Newbie 993 - Game Over!

[Kirbyoshi]

We need to lynch Mysterio. I am becoming increasingly sure that he is scum.

[Kalimar]

Wow. I actually put a vote behind my suspicion of Mysterio, which is something no one has had the guts to do Day 2, and I get put at L-1 for it? Good job people. Especially town, you guys are amazing. [/sarcasm]

Anyway, claim time I guess, since if I don't, I'll probably be lynched. I'm the Doc. I protected star last Night.

Mysterio still needs to answer my question, and Leech needs to stop tunneling so much.

But your suspicion wasn't adequately explained... and still isn't, really.
And why protect star? He's been completely useless to town so far.

From what I gather you aren't happy that he didn't explain why he thought Thian voting drowmage who wasn't in the game was scummy. But what is particularly significant about that? Please explain.

And, the deadline is fast approaching (less than 5 hours?)

[Kalimar]

EBWOP: even if you did explain, this is really far too late anyway. Your claim is late and we are left little time to discuss it. Nevertheless from a town perspective a good case on Mysterio could be helpful, so give that if you can.

[Chimp Pants]

Stop! Hammer time! Someone not voting needs to make this happen.

[Mysterio]

Don't have a lot of free time today and I'm trying to get this post in before deadline, so I'll be brief.

@Kirby, my knee-jerk reaction to your claim is one of skepticism. Your protection choice is questionable and your play has been terrible, thus a doc claim sounds like a convenient way of erasing all of your bad play. Having said that, I'm reluctant to hammer an uncounterclaimed doc, considering how much it would hurt town if I were wrong. However, your play will be scrutinized from here on out.

Given Kirby's claim, I think the best lynch we can hope for today is Thian. His play became progressively scummy the more pressure I put on him, which is the opposite of what I would expect from someone who is town. Otherwise, a no lynch will happen as I don't see anyone else willing to hammer Kirby. I personally am against a no lynch when we have a clear scum candidate in Thian.

@Chimp Pants, your question to me is completely irrelevant to the point I was making. Had Thian simply unvoted and left it there, he would be in the same boat as Star. Which is to say his lack of scumhunting would warrant a FoS.

My

claim goes beyond that, which is Thian's immediate switch to a Shotty vote that makes him scummier than Star (or in this case Star's replacement). My argument references more than just Thian's lack of scumhunting by keeping his vote on a non-existent player, which you should have gathered if you were reading my posts. It may or may not be scum tell to consistently skim people's posts, but it is definitely annoying as hell.

tl;dr I support a Thian lynch in light of Kirby's claim.

[Chimp Pants]

@Mysterio: You've made the assertion that I only skim your posts several times. This is

not

true. I read every word very carefully. I've said as much multiple times. Maybe you're skimming?

I understand your general argument about Thian. I've stated as much several times when I asked my question (maybe you skimmed those parts). I even made a similar argument when I voted for Thian (did you skim this?). I don't understand

why you felt the need to beef up your case against Thian with something as irrelevant as his vote on Drowmage

. You have suggest twice (Post 336 and Post 354) that his long lasting vote on Drowmage by itself suggests scumminess. Now you seem to be backing off and calling it no different than Star's failure to vote. Which is it?

[Thian]

6 hours to go. Well, now lol Mysterio you really need to stop a minute and re-evaluate why you are telling the group I am scummy.

To you, I am scummy because I didn't unvote ((lol@that)) that's not a scum tell
I apparently haven't scum hunted ((thats not true))
Voting for shotty ((you did too))

Then you go and tunnel in on me to "add pressure" until I flake out.
You claim Scum flake out if you put pressure on them, but consider this as well.
Someone who puts pressure ((tunnels in)) on a town that much can end up making a town flake out and appear scummy so you can use to your advantage.

So just as you are putting pressure on a townie ((me)), I can accuse you of being a tunnelling scum based on horrible logic. The fact that you haven't bothered with anyone else at this point Mysterio seems scummy.

Its funny how Kalimar is only stepping in as well when he is asked a question or his name is brought up. Why are you sitting back?

[Thian]

I find Leech's and Mysterio's debate at the beginning a distraction to distance themselves.

They both jumped onto shotty bandwagon which linked them together again.
Someone called the whole group out being on the shotty lynch Scummy. They both panicked and started pointing fingers at the other two people on the shotty bandwagon and not at each other either.
Now Leech cheerleaded Kirbyoshi and is on a potential mislynch. ((leech was tunnelling))
Mysterio is cheerleading a lynch against me a townie. ((mysterio was tunnelling))
They are distancing themselves again.

Now that Leech is on a kirbyoshi lynch, Mysterio doesn't seem to want anything to do with a Kirbyoshi lynch because that would link them back up together again as they are working very hard to distance themselves after being linked to the shotty lynch.

Now that Kirbyoshi claimed doc, it makes even more sense for him to stay off the lynch as it would tie Leech and Myserio back up together again as they already distanced themselves.

Something about Mysterio's post 336 and Leech's response in 337 just seems encouraging to each other and giving Mysterio a friendly soft reminder not to do the FOS and Vote as it looks scummy after they fought about it on day one.

If you are questioning someone, you are questioning them because you feel they are worthy of suspicion and this adds true pressure and produces content for everyone to analyze ((that is scum hunting I have been doing that))
Simply typing out a reason why you FOS someone, does not consist of scum hunting. Thats just saying oh, I suspect you.
Mysterio hasn't bothered to question anything with anyone else what so ever.

[Thian]

5 Hours. I don't think much will be accomplished. I will be checking back and will consider hammering in a few hours.

[Chimp Pants]

With the pace of this game, I don't think we're in any position to be rearranging votes this late. Discussion is fine, but someone needs to be prepared to hammer before deadline.

