Mini 1041: Wheel of Fortune Mafia (Game over!)

[StrangerCoug]

VOTE COUNT

brianj (1): Charlie
curiouskarmadog (1): Xite91
PieMan (2): Reckamonic, brianj
Xite91 (4): curiouskarmadog, Prof. Guppy, Tasky, Oman
Not voting (4): FakeGod, PieMan, Tazaro, yabbaguy

With

12

players alive, it takes

7

votes to lynch.

[Oman]

Oman, your post is so full of crap it hurts.

You strike me as a 16 year old who plays the game well, but needs a friend.

[*]brianj: The worst thing I could say about braianj is that ...

... is that? what? finish your sentences please

Whoops, I kind of went top down and forgot about him. I did it over two or three steps.

Brainj gives me a bad feeling. It is all gut, that's all it was. I've learned to trust my gut, so I'm watching him.

[*]Charlie: This dude has attained semi-confirmed status quite easily because of the softclaim. The way I see it there are only three outcomes, one is that they're not fully confirmed, two is that

they're scum pulling a gambit, which doesn't seem likely at all

, and three is that we now have two confirmed town. I'll you what, it's a great outcome for us,

because if one comes up scum, the other is likely town

, and while they're both alive, they're both likely town. So for now I'm happy to give Charlie my tick, but we'll see. Really comes out of his shell at post #87 where he suddenly has a lot more confidence and posts big explainations. Why the change here?

It almost feels like the gambit is working, so he pipes up a little.

It just doesn't fit. Post #91 is really interesting because it's the inside man's view. Let's assume Charlie is town for now: he posts about reactions to himself, giving a different perspective. It's also really dangerous because he's emotionally involved. That line

If I could day-kill anyone, it would be him at this point.

What an odd comment.

My biggest problems are that he said "Mason-like". There was no mention of confirming two players, which would have been the first thing out of my mouth as a town player making the call to softclaim

.

I also hate the "useless" thing.

those two sententes are a little contradicting each other, aren't they?

this is total crap. they both confirmed each other. a townie would no reason to lie. therefore they are either both town or both anti-town (or we have a bastard mod, but if I remember right we excluded this).

what is so odd about it? is odd=scummy? if yes, how? if no, why bother with it?

what didn't you like?

Charlie probably hoped to find his partner without outing themselves, or at least wanted to keep the option open to not reveal himself

No, it can still feel like a gambit without being one. And I said I don't think it's likely, which means it still could be. It's a feeling and a chance, but notice I didn't put him in either of my scumteams, the probability is still against it.

They didn't confirm each-other as town in their first posts. It wasn't until Fakegod posted later that they confirmed each other, and even that was a hassle. Therefor nothing, Fakegod confirmed it off the bat, Charlie didn't until well after fakegod did.

Odd does not equal scummy, but it's all about context. Odd can later be scummy, if the right context is given to it. You have to remember this day one information is all in such a small context (i.e. that the editorial "you" is town) that we can't get all the information out of it that we need. So I say it's odd for that kind of thing to be said, but maybe later it can give us some good info.

Confirming each other is not useless. Charlie's initial claim doesn't fit with what came out later in the discussion of their pair. What annoys me is that he says "yeah I'm useless" fakegod says "so am I" but now we take it as read that there are two confirmed town in this bunch (in my opinion, fakegod is the...less confirmed). That is unuseless, inuseless, deuseless. It is useful, it is full of uses.

Well, I doubt that was his intention, and if it was it was subtlety fail.

[*]curiouskarmadog: CKD has this skeptical outlook, that lead to a lot of questions about the roles. Then he really fires up. I don't know about alignment on that.

Note #156 as a CKD defense of Xite.

Nothing serious. Oh man, after what happens page 8+ you guys have bigger issues.

what is so noteworthy about it? is it scummy? is it a town-tell? something else?

See the next sentence,

nothing serious

noting if for context, or to look back on later. It kind of fed my CKD+Xite thoughts. At the moment, it's a nulltell, but if and when something happens to change my opinion.

[*]FakeGod: vote going to the highest bandwagon in the RVS is cool. Nulltell. #30's comment of "my role is as useless as [charlie's]" sucks for a softclaim too.

lol reck, you're just jealous cuz I got a buddy

I know this is throwaway line, but that's where the good stuff happens, when it wasn't planned out.

You use A) the term "buddy" