Mafia 125: Khan's Game of Mafia (Game Over)


User avatar
SpyreX
SpyreX
POWERFUL WIZARD
User avatar
User avatar
SpyreX
POWERFUL WIZARD
POWERFUL WIZARD
Posts: 18596
Joined: April 24, 2008

Post Post #250 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:28 pm

Post by SpyreX »

SpyreX, you are like driftwood in the ocean.
The PR-business stuck me off.

I've got my vote where it NEEDS to be and you know it too.

I'm sorting on the other ones. Chevre's WORDS 9000 needs to be reparsed.

I've got my own list I'm working on but there's still too many floating in the morass. Wizard needs words badly.
Show
I always lynch scum... sometimes they're just not mafia. :P

Town: (49-47-1)
Scum: (23-11)
Third Party: (2-0)
Proud member of BaM
User avatar
Korlash
Korlash
Krap Logick
User avatar
User avatar
Korlash
Krap Logick
Krap Logick
Posts: 6579
Joined: August 23, 2007
Location: The Constellation of Kasterborous

Post Post #251 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 12:57 pm

Post by Korlash »

quote="Farside"]Please link me to a game that scum started off page one doing something mornic, crazy or off the cuff then because as I stated I have never seen scum do it.
Does it mean auto-town and clear. No someone one day who is mafia could be ballsy enough but I have seen scum buckle under pressure more often then not.[/quote]

ha ha ha ha... the "Prove me wrong or else I'm right" argument. As you're the one that made the false statement you should be the one to link me every single game that ever started with a person or persons acting crazy or moronic and ended up being town. As that is both a waste of time and stupid, I'll pretend I wasn't an eight serious about it.
Farside wrote:so Korlash your voting for me based on an opinion I have developed playing mafia here at MS? Is that really the full case?
As for you DGB question I have never seen her come out of the games and do something mornic as scum.
I'm voting you for using an obviously untrue statement to, for lack of a better phrase, poo-poo the person you are voting's reason as to why she did what she did. If it's your opinion, fine. You're welcome to it however wrong it may be. But you can't use it to ignore, or otherwise dismiss another person's logic or reasoning. In addition, you are also granting a completely free pass to anyone who has done anything even remotely anti-town this game so far... well up unto your magical post number in which the "start" of the game ends and the craziness starts to count.
Chevre wrote:Korlash, If nocase intended for his claim to be a joke, it does not prevent it from being a lie. DrippingGoofBall's claim isn't serious because as you said, it was asked for and we therefore knew that it wasn't likely to be true. nocase, on the other hand, came straight out the gate with an obtuse claim that got reactions out of many players. I'm slowly warming up to it being "the start of the game" though.
I do agree that treating all fakeclaims, even jokes obvious or otherwise, as full on lies is a good way to play. However, each of us also has to at some point allow our own ironclad beliefs bend in order to facilitate the playstyle of others. If you can recognize something as a joke, even if it takes until after the fact, you shouldn't continue to hold to the strict standard that it's a full on lie. Otherwise you start to get blinded about the issue. You have to be able to admit as well that someone claiming a role post one of a game, and someone claiming the same role on page 15 for instance, are a huge difference in terms of what is and what isn't an acceptable "lie." In short, sadly even something as pure as the definition of a lie and what it means to the town has tto have exceptions in any game with people, especially when we're all as crazy as we all are.

And I'm sure i didn't make a lot of new friends with that one. Can't wait to see what people try to turn that into...
It's not my job to be right, it's my job to be convincing.

Star Trek Voyager Mafia! Ends in a Starfleet victory! Pomp, Circumstance, and Bloodwine for all!
User avatar
farside22
farside22
Mafia Mum
User avatar
User avatar
farside22
Mafia Mum
Mafia Mum
Posts: 35785
Joined: October 24, 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY

Post Post #252 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:07 pm

Post by farside22 »

I'm voting you for using an obviously untrue statement to, for lack of a better phrase, poo-poo the person you are voting's reason as to why she did what she did. If it's your opinion, fine. You're welcome to it however wrong it may be. But you can't use it to ignore, or otherwise dismiss another person's logic or reasoning. In addition, you are also granting a completely free pass to anyone who has done anything even remotely anti-town this game so far... well up unto your magical post number in which the "start" of the game ends and the craziness starts to count.
No. But I'm sure putting words in my mouth is the one that I didn't miss when playing mafia.
ha ha ha ha... the "Prove me wrong or else I'm right" argument. As you're the one that made the false statement you should be the one to link me every single game that ever started with a person or persons acting crazy or moronic and ended up being town. As that is both a waste of time and stupid, I'll pretend I wasn't an eight serious about it.
Really? I have been out of mafia for 6 months and prior to that I was out for a few months and you want me to do a search on this when you seem to have it that scum acted moronic page one but haven't stated when you saw when scum did it?
I can at least say look at my last game I played which was the invitational game with Jack acting crazy.
You want more then that then you give something back that shows I'm lying which you claim I"m lying with nothing to back it up.

Oh wait that's right people on MS are hypocrites!

*asshole*
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
User avatar
farside22
farside22
Mafia Mum
User avatar
User avatar
farside22
Mafia Mum
Mafia Mum
Posts: 35785
Joined: October 24, 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY

Post Post #253 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:46 pm

Post by farside22 »

Since my son gave me time I did a search of the games I could recall the crazies in the game.


http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13699

There were many a character and jokes during RVS. Notice who is scum in the game that didn't say much of anything at the start.
Even when Sera is saying it's serious Poro post a pic of anteaters, Sera then did pictures.
It was none serious chaos.

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=14753

As I said the invitation Jack lies and crazy page one.

Escouta
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=56&t=13825
Call it foot in mouth, call it stupid, but it got the game going none the less.


I know there was another game but for the life of me I can't remember which game it was in.

