Cyclic Experimentation Set x01 - [Game Over]

[popsofctown]

You're sure he's scum, yet his flip yields information?

Interesting.

[RedCoyote]

Uh, yeah. Especially if he flips "Scum Group 1".

[popsofctown]

And how does that help us make our next lynch any more accurate?

[RedCoyote]

How does any flip make a successive lynch more accurate? Through wagon analysis and rereading. I don't see where you're going with this.

[popsofctown]

Normal flips help because you at first thought someone scum, but then afterwards you KNOW they are scum.

You're acting like you know tmh is scum, but simply dont know if there are multiple scumteams. This is not the normal case you are making it out to be.

[RedCoyote]

Of course I'm not 100%, no. I'm pretty darn confident though. Confident enough that I'd risk losing the daykill over it.

If he isn't scum, I don't think we're in a very good spot.

[popsofctown]

Exactly why I would argue we should assume he's scum and wait for his ability to change hands, then lynch him tomorrow, after diddin passes him that infernal antitown ability.

[I Am Innocent]

Daykill: Parama

whoops

Where was the claim request? I told you to ask for one before shooting! Esp since DBE all but breadcrumbed that she passed the Doctor role to Parama.

Obv scum. I still want to wait until D3 to take you out, as I want the Treestump out of the game.

CKD, pass the tree stump to TMH tomorrow.

For anyone adamant about lynching TMH today, you obv think he is scum too so my say is to focus on the three players that helped push Powerox (and in essence save TMH D1).

BunnyLover
Wrath Child
Pops.

If anyone but one of these three players gets lynched, I am breaking my own rule and replacing out. I did not want Helghast shot, I voted for TMH over Powerox, I said DBE was being used as the easy target today, and said I had a town read on Parama, who is also a very solid endgame player. Give me some credit and let's please target just one of these three players D2.

[popsofctown]

If anyone but one of these three players gets lynched, I am breaking my own rule and replacing out.

If you're not here to respect your commitment and play to your wincon, leave now. I don't want to play with someone like you.

[Saint]

You guys shoot whoever you want. I can't find scum in this game and I just give up. Well I can't totally give up, I've got a duty to play to my wincon, but I am going to take a break. I've read too many players wrong this game, I need some time to develop a new angle on this game. Or more information.

If anyone but one of these three players gets lynched, I am breaking my own rule and replacing out.

If you're not here to respect your commitment and play to your wincon, leave now. I don't want to play with someone like you.

Still trying to find time to reread (and I'm hesitant to jump on bandwagons because of it in spite of how frustrating it is to read recent developments) but I think this just became relevant.

I didn't have a scum read on themanhimself before. Shooting someone who wasn't just heavily crumbed as Doctor, but if I'm not mistaken DBE actually outright

said

Parama had the Doc ability was indeed short-sighted to say the least, and if tmh IS scum then we're in a no-win situation (well, we win if it means no more of this daykill silliness), but if tmh is NOT scum then we have no reason to autolynch him. We've been basically policy lynching all game and it hasn't gotten us anywhere, and I'm very confident that that trend will continue.

Aside from recent developments, someone please tell me why everyone wanted tmh dead before; because I don't remember it, I haven't read up to the tmh hate thus far, and in the QT I mentioned that I didn't understand the wagon while it was ongoing.

Also - stop saying this game sucks and that you're going to replace out. It's painful to be a mod and watch your player list say things like that, plus everyone is already well aware that the situation we're in is ungodly bad, plus it just drags Town morale down and makes everyone even MORE ineffectual than ever before.

I should be able to progress farther in my reading this morning. I apologize for life.

[curiouskarmadog]

I count somewhere around five people who wanted parama dead plus me, the game was stalling and he was being unhelpful so I took it into my own hands

can we lynch him now....PLEASE?

[curiouskarmadog]

Uh, yeah. Especially if he flips "Scum Group 1".

scum group 1?....

[themanhimself]

in the QT I mentioned that I didn't understand the wagon while it was ongoing.

Wait a minute, what QT?

[Saint]

in the QT I mentioned that I didn't understand the wagon while it was ongoing.

Wait a minute, what QT?

Hydra QT, obv.

