DEFCON Mafia 2.0 - Over, American Victory!

[Jack]

Jed I will nuke you if you keep up the "any townies who nuke without my permission will get lynched" stuff.

[Bunnylover]

If we get Cop, awesome. Chances are we will because no scum is going to prioritize it anyways unless they really want to know who the other scum team is or deny us from getting it.

I'm saying it's low priority for us as well. There are other things I would rather deny the scum teams first, and they are going to want them as well. Cop is going to be one of those lesser contested roles I think, and it probably should remain that way.

Can you re-post your list of

what Town should get

before

Scum

does

Why do you say before scum does?

There is only one way you can be certain that Toog is not scum...

Well aren't we picking at the same time and first come first serve?
That mean we need to get certain classes before scum.
I'm not certain that Toog is town or scum. I am most suspicious of the ones who are helping us the most, as scum would have as much reason to do this as town does. I've never implied that Toog was scum or town yet.

[Jed Cooper]

I've never been in a game with Scumfate until now, Fate. You know that.

Thanks, Toog.

Ok, so you are admitting that you are a Benmage alt right?

Waa?

You quoted a game you were in with Fate and he said you were a Benmage alt...

What is your main alt if not Benmage??

[Toogeloo]

Theme music as we prepare to enter DEFCON 4 for everyone!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb-gI_pFog0

[chesskid3]

When the hell did I say I was a benmage alt?

[Jed Cooper]

BY THE WAY.

If you want to hang me cause I nuke without your permission, you can do it. But when you lose cause you lynched me for

no[REDACTED]damn reason

breaking the nuke curfew as scum, you're gonna be feeling like a

dumbass

townie genius.

/fixed.

[Jed Cooper]

Haha. Yeah, it would create a lot of pressure. Pressure is how you catch scum, dumbass.

As for huge distraction..... How so? TBH, it'd be like a vote. Who knows whether you're going to recall it or not? At least, that's how I'd use it.

Ok, I admit it would be fun but its anti-town because it creates MASSIVE confusion. Don't forget that scum are ALWAYS 100% ACCURATE with their nukes AND know EXACTLY who is getting nuked.

Here's an example with just 4 people (not 11):

Player A nukes player B to "put pressure on them". Player C nukes player A for nuking player B. Player D nukes player C for nuking player A.

All 4 players are town.

Thats 3 broken arrows with only 4 people but it doesn't stop there because we have 11 people with nukes AND we have:

1) No accountable wagon
2) No accountable way to track everybody's reads

That is EXCELLENT for scum. They just got 4 town kills without having to involve themselves and they are much closer to a win.

Just because somebody nukes a townie, doesn't make them scum -- its very easy to have townie-townie nuking. The scum can watch while the town quickly destroys itself.

I might be willing to accept "If you nuke a townie you get lynched" but even that is anti-town because it encourages individual nuking with no accountable wagon which is unorganized and inefficient.

[Jed Cooper]

If we get Cop, awesome. Chances are we will because no scum is going to prioritize it anyways unless they really want to know who the other scum team is or deny us from getting it.

I'm saying it's low priority for us as well. There are other things I would rather deny the scum teams first, and they are going to want them as well. Cop is going to be one of those lesser contested roles I think, and it probably should remain that way.

Can you re-post your list of

what Town should get

before

Scum

does

Why do you say before scum does?

There is only one way you can be certain that Toog is not scum...

Well aren't we picking at the same time and first come first serve?
That mean we need to get certain classes before scum.
I'm not certain that Toog is town or scum. I am most suspicious of the ones who are helping us the most, as scum would have as much reason to do this as town does. I've never implied that Toog was scum or town yet.

Definitely not first come first served. All lists are compiled and at the end roles are assigned with duplicate choices randomized.

[Jed Cooper]

I've never been in a game with Scumfate until now, Fate. You know that.

Thanks, Toog.

KEEP ON KEEPIN ON IN THE FACE OF ALL LOGIC AND UNSUBSTANTIATED READS.

YOU GOT BALLS ILL GIVE YOU THAT. BUT ON THE MORNING OF MATTERS YOULL BE DEAD AND I WONT BE.

YOU [REDACTED]DAMN BENMAGE CLONE

[Jed Cooper]

This sounds overly scum aware.