Actual

Richard I knew there was another who did a taboo more then something on purpose when he asked the question he did in this game.
http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 2&start=25

Sadly that was not done to get out of the RVS that was just newb stupidity.
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
User avatar
Antihero
Antihero
al;kdjfal;kj
User avatar
User avatar
Antihero
al;kdjfal;kj
al;kdjfal;kj
Posts: 15872
Joined: March 30, 2009

Post Post #254 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 1:46 pm

Post by Antihero »

DrippingGoofball wrote:
Antihero wrote:OK, well why did you only quote a small portion of the wall Chevre typed?
R U C rius?
Completely.

Farside, I'm sure korlash didn't mean anything he said personally. *pats back*
The distance between insanity and genius is measured only by success.
User avatar
Gorrad
Gorrad
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Gorrad
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4578
Joined: April 30, 2007
Location: Land of Dungeons and Stairs

Post Post #255 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 2:24 pm

Post by Gorrad »

curiouskarmadog wrote:
Gorrad wrote:
curiouskarmadog wrote:OMG, I have been here for years...and that post was the longest I have ever read...firm stances and opinions...and lots of content...town or really ballsy scum...got to be town.
CKD, money where your mouth is time. Point out where the firm stances and opinions are.
come on gorrad...you really dont see any stances or opinions if that post?...I mean I can break it down...but there are definately opinions there.
You're dodging the question. I didn't say I didn't see any, and that isn't the point. You said "Firm" stances and opinions, and I want you to enumerate exactly what you meant.

DGB, all fluff? Seriously? I goofed around at the start, but I'm playin' serious (by my standards, at least) now.
I will not assume everyone with blue eyes has Mako poisoning
I will not assume everyone with blue eyes has Mako poisoning
I will not assume everyone with blue eyes has Mako poisoning
Seraphim
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Seraphim
she/her
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 6165
Joined: September 20, 2008
Pronoun: she/her

Post Post #256 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 3:48 pm

Post by Seraphim »

I'm going to actually read and break down Chevre's post. I have categorized the post into the following:
This color
indicates fluff(noise). This has really little or nothing to do with the at hand.
This color
indicates information that is merely a summary of events.
This color
indicates opinions and reads.

You don't need to actually, persay, read the post. It is merely Chevre's wall color-coded using these three codes. Feel free to skip ahead.
Spoiler: Chevre's post
For Gorrad:

Dear person who I do not know,

A person who I know as Gorrad has just walked up to you on the street, and handed you a piece (or possibly multiple pieces) of paper, and asks you if you can understand them. Well, Gorrad is not the author of these papers, I am, and I am determined to prove my Town stature by making you understand.


See, me and Gorrad are playing in a game of Mafia. If you are not familiar with the game, I shall present a brief explanation. Mafia was first played in real time. Players sat in a circle, and were dealt cards to determine their role. The basic setup includes an uninformed majority, usually known as "the Town," and an informed minority, usually known as "the Mafia." The game alternates between phases known as Night and Day, during the Night, everyone closes their eyes. However, at some point, the Mafia are allowed to open them and silently discuss who they wish to "kill," or eliminate from the game. Once they have decided, the game moves on eventually to Day, where everyone opens their eyes and the killed player is announced. Now, the players all discuss and attempt to gather enough information to "lynch" a player they believe is Mafia, or eliminate them from the game. This continues until all the Mafia have been eliminated, or enough of the Town has been eliminated so that they may no longer form a majority.

Me and Gorrad are playing a version of this game online, with nineteen other players. We have somehow gotten to a point in the game where Gorrad has inquired that I form opinions on him and three other players in the game, specifically known as "curiouskarmadog," "Cyberbob," and "SpyreX." I will now broadcast my opinions to you, in the hope that you, a stranger on the street who Gorrad has only just met, can understand them.


The player known as "curiouskarmadog" has made 5 posts so far. The first post was what we call a "random vote" to start the game, to give us a point from where we can begin to form true suspicions. His vote was on a player known as "Antihero," who had earlier stated that it seemed impossible for players to have post restrictions (not being able to do certain things with their posts, like "don't use e's") from "the material [the moderator] gave us." curiouskarmadog wanted Antihero to "come clean," as in, fill us in on how he attained such information from the moderator. However, such information was conspicuously available in the first post; therefore, it was fairly obvious to see that curiouskarmadog had intended for a joke. The random voting stage is usually filled with such hilarity. Anyway, the player known as "Cyberbob" appeared not to understand the joke, and this became the subject matter of curiouskarmadog's second post. He asked Cyberbob if he thought that curiouskarmadog (weird sentence structure here I know, but they are both males and I wish to avoid pronoun ambiguity) was being serious. Cyberbob later posted that he was already in "a serious mindset" due to an earlier post by SpyreX, another player I will be covering.


In curiouskarmadog's third post, he analyzes the post of another player, "Dutch one". This player is somewhat new to the site we play Mafia on, so he is still picking up on some common practices we utilize. The practice in question was the Random Voting Stage. Dutch one said he did it, but not as quickly as we had. This was, of course, strange to us because the Random Voting Stage is the first event most players partake in during the duration of a game. curiouskarmadog first asked about this, and then asked about Dutch one's reasonless vote on Gorrad. When a player receives a vote, it moves them one step closer to the lynch. We prefer that players give reasons to accompany their votes, so the question posed here by curiouskarmadog is common enough. curiouskarmadog's fourth post refers to an earlier incident he had with another player, "DrippingGoofBall." This player apparently makes lists in all her games, declaring what she feels to be the "Town players," the "Questionable players," and the "Scum players." (Note: Scum is a somewhat slang term we use for the Mafia.) Anyway, curiouskarmadog asked that he be kept off her "Town list" as apparently last time, "things didn't work to well." I was not in the previous game, so I have no idea what happened, but I assume that curiouskarmadog lost that game. It was most likely not a direct result of being on DrippingGoofBall's "Town List," but it is coincidental anecdote which curiouskarmadog is simply presenting. In fact, in curiouskarmadog's fifth post, he thanks DrippingGoofBall for placing him on her "Scum List." In this post, he also notes someone's snarky retort to DrippingGoofBall, votes Dutch one for ignoring him, and asks me why I didn't provide reasoning for my own vote.
I feel that I gave enough reasoning; I kept my vote on a player named "Xalxe" because I when I random voted her, she seemed unnecessarily worried. As for his accusation that Dutch one was ignoring him, it's reasonable because Dutch one did post between curiouskarmadog's third and fifth posts.