[themanhimself]

I don't know anything about hydras so I'm going to default to the town on this one, was that a scum slip or do hydras use QT's?

[Bunnylover]

Hydras use QT.
I am Innocent has begun to be one of my scum reads. His latest post is basically, "I HAVEN'T MISLYNCH/MISKILLED ANYONE. LOOK AT ME EVERYONE, LOOK HOW MY READS ARE AMAZING!"
Townies end up killing other townies. Its part of the game. The way you tell the difference between a townie trying to lynch scum and scum just pushing for a lynch is the evidence brought up and how they respond when other people disagree with them.

And once again, I will point out, the only reason TMH hasn't been lynched yet is because of the ability he held. That is the only reason my vote isn't on him.

[LimMePls]

Vote: Wrath Child

I've made my position here pretty clear. The "if diddin flips town does not mean tmh is scum" bit only seals the deal for me.

[LimMePls]

Oh wait, tmh killed Parama.

I'm also willing to lynch tmh. At this point, I don't think the town can afford the vig power passing around anymore anyways.

[Saint]

Read up to Page 20. Current standings:

SCUM

*EtherealCookie - The only thing he said in this post range that I noted (278, contrasted with Town-diddin's 277) rubbed me wrong because he was pointing out his superior knowledge of game mechanics (which I'm quite sure scum would know more about), so.
*RedCoyote - The second-biggest active lurker in the game. There was one time when he said something that made me consider that he might be looking from a pro-Town motivation, but most of his posts are just walls that don't go anywhere, don't do anything, and uphold the status quo.
*TheLonging/Lateralus22 - Has shot up to be one of my biggest suspects. The vast majority of Lat's posts have reinforced what I thought were the most scummy positions available (for instance, 344 doesn't seem trustworthy now that we know Helghast's alignment).
*I Am Innocent - This is the biggest active lurker in the game, right here. I feel like he only posts when he can post about a specific subject and look good doing it.
*popsofctown - pops has been one of the biggest contributors to the game so far, and I can still count the number of posts I like on one hand. However, there are still a few glimpses of Town motivation (which I may be giving him too much credit for). Has a very strange relationship with RedCoyote and I Am Innocent; they've both done awkward distancing and association.
*LynchMePlz - Only shows up around Page 20 and pushes WrathChild in a scummy way (as in, like he's already decided he wants WC to die).
*quadz - quadz was absent before, but the tl;dr of his catch-up post on Page 20 pretty much says to lynch and/or vig a long list of people - all of whom I'm willing to buy are Town. This positioning on the list might be swayed by recent posts.
*q21 - Sorry, my previous Town read on q21 went out the window with his painfully mediocre 263. He hasn't posted anything else of interest in this range, so.
|<gap>|
*diddin - The way he's using his daykill is pro-Town, but saying he refuses to Vig EC and reeeeeally wanting to vote WC makes me have misgivings.
*themanhimself - His knack for finding slips and pushing them seems Townish, even if he comes out with the wrong responses. In recent news, the fact that he's not done trying to find things to call out - and the fact that he had the sense of fair play to give diddin his Bus Driver ability - speaks in his favor, I think.
*Nero Cain - Crazy as anything and not always on the right track but I don't really detect any malice in his posts.
*StrangerCoug - Hasn't said anything much up to this point but I distinctly remember having a Town read on him from later, so he goes here.
*WrathChild - Either he's this conniving scum hiding his experience and implicitly playing the newb card EXTREMELY well, or he's very honest and Town.
*curiouskarmadog - Having read through his slip, I don't think it's a big deal. He's dropped much larger Town-tells.
*implosion - With Parama gone implosion is now the Towniest Townie in the game.

TOWN

For Today, I would highly recommend against shooting, lynching, etc. anyone in the lower tier. I don't think the last three on the list, at least, should die at all. On the other hand, I'm willing to bet that at least two of the top four are scum, and that there is at most one scum in the bottom tier.

@MOD: Do the scum have daytalk?

Cut by LMP: Oh yes I like your position on this list.

[I Am Innocent]

Vi, you have read up to page 20, and you are recommending lynches and protections from lynches based on that? No, it does not work that way buddy. Catch up and then you can start making some recommendations.