My joke, a joke based entirely on the unrelated topic of my name, a name that I chose several years before this game started and before I even joined this website, is "overly scum aware"? You know there's one thing I'll hate until the day I stop playing this game, and it's players who think that they have to find something sinister in every ISO post another player makes in order to have a valid point. It's absolutely pointless, and it does nothing except make you look weak and reachy.

Just for the record, I said "Here is the

read

I have on you

so far

". The first two notations were possible +scum things that I noticed. Because you then accused me of flapping my jaws for no reason I included them with the scum read that sent me over the edge which you still have not adequately answered.

Why is sub left completely off of your analysis??

Because it was clearly an example. I was stating my opinion on how players should individually setup their specific lists. If they like to be in charge of Vig-like shots, they should obviously go for the Sub as a high priorty. Just like if they want an Cop/Tracker like role, they should look to investigative powers. etc.

No, you were telling people where they should "start their list". Everyone read his post again. You were clearly guiding newbie town away from the sub -- you NEVER even MENTIONED it in your post. Saying "it was just a general post" is no excuse.

I think you are scum.

qft.

[Toogeloo]

Here's an example with just 4 people (not 11):

Player A nukes player B to "put pressure on them". Player C nukes player A for nuking player B. Player D nukes player C for nuking player A.

All 4 players are town.

Thats 3 broken arrows with only 4 people but it doesn't stop there because we have 11 people with nukes AND we have:

1) No accountable wagon
2) No accountable way to track everybody's reads

That is EXCELLENT for scum. They just got 4 town kills without having to involve themselves and they are much closer to a win.

In that

highly

unlikely scenario, town would deserve to lose for being utterly moronic. Why stop there Jed? Let's say we have 13 nukes! Player A nukes Player B, Player B has Fail Safe, uh-oh, no protecting Player A now... But Player C doesn't know that! He nukes Player A as well, and Player D nukes Place C as well. Player E thinks Player D is scum trying to reduce town members for LyLo and nukes Player D! The Sub decides that Player E must be scum and nukes him in secret...

oh... my ... ... lord! What have we done!!!



Yeah, uh, I highly doubt any scenario like that is really going to play out. Worst case scenario I forsee is threats of counter nuking, or a bunch of people nuking and recalling within 48 hours.

Possibly

, a couple players may just say "fuck this game" and nuke random people for the lulz, which no amount of policing is really going to stop anyways.




If we are going to direct nukes, let's take it a step further. Let's direct our scanners/protectors who to scan and doc/rb, hmm? Let's take away the free will of a player who has a read, or wants to use the fear factor of the nuke, and do the same with our other PRs as well. I make it sound pretty drastic, huh? Directing anyone's play style is pretty worthless, and just because a person may have a nuke doesn't mean they don't have a plan for said nuke. We can't launch until DEFCON 1 anyways, at which point there will be a few dead players, 4 phases worth of reading, and plenty of targets/gambits worth playing out. Anyone trying to inhibit nuke use needs to chill until DEFCON 1 imo.

[Jed Cooper]

Directing

claimed[/u] power roles is a +town thing to do. There is nothing wrong with treating silos/sub as the same thing. Accountable wagons are the most efficient way of hunting scum period.

I'll chill if you all will.

[AlmasterGM]

[DEFCON Mafia 2.0 - Day 1, DEFCON 4]

[NORAD SYSTEM] Enemy movement detected…
[NORAD SYSTEM] Checking for false positive…
[NOARD SYSTEM] Analyzing…
[NOARD SYSTEM] Threat legitimate. Forwarding…

…

"Have you read the latest intel?"
"No, I haven't. What's it say?"
"Enemy troop movement in the Pacific. Both Russia and China."
"The source of this intel?"
"...well, I don't want to say 'I told you so,' but the syst.."
"Oh stop. It's probably a false positive.
"It matches the intel Langley has. They're prepared to back it up."
"Fine. This still means nothing. The Pacific is big and stuff gets shuttled around there all the time."
"It's heading eastward, this time. Not north and south."
"What could possibly happen, Pearl Harbor 2.0? I think everyone knows how that one ended."
"I'm taking is down to DEFCON 4."
"WHAT? Are you out of your mind?"
"It's DEFCON 4, not a fucking nuclear launch or declaration of war. They move, we move. No big deal. We're just going move a few units around, reposition a few satellites ... the usual drill."
"You're not even going to ask the President first?"
""The President is sleeping and has a lot on his plate. I'm not going to bother him with, Excuse me, sir, I know you're busy, but I'd like you to approve moving our carriers a few inches and a few routine reconnaissance missions.'"
"You're out of your mind. This is going to get really bad, really fast, and it's going to be your fault."
"Fine, it's my fault. Feel free to whine all you want during morning briefing. I'm making the call."