So how do I feel about curiouskarmadog, given the above posts? While only five posts is barely enough to judge, I think curiouskarmadog looks Town so far. He has managed to inquire of others without following anyone's already stated points. Though relatively early, I feel as though curiouskarmadog may be a little severe with Dutch one. Everyone has their own way of dealing with new players, though, so we shall see what happens as the game progresses.




I will be stating my opinions on the four players in alphabetical order, so the next player we shall move on to is Cyberbob. Cyberbob's first post deals with an event that happened in the very beginning of the game. The player known as "nocase" stated that he had a post restriction, but this seemed impossible with the information the players were given (this was touched on in the discussion of curiouskarmadog). Cyberbob asked if nocase could elaborate on what his post restriction was. Although at first this may seem incorrect, as I have already stated that it should not be possible for players to have post restrictions given the information, Cyberbob, as well as myself, gave nocase a chance to explain himself. Cyberbob's second post was explained in curiouskarmadog's discussion; Cyberbob was the one who did not fully understand curiouskarmadog's joke. His third post is also related to this matter, clarifying that he had already put himself in a serious mindset. The fourth post came after another player, "inHimshallibe," indicated that he had a post restriction as well. He asked inHimshallibe to elaborate on his post restriction.
This whole "post restriction" matter has been deemed untrue and, in my opinion, pointless.


In his fifth post, Cyberbob indicates he has what I believe to be a slight scum read on the player who handed you these sheets, Gorrad. He determined this via the use of a post where Gorrad asked the aforementioned DrippingGoofBall to claim her role. It is at this point that I should explain that while the basic factions of Mafia are Town and Mafia, there are certain other roles that may be utilized during the night. When a player feels it is right to do so, or is in danger of being lynched, they claim, or reveal their role to the public so that other players may know of it. Of course, it is entirely possible for the Mafia to present fake claims, to prevent them from being lynched. Anyway, Gorrad seems to believe that when DrippingGoofBall makes a claim, it turns the game on it's head, and makes it more interesting.
While I have no memories of playing a game with DrippingGoofBall where such an event happened, her style so far has indicated that many things she does may turn the game on it's head.
Anyway, Cyberbob indicated that it was a gut feeling.
Since I myself cannot truly find any scummy points of this post, it appears that Cyberbob and Cyberbob alone truly found something strange in either the structure or the tone of the post in question.
Gorrad is also dealt with in Cyberbob's sixth post, which quotes a post where Gorrad voted for himself. Self-voting is usually frowned upon at this site, so it is easy to see why Cyberbob noted this event. Cyberbob didn't know whether Gorrad was joking or not.


In his seventh post, Cyberbob notes many things. He begins with nocase and inHimshallibe both claiming to have post restrictions, as he was still leery of the event. He assumes it was a joke. Next, Cyberbob notes how Dutch one's post structure doesn't sit well with him, and it's going to be hard to figure out his alignment (as in, is he Mafia or Town?). Then, Cyberbob lists many players and their impact so far. He remembers DrippingGoofBall's eccentric posting style from another game, and notes that inHimshallibe is doing a mini-version of the same thing. He also says Gorrad is "annoying" but doesn't know whether it garners four votes (for at that time, four other players were voting for Gorrad) and declares him as a possibly Mafia member. On the flipside, he declares Antihero "town" for no given reason, so we are to assume that he meant the general feel of his posts was in a Town manner. He then notes three other scummy posts, and votes one of the scummy post-makers.
The one thing I find glaringly missing from this post is my name. This may sound quite narcissistic but I have been a very visible player in this game so far so it would make sense to at least mention what he thought of me and my posts.


The eighth post of Cyberbob refers to a post made by Dutch one. Being new, Dutch one did not recognize the regular playing style of DrippingGoofBall, so he attacked it.
However, to Cyberbob, me, and many other players, it appeared that Dutch one had brought some good points to the table. DrippingGoofBall's habit of making lists and then including herself as Town seemed to put herself on a pedestal above the others, therefore making her semi-invulnerable as nobody wanted to attack her.
In his ninth and tenth posts, Cyberbob replies to an unbelieving DrippingGoofBall by saying that while he doesn't think she's scummy for it, what Dutch one said about her was very true and that it wasn't healthy one player to be so afraid of attacking another.


So what do I think of Cyberbob so far? Even though Cyberbob has twice as many posts as curiouskarmadog, he is still a bit neutral. Yes, he is making points upon other players, but I don't feel the same intensity that I feel in curiouskarmadog's posts. Maybe he isn't as determined and dedicated of a player as curiouskarmadog, but I do not feel that is an accurate judgment to make.




