Mini 1096 - Seinfeld Mafia (Game Over)

[Katsuki]

Vote: MOI

[Kmd4390]

Talitha, if Peanut was lurking scum, why would The Fonz have to carry the exact same strategy?

Also, you said it:

I could see BV as scum, but can't see why this would mean Raj is town. Decent chance he's bussing IMO.

Where's the scums?
Talitha, Haschel Cedricson, MagnaofIllusion, Kmd4390, Untrod Tripod, bv310, Katsuki

Vote Untrod

for now.

[Kdub]

JERRY: So Puddy, this is a pretty good move for you, huh? No more grease monkey.
PUDDY: I don't much care for that term.
JERRY: Oh. Sorry, I didn't know.
PUDDY: No, I don't know too many monkeys who could take apart a fuel injector.
JERRY: I saw one once that could do sign language.
PUDDY: Yeah, I saw that one. Uh, Koko.
JERRY: Yeah, Koko.
PUDDY: Right, Koko. That chimp's all right. High-five.

Vote Count

charter (0) -
LynchMePls (0) -
Katsuki (0) -
The Fonz (0) -
MagnaofIllusion (2) - Untrod Tripod, Katsuki
bv310 (0) -
Haschel Cedricson (0) -
Talitha (0) -
Untrod Tripod (1) - Kmd4390
Kmd4390 (0) -
MacavityLock (0) -
Not Voting (8) - charter, LynchMePls, The Fonz, MagnaofIllusion, bv310, Haschel Cedricson, Talitha, MacavityLock

11 votes available, 6 votes needed to lynch.

[Talitha]

Talitha, if Peanut was lurking scum, why would The Fonz have to carry the exact same strategy?

Um, he wouldn't. Are you suggesting that I should have formed a firm opinion on Peanut's alignment from his 5 posts and not be able to change that opinion based on The Fonz's greater number of posts? You're crazy. Actually, going over my iso I don't even think I ever articulated my mild suspicion of peanutman. So what the heck are you on about??

[Talitha]

It's a good thing I'm only playing one game. I'm just going to blame my old age for the memory lapse.

[Kmd4390]

Talitha, if Peanut was lurking scum, why would The Fonz have to carry the exact same strategy?

Um, he wouldn't. Are you suggesting that I should have formed a firm opinion on Peanut's alignment from his 5 posts and not be able to change that opinion based on The Fonz's greater number of posts? You're crazy. Actually, going over my iso I don't even think I ever articulated my mild suspicion of peanutman. So what the heck are you on about??

Well, if your suspicion of peanut was on some mild thing in Peanut's posts or something, I could see that. But you just said you thought he was lurker scum. If Peanut chose to lurk because he was scum, why does anything The Fonz has done make Peanut's lurking any less of a scum tell?

[MagnaofIllusion]

@Charter

– still waiting for your response to my latest questions.

I'm also highly regretting my rajr hammer right here, MOI was the correct lynch for today.

Let me see.

1. You state you are highly regretting the hammer BEFORE the flip. Why?
2. The only thing that happened between your hammer and this gem is me calling you useless. Which you have been this entire game. Looks pretty clearly like you are attacking me because I’m calling you scum.
3. You know what would be great. Any sort of reason to go along with your vote.

VOTE: Katsuki

I think you were scum avoiding the thread. You’ve done zero scum-hunting this entire game just rode the wave of whatever wagon you could hop on. Add in this latest little bit and I think you deserve votes, pronto.

As for the Magna-meta thing, yes, there was something in his first 3 posts that tipped me. In addition, I did feel that his reaction to getting voted was not particularly pro-town: I felt like rather than defending himself,

he was using whatever he could including misrep-ing to explain the votes on him

, which doesn't feel very pro-town to me.

Emphasis added. I have every right to attack bad or completely unexplained votes for me. I can’t mis-rep reasons for votes when none were given.

As for your meta thing color me unimpressed. You’ve hidden behind the ‘invisible meta’ shield all day long, acting as if it is valid. You can’t have valid meta on me that shows I am scum since I am Town. Until you show your ‘work’ I’m just going to chock it up to a scummy attack by you.

However, meta-wise there's been something his most recent 3 posts that has kind of tipped me the other way. Yes, I'm keeping this intentionally vague. Anyway, if after flips I decide to continue to go after Magna, there will be an articulated case behind it.

Saying you’ve kept it intentionally vague means you know you can’t provide something that will stand up to scrutiny, IMO. Yes, I see how ‘private tells’ being kept private are important if they are valid. But I know for a fact you can’t have a valid tell.

no reason for him to be *that* pissed about a townie lynch if he was actually a town member. I think he's mafia trying to earn towncred by being "mad" about a town lynch.

