1119: The Might of Mordor: Game Over

[Andrius]

Day One, Lynch-Count One

gandalf5166 (2): quadz08, SpyreX
Mariyta (2): Katy, Plum
Edge (2): Mariyta, gandalf5166
quadz08 (1): singersigner
Katy (1): esuriospiritus
AlmasterGM (1): Edge

Not Voting (3): AlmasterGM, Sevei, VasudeVa

Day One, Imbue-Count One

quadz08 (2): quadz08, singersigner
SpyreX (2): Edge, gandalf5166
esuriospiritus (1): esuriospiritus
Edge (1): Plum

Not Voting (6): Katy, SpyreX, VasudeVa, AlmasterGM, Mariyta, Sevei

Notices

With 12 alive it takes 7 to Lynch and/or Imbue.
Deadline is set at Thursday, February 10th, at 1:00pm PST.

[singersigner]

oops, I meant to UNVOTE: quadz08

[VasudeVa]

Vote: Singersigner

quadz: *RVS Gandalf*
Singer: *vote quadz*
quadz: *something something about imbues, imbue self*

Singer: I agree with quadz. *imbue quadz*

Lack of unvote in the italicized portion is scummy.

[singersigner]

Your lack of reading the rest of the thread is enlightening.

[VasudeVa]

Mechanics talk and RVS-topia do not interest me right now.

No reaction to the case?

[singersigner]

You don't have a case to react to.

[Mariyta]

@Katy: Voting for Edge is like wearing Uggs. They're ugly, stupid, and you just want them to go away, but they stick around like a bad case of fleas. And I never voted for him last year, so there.

@Plum: It wasn't vote-worthy, just note-worthy. I can actually see town saying something like that more than scum, but I still wanted to point out how dumb it was.

Flavorwise, it's probable that scum do not have superpowers. Just sayin.

What makes you say this?

Singer's comment on quadz' "beneficence" is really, um... what's the word? Naive? And massively WIFOMilicious.

Gandalf has it right. Don't imbue anyone you don't trust. My question is why are so many people so trusting at this stage in the game?

[Fate]

FATE TAG

[Edge]

#1

VOTE: Edge
Imbue: Edge

The thing that makes this different from SSBB is that the person who gets the superpower isn't held accountable.

Flavorwise, it's probable that scum do not have superpowers. Just sayin.

#2

..............

Imbue: SpySpy

Plum, I don't think that Imbue wagons can be "hammered". Pretty sure that it goes to the plurality at the time of lynch.

To his credit, his vote is still on me, BUTTTTTTTTTTTTT he said "scum dont have superpowerz"

THEN I CALIMED NOT TO HAVE THEM.

Then he just imbues someone else. HE DID NOT UPGRADE HIS RVS VOTE TO A REAL VOTE, OR SAY "wow claimed scum" OR ANYTHING.

Yeah Gandalf can go.

Not joining the Mariyta mini-wagon. Last time I remember seeing someone get accused of trying to direct the town, the accuser was 100% right but got shouted down for it, leaving the scum to direct the town into a horrible loss.

Esu gives an excuse to NOT vote Mariyta.... saying that her pointing out the town direction is not a scumtell, aka IMPLYING that AGM

is scum directing the town

HER VOTE?

ON FUCKIN KATY.

Vote: Esurio

#3

(and, yes, I am a bit flummoxed at you MR EDGE but doing that NOW is so town that we can discuss this at a later date).

It was either that or come up with some BS gambit as TO WHY I SHOULDNT be imbued D1 (which I would gun for all day were I town with an actual super power regardless of ability and scum), so yeah. I was TRYING to avoid claiming town so early, but hell, I guess I'll just die N1 again.

YOU ON THE OTHER HAND NEED TO BE IMBUED EVERYTIME YOUR ARE ALIVE.

HAIL SAURONEX!

[AlmasterGM]

You don't have a case to react to.

But you do have VOTES.

Vote: singersinger

I like VV's argument, actually (although calling it a case is a bit of an overstatement).

To his credit, his vote is still on me, BUTTTTTTTTTTTTT he said "scum dont have superpowerz"

THEN I CALIMED NOT TO HAVE THEM.

Then he just imbues someone else. HE DID NOT UPGRADE HIS RVS VOTE TO A REAL VOTE, OR SAY "wow claimed scum" OR ANYTHING.

Yeah Gandalf can go.

Ehhhh this just seems like gandalf being an idiot.

[AlmasterGM]

And with this many PRs there is sure to be a VIG who can handle the IDIOTS.

[gandalf5166]

VOTE: Edge
Imbue: Edge

Flavorwise, it's probable that scum do not have superpowers. Just sayin.