Now, it is time we turn our attention to the player who first gave me this assignment: Gorrad. His first post included a random vote for Dutch one. Dutch one hadn't confirmed his status yet, so Gorrad's reasoning was that the moderator would not have to find a replacement player for Dutch one. Also, Gorrad asks DrippingGoofBall to claim, which was already discussed in the section on Cyberbob. In his second post, he gives a link to previous game which had DrippingGoofBall in it, to provide an example for her antics. He also performs the aforementioned self-vote in this post. This is also partially the topic of his third post, where he replies to Cyberbob's inquiry about whether this was a joke or not. Gorrad declares that it was in fact, because "one who has read their Role PM cannot have a gut read on theirself.
It was a very odd way to put it,
and even after this, Gorrad had not unvoted. In his fourth and fifth posts, Gorrad greets and chats with an old acquaintance, "Korlash."
This isn't out of the ordinary, but it doesn't really add anything to the game either, except for that this slightly decreases the chances of Gorrad and Korlash being in the Mafia together. It does not, however, make either one of them more or less scummy.


In his sixth post, Gorrad answers Dutch one's question about the Random Voting Stage with a satirical viewpoint.
I, in fact, found it somewhat funny, and didn't see any issues with it.
However, it appears someone did find it contentious, as in his next post, Gorrad indicates that he is going to inform players who do not know what the RVS is of it's definition. He then attacks Cyberbob
i
n what seems to me a very weak manner.
He says that Cyberbob has been following the crowd and contributing nothing, then saying he's not a hypocrite because he isn't faking contributing nothing. Finally, Gorrad still continues with the "Gorrad is scum" joke,
which by now is just stale.
In the seventh post, Gorrad declares his suspicion of me, and asks me to do the assignment which you are currently reading.
T
he four people which he picked did seem somewhat out-of-the-ordinary,
but in his next post he clarifies why he chose those people.
S
o far, I have found this to be thought-provoking, so I don't really have any quarrels with it.


I haven't really seen much serious content from Gorrad so far. I hope that his seventh post is what he keeps up for the rest of the game, as the "Gorrad is scum" act is useless, trite, and suspiciously odd.




SpyreX, the last of the four I'm supposed to opinionate upon,
was the most out-of-the-blue choice. I remembered very little of his gameplay before embarking on this assignment.
SpyreX's first post is after nocase claims he has a post restriction. SpyreX votes nocase because there are no abilities available that would seem to encompass a post restriction.
While slightly hasty, I must admit it was the same thing I was thinking as well.
His second post also deals with this, as he says we should lynch nocase if we do not see another claim of a post restriction, strangely enough, we did, and SpyreX's frustration at inHimshallibe is shown in the next post. SpyreX continues to be confused by the post restriction thing in his fourth and fifth posts. He finally let's it go in his sixth post, where he votes Gorrad for having "six posts of fluff."
While I understand the motivation behind some of Gorrad's posts (helping Dutch one wasn't a bad thing to do), the whole self-voting thing was kind of ridiculous and had very little effect on the game.
In his next post, SpyreX desires to confirm that nocase and inHimshallibe were lying about their post restrictions. He then explains why he was voting Gorrad; it appears SpyreX was the one who attacked Gorrad's post in which he helps Dutch one. SpyreX declares this as Gorrad trying to go back to the RVS even though the game started in a serious manner.
I don't believe Gorrad was trying to do that; instead, he was simplying telling Dutch one what the RVS was.
I
n his penultimate post, SpyreX responds to a question from DrippingGoofBall asking his opinion of Dutch one; SpyreX feels that Dutch one is a newbie who is trying hard and likely isn't scum. SpyreX's final post so far indicates his disapproval of nocase's lie about the post restriction.


I hope that SpyreX finally realizes that the post restriction lies were just that, lies, and he can finally delve into more serious matters. I find his attack on Gorrad's RVS description a bit irrational, but I do believe most of what Gorrad had said so far was fluff.


Well, that's all. I hope you understood; I can only hope you are more capable than me because if someone handed this to me on the street, I'm pretty sure I would be a bit flustered.

Yours Truly, Chevre


Total word count: 2704 words
Total Fluff(noise):
363 words - 13.42%
Total Information:
1730 words - 63.98%
Total Opinions:
611 words - 22.60%

Approximately one-fourth of that massive text wall was actual opinions rather than a fanciful way of restating the game or just plain fluff.

Further analysis is pending but a lot of the post seems artificial and carefully constructed so I don't think it's exactly a monument to her town play. It almost feels more like a distraction rather than an honest attempt to outline reads.
User avatar
Antihero
Antihero
al;kdjfal;kj
User avatar
User avatar
Antihero
al;kdjfal;kj
al;kdjfal;kj
Posts: 15872
Joined: March 30, 2009

Post Post #257 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 4:04 pm

Post by Antihero »

What's your cutoff for how much "opinion" needs to be in everyone's posts?

Also, I have a feeling that the extra stuff was put in there to point out how ridiculous Gorrad's initial request was.
The distance between insanity and genius is measured only by success.
User avatar
Gorrad
Gorrad
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Gorrad
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 4578
Joined: April 30, 2007
Location: Land of Dungeons and Stairs

Post Post #258 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 4:26 pm

Post by Gorrad »

In my defense, I more wanted him to post it in terms that someone on the street who already knew the game could understand. I was shooting for trying to get him to stop hiding behind fancy vocabulary (not that there's anything wrong with it in principle- it just seemed like he was being sesquipidalian for its own sake). I did not honestly expect him to explain out the entire game.
I will not assume everyone with blue eyes has Mako poisoning
I will not assume everyone with blue eyes has Mako poisoning
I will not assume everyone with blue eyes has Mako poisoning
User avatar
Korlash
Korlash
Krap Logick
User avatar
User avatar
Korlash
Krap Logick
Krap Logick
Posts: 6579
Joined: August 23, 2007
Location: The Constellation of Kasterborous

Post Post #259 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 6:17 pm

Post by Korlash »

Farside wrote:Really? I have been out of mafia for 6 months and prior to that I was out for a few months and you want me to do a search on this when you seem to have it that scum acted moronic page one but haven't stated when you saw when scum did it?
I can at least say look at my last game I played which was the invitational game with Jack acting crazy.
You want more then that then you give something back that shows I'm lying which you claim I"m lying with nothing to back it up.
Farside I've been out for my randomly generated number of 22 months plus I'm an idiot and yet you asked me to do legwork so don't be surprised if I throw it back onto you. Unfortunately it will take more then one game to back up your statement. Where-as it would only take one game for me to discredit it. That alone should give you pause for thought as statistically I could find one game a heck of a lot faster and easier then you could find, lets pick an arbitrary number, 7...