Regarding my active lurking, please read post 642 to see why.

Then read pages 29-57 and see if my participation and play is still active lurking.

************************

Nice OMGUS Bunnylover. Noted.

Scummy things you have done off the top of my head:
You hammered Powerox before giving the group a chance to discuss the matter. In effect saving TMH who was the 2nd leading vote getter.
The crazy bit where you claimed you had MOI's ability from yesterday.
You outted Parama when I told the group to leave it/DBE well alone on who she protected.

You have no case on me yet you suspect me for there being no case on me. I have had one vote the entire game, a RVS vote. I do not need street cred, so your argument is weak. Once again, nice OMGUS.

[I Am Innocent]

Oh yeah, you lied saying your other game had one vanilla townie, where it really said at least one vanilla townie.

[Bunnylover]

@I am Innocent:
LOL OMGUS REALLY?
What you just did is OMGUS. Trying to discredit what I posted by saying its because you posted me as one of your "to kill" reads.
A lot of people have put me on their "to kill" list, and have I said anything about that, called them scum? NO I HAVEN"T.
Reason why I haven't is because that is their opinion.
WHAT YOU DID THOUGH, is point out that you haven't been on any mislynches of killing townies player. Your basically bragging about it. No one needs to bring up that point unless your scum trying to get viewed as a pro-townie.
I was the vote that put him at L-1.
I also gave reason as to put my vote their.
If you want to vote me for that shit, then go ahead. I gave my reason as any other person would do. If I had just voted and given nothing at all to back up my vote, then yes I would agree with you that in fact is scummy. But frankly I didn't just vote, nor did I hammer.
Also what is their to discuss? He said he had a power. I found that power not pro-town and in a situation where we have to lynch scum and scum have that power, they could use that to win the game. The power passed on as any other power in this game.

Yeah we already went over that bit.

I outed Parama? No. Parama was not outed. He was protected by DBE. Yes in hince sight that would mean he would pass it to Parama as you pointed out, but thats leads into WIFOM situation.

Also, what happens if that game DOES have one VT? Is that not a possible outcome?

I like the fact that you point out that you haven't voted. Aren't votes the most powerful tool townies have? Don't they lead to VC analysis? Wouldn't scum want to be left off of VC analysis? (credit goes to MoI for teaching me these things in Secret Invasion Mafia).

Vote I am Innocent

[Saint]

Vi, you have read up to page 20, and you are recommending lynches and protections from lynches based on that? No, it does not work that way buddy. Catch up and then you can start making some recommendations.

Oh, but yes it does work that way.

I skipped ahead just for you, and I'm willing to buy some temporary leave due to other games, but from December 22 all the way to January 6 (two weeks)? And you were literally incapable of posting anything convincing until then?

And perhaps more pressingly... you're casting doubt on ALL of my reads because YOU don't feel your description was accurate? No, please, enlighten me. Tell me how I'm wrong on the others.

[Saint]

Vi, you have read up to page 20, and you are recommending lynches and protections from lynches based on that? No, it does not work that way buddy. Catch up and then you can start making some recommendations.

Oh, but yes it does work that way.

I skipped ahead just for you, and I'm willing to buy some temporary leave due to other games, but from December 22 all the way to January 6 (two weeks)? And you were literally incapable of posting anything convincing until then?

And perhaps more pressingly... you're casting doubt on ALL of my reads because YOU don't feel your description was accurate? No, please, enlighten me. Tell me how I'm wrong on the others.

And while you're here... I distinctly remember reading recently that you wanted Saint (read, ME) out of the game. Yet if I'm not mistaken, you said this slot was a Town read both before and after that statement. Really?

[LimMePls]

I skipped ahead just for you, and I'm willing to buy some temporary leave due to other games, but from December 22 all the way to January 6 (two weeks)? And you were literally incapable of posting anything convincing until then?

There was a couple of little holidays that fell in here, you might have heard of them. They're called Christmas and New Years. Some of us weren't available for mafia during that time.

For instance, you point out that "Only shows up around Page 20", as though there is a scummy reason for this, when the simple truth is that I was V/LA over that time, and had announced it clearly to the mod and in the thread.