Where am I ‘overly’ pissed? Here’s a hint … attacking obv-scum Kats for being useless isn’t being pissed about the lynch. I wouldn't have been voting for rajr if I didn't find him scummy.

[LimMePls]

Vote: Untrod Tripod

[Katsuki]

and MOI, yes, I was most definately scum-avoiding this thread.
Did you honestly expect to get a meaningful answer out of that useless question (and fake pressuring)?

Unvote, Vote: RAJR

I thought you might try to provide an explanation as to how you 'mystically' forgot this game. You know, since you are uber-active all over the site.

Do you not bookmark the games you are in?

But instead of responding with reasons you play the sarcastic, useless fool.

Congrats.

This post told me all I needed to know about MOI alignment, and it also did not give me good vibes about my hammer.

Essentially, this is a post town-MOI would NEVER make. If my gut is 100% in finding non-town fate, I'm sure it's just as accurate with you.

[LimMePls]

I'm not sure I agree that town-MOI would never make a post like that. For one, i don't see how you can possibly substantiate a claim like that.

[MagnaofIllusion]

This post told me all I needed to know about MOI alignment, and it also did not give me good vibes about my hammer.

Essentially, this is a post town-MOI would NEVER make. If my gut is 100% in finding non-town fate, I'm sure it's just as accurate with you.

Speaking of 'Fake-hunting',which you love to bandy about. This is a pure example.

What games have you been 100% in finding non-Town Fate? Can you link to any completed? Furthermore how is your claimed ability to read Fate have any bearing on your ability to read me? You've been wrong in the past (Prison Mafia where you called me scum, perhaps LOTR where you called me scum although that may have been you posturing as scum).

But I have been successful in identifying scum Katsuki before, haven't I (LOTR).

My vote looks good.

[Kdub]

bv310 and Haschel Cedricson have been prodded.

[Talitha]

Kmd:
1. Not all lurkers are scum but my philosophy is that they deserve suspicion because it's harder to catch them when they're not posting.
2. The lurker in question flaked, therefore it becomes more likely he was just busy and less indicative of his alignment.

___

I'm going to read over the last few pages before voting.

[Haschel Cedricson]

Prod received.

I have to leave now to attend a meeting, but I'll probably have something posted tonight.

[MacavityLock]

MacLock, how can he defend himself if you don't say why you're voting him?

While that's certainly true in the case of my vote, which is unexplained, it's not true for others' votes on him. For example, I saw strains of this in various places:

Iso 4:

I second this question. And confirm my vote. I'm thinking MoI and Untrod right now.

So you are confirming the vote you made on the basis that it would be better to lynch me D1 than have me NKed N1?

I love that.

Iso 12:

Then,

his extreme overreaction

to Untrod's post 34. It seems to me that 34 was a joke, since 32 looked like a joke. I find it difficult to believe that even Untrod believes his four people are scum, and how Magna cites this as his reason for voting Untrod. Very bad, but on the surface it looks like it is legit.

Bolded for emphasis is a classic unsupported statement. How is it an ‘extreme overreaction’. Be a big boy and support your assertions.

And an overreaction to 34? You must be kidding me. 34 is the classic precursor to scummy behaviour. He puts LMP on his joke scum list. Later he asserts that LMP’s 32 supports his ‘theory’ into that LMP is scum, yet when he unvotes the obv-bad bandwagon on me not a hint of his ‘scum suspect’ LMP. I’m not the only one who sees it given that both Haschel and LMP have commented on it.

Your attempt to minimize UT’s scummy behavior as ‘a joke’ is either stupid or scummy. Not sure which at this point.

Iso 16:

No. And "agreeing that UT's behavior is scummy" isn't why I find you suspicious.

Are you purposely continuing to DODGE the question purposefully? Scumtastic.

I also really dislike Iso 23, which is all "Hey, I'm almost lynched, but look over there!":

Before I forget

–

Bv stop avoiding the thread

. You’ve made 18 posts since Friday when you posted your ‘catching-up later’ post. At least 8 of those were in other games. So you don't have an lee-way to say you were making Mish-Mash or General Discussion short posts and didn't have time to read this thread. It's barely 7 pages long for god sakes.

I saw enough that I didn't like to continue the crusade, given that it started with the meta. After another in-depth read of Magna, I won't be voting him to start the day. A question though:

As for your meta thing color me unimpressed. You’ve hidden behind the ‘invisible meta’ shield all day long, acting as if it is valid. You can’t have valid meta on me that shows I am scum since I am Town.

Until you show your ‘work’ I’m just going to chock it up to a scummy attack by you.

It's fine if you don't believe me. Eventually, I will explain it, even if it does end up being post-game. That said, if you've been thinking it's scummy for so long, why haven't I gotten a vote from you ever?

----

bv's "Can I vote for a townie, please please, can I?" post 192 is more than enough for me to VOTE: bv310.

