Mini 1075 - Fishtown Mafia


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Post Post #825 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:19 pm

Post by Fishythefish »

Day 8, Final Votecount

Empking (3) - corvuus, LlamaFluff, neko2086
corvuus (1) - Empking

Not voting (3) - DavidParker

Empking, vanilla townie
is lynched.
DavidParker, vanilla townie
is endgamed.
corvuus, vanilla townie
is endgamed.

Congratulations to
LlamaFluff and neko2086, Mafia Goons
, who win the game!
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Post Post #826 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:24 pm

Post by Fenhl »

:)
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Post Post #827 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:56 pm

Post by singersigner »

UGH. THIS GAME WAS THE DUMBEST THING TO WATCH EVER.

You guys suck for not lynching D1 OR D3.

uuuuuuugh.
Glork and quadz08 are my favorite.

I like tomatoes.
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Post Post #828 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 7:57 pm

Post by DavidParker »

neko2086 wrote:I'm thinking an emp vote is good.

vote: Empking
I lol'd.
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Post Post #829 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:13 pm

Post by LlamaFluff »

neko can post the QT if he wants to. To make up for the JK scum had daytalk so there is quite a bit there.

Will comment more in the game later on, really have been busy as of late.
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Post Post #830 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 8:17 pm

Post by singersigner »

Oh geez...day talk is not even fair...
Glork and quadz08 are my favorite.

I like tomatoes.
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Post Post #831 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 9:50 pm

Post by Empking »

OK, I'm not going to lie here. Very, very good play be Neko and very, very, very good oplay by LF.
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Post Post #832 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:06 pm

Post by LlamaFluff »

singersigner wrote:Oh geez...day talk is not even fair...
It depends on how well scum uses it. There are just over 100 posts in the QT, and half of them came after I replace in. Until then it really had little bearing on what scum actually did.

Towns problem was lack of ability to do anything early on, the double no lynch was just crushed most of the chance that they had of winning the game. It left too many suspected people around late in the game for scum to capitalize on. FA should have been lynched day one at the very least, Emp probably too. It would have made the game much harder for my slot who was in some danger for quite some time. Thats all givens though.

The read of Emp was totally genuine. I saw that thread before this game and figured when Emp pulled that stunt he was going to be town. I started reading this game about half a day before I got my role and decided that he was probably town due to it. I know not a lot of people agreed with that, but he was doing something I felt he was genuinely sure was the right thing to do.

Replacing in I actually somehow wanted Emp lynched, since the Corv-Haylen dual wagons left scum the most wiggle room in suspicions. I just was a little concerned of the Corv-Emp one since I had already laid down my read on Emp, and Corv is probably one of the most underrated players on the site and I really didnt want to go up against him with Emp looking like my scum partner, since that could end disasterous. It was hard to make a kill on that last night two, since me and neko both were mostly regarded as town, neko especially since I at least had the previous people card to play.

Was an interesting game, and I think its a balanced setup with the JK role and scum getting daytalk instead. Both good things, but only if used correctly.
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Post Post #833 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:31 pm

Post by singersigner »

I don't think it matters how well scum uses daytalk. Not using it is the equivalency of not sending in a night action. It's the fact that it can be very powerful. Much more powerful than one town PR.

But you're right, the fact that we went with TWO FUCKING NO LYNCHES just because people "didn't agree so-and-so was scummier than so-and-so" was just dumb. I had even asked Corv if he would hammer at one point when he replaced in just so that wouldn't happen. :roll:
Glork and quadz08 are my favorite.

I like tomatoes.
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Post Post #834 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 10:50 pm

Post by DavidParker »

I think you're overplaying how useful day-talk really is. I mean there's not a huge amount scum can do with it early on for strategizing.

And yeah agree with Emp. You both played really well. Especially llama who I had pinned as def-town. I think it often helps to read the game before replacing in so you can generate some "actual" reads, and your reads are affected by the role you receive (mostly if you receive a scum role), you can post your genuine scum/town reads. Kinda makes playing scum easier :)
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Post Post #835 (ISO) » Sun Jan 30, 2011 11:10 pm

Post by LlamaFluff »

DavidParker wrote:I think you're overplaying how useful day-talk really is. I mean there's not a huge amount scum can do with it early on for strategizing.
Yes and no.

I consider daytalk to be the equivilant of an average strength scum player IF both remaining players are very active and are decent players. In the case of this game, there was no two people active (sans a breif incog-grump pair) until the point where I came in the game. Daytalk is swingy for that matter, it depends on how good the scum players are to be effective or not. I would rather have daytalk then a third player who I view as weak as scum if my other partner was a good player. I think someone did some research where daytalk is equvilant to almost a goon in average strength players.

It just has so many ways to be taken away, epsecially if there are only two players. Inactivity, replacements, early lynch, all of that will destroy the ability of daytalk to be strong in the game.

This game continues to prove the fact of if I joined in the queue im town, if I replaced im scum. Its like clockwork.
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Post Post #836 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:05 am

Post by neko2086 »

Yeah, here's the QT thread-- http://www.quicktopic.com/45/H/8wwbZbLHLGs

I spend most of it talking to myself until llama arrives. Props to him for saving a quickly sinking role that I was ready to bus if necessary.

The advantage of the daytalk early on was following incog's strategy to keep the town split as much as possible and making sure the two scum are focused on different people, which is easier to coordinate with daytalk.