Also I never claimed you were lying, simply wrong. I did insinuate you were using your falseness in a malicious way, but i've never claimed you were actually lying about anything.
antihero wrote:Farside, I'm sure korlash didn't mean anything he said personally. *pats back*
I don't even remember getting insulting... I guess it's a hot button issue... sad that only makes me want to push it more...
It's not my job to be right, it's my job to be convincing.

Star Trek Voyager Mafia! Ends in a Starfleet victory! Pomp, Circumstance, and Bloodwine for all!
User avatar
Korlash
Korlash
Krap Logick
User avatar
User avatar
Korlash
Krap Logick
Krap Logick
Posts: 6579
Joined: August 23, 2007
Location: The Constellation of Kasterborous

Post Post #260 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 7:33 pm

Post by Korlash »

Farside wrote:Farside I've been out for my randomly generated number of 22 months plus I'm an idiot and yet you asked me to do legwork so don't be surprised if I throw it back onto you. Unfortunately it will take more then one game to back up your statement. Where-as it would only take one game for me to discredit it. That alone should give you pause for thought as statistically I could find one game a heck of a lot faster and easier then you could find, lets pick an arbitrary number, 7...
yeah I'm going to have to take most of this back. Not as easy as it sounded. Granted the terms are vague and the results are situational... heck even my ace in the hole, myself, is proving difficult. I'm sure someone more interested or more active as of late would be able to provide a game or two, but I have seen enough to at least accept you are able to back up your opinion. That being said I still think you are wrong. Being scum probably will affect certain people and how they act in the beginning of games, but the biggest factor isn't role, it's who the player is and how he/she plays. So the biggest thing would be to find a game where nocase was scum and see if he acted differently. (I half-looked and couldn't find one...)

Still i accept you at least have reason to believe things the way you do and admit I even started to see it your way while searching games. So lets try it another way...
Farside wrote:I don't ever recall a game where scum put their neck out on the line at the very first page and face the consequences of getting voted out. Mind you that is the games I have played. Some are with people like Jack, DGB and a few people I can't remember without searching my games.
The point of starting out the gates and do something what you call out-of-the-ordinary is for reaction persons. To see who responds and how they respond, if someone responds or doesn't. Who votes on it and why.
It also gets people talking and out of the RVS stage, which sometimes I find quite useless.
If "starting out the gates and do something what you call out-of-the-ordinary" is simply to see how people react and go from there then why would scum have any real fear of doing it? I mean players wouldn't regularly do something that has a huge chance of getting them lynched, so if it is commonplace (you were able to link 4 games so I'm hoping we can accept it's at least a common thing for most games) then it can't result in said person being lynched a *huge* majority of the time. Long story short, if town does it so much, why would mafia be afraid to do it? More to the point, if the entire reason to do it is to get other people to react and move the discussion onto their reactions, then the person who does the initial thing wouldn't be worried about what happens to them as the entire point is to move discussion onto someone else.

And returning to the actual game, and the actual topic I wanted to talk about in the first place, your post 180. Can you honestly say that after all this discussion with me that your response to Chevre makes any sense? Nocase does something you suggest is merely to get people to respond, and when someone responds, you question why they are doing it?
It's not my job to be right, it's my job to be convincing.

Star Trek Voyager Mafia! Ends in a Starfleet victory! Pomp, Circumstance, and Bloodwine for all!
User avatar
nocase
nocase
Hot Streak
User avatar
User avatar
nocase
Hot Streak
Hot Streak
Posts: 718
Joined: November 22, 2009

Post Post #261 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 8:20 pm

Post by nocase »

seraphim, why did you feel it was necessary to put so much effort into preaching to the choir?

fos: ckd.
User avatar
Dutch one
Dutch one
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Dutch one
Goon
Goon
Posts: 100
Joined: January 7, 2011
Location: probably still in a lucid dream

Post Post #262 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 8:44 pm

Post by Dutch one »

Antihero wrote:
werewolf555 wrote:I'm not sure what i'm trying to prove.
I just feel like pointing some things out.
OK, well why did you only quote a small portion of the wall Chevre typed?

I also think I forgot to answer farside about Jerbs. In short, his reactions to things Chevre and Dutch said seem like something town who is making a genuine effort to hunt scum would do.
wow, this is the worst reason I've heared since the start of the game...

He said something like:

"CHEVRE!!!! Why are you answering my question for Dutch??
vote: Chevre"
____________________________________

Yes, I totaly agree with you :roll: definately a townie hunting for scum.

Look at his posts, and you will see that everything he does has to do with me. If you look at all his posts, then you will know he acts extremely scummie.
And something else, even if he is a townie, then what? We don't loose anything, he hasn't done anything good for the town. The only thing he does is a rediculous hunt to lynch me. IMO, if he is scum, then we can say "yes, we got one!" and if he appears to be a townie we can say "what a shame he is a townie... well, at least we don't loose anything important, so it's okay". If he is a townie, then he is a town idiot.
unvote, vote: Jerbs.
PoS: Antihero
User avatar
SpyreX
SpyreX
POWERFUL WIZARD
User avatar
User avatar
SpyreX
POWERFUL WIZARD
POWERFUL WIZARD
Posts: 18596
Joined: April 24, 2008

Post Post #263 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:41 pm

Post by SpyreX »

I reread that crazy wall and I still don't understand breaking it down like that EITHER way.