[charter]

Now it is your turn

– Fonz has pretty succinctly pointed out how the majority of the votes on me are terrible. Please comment on those players not yourself making votes for me (Kats and Maclock in particular).

I don't like how Maclock has some supersecret reason you're scum but has gone so long without saying it. I don't see why he won't say it. He hasn't really done much but that, but since I think he's right, I don't particularly mind.

Katsuki's was a random vote, that I believe he turned in to a serious one, then he doesn't really do anything the rest of the day. But the worst thing he has done is stopped voting you to hammer Raj quickly and for no reason.


Going to

Vote Kmd

because I'm more sure he's scum at this point. Heavy dose of gut in there, but I'll be posting a case on him shortly.

[Kmd4390]

Kmd:
1. Not all lurkers are scum but my philosophy is that they deserve suspicion because it's harder to catch them when they're not posting.
2. The lurker in question flaked, therefore it becomes more likely he was just busy and less indicative of his alignment.

Ok.

[Kdub]

bv310 has requested replacement. Jahudo replaces him, effective immediately.

[LimMePls]

Still liking my vote.

[Untrod Tripod]

Still liking my vote.

that one you never provided any backing for?

[Jahudo]

I'm here, am going to catch up by tonight.

[LimMePls]

Still liking my vote.

that one you never provided any backing for?

You have to be kidding, right? I've only stated my reasons to lynch you like a million times in this game.

Seriously, are you even paying attention?

[MagnaofIllusion]

I'm here, am going to catch up by tonight.

I eagerly await input from your slot.

--

Going to Vote Kmd because I'm more sure he's scum at this point. Heavy dose of gut in there, but I'll be posting a case on him shortly.

I guess your and my definitions of shortly vary. I eagerly await this case.

--

That said, if you've been thinking it's scummy for so long, why haven't I gotten a vote from you ever?

You are better than this Mac. I only have 1 vote to give and there are plenty of actively scummy players to chase. You can’t honestly think I should only restrict my scum-hunting to the single player I am voting for, correct?

@Mac

– So after you wasted a Day1 doing no scum-hunting your vote for today is lurker-hunting?

[MacavityLock]

That said, if you've been thinking it's scummy for so long, why haven't I gotten a vote from you ever?

You are better than this Mac. I only have 1 vote to give and there are plenty of actively scummy players to chase. You can’t honestly think I should only restrict my scum-hunting to the single player I am voting for, correct?

Yes, but in all this time railing against me, you've never voted. Am I not allowed to ask?

@Mac

– So after you wasted a Day1 doing no scum-hunting your vote for today is lurker-hunting?

How is specifically referencing post 192 in my vote lurker-hunting?

[Jahudo]

I've read everything and at the moment my two suspects are LMP and Mac, largely for how they are going about their cases on UT and MoI respectfully.

LynchMePls

– I do not like how he searched for scumpairings before having any individual scum tells, or at least not any that he mentioned early yesterday. He says UT’s list looks like something scum would do when they want to distance a buddy or more in a pile of townies. But that doesn’t explain why UT looks scummy in the first place.

In 57 he says the UT/MoI looks like distancing, but also says he’s less sure about MoI being a scumbuddy which doesn’t make any sense with his distance theory. He didn’t argue that the list looked like distancing. He argued that the UT/MoI votes looked like distancing. I just don’t see the logic here.

He’s most recently said he’s explained why he thinks UT is scum but I still don’t see it anywhere. If its for just making this post:

Katsuki, MoI, LMP and charter are scum. calling it now.

You have failed to explain why town-UT would not say this, or even why sucm-UT would say it under those circumstances.

If its for UT voting a person on that list, you haven’t mentioned why it can’t be coincidence or odds (36% random chance his first vote would be on one of those four people).

So what is it? From what I’ve seen your case looks like circular reasoning by saying a cross-vote could be distancing, and scum distance, so he could be scum. Only scum could get behind that logic.

---------------

MacavityLock

– Its suspicious that he focuses so much of his game on the one player he’s taking a “wait and see” approach to. If you think you have a reliable meta on someone, that’s fine. If that meta depends on keeping your vote on them for pressure/reactions, that is sometimes fine too but will ultimately depend on the meta you have.

But how does any of that prohibit you from talking about other players? Day 1 you were very much on the sidelines about people that got a good amount of attention (raj, LMP and UT to name a few). I believe scum would like to avoid taking stances for as long as possible, while town should look in several places for scum, so this part makes me suspicious of you.

@MacLock: Was MoI’s reaction to getting voted a part of your secret meta tell? Otherwise I don’t know why it took you until 246 to bring it up. Couldn’t it have been used in addition to something you couldn’t say on Day 1?

I'm outta time, I'll have to do some more catchup reads later.