RE: Katsuki Wagon
charter wrote: The LMP has all the signs of crummy votes, same as yesterday. Fonz is the only one voting LMP who I think is justified in doing so.
Charter, if you still believe this then back it up with your reasoning. I’m about to do the same, but for the Katsuki wagon.
As a foreword, I will say that my vote is on LMP because he’s my top scumpick. After that I do have problems with the Katsuki wagon, but I do not think everyone on it is being scummy for those reasons. LMP is the one who is on that wagon for all the wrong reasons. Magna and Charter are using tells that townies often use but I see different conclusions from them. I don't think they are scum. MacLock could be scum but his defense of my original case in turn decreased my suspicion of him, while HC has just looked short on time and lazy this whole game. I do believe that lack of reasoning by itself is not a good reason to condemn someone, so its hard to call either of them scum for it.
Nor do I think everyone on the LMP wagon are town. I’d like to look into charter’s KMD case some more. When I have more time I want to talk about Tally’s role on the raj wagon which is bothering me now. Fonz is cool though
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(1)
MagnaofIllusion
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104 needs to be talked about. MoI mentions a meta read on Katsuki here he has questionable reads but is also town? What are you two hiding about how much you know each other and trust you know? Or is this nothing, links would be good.
225 calls out Katsuki for active lurking. That was the first time he did it so it’s a valid thing to talk about. Even his excuse about not using bookmarks doesn’t prove anything so it’s a valid concern to have about him the first day. (however the second time he does it I don’t think it becomes a stronger tell at all)
240 calls Kat out for missing the mod post. Eh, some people are like that. I’ve seen town do it. MoI also calls him out for not scumhunting. I skimmed a few of Kat’s games and don’t think he’s out of character at that point. Right now this looks null to me, because people scumhunt in different ways and I’m done trying to get someone to play the way I want them to (See:
Objection mafia).
398 (as in the post you made yesterday) looks like the first time he adds the tells about Kat’s hammer and reaction being scummy? I don’t see your explanation. The hammer business to me looks worse than it probably is. Town should not be afraid to hammer. This is a common mantra that even scum know. So I think Kat is either scum that didn’t know raj was at L-1 or he is town that didn’t know raj was at L-1.
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(2)
LynchMePlease
– First calls Katsuki scum in
286 by first trying to find scum pairings that make sense for him. I have no idea what he’s calling scummy in the first link of that post. Not being hard enough on Talitha? That’s a stretch for a townie to start thinking Katsuki and Tally are scum together without a flip first. Claiming that Katsuki calling Peanut town while they both go after MoI and LMP indicates a scum strategy? Another big stretch because those kinds of scenarios are so so common. Everything is not black and white. Not everyone who shares an opinion must be connected. Yet LMP tries to force connections when they favor him. That is why I’m voting him. It’s a very opportunistic tactic that town don’t use to make their cases.
He also infers (I guess) that Katsuki secretly knew raj was at L-1 but decided to vote LMP first anyway. Hard to prove, or even guess what is more likely. At this point LMP is just padding his case with anything he can find, instead of rightly saying this is more null than anything. Or if he really wants to go there, reasoning why this is scummy.
Then LMP criticizes how Katsuki goes after another of his suspects after the lynch. Yet LMP doesn’t explain why that point is bad.
After that vote post, LMP doesn’t say much about Katsuki. No questioning in fact. What he does instead is try and pair people to Katsuki, set up additional lynches. This makes me think he’s not voting Katsuki to get a better read on him, confirm to himself that Kat is scum. Instead it looks like he’s using the pressure on Katsuki and transferring it to other people. Artificially boosting their own spotlight without continuing an investigation on Katsuki. IE: not trying to find scum in Katsuki but trying to make scum out of Tally, Fonz, etc.
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(3)
charter
– His only reason for voting was in
309, Katsuki voting for LMP looking like a self-preservation vote. I don’t follow your logic on this one. Katsuki had been calling LMP and MoI scum on day 1 and voted for them. So how does voting them on day 2 when a wagon was forming on him have anything to do with a wagon forming on him?
After you vote Katsuki you label him a scum lurker. I’m not buying the lurking tell here because he was already called out for it day 1. Scum would react to pressure like that by fixing their problem for self-preservation sake. Town would react to it by not caring about how they look to others. So your claim that he is about self-preservation does not work with your claim that he does not care about self-preservation.
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(4)
MacavityLock
– Completely dismissive of wagons he doesn’t like while being completely vauge about the wagons he does like.
358 is futhter proof of this. Without a reason for voting Katsuki, I have a hard time believing his read is confident or if he is just trying to prevent a LMP lynch. If he really thinks the LMP wagon is made up, why isn’t he going after the people that are pushing it instead? His words and actions do not align. And he really should have tried to piece through the raj and now LMP wagons to say why he thinks they weren’t/aren’t real cases. I don’t trust his motivations when he’s not trying to do something pro-town like that.
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(5)
Haschel Cedricson
– Calls LMP scummier than MoI in
140 for no reason. Calls Katsuki scummier than LMP in
362 for no reason. There’s no pausing to consider the scumminess of LMP so I have a hard time believing his read on LMP at all. This is a bad vote.
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This isn't about me calling Katsuki town. (A) Its me explaining why I don't see a case that makes Katsuki look like a good scum bet. (B) Its me also reiterating my LynchMePlease case in how he scumhunts without a town mindset.