Soo many unnecessary words but why in the hell would a scum powerbomb that to escape notice? That BEGS notice.
Show
I always lynch scum... sometimes they're just not mafia. :P

Town: (49-47-1)
Scum: (23-11)
Third Party: (2-0)
Proud member of BaM
User avatar
RedCoyote
RedCoyote
Jack of All Trades
User avatar
User avatar
RedCoyote
Jack of All Trades
Jack of All Trades
Posts: 8036
Joined: October 19, 2008
Location: Houston, TX

Post Post #264 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 9:56 pm

Post by RedCoyote »

Runner 198 wrote:I see the case on farside, Gorrad, and Antihero, Seraphim. See a few other votes around, don't think they're cases though - mainly Jerbs and Dutch one.
Wait, you just said you didn't see the case on Gorrad, so I wanted to know what case you did see. By see I hope we're both on the same page as synonymous for "accept" or "see as valid". You listed Gorrad again, so where exactly is Gorrad in your view?

Additionally, you're not voting despite the fact you "see" several cases being made against people. Tell me we're misunderstanding each other because otherwise I really am not liking the way you're coming across so far.

---
Chevre 214 wrote:RedCoyote, if DrippingGoofball voted for you and gave you those "tells" for reasons, how would you defend against them?
I don't like the way you approached it. DGB attacked you in her own cutesy way, but I think we both got the jist of it. So the idea that you can't respond to her case unless it's laid out in a certain way causes me to make that emoticon face in reality.

---
Antihero 217 wrote:RC, what are you babbling about?
I don't like the way you started the game, but when I really go back and look at your posts, I can't honestly rank you scummier than Kat right now.

Unvote
;
Vote: Katsuki


Kat, you're going to have to give us something better than what you have. I especially do not like your Chevre vote.
Antihero 222 wrote:Also, there are plenty of lazy people on this site. Jerbs isn't one of them. Try again.
Why are you in such hardcore defend Jerbs mode? He can speak for himself too, you know.

---
werewolf 243 wrote:I'm not sure what i'm trying to prove.
I just feel like pointing some things out.
Huh? Clarify this for me.

Why is everyone so confusing this game? Is it just me? I'm not even prepared to touch the farside/Korlash battle. The best I gather, it's an argument over whether one person has seen awkward townie play before or something? Ugh, I feel like this is such a lame start to what could otherwise be a really enjoyable game (although I'll admit I have really been enjoying DGB's posts). That's not to say it won't get better of course.
User avatar
Cyberbob
Cyberbob
Mafia Scum
User avatar
User avatar
Cyberbob
Mafia Scum
Mafia Scum
Posts: 2480
Joined: December 2, 2007
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Post Post #265 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 10:47 pm

Post by Cyberbob »

RedCoyote wrote:Why is everyone so confusing this game? Is it just me? I'm not even prepared to touch the farside/Korlash battle. The best I gather, it's an argument over whether one person has seen awkward townie play before or something? Ugh, I feel like this is such a lame start to what could otherwise be a really enjoyable game (although I'll admit I have really been enjoying DGB's posts). That's not to say it won't get better of course.
Scumlist++
FOS: RedCoyote
tread softly because you tread on my dreams
daddy's little girl ain't a girl no more
"quasi-rape" --Vi
"real liberals" --Yos
User avatar
Katsuki
Katsuki
Cupcake
User avatar
User avatar
Katsuki
Cupcake
Cupcake
Posts: 14872
Joined: April 26, 2010
Location: In your head~

Post Post #266 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:17 pm

Post by Katsuki »

Erg this game, just finished skimming it. I probably will not have time until Wednesday to read though, due to sheer volume of work.

@Farside: By
"Works for me"
, I was referring to Chevre wagon.

Re: Chevre wall, I see no pro-town reasoning for typing such a giant wall of text at this point of the game, considering the amount of people who would actually read it (not very many). He was asked for reads on three people, and instead of responding with clear answers, he gives us this giant monstrosity. It's essentially equivalent to not having answered the question IMO.

I will clarify this point if anyone finds it confusing, I don't think I worded my thoughts particularly well.
Fluffy fluffy~~~ |
"READING KATSUKI IS LIKE SOME SORT OF POSTMODERN ARTFORM"
- GreyICE
Katsuki is by far more absurdly beautiful than Fate. (hai parama)
Katsuki's Madness coming to you shortly: Nov, 2011!

C
u
p
c
a
k
e
M
a
f
i
a
I
I
coming to you summer 2011! ~ Pre-ins: 11/13
User avatar
Dutch one
Dutch one
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Dutch one
Goon
Goon
Posts: 100
Joined: January 7, 2011
Location: probably still in a lucid dream

Post Post #267 (ISO) » Sat Jan 22, 2011 11:32 pm

Post by Dutch one »

btw, does this day really end after a month? Or is that the end of the entire game? I mean, a month is a bit long for one day I gues..
User avatar
Kublai Khan
Kublai Khan
Khan Man
User avatar
User avatar
Kublai Khan
Khan Man
Khan Man
Posts: 5278
Joined: August 5, 2008
Location: Sarasota, FL

Post Post #268 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 1:22 am

Post by Kublai Khan »

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 11


"Pluralism is no longer simply an asset or a prerequisite for progress and development, it is vital to our existence."
- His Highness Prince Karim Aga Khan IV

Chevre
- 5 - Seraphim, DrippingGoofball, inHimshallibe, Jerbs, Katsuki
Seraphim
- 3 - Antihero, farside22, werewolf555
Antihero
- 2 - iamausername, Cyberbob
Jerbs
- 2 - Chevre, Dutch one
Gorrad
- 1 - SpyreX
Xalxe
- 1 - nocase
Cyberbob
- 1 - Gorrad
Dutch one
- 1 - curiouskarmadog
farside22
- 1 - Korlash
Katsuki
- 1 - RedCoyote

Players not voting: Runner, Kmd4390, Xalxe
Occasionally intellectually honest

Black Lives Matter
Get vaccinated
User avatar
Jerbs
Jerbs
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Jerbs
Goon
Goon
Posts: 416
Joined: December 11, 2009
Location: Over there *points*

Post Post #269 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:05 am

Post by Jerbs »

Jesus christ you guys post to much

@Dutch
Dutch one wrote:btw, does this day really end after a month? Or is that the end of the entire game? I mean, a month is a bit long for one day I gues..
Ya, a whole day takes that long, unless we lynch someone first
Dutch one wrote:@ Jerbs, to wich sentence are you replying to? It seems a bit random..