…

[NORAD SYSTEM] ALERT. ALRET.
[NORAD SYSTEM] Attention all units, this is command. We are at DEFCON 4. Repeat, we are DEFCON 4. Enemy movement and reconnaissance is suspected in multiple sectors. Begin routine surveillance and be on cold standby for future orders. Do not fire unless fired upon. Over.

…

It is now Day 1, DEFCON 4. All players must submit their deployment choices via PM at this time. The deadline is Monday, 13 December 2010 at 11:59pm EST.

[Jed Cooper]

Just to re-iterate, this is not "first come, first served". All orders will be processed at the same time at the deadline.

[AurorusVox]

This sounds so much like pro-scum chaos to me. The town can (and WILL) simply enforce lawful nuking at the end of a rope! The sign clearly reads:

NO NUKING WITHOUT DISCUSSION AND VOTING. VIOLATORS WILL BE PUBLICLY HUNG.

My point is that we should be thinking of ways to deal with the inevitable slew of people (who WON'T all be scum) who decide to nuke without discussion. If you blanket say you want to lynch everyone who nukes without discussion, then that's about half the game so far who have said they don't care for rules and restrictions. Sounds like you either (a) are incredibly naieve or (b) setting up to policy lynch half the game. What I propose is that if people nuke without discussion, then they need to be able to back up WHY with a decent explanation. Like Faraday said - saying why doesn't make it not-scummy. Saying why might explain it, it might not. In the case of the latter,

then

we can talk "violators will be publicly hung."

[Jed Cooper]

Well, DEFCON 1 isn't here yet and I'm not willing to cave to your inevitable pessimism. You should be backing up the Earps by joining them not by standing on the sidelines and saying "it will never work". It will work if you and others join in.

Simply, if you're town and you care about a town win, support controlled nuking/vigging with bandwagons. And that means lynching the first rebel that throws a nuke without a wagon.

We can band together and lynch the scummiest of the rebels in DEFCON 3 just to let everyone know we mean business.

I'm taking signups now. So far we have:

Percy
VV
JC

I would like to add your name to the list. Faraday looks like he could swiing this way. Dana should state his opinion and I wouldn't be suprised if he joins up (in fact if he doesn't post I wouldn't mind a Dan lynch DEFCON 3). I think Kitoari will join.

Now once this list starts growing many of the people that are like "this can't work why try" (I believe this is a scum driven argument btw) will change their tune. The first rebel lynch in DEFCON 3 will seal the deal.

So don't tell me it can't be done. Thats a cop out. If you care about the town you will MAKE it happen.

[Baby Spice]

Nuke whoever youwant,

just be willing to justify yourself or

recall

.

Which brings me to:

Nuke: Someone

V/LA 3 days

^^ Anyone doing that should be made to glow in the dark.

Launch yes, but don't launch and disapeer

.

This is my strongest scum read so far of any.

Can you imagine the chaos created by multiple nukes in the air (with the understanding that its OK if you just recall them of course)??

Boy I'm glad you dropped in from your QT to share with us.

I mean can you IMAGINE the chaos and the HUGE distraction to the town!? Man scum would LOVE LOVE LOVE this!

MAN, I'm so worked up about this one, I'm about to go all caps like our friend Fate here...

Wow, I mean, wow.

"I launched the nuke because I have a gut scum read on him"
"He's not playing to his town meta soI nuked him"

You willing to put up with that kind of rubbish are you? Lovely reasons that the commies can use quite freely because you don't think people should be accountable for their launches.

Chaos like you seem to be pushing is the commies best friend.

Or are you trying to say that no-one should launch a nuke. Remove one of the Americans best weapons in killing off the commies.

American control, and American reasoning, and American teamwork is what will win this. Not spouting rubbish and trying to shoot down the winning strategies.

Preview edit

Wow JC talk about a change of tune. Call me scum for trying to suggest a control of nuking, then try and suggest your own.
Best yet, nuking the wagons. That is the scummiest idea I have ever heard of. Nuking doesn't end the day, so I can see it now.
Nuke the wagon, build the next wagon and nuke it. Rinse and repeat every 72 hours or so. Hell, as soon as that nuke is launched everyone will unvote the now pointless vote and form the next wagon. You could nuke 10 wagons in a day. Way to help the town.