This is implying that Edge effectively claimed scum by this:

errr I left out of that post the part where it should say I don't have any super powers to gain access too***

So...I'ma say no on that one...

While I can't think of why town wouldn't be able to use the ring(I only just bought the Silmarillion, and haven't gotten around to reading it yet, so I don't even know who the hell MY character is), scum are the good guys. In the books, good guys don't use the ring. Thus, scum don't use the ring. Comprende?

Spy, you're stupid. That is all. Scum can't use the ring, thus I would rather give it to someone who I trust to use it properly IF they are town than no-one.

Also, I think you're forgetting that ITS THE RVS. I PURPOSELY VOTED AND IMBUED. GET THE FUCK OVER IT.

[esuriospiritus]

Esu gives an excuse to NOT vote Mariyta.... saying that her pointing out the town direction is not a scumtell, aka IMPLYING that AGM is scum directing the town

Fate, you -always- think I'm scum. And you're always wrong.

'pointing out that someone is trying to direct the town' is not a scumtell =! implying that AGM must be scum. It's not necessarily a "one or the other of these people must be scum" thing.

Literally all I was saying with that is "last time I saw a situation like this the person accusing the other person of directing the town turned out to be right, and I don't like the fact that Mariyta has votes for that." I said NOTHING about "well, LAST time the person who was directing the town was scum, so that must be the case THIS time too." I've seen plenty of times where town directed the town too (COUGHFATECOUGH), I'm just saying voting someone for saying someone else was directing the town is dumb.

My vote is still on Katy because her reason for voting Mariyta is entirely too nebulous for my tastes and also because she's one of like 2 people here I've never played with or seen in action before and have thus prioritized getting a read on.

@gandalf: Frodo used the Ring. Sam used the Ring (briefly). Bilbo used the Ring. Quite a few elves used

a

ring, if not

the

Ring. There may be dwarves somewhere that use a ring even if we don't see it in LotR (at least, not to my rusty recollection). I see no reason to believe that the scumteam

can't

use the Ring. And again, even if they can't, they'd still probably rather keep it for themselves than let a townie get a stronger power, so it's kind of a moot point and I don't see why you're arguing it.

[gandalf5166]

Okay, so if you allow that, then maybe giving the ring to scum would lead to them being action-immune. But they never actually USED the ring. You know what I mean. And yeah, some characters used A ring, but not THE ring, because they were afraid of corruption. I realize that giving the ring to scum would obviously not be good for the town. That's not the point. The point is that 3/4 odds of it going to town are really just fine by me, so why not give it to a competent null-read.

On that note: Since it is likely that scum recieving the ring might become action-immune, I wouldn't recomend anybody but the doc targeting the ring-bearer as it's possible that your action would be useless.

[AlmasterGM]

Ok, I'm changing my mind about Gandalf. His arguments are becoming too pointed to be dumbtown and are more likely to be coming from scum.

1) This kinda offbeat theory that scum don't have super powers / cannot utilize the ring. This possibility did not occur to me AT ALL. Maybe it did for other people, in which case I'm wrong, but it smells like insider info.

2) The whole "ring makes scum action immune, so nobody targets ringbearer." Same as above. It is just not something that occurred to me AS TOWN.

3) Why the hell would we give the ring to a random NULL read and not a strong TOWN read? Or someone claiming to have a good power?

[Plum]

hmmmmmmmm Plum calling me town before I've done anything TOWN-like?

IS YOU A SCUMGIRL AGAIN THIS TIME? I WONT BE FOOLED TWICE.

IF I'D REMEMBERED WHO YOU WERE THIS MAYBE WOULD HAVE BEEN RELEVANT. IN ABSENCE, UH . . . LULZ.

Ye gods, will people stop softclaiming/whatever claiming? Maybe Edge is exempt because yeah but there are people here who don't have that excuse, and whom I'd expect to be smarter or whatnot >.<.

Hey Gandalf, why vote to Imbue SpyreX?

Vote and Imbue? Check.
Talking about lack of accountability IN A POST WHERE YOU IMBUE SOMEONE? Check.
Saying that 'flavor' would mean the ONE RING DOESNT DO THINGS TO EVERYONE? Wooosh Check.

I'm not seeing anything here but the first line, and that just might be RVS shenanigans.

@Plum: It wasn't vote-worthy, just note-worthy. I can actually see town saying something like that more than scum, but I still wanted to point out how dumb it was.

So if you didn't intend your noting to mean that AGM's action was scummy, and in fact you think it's null at least - why the ambiguous statement where it looks like you're implying that it's scummy? Why didn't you say something like 'Null/not scummy, but dumb, and noted' ?