Jerbs, I looked at all the posts you made this time. You popped into the game very late, you inmediatly accuse me, and in any other post you made, everything you said was about me. You've never talked about something else.. You are targeting me based at one single post... I don't see your point. Can you explain to me (with real evidence) why it is so important for you to get me lynched?
I was referring to this
And after that post I'm suddenly not suspicious anymore in your eyes. That is a really easy way to get away with it.
I popped into the game 14 hours after it started. I don't think thats "very late". I am targeting you so that I can see your reactions, and everybody else can see your reactions. Once I determined if you were likely town or likely scum, I moved on.


@Antihero

Why are you defending me for such a useless point. Being lazy has no correlation to whether I'm scum or not.
"Those that hammer others are called scum. But I think those who lurk and refrain from voting are worse than scum. If I'm going to be called scum either way, I'd rather hammer! And if that's not being a proper Mafia player, then I'll destroy that idea!"
V/LA on most weekends
User avatar
curiouskarmadog
curiouskarmadog
This Space for Rant
User avatar
User avatar
curiouskarmadog
This Space for Rant
This Space for Rant
Posts: 14229
Joined: June 17, 2007
Location: Roanoke, Va

Post Post #270 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:20 am

Post by curiouskarmadog »

farside22 wrote:CKD: Please link a game where you saw scum come out of the gate at the start of the game on page 1 doing something something moronic or crazy.
What is the point? The term “moronic” is relative btw, I have been lynched day one as a town for “overreacting”, recently “underreacting”, and for unvoting and not replacing my vote….these were mostly (note a say mostly) scum driven attacks…but they labeled it as “moronic”…or scummy….same with “crazy”…so I can look and find what you are looking for…but what is the point?
werewolf555 wrote:I'm not sure what i'm trying to prove.
I just feel like pointing some things out.
not sure what this means..what exactly are you pointing out and why did you feel it important to point out?
Gorrad wrote: You're dodging the question. I didn't say I didn't see any, and that isn't the point. You said "Firm" stances and opinions, and I want you to enumerate exactly what you meant.
as you wish...if anyone complains about wall of words, blame gorrad.
opinion and stances..

edited:
Chevre wrote: ......curiouskarmadog wanted Antihero to "come clean," as in, fill us in on how he attained such information from the moderator. However, such information was conspicuously available in the first post; therefore, it was fairly obvious to see that curiouskarmadog had intended for a joke......

...This was, of course, strange to us because the Random Voting Stage is the first event most players partake in during the duration of a game. curiouskarmadog first asked about this, and then asked about Dutch one's reasonless vote on Gorrad. When a player receives a vote, it moves them one step closer to the lynch. We prefer that players give reasons to accompany their votes, so the question posed here by curiouskarmadog is common enough....

...As for his accusation that Dutch one was ignoring him, it's reasonable because Dutch one did post between curiouskarmadog's third and fifth posts....

.... I think curiouskarmadog looks Town so far. He has managed to inquire of others without following anyone's already stated points. Though relatively early, I feel as though curiouskarmadog may be a little severe with Dutch one....

....This whole "post restriction" matter has been deemed untrue and, in my opinion, pointless.....

...Since I myself cannot truly find any scummy points of this post...

........The one thing I find glaringly missing from this post is my name. This may sound quite narcissistic but I have been a very visible player in this game so far so it would make sense to at least mention what he thought of me and my posts.....

...DrippingGoofBall's habit of making lists and then including herself as Town seemed to put herself on a pedestal above the others, therefore making her semi-invulnerable as nobody wanted to attack her. ....

...Even though Cyberbob has twice as many posts as curiouskarmadog, he is still a bit neutral. Yes, he is making points upon other players, but I don't feel the same intensity that I feel in curiouskarmadog's posts...

...This isn't out of the ordinary, but it doesn't really add anything to the game either, except for that this slightly decreases the chances of Gorrad and Korlash being in the Mafia together. It does not, however, make either one of them more or less scummy....

.... I, in fact, found it somewhat funny, and didn't see any issues with it....

.... Gorrad indicates that he is going to inform players who do not know what the RVS is of it's definition. He then attacks Cyberbob in what seems to me a very weak manner...

....I haven't really seen much serious content from Gorrad so far. I hope that his seventh post is what he keeps up for the rest of the game, as the "Gorrad is scum" act is useless, trite, and suspiciously odd....

...SpyreX votes nocase because there are no abilities available that would seem to encompass a post restriction. While slightly hasty, I must admit it was the same thing I was thinking as well....

...While I understand the motivation behind some of Gorrad's posts (helping Dutch one wasn't a bad thing to do), the whole self-voting thing was kind of ridiculous and had very little effect on the game...

...SpyreX declares this as Gorrad trying to go back to the RVS even though the game started in a serious manner. I don't believe Gorrad was trying to do that...

