 heads and counting now, plurality is adaptive. If our experience might help you,
click here
.
If you wish to
speak to one of us
, we are Niamh, Rhiannon, Rhea, Aisling, Saoirse, Selene, Aoife, Fírinne, Aurélie, Lyra, Airna, Fiadh and Laoise.
Soar on wings of retribution and set the world ablaze
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #840 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:08 pm

Post by Seraphim »

Because not everyone has their head set in "tunnel vision" mode like you and UK?

Honestly, lynching claimed third-party makes zero sense right now. Let's deal with the miller situation, see if we can't confirm some town or force scum to deal with it.
User avatar
Nachomamma8
Nachomamma8
Devil in the Details
User avatar
User avatar
Nachomamma8
Devil in the Details
Devil in the Details
Posts: 38382
Joined: June 5, 2009
Location: Chicago

Post Post #841 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:09 pm

Post by Nachomamma8 »

UK, LLD, what are you expecting Seraphim to flip?
"Playing with Nacho is like playing with a religious conservative." ~UncertainKitten

-- Fate, Vanilla Townie, was brutally stabbed by a throwing sword in endgame.
User avatar
Lady Lambdadelta
Lady Lambdadelta
She/Faer
Rise of the Phoenix
User avatar
User avatar
Lady Lambdadelta
She/Faer
Rise of the Phoenix
Rise of the Phoenix
Posts: 25201
Joined: August 31, 2010
Pronoun: She/Faer
Location: formerly in a Rage

Post Post #842 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:11 pm

Post by Lady Lambdadelta »

Nachomamma8 wrote:UK, LLD, what are you expecting Seraphim to flip?

Scum.

Potentially third party... But I don't think so. I think Seraphim was gambitting scum, trying to make his position better in this game, rather than third party, trying to claim.

Oh, and seraphim. Claiming: You're doin' it wrong.
Yes my Lord, but questions are dangerous, for they have answers.

13 heads and counting now, plurality is adaptive. If our experience might help you,
click here
.
If you wish to
speak to one of us
, we are Niamh, Rhiannon, Rhea, Aisling, Saoirse, Selene, Aoife, Fírinne, Aurélie, Lyra, Airna, Fiadh and Laoise.
Soar on wings of retribution and set the world ablaze
User avatar
UncertainKitten
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
User avatar
User avatar
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
Maid In Japan
Posts: 6339
Joined: December 1, 2009
Location: Virginia

Post Post #843 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:14 pm

Post by UncertainKitten »

@Seraphim: But RDC investigation != RDC scum. It's just highly probably. That does not 100% confirm the RDC as scum. I'm mostly splitting hairs here. I believe they are likely our scum group, I just don't see it as "100% confirmed"

@LLD: My role implies it as well. But I don't see that as ~*~fully confirmed~*~ publically, if that makes sense?

@Nacho: At this point? Scum. And if he flips scum, I expect Jahudo would flip scum. The only wall I run into here is that if we lynch Vi in response to Jahudo's claim, and Vi flips miller, than that sacrifices Jahudo to keep Seraphim alive...why?

His role makes absolutely no sense.

@Seraph: Keep thinking it's tunnel vision and you've done absolutely nothing scummy, made no ridiculous claims, or just overall not played awfully.
"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug

Internet Mafia
is probably never going to happen. You all probably knew that.
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #844 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:20 pm

Post by Seraphim »

no, read GreyICE's claim, he specifically stated that RDC IS scum because he claims to be an alignment cop.

I have a feeling that one of: Vi, GreyICE, Jahudo is completely and totally lying. There is scum here.

We need to hear from Rhinox, CES, UT, Antitown, and Toasty. They all need to take a stand on the two competing wagons, the only other player I could see getting lynched today is Jahudo, and his claim makes no sense in context.

UK: Later, once you've seen my role PM, feel free to spell out exactly how you would play my role.
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #845 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:23 pm

Post by Seraphim »

People voting me: explain how both Vi and Jahudo can be town

OR

how it makes sense for one or both of them to be scum with me
User avatar
UncertainKitten
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
User avatar
User avatar
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
Maid In Japan
Posts: 6339
Joined: December 1, 2009
Location: Virginia

Post Post #846 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:28 pm

Post by UncertainKitten »

@GI: Are you claiming that you specifically get alignment through RDC flavor, as in it specifically says such? Or are you conjecturing because "Fate wouldn't put in a useless one shot cop"?

@Seraph: I don't think both Vi and Jahudo are town. I do think your flip will solve this. One of them pretty much has to be scum with you. If you flip scum, one of them was trying to divert the lynch to the other miller. If you are third party as you claim, or not mafia, then the counterclaim is true, though REALLY late in coming for some odd reason.

Lynching one of the millers directly at this point is a suboptimal strategy since you're pretty much proven not town. We win regardless of your flip given our parameters. Further, your flip provides ~*~informations~*~ that lead to scum, whether it's your buddy or unrelated to you.
"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug

Internet Mafia
is probably never going to happen. You all probably knew that.
User avatar
Lady Lambdadelta
Lady Lambdadelta
She/Faer
Rise of the Phoenix
User avatar
User avatar
Lady Lambdadelta
She/Faer
Rise of the Phoenix
Rise of the Phoenix
Posts: 25201
Joined: August 31, 2010
Pronoun: She/Faer
Location: formerly in a Rage

Post Post #847 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:28 pm

Post by Lady Lambdadelta »

Seraphim, haven't I already explained my position on your flip enough?
Yes my Lord, but questions are dangerous, for they have answers.

13 heads and counting now, plurality is adaptive. If our experience might help you,
click here
.
If you wish to
speak to one of us
, we are Niamh, Rhiannon, Rhea, Aisling, Saoirse, Selene, Aoife, Fírinne, Aurélie, Lyra, Airna, Fiadh and Laoise.
Soar on wings of retribution and set the world ablaze
User avatar
Kdub
Kdub
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Kdub
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4220
Joined: March 3, 2009

Post Post #848 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:33 pm

Post by Kdub »

I'm fairly sure that Seraphim is mafia. His claim of staying in the game after he "wins" makes no sense for a lyncher to claim. In fact, even if it were somehow true, I think he would not reveal that just because it doesn't help his argument at all. On the other hand, that claim makes perfect sense for scum who needs to explain why he is still in the game if somebody flips as Vicious.

As crazy as it sounds, I'm actually feeling a Seraphim-Vi scum gambit as a possibility here. The interactions between them just don't feel right. It's hard to explain at the moment.
Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic Mafia - 17-player large theme, currently needs (0) replacements
User avatar
UncertainKitten
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
User avatar
User avatar
UncertainKitten
Maid In Japan
Maid In Japan
Posts: 6339
Joined: December 1, 2009
Location: Virginia

Post Post #849 (ISO) » Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:35 pm

Post by UncertainKitten »

Yeah, that's the essentia of it KDub. I'll be interesting to see how you support Seraph-Vi scum in the future.

But, if he REALLY didn't get removed from the game, why should he care? Vicious dies, he gets lynched, ~*~he still wins!~*~
"Never have I seen anybody glorify their own lynch."
-StrangerCoug

Internet Mafia
is probably never going to happen. You all probably knew that.

Return to “Completed Mini Theme Games”