In fact, someone could hammer and we could still discuss during twilight. That might be a safer option.

Hammer time...

[Thian]

yeah, this is going to really be unfortunate if this doc claim is really true.

unvote: Mysterio
Vote:Kirbyoshi

[Thian]

Kalimar, you logged in, why no comment? you have no reaction to a doc claim?

[Kalimar]

Whoops. I forgot the game was running on EST time. (I'm from the UK, so 5 hours behind).

regarding Thian's: "Its funny how Kalimar is only stepping in as well when he is asked a question or his name is brought up. Why are you sitting back?"

Only two of my posts have been direct replies to questions (three if you want to be pedantic and include this). Please don't misrep the facts.

I see the hammer's been dropped. Myst, you have to remember if we didn't hammer Kirby, we would have zero time to discuss Thian's claim. At this point, there was precious little else we could do.
The phrasing of "Having said that, I'm reluctant to hammer an uncounterclaimed doc, considering how much it would hurt town if I were wrong. " bugs me somewhat. It makes me concerned that you would be distancing yourself from this lynch and if Kirby does infact turn out to be the doctor. If he turns out to be scum, I'm not sure what it means. Do you expect his claim to be real?

Kirby, I feel if you're town, you left it all a bit too late.

[Thian]

to my above comment to kalimar. Sorry I saw you log off your name wasn't updated. probably because you were typing a message. My apologies.

[Kalimar]

Thian, whilst you are here, do you expect Kirby to come up scum, or do you think he is really doctor?

[Thian]

Kalimar, I expect the worst ((that he is a doc)) but hope for the best ((that he is scum)). I feel there might be sincerity in his claim and since no one else has claimed doc, thats really making me think he is who he says he is. The problem is, he left it late, we had no time to actually get anywhere and we need a lynch. He states it was his absense from the website that caused his inactivity. Did he leave it late on purpose? or was it genuine?

[Thian]

**at work right now, so my responses might be a bit slow if off break**

[Kalimar]

Hmm. To answer my own question... it's the claimed star save which intrigues me. Why would someone make up that they saved Star? It wouldn't be my first expected pick for a contrived response.
I'd have liked to known Kirby's response to that.

The lack of a counterclaim is... not so surprising, really. Considering not everyone has even come on since the claim. And also that the setup is 50/50 on even having a doctor to begin with.
I still feel there is a good chance for a scum lynch, though. Having more time to discuss the claim would have helped though...

At any rate, bedtime.

[Thian]

yes, I see your point.

[Chimp Pants]

Why would someone make up that they saved Star? It wouldn't be my first expected pick for a contrived response.

Look at it from the doc perspective. Why would he protect Star?

[Mysterio]

Hammering a claimed doc in order to slip in a deadline lynch is just terrible. We could have just as easily discussed his claim during the next day phase, instead of hammering a potential town PR. Ugh

@CP, my annoyance with you is growing. You cited posts #336 and #354. Tell me, did you read them? Because here's what I see:

You didn't even bother unvoting, which says to me you never had any intention of voting

until Shotty came around

and gave you an easy target to finally vote for.

However, you kept your vote on a non-existent player for the entire game

until Shotty came in late

in the game and gave you an easy target. That is suspicious.

Oh my, would you look at that. I mention Shotty in

both

of those points when I brought up Thian's vote on drowmage. So, tell me, where in either of these posts do I "...suggest...that his long lasting vote on Drowmage by itself suggests scumminess"? This has gone beyond mere skimming of posts and is becoming a classic scum tell.

[Chimp Pants]

@Mysterio: Yes I read your posts. Maybe you should too. I don't understand what Thian's failure to unvote had to do with his vote for Shotty.

You didn't even bother unvoting, which says to me you never had any intention of voting until Shotty came around and gave you an easy target to finally vote for.

What does Thian unvoting a vote that

never counted

have to do with his vote on Shotty? Had he unvoted immediately or even never placed a vote like Star or Brod, his vote for Shotty would be the same. Did Drowmage ever show up in the vote counts? Of course not. What would be the use of Thian unvoting and why is failing to do so scummy?

I fully understand how Thian's votes were opportunistic. His vote caught my attention enough to look carefully at him and vote for him at the start of D2 (remember the guy who voted Thian before you did?). I understand that your points were looking at Thian's votes on Shotty, but you repeatedly used Thian's failure to make an unnecessary unvote to enhance your point. Now you're attempting to put me in a scummy light for wondering why you're pretending that only some of your words count.

Would you care to elaborate on this "classic scum tell" of mine?

Hammering a claimed doc in order to slip in a deadline lynch is just terrible. We could have just as easily discussed his claim during the next day phase, instead of hammering a potential town PR. Ugh

Based on this game's activity level, you were willing to risk a on lynch to save a claimed doc?

[Chimp Pants]

EBWOP: Based on this game's activity level, you were willing to risk a

no

lynch to save a claimed doc? I'm not sure what an on lynch is, but it's probably awesome.

[Thian]

Actually Chimp Pants brought up a good point to Kalimar. What motivation would Kirbyoshi have to save star? Star didn't really do anything besides promise more content later for most of the time, and he isn't even over 1 page of content.

Get together with a group of people you mistrust as a doc, and you know that the first night someone is going to get killed? Why would the doc not save himself to keep himself safe until the next day at least until he gets a trust worthy read on someone?

Kalimar will have to be looked at next day if Kirbyoshi turns up scum.

[Chimp Pants]

@Thian:

Note: Doctors are 100% effective in Newbie Games (the person they protect will never die on the night they are protected). You may not protect yourself.