Jed C, scum.
A scumtell, for reference, is something that benifits scum more than town, and that idea is a big one.

[Jed Cooper]

Chaos like you seem to be pushing is the commies best friend.

Since when is multiple, iniformational, town-driven bandwagons chaos? Its so ordered and helpful to town it hurts.

Or are you trying to say that no-one should launch a nuke. Remove one of the Americans best weapons in killing off the commies.

Since when did I say that? Were gonna launch huge and catch scum too.

American control, and American reasoning, and American teamwork is what will win this.

Thank you for making my point you may add your name to the list now.

Nuke the wagon, build the next wagon and nuke it. Rinse and repeat every 72 hours or so. Hell, as soon as that nuke is launched everyone will unvote the now pointless vote and form the next wagon. You could nuke 10 wagons in a day. Way to help the town.

You're going to have to explain this one. Since when do town driven wagons work that way? Its YOUR strategy where people launch and then recall saying "tee hee I was only applying pressure". When we launch as town that puppy hits and hits hard. We don't recall our nukes.

[Internet Stranger]

Hey Jed, thanks for setting up a list of "more probably scum" for me to nuke. Of course, you will be going first for causing all this chaos and disruption to the town.
You aint no Earp, buddy. No one elected you Sheriiff or Marshall. Youre just another mook with a nuke like the rest of us.

The scum are the ones that try to control the actions of the town, whether overtly (via white knight shennanigans like youre trying to pull) or subtly, like the your lurking scum buddies are doing.

Nukes will fly amigo, for America!
U.S.A! U.S.A!

[Jed Cooper]

Yes I understand that the Communists have infiltrated the USA but do you have to make it so blatant?

There are still enough red-blooded Americans left to take care of you though. By the time DEFCON 1 rolls around Law & Order will prevail.

Taking signups now. Anyone that cares about America is urged to join.

[SocioPath]

Don't forget that scum are ALWAYS 100% ACCURATE with their nukes AND know EXACTLY who is getting nuked.

This is wrong. And nuke-worthy.

Just because somebody nukes a townie, doesn't make them scum -- its very easy to have townie-townie nuking. The scum can watch while the town quickly destroys itself.

I might be willing to accept "If you nuke a townie you get lynched" but even that is anti-town because it encourages individual nuking with no accountable wagon which is unorganized and inefficient.

Notably leaves out the most important of scenarios.


All in all Jed is scum.
And using one of my favorite scum tells.
CARE TO GUESS WHICH ONE?

[Jed Cooper]

Btw, I never said that I am Wyatt Earp.

I said that I am on the side of the Earps (multiple, informational, town-controlled nukes/sub vig) because its the best for the town.

Anyone who understands how wagons work and how a town directed day vig helps the town by providing 2 (or more) town driven lynches to 1 scum NK (better than the usual 1:1) will also join the Earps.

Its just simple patriotic logic. Join now!

[Jed Cooper]

Don't forget that scum are ALWAYS 100% ACCURATE with their nukes AND know EXACTLY who is getting nuked.

This is wrong. And nuke-worthy.

No its not because a scum cross-kill is +town. failkthx.

Just because somebody nukes a townie, doesn't make them scum -- its very easy to have townie-townie nuking. The scum can watch while the town quickly destroys itself.

I might be willing to accept "If you nuke a townie you get lynched" but even that is anti-town because it encourages individual nuking with no accountable wagon which is unorganized and inefficient.

Notably leaves out the most important of scenarios.

Well lets remember that if you hit scum it still could of been a cross kill -- I'm just sayin'.

[Internet Stranger]

Oh Jed, I cant wait to nuke you until youre crispy.

[Faraday]

I agree with Faraday here because he also advocates a lynch of the nuke rebel, but look at the bolded!

Next thing you know you have broken arrows flying everywhere. Scum heaven.

I don't think you do, I'm saying fire off nukes, if I don't like the target then tick tick tick that's the sign of your life running out. Definitely not interested in trying to control people.

IDK about Jed, I vaguely remember reading a game with his alt in it, a webcomic game or something, where he got himself in all sorts of trouble day 1. I don't think he's really that scummy at the moment. Certainly there are better targetstm.

Seems like there should be more people posting ITT.