My job was relatively easy since I replaced into a town-looking position, and since in general, it seemed like the town was ready to accept things at face value. Fairly large posts (which I usually do anyway) seemed to keep everyone happy, except for Corv later on, who started to question my play, but nobody cared what he had to say so I never had to worry about it too much. I think the game would have changed pretty drastically if Corv/FA had just been lynched and the town could have moved on. In that sense, maybe a self-hammer would have been best, but honestly, I don't know what I would have done in that situation.

DP, no hard feelings. I don't think I would have done much differently as town, maybe not so much to get you lynched as just to get you talking. I think you played a much better second half of the game.

More comments later, probably
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Post Post #837 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:19 am

Post by havingfitz »

Well suck.

This game was painful to be in annnd to watch. Good going scum. That daychat thing is a pretty powerful tool.
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Post Post #838 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:47 am

Post by Rhinox »

hmph... never suspected neko at all. Llama/fenhl scum doesn't surprise me. I'm glad corvuus wasn't scum in the end. It was pretty painful to be a part of this town. Thanks to fishy for keeping the game going, and congrats to the scum for geting the flawless victory.
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Post Post #839 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:49 am

Post by Fishythefish »

Thanks to everyone for playing, and particularly all the replacements. No lynching twice before mylo was obviously no good for the town, but the scum also played extremely well - even knowing the answer it wasn't easy to catch them.
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Post Post #840 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 7:07 am

Post by Scott Brosius »

havingfitz wrote:Well suck.

This game was painful to be in annnd to watch. Good going scum. That daychat thing is a pretty powerful tool.
All of this. Thx for modding.
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Post Post #841 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:50 am

Post by Incognito »

Hi all. Just wanted to apologize to the players and especially the mod for leaving the game the way I did. A lot of stuff just came up all at once for me, and I knew I wouldn't be able to put all I could into this game or anywhere else on MS, so I thought it best to request replacement.

Congrats to neko and LF.

And I hope you all continue to enjoy playing Mafia! :D
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Post Post #842 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 11:53 am

Post by Haylen »

I think I'm gonna cry :< I had a town read on you and a mafia one of Neko -_- And BTW WHEN A PERSON'S V/LA IT MEANS THEY AREN'T GONNA POST MUCH OR VOTE.
Seriously. Read your role PM before playing.
I am sorry if you have to prod me, I have absolutely no concept of time.

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Post Post #843 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:17 pm

Post by neko2086 »

Big thanks to Fishy for being a great mod and dealing with so many replacements!
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Post Post #844 (ISO) » Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:54 pm

Post by Corvuus »

I'm disappointed but congratulations to the scum team.

I was fairly convinced of DP-town but after EMP and I voted for each other it was game over. (I guess scum daytalked to figure out time to place votes/hammer the town player they wanted to).
-----
Honestly, EMP I tried to see you as town at different times during this game and it just didn't happen for me. When I mentioned in my previous post that "if you are town, this is your chance to convince me" that was honest. I was preparing for a vote on you (saturday) but I don't believe in any game that 'things are certain/fate, etc.' so I was surprised you voted for me without saying anything and, since i know that i myself am town, I am forced to vote you in return regardless of anything else.

In terms of my lylo play, I was worried about inactivity and 'cutting close to deadline' since my time would drop dramatically in the upcoming week.... so attacking everyone and trying to get a response was to just double-check. I didn't like your response at all Neko but other than helping me confirm that DP was town, I felt that I needed to get votes and prepare for a move since my general opinion was that LF-Neko were going to hedge, DP would follow, EMP would stay silent. That was saturday and my flip-flop on attacking LF, to then try and convince LF to vote with me and provoke a response from EMP. Did you honestly think i was scum EMP or what? I can 100% assure you that if I was scum i would have either nightkilled you or just called you town like everyone else and hedged so I'm not sure what you thought about me when I did things counter to being Corv-scum.

If Neko and LF both hedged in their response, I was going to push a Neko lynch (for various reasons that I outlined before plus he would be 'easier' to lynch than EMP with DP and potentially LF). If LF refused/changed response on Neko and EMP actually said something other than voting then maybe things would have been different with people talking. Not very likely at all though. The only thing I found strange about LF was exasperation in tone.

-----------------------

In terms of self-lynch, hammering. I fully planned on hammering myself over voting singersinger since I didn't think people would listen and optimum town move for me was to remove myself so that my slot wouldn't be an issue. Singer was hammered by the switch vote when i was gone which I didn't expect.

If the Christmas lynch on EMP was successful, then town might have had a chance as well.

In terms of Haylen lynch, Haylen, I understand VLA but it was deadline and you had several days before your VLA on weekends. If you had voted EMP or said something, I might have tried for deadline extension, push like I did in previous days but you were a suspect if 3 scum team and I wasn't willing to derail your lynch with having no idea of your alignment. So while you may consider it 'poor play', you bear some responsibility for your own lynch as well.
-------

If I was in the game from the beginning as opposed to FA-replacement, then things might have been different as well.

I'll respond if you guys have any questions or further comments. Otherwise, gg.

Corv
p.s. good game fishy.
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Post Post #845 (ISO) » Sat Feb 26, 2011 4:25 pm

Post by Papa Zito »

fin.
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