I find his attack on Gorrad's RVS description a bit irrational, but I do believe most of what Gorrad had said so far was fluff.
Answer me this Gorrad, do you think there are not firm opinions and stances on actions in this game in this post?
Seraphim wrote:You don't need to actually, persay, read the post. It is merely Chevre's wall color-coded using these three codes. Feel free to skip ahead.
oh god dammit....just wasted my time.
NO YOU'RE OVER DEFENSIVE
User avatar
Dutch one
Dutch one
Goon
User avatar
User avatar
Dutch one
Goon
Goon
Posts: 100
Joined: January 7, 2011
Location: probably still in a lucid dream

Post Post #271 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:22 am

Post by Dutch one »

@jerbs, That post you were referring to was a post about DGB, not you. So I don't see the point of your reply to that.
And I guess you are just "another" person who thinks he has to test me because I'm new here. That's really mature ;) (lol, I just saw you are a kid like me, so that kind of fits :)) Anyway, whatever you do, I don't really care about it anymore. Just go on if you want to read me

And a whole month?! Most time I'm playing a game it only takes a week... so if we don't menage to lynch people during the day, then this game is supposed to go on for a year? :)
User avatar
farside22
farside22
Mafia Mum
User avatar
User avatar
farside22
Mafia Mum
Mafia Mum
Posts: 35785
Joined: October 24, 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY

Post Post #272 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:28 am

Post by farside22 »

If "starting out the gates and do something what you call out-of-the-ordinary" is simply to see how people react and go from there then why would scum have any real fear of doing it? I mean players wouldn't regularly do something that has a huge chance of getting them lynched, so if it is commonplace (you were able to link 4 games so I'm hoping we can accept it's at least a common thing for most games) then it can't result in said person being lynched a *huge* majority of the time. Long story short, if town does it so much, why would mafia be afraid to do it? More to the point, if the entire reason to do it is to get other people to react and move the discussion onto their reactions, then the person who does the initial thing wouldn't be worried about what happens to them as the entire point is to move discussion onto someone else.

And returning to the actual game, and the actual topic I wanted to talk about in the first place, your post 180. Can you honestly say that after all this discussion with me that your response to Chevre makes any sense? Nocase does something you suggest is merely to get people to respond, and when someone responds, you question why they are doing it?
I think the only time I saw a quick lynch was with Vengeful mafia. Yes that is a completely different case.
And your right I don't see people lynched at the start of the day for doing crazy things, but I only recall one person who handled pressure and was scum when being voted for. Usually I see scum flustered.
Maybe it's being gone for 6 months and thinking that crazy actions were normal in every game (which now upon looking at my past games there are not as common as I believed) I was harsh on Chevre for her belief. I think I just got it in my head that people on MS were nuts in most every game I was in. But I realize it wasn't as common so I was wrong to think Chevre was faking her belief however I will point out if she was suspicious and it's the start of the game why didn't she vote for Norse in the first place then?
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
User avatar
farside22
farside22
Mafia Mum
User avatar
User avatar
farside22
Mafia Mum
Mafia Mum
Posts: 35785
Joined: October 24, 2007
Location: Buffalo, NY

Post Post #273 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:33 am

Post by farside22 »

CKD wrote:What is the point? The term “moronic” is relative btw, I have been lynched day one as a town for “overreacting”, recently “underreacting”, and for unvoting and not replacing my vote….these were mostly (note a say mostly) scum driven attacks…but they labeled it as “moronic”…or scummy….same with “crazy”…so I can look and find what you are looking for…but what is the point?
I really wish I had two votes right now.

You did just do at QFT under what Korlash stated and now your back tracking and also proving my point on idiotic things people do as town.
Oh and scum pushing the lynch, thanks I forgot to put that on my list of why someone town would do something crazy and it's to see who pushes the lynch based on that stupidity (aka Richard from 2 games I was in).
Sarcasm is just a way of saying how stupid you think someone is but in a more polite way.
User avatar
DrippingGoofball
DrippingGoofball
Mafia Piñata
User avatar
User avatar
DrippingGoofball
Mafia Piñata
Mafia Piñata
Posts: 40642
Joined: December 23, 2005
Location: Violating mith's restraining order

Post Post #274 (ISO) » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:44 am

Post by DrippingGoofball »

Let's look at this.
Chevre
- 5 - Seraphim, DrippingGoofball, inHimshallibe, Jerbs, Katsuki >>>
This is a good wagon, I like the company on it.

Seraphim
- 3 - Antihero, farside22, werewolf555 >>>
This is a good wagon, I like the company on it.

Antihero
- 2 - iamausername, Cyberbob
Jerbs
- 2 - Chevre, Dutch one >>>
These are really sucky votes on a refreshingly aggressive noob townie. Dutch one's scumdar needs to be re-calibrated in reverse position, but there is no excuse for Chevre's vote.

Gorrad
- 1 - SpyreX
Xalxe
- 1 - nocase
Cyberbob
- 1 - Gorrad
Dutch one
- 1 - curiouskarmadog >>>
seriously, CKD, why are you voting the kid? So, his reads are atrocious and he wants to behead all my town reads in broad daylight. If he were scum, he'd have the luxury of doing it at night. The kid is town. Your vote is krap.

farside22
- 1 - Korlash >>>
Darling, farside isn't reacting to your vote like I'd expect her to if she were scum. You might have a point with this vote, but farside isn't today's lynch.

Katsuki
- 1 - RedCoyote

Players that need to be stabbed until they vote: Runner, Kmd4390, Xalxe

======================

SpyreX, Gorrad, nocase, RedCoyote
>>> You are all singly voting for players that might be viable lynch candidates. If you want that player lynched, convince us.
Paraphrasing a role PM takes seconds, fabricating a good fakeclaim takes an eternity.

"Metadiving DGB is like playing Roblox" - T3
"She's sort of like a quantum computer, her reads exist in multiple states at once. u have to take into account the other dimensions." - Morning Tweet

Return to “Completed Large Normal Games”