Gandalf has it right. Don't imbue anyone you don't trust. My question is why are so many people so trusting at this stage in the game?

Are you pretty damn sure that Edge is a good lynch today? If not, why are you voting to lynch him? ANSWER: Because there's no harm in early-game imbue votes. Hell, I'd forgotten who Edge was and he got some extra Townpoints in my book for having a Fate-like approach (more intuitive as Town and harder to pull off as scum) until I realized that, oh yeah, he

is

Fate (and RC). But it makes no difference because there will be no serious Imbue wagon that's liable to go through before people have serious Townreads - and in the meantime, early/quasi-random Imbue voting can't hurt.

The singer case is, uhhhhhm, interesting. By which I mean cruddy through and through. I don't see her intentionally not unvoting quadz and I don't see anything but null in forgetting to do so. Of the ones voting her, I'm inclined to say AGM's response is the scummier - it's some piggybacking with some qualifying with some idle wondering on my part why he hadn't been voting anyone before this despite having time to talk about mechanics. Yeah, AGM hasn't been involved in anything, I don't think, which is one better than Mari.

@esurio - Hmm, fair point, but Mari was very ambiguous in her sentiments when she noted AGM's behavior.

Gandalf, the information relevant to this game is probably not in the Silm . . . but enjoy the book anyway . In terms of scum being able to use the Ring, the implication is that yes, the good guys could've used it for powerful stuff (though I don't think we're lucky enough for it to corrupt them), so I'm not sure that we should be on it being only action-immunity for them. Granted, your reasoning for having thought that scum don't have superpowers makes sense in your contexts, so I see Edge's logic but disagree with the conclusion. Instead, let's try this:

UNVOTE:

VOTE: AGM

PREVIEW EDIT:

Ok, I'm changing my mind about Gandalf. His arguments are becoming too pointed to be dumbtown and are more likely to be coming from scum.

1) This kinda offbeat theory that scum don't have super powers / cannot utilize the ring. This possibility did not occur to me AT ALL. Maybe it did for other people, in which case I'm wrong, but it smells like insider info.

2) The whole "ring makes scum action immune, so nobody targets ringbearer." Same as above. It is just not something that occurred to me AS TOWN.

3) Why the hell would we give the ring to a random NULL read and not a strong TOWN read? Or someone claiming to have a good power?

1. Flavorwise it's not the craziest thing to say, and I know the flavor.

2. Same as above.

3. Only decent point in the lot.

Where's the Gandalf vote??? NONE.

CHECKMATE.

[gandalf5166]

I'm just thinking about the flavor and making fairly obvious assumptions. If I was scum, remind me why I would supply the town with this "insider info"?

Do you have anyone as a STRONG town read at this point? I don't. The closest to that that I have is a leaning-town on esurio. But my point is that WE WANT GOOD PLAYERS TO HAVE THE RING. NOT STUPID TOWN. And I don't know anything about esurio, so I don't trust him to use it well if he is town. Thus, I vote for SptySpy because I DO think that if he is town, he'll know how to use it.

And to be honest, I don't trust anyone who claims that they have a strong superpower. Why would town claim that? It's basically telling the scum "O HAI GUIZ I HAVE REALLY AWESOME ROLE NK ME PLOX?"

I do like the AGM wagon. He seems like he's pretending to be stupid, probably because I'm right, as opposed to Edge who I'm pretty sure actually is being stupid.

VOTE: AGM

[Mariyta]

@Plum: It wasn't vote-worthy, just note-worthy. I can actually see town saying something like that more than scum, but I still wanted to point out how dumb it was.

So if you didn't intend your noting to mean that AGM's action was scummy, and in fact you think it's null at least - why the ambiguous statement where it looks like you're implying that it's scummy? Why didn't you say something like 'Null/not scummy, but dumb, and noted' ?

Sorry I didn't word it the way YOU would have worded it. Next time I shall try my best to emulate you.

Gandalf has it right. Don't imbue anyone you don't trust. My question is why are so many people so trusting at this stage in the game?

Are you pretty damn sure that Edge is a good lynch today? If not, why are you voting to lynch him? ANSWER: Because there's no harm in early-game imbue votes. Hell, I'd forgotten who Edge was and he got some extra Townpoints in my book for having a Fate-like approach (more intuitive as Town and harder to pull off as scum) until I realized that, oh yeah, he

is

Fate (and RC). But it makes no difference because there will be no serious Imbue wagon that's liable to go through before people have serious Townreads - and in the meantime, early/quasi-random Imbue voting can't hurt.

First off, it's an RVS vote. Second, that's your opinion that early imbue votes are harmless. IMO, imbuing seems more powerful than lynching and I don't want some random person who I don't trust to gain access to a power that could kick the town's ass if gained at the wrong time. You seem certain the town won't "quick imbue." I don't hold that same faith.

[Plum]

imbuing seems more powerful than lynching

O_O

I guess this is where our opinions differ. But seriously, WTH. How can you believe this is possible? I just.

Ambiguous statements can leave an out for scum to go with the flow (the way yours went, you could've theoretically joined in any AGM hate that followed and if none did just say you meant it was null but worth noting. It has nothing specifically to do with wording it

the way I would have

; I was just giving an example of a phrasing that wouldn't be conducive to scum opportunism with the statement).

[Mariyta]

imbuing seems more powerful than lynching

O_O

I guess this is where our opinions differ. But seriously, WTH. How can you believe this is possible? I just.

I know what my superpower is, and I know that it can be pretty damn powerful if used correctly. I'm sure there are likely others out there who have powers that are way cooler than what I have and could do serious damage if they're in the wrong hands. Maybe "potentially more powerful" would have been a better wording choice.

[AlmasterGM]

Where's the Gandalf vote??? NONE.

I don't see why I have to vote Gandalf to say he's scummy. I only have one vote, and I like my vote on singersinger more.

Do you have anyone as a STRONG town read at this point? I don't. The closest to that that I have is a leaning-town on esurio. But my point is that WE WANT GOOD PLAYERS TO HAVE THE RING. NOT STUPID TOWN. And I don't know anything about esurio, so I don't trust him to use it well if he is town. Thus, I vote for SptySpy because I DO think that if he is town, he'll know how to use it.

There's also no requirement that we imbue RIGHT NOW. Just wait a bit and see what reads develop, then make your pick. It's that simple?

The idea of imbuing somebody just because you think they will use it right IF THEY ARE TOWN is terrible. We are not giving the ring to anyone who is not to the town side of center. Preferably, they will be very far from the center.

[Edge]

Unvote:
Vote: Plum

There's no way in FUCKING HELL Plum forgot who I was.

She's lying scum backtracking to cover her tracks.

She modded a 100 page fucking game in which I CONTINUALLY posted out of Hydra with me in it.

She didn't even SAY in her original post "oh wow Edge is totally town for confirmation stage, his Fate liike approach...."

etc. etc. She's saying that NOW since I called her out on having a town read on me too early that was comfortable.

AND ESURIO IS SCUMSCUMSCUM STILL

Fate, you -always- think I'm scum. And you're always wrong.

'pointing out that someone is trying to direct the town' is not a scumtell =! implying that AGM must be scum. It's not necessarily a "one or the other of these people must be scum" thing.

Literally all I was saying with that is "last time I saw a situation like this the person accusing the other person of directing the town turned out to be right, and I don't like the fact that Mariyta has votes for that." I said NOTHING about "well, LAST time the person who was directing the town was scum, so that must be the case THIS time too." I've seen plenty of times where town directed the town too (COUGHFATECOUGH), I'm just saying voting someone for saying someone else was directing the town is dumb.

My vote is still on Katy because her reason for voting Mariyta is entirely too nebulous for my tastes and also because she's one of like 2 people here I've never played with or seen in action before and have thus prioritized getting a read on.

@gandalf: Frodo used the Ring. Sam used the Ring (briefly). Bilbo used the Ring. Quite a few elves used a ring, if not the Ring. There may be dwarves somewhere that use a ring even if we don't see it in LotR (at least, not to my rusty recollection). I see no reason to believe that the scumteam can't use the Ring. And again, even if they can't, they'd still probably rather keep it for themselves than let a townie get a stronger power, so it's kind of a moot point and I don't see why you're arguing

I mean just look at this post. All justification, all whiny defense, all flavor fluff all SCUM. Not a bit of content.

[AlmasterGM]

And to be honest, I don't trust anyone who claims that they have a strong superpower. Why would town claim that? It's basically telling the scum "O HAI GUIZ I HAVE REALLY AWESOME ROLE NK ME PLOX?"

This is equally dumb because I'd be willing to bet MOST IF NOT ALL supers are better than regular powers, soooo in 99% scum are probably going to be like, "wow, who should we kill tonight, I don't know, MAYBE THE PERSON WHO PUBLICLY GOT THE RING THAT DAY."

Now presumably there's a doctor BUT STILL.

[Plum]

Fate, dude, if you'd managed to post UNDER THIS ACCOUNT for a reasonable percentage of the game I Modded I might've remembered.
\

[Edge]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... start=2450

14 PAGES OF ISO LOL NICE FUCKING TRY.

Also, if you're in a hydra, it's much preferred that you attempt to keep your posting from the hydra account only

PLUM DIES SOON