Cowboy Bebop Remix [Endgame]

[Fate]

The vote count that never was.

[GreyICE]

@GI: I don't care for meta myself. But in this case it kinda applies. Save your case for D2. I sympathize with Vi on this issue. I was basically in your shoes last game I played with her, so.

Oh I agree completely, if for no other reason than the game changes if my LLD and/or Seraphim read is wrong. And I hate lynching really interesting people early in the game

[Jahudo]

Moar Seraphim case points

I'm backpeddling? It was an offhand comment. Your post was scummy.

One scummy post does not make you scum, as I will happily link you to game after game where townies make perfectly scummy posts.

Does one scummy post count as a serious accusation? Taking just that part of the post I can understand anyone (Sera included) in thinking they are two different levels of seriousness. Offhand comment sounds more like an inquiry where you don't know if there's anything scummy going on yet.

But in Grey's case he does explain how his offhand comment carried some level of suspicion. And also in post 105 he said he liked his vote, so I don't think he was trying to backtrack.

As scum, you feel yourself being wagoned, and then switch your vote to the next largest wagon to try and save yourself.

You haven't even given me a reason why you think I am scum.

Well Sera did give the reason of not liking Lady L jumping onto a large wagon without a reason first, and asking a claim in a situation where he thought it should be asked.

They were both playing in the moment so Lady does give reasoning within minutes. Would she have delayed it if Seraphim wasn’t online at the time? Hard to say, and that’s the essence of his defense. That she voted and fled. But it looks more like she was adding pressure while she wrote up more posts. Which is understandable.

And she isn’t wrong that her wagon was large at that moment, so Seraphim was jumping onto a large wagon. I still have trouble deciding what the difference is between OMGUS used by scum and town. I think they are both driven by an emotion of being pressured whether you know they are right or wrong.

But I’d ride some woolongs at Gordon’s casino on both Seraphim and Lady Luck as town. (no reading into flavor here)

I’m caught up and will talk about other people, scummy people in my next post.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Can I get anymore nicknames in this game?

"Bandwagon ho!" (Vi, I now find this offensive after saying it outloud Sounds like you're calling me a ho.)

Don't worry, I've sent Vi an official warning.

>_>
<_<

That his nicknames are HILARIOUS!

[UncertainKitten]

I think that was intentional, LLD.

[Cogito Ergo Sum]

Yeah, it doesn't really make sense as a nickname otherwise.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I'll kill him. :X

[Lady Lambdadelta]

EBWOP: Her. My bad. >.>

[Vi]

Furthermore, what really irritates me is the way he tries to pass of his scum tells as "jokes". If you believed him every time he said something you accused him of was a "joke", you'd think he was doing a stand up comedy act or something.

My issue is somewhat related to this.

it's only six pages and I'm at L-2.

This might be a new record.

Personal record obviously, fairly sure that other people have gotten lynched quicker.

Also, GreyICE, what about Toast, man? I'm sure you had like eighteen scumtells on him maaaaaan.

Whether the last sentence is a joke or not, this isn't something I would expect a Townie to say. Nor is the earlygame flavorscumfishing.

That and what I mentioned in my last catch-up post.

---

Vi vs. Pre-Bandwagoning Bandwagoning Ho -

Bandwagoning Hoes on Bandwagoning Ho - I've already given my opinions. She looked like she was trying way too hard from the beginning through her CES vote, except for post 39 which I didn't think would likely come from scum. I was initially frustrated with her vote+claim request, but after reading into why she did it the only things that bother me about it are things that don't matter (i.e. the validity of some of her arguments vs. Seraphim).

You even quoted this, but then you were ignoring all but one line of that post anyway so etc.

Vi not analyzing the wagons - You asked that question at freaking 11 at night.
I overslept and ran out the door this morning.
I JUST got in and this post is the first (and maybe last) thing I'm doing online for a while. I just finished eating dinner at this sentence.

The only polite thing I can think of to conclude this is: Etc.

From the way Vi is directing attention towards LLD and not doing the same for Seraphim, I was logically assuming that she felt LLD was scum and Seraphim was town.

I had no idea what you were talking about here, so I looked.

LLD 109 - Who is "we"? And if you're including yourself, why are you not voting with me?
Also, how do you take C∴S's accusation that you are a "bandwagoning ho"?

GreyICE's 105 is not the clear posting that was advertised, because I can barely tell what's being said. Seraphim is definitely correct about smelling rhetoric, because ICE looks like he's trying to build himself up to be this Big Deal that he's really not.

(...)

Seraphim 126 and 128 really don't look like they're coming from Town.

LLD 134 - Okay, your name for the rest of the game is "Bandwagoning Ho".

Everything after that - Waiting on C∴S.

---

Seraphim and Bandwagoning Ho - What do you think of the wagons you have on youse?

There's a reason that asking for a claim after voting someone to L-1 shouldn't be accepted claim practice.

U. vote count impending.

Cut by Bandwagoning Ho - Where is Nacho in this?

This post is almost understandable as "focusing on LLD" except I was trying not to pass judgment on the wagons here.

Bandwagoning Ho's new name aside, while I don't agree with some amount of her accusations (I have my own reasons to dislike Seraphim )

I don't see scum motivation in the fervor.

Spearophim, as mentioned before,

looks less than kosher

given the taunts I brought up earlier and questionable reasons for doing questionable things. However, Seraphim's ardent guarantee that he won't be lynched is interesting enough that it's worth putting him on hold for a moment.

I DUNNO THIS LOOKS A WHOLE LOT LIKE I'M CALLING LLD SCUM AND SERAPHIM TOWN

Scumhunting becomes rather difficult when every single post I make becomes another tumor on your convoluted "case". Thanks for clearing up any indecision I might have had concerning my vote on you.

So Bandwagoning Ho is

making

you tunnel on her?

THIS IS TOTALLY ME SAYING SERAPHIM IS DOING NOTHING OUT OF PLACE

Thank you and good freaking night.

And while I'm here.

Huh.

Fair enough.

Hope there's a reason for what you're doing.

Finish better have fucking fireworks and a brass band, is what I'm saying.

Those questions weren't lazy, I was getting somewhere. And where I was getting is what to think of Vi based on Seraphim and LLD's alignments. And if LLD is town and Seraphim is scum, which is what I believe, then Vi?

Doesn't look good.

What the hell are you trying to convey here?
"Y'know, if you don't play my game, I'm going to put you on my

bad list

."
If you think I'm scum, you don't say "I'd watch out, I might find you scummy if you keep this up".

That's not how suspicion works.

That IS, however, what you do to put up bad-play lynches.

---

I sympathize with Vi on this issue. I was basically in your shoes last game I played with her, so.

And remind me of your alignment in that game.

Hey wait a minute.

@Vi: I'll admit the latest barrage of questions felt careless. As in "attempting to look proactively pro town real quick here", but kinda missing the fact things had been answered. Sorta like he was trying to pump up his vitals with the serum stuff in Trauma center, but somehow missed. Except in this case his vitals were his townness. I still like Sera scum better, but GI is not outside the realm of possibility.

<post talking to but showing no suspicion of GreyICE>

<another post of the same>

What is this?

---

I see a Jahudo post and I'm too spent to worry about it right now.

[UncertainKitten]

@Vi: I'm not convinced of Grey scum yet. I'm merely slightly more suspicious of him. Seraphim is far scummier in my eyes.

[Jahudo]

Thoughts on some players:

UK - Is not yelling at me so she must be town But yeah, lots of questions and opinions all around. I don't see anything opportunistic and she is one of the stronger voices in the game so hopefully that's good. Town.

---
Vi - Similar to UK. I don't mind that Vi holds back opinions at points waiting for other people to post more. Her stances on Sera and Lady look in order, nothing contradictory or questionable as to why she'd take that position. I'll have to look into Grey again because on my first read I didn't feel he was ever scummy. More like a player that could use some elaboration. Anyway, Vi town.

---
Kdub – Actively commenting on a lot of various events and people looks good, its not just about who he’s voting but I think he’s also dedicated enough focus in Seraphim too. Says he doesn’t like how Seraphim reacted to LL’s vote. I can understand how that OMGUSy tone would make someone happy with their early gut vote. It is one of the parts about the wagon I’m less sure about, though I still thinks its more likely null. Kdub looks pro-town.

---
Rhinox – Takes stances on the big discussions which is good, but he doesn’t say why he finds Grey worse than Sera. Most of his explanation part is about Lady, even though his attention is more on Grey right now. So I’m wondering why he finds Lady delusional and Grey scummy? Lean town.

---
Toasty – He’s trying to balance finding both Sera and Grey scummy, which is alright because they aren’t both connected to the cases those players have for each other. But I wonder why Toasty thinks that Seraphim tell (of keeping back flavor info) is a good one. Or why he thinks Grey is testing out various lynches. I didn’t get that conclusion.

---
CES – I don’t know what he’s thinking for the most part, but he probably knows what he’s doing with his votes. The line about Seraphim pulling a quote out of context was original content. I guess I just wish he had more. Null read unfortunately.

---
Antitown – Nothing interesting here. Null.

---
Nacho – I find it concerning that after 16 posts he hasn’t given any opinion on Sera or Grey. Is it not important to you Nacho? Lean scum.

FoS: Nacho

---
Untrod – I don’t understand how he goes from “I can get behind a Seraphim lynch” to “I’m not for a Seraphim wagon at all right now”. He kept most of his reasoning hidden and its just not enough to say that Seraphim looks like he is genuinely scumhunting. There’s no mention of the points on the case, especially Lady’s who he seems to like in this game so far.

His Toasty vote looks weak because he didn’t initially know the extent of Toasty’s voting patterns (which look average). I also don’t understand this “Indicating” scumtell at all. How is that different that what UT did himself in 155 (unvoting and saying he could get behind a Seraphim or Toasty lynch)?

It looks the exact same to me, but the difference is when I read UT’s ISO I see more evidence of testing the Seraphim wagon, because he decides against it without fully explaning his actions. Toasty and Antihero look more like safety picks. UT reads scum.

unvote;
Vote: Untrod Tripod

[Seraphim]

I need to reread Grey and LLD and try to figure out exactly what I'm doing.

I will admit that rolefishing was a terrible term to use for what I was trying to say, but my point still stands. LLD's posting previous to voting me looks like she was more concerned with my claim and my role than whether or not I was actually scummy.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

I need to reread Grey and LLD and try to figure out exactly what I'm doing.

I will admit that rolefishing was a terrible term to use for what I was trying to say, but my point still stands. LLD's posting previous to voting me looks like she was more concerned with my claim and my role than whether or not I was actually scummy.

You're still pushing that? Do you

have

any other points? I haven't seen any. This point has been covered, discussed, and considered. Next point against me please, or admit you have no case.

[Seraphim]

BTW, for someone who has a case built around the fact that I'm supposedly misrepping people, continuing to misrep my "rolefishing" point and spinning it as a scumtell seems pretty shady.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

BTW, for someone who has a case built around the fact that I'm supposedly misrepping people, continuing to misrep my "rolefishing" point and spinning it as a scumtell seems pretty shady.

Good god! That's not what I'm saying! It's not that you're wrong, it's that

YOU ONLY HAVE ONE POINT IN YOUR CASE AGAINST ME.

Stop MAKING SHIT UP. AGAIN.

[Lady Lambdadelta]

Honestly, I'm done with this. Seraphim needs to swing.

These last few posts should be CONCLUSIVE.

[Seraphim]

Nothing is true. Everything is permitted.

[ToastyToast]

I need to reread Grey and LLD and try to figure out exactly what I'm doing.
I will admit that rolefishing was a terrible term to use for what I was trying to say, but my point still stands. LLD's posting previous to voting me looks like she was more concerned with my claim and my role than whether or not I was actually scummy.

why mention this now, after most have decided that your argument is inadequate? more importantly, which previous posts suggests that she was more concerned with a claim. Doesn't matter what a post "looks like" if there's nothing actually there.

@Jahudo: Why did you leave LLD, GreyICE, and Seraphim off your list? Its a very fair post, just curious about that.

Anyone else notice how GreyICE has backed off on both attacks and defending? Get in here, man!

[Seraphim]

why mention this now, after most have decided that your argument is inadequate?

Connect your own fucking dots. And who's most? LLD? I would hardly count her as "most".

There are certainly other points, like that most of her content before voting consisting solely of mechanic speculation, flavor speculation, and votes based upon aforementioned categories of play.

more importantly, which previous posts suggests that she was more concerned with a claim. Doesn't matter what a post "looks like" if there's nothing actually there.

The fact that her previous "suspicion" of me amounts to depreciating comments concerning a post made mostly in jest. The fact that she wants a claim despite the lack of lynching intent on the wagon on me is clearly a slip on her concerns to my role rather than my alignment, a scum motivation.

@Jahudo: Why did you leave LLD, GreyICE, and Seraphim off your list? Its a very fair post, just curious about that.

Please connect the dots, sir. You can figure this out on your own. What do the three players you've listed have in common?

Toast is either mentally sluggish or scum BTW. His 292 may be the most useless post anyone has made all game and Lady Lambdadelta has a fucking novel for an ISO.

[Untrod Tripod]

Untrod – I don’t understand how he goes from “I can get behind a Seraphim lynch” to “I’m not for a Seraphim wagon at all right now”.

I'll reread and figure out whether I like a Seraphim or a TT vote moar.

By rereading the game more closely. Lrn2read

[ToastyToast]

@Seraphim: Woah, bro. I'm just trying to get back into this. Your response was equally unhelpful. My point WAS to understand why your opening up an argument that sucked. You are just adding on to it without any proof that it was actually important to you at the time.

And my question to Jahudo is 1) not for you and 2) obviously rhetorical. I want to know why he's leaving out the three big suspects and going straight to UT. Odd to completely ignore them.

Don't insult me. It doesn't add anything.

[Jahudo]

@Jahudo: Why did you leave LLD, GreyICE, and Seraphim off your list? Its a very fair post, just curious about that.

Because I had already given my reads on them when I talked about the Seraphim wagon earlier. I said I think both Lady and Sera are town. I disagree with Grey's case and Sera's case against Grey but right now the only concern I have about him is this one you just brought up. I do wonder why he faded into the background after being more aggressive before.

Untrod – I don’t understand how he goes from “I can get behind a Seraphim lynch” to “I’m not for a Seraphim wagon at all right now”.

I'll reread and figure out whether I like a Seraphim or a TT vote moar.

By rereading the game more closely. Lrn2read

The fact remains that you did like a Seraphim lynch in the first post, and not in the second. It wasn't a matter of deciding you'd rather vote Toasty, that would be understandable. But you said Seraphim was "pretty townish". That is a dramatic change in such a short time.

Without giving good reasons why you changed your mind, I suspect that you were testing the waters of another Seraphim vote. So why didn't you think Seraphim was doing good scumhunting before? Or was he only doing good scumhunting in the 3 hours between your two posts?

[Seraphim]

I have no clue what you're talking about in your first point. Honestly.

The question may have been directed at Jahudo but it doesn't make it any less useless. It's pretty obvious why those particular players were excluded.

Mod: V/LA until Sunday

Actually, I think this is BaM, so it doesn't matter, but I might as well post it anyway. I should have internet access, but it's worth noting.

[Kdub]

The fact that her previous "suspicion" of me amounts to depreciating comments concerning a post made mostly in jest. The fact that she wants a claim despite the lack of lynching intent on the wagon on me is clearly a slip on her concerns to my role rather than my alignment, a scum motivation.

I mentioned this earlier, but I don't actually think this indicates scum motivation. I don't have statistics offhand, but the number of times I have seen town players put someone at L-1 and immediately ask for a claim (I remember having done it myself when I was a newer player) just because it's conventional to claim at L-1 makes me believe that this is not a valid scum tell.

Toast is either mentally sluggish or scum BTW. His 292 may be the most useless post anyone has made all game and Lady Lambdadelta has a fucking novel for an ISO.

I'm actually getting a townish feel from Toasty in 292. I think his questions are legitimate, and he's actively challenging his suspects (you, GreyICE). At the very least, it's far from a useless post.

[Fate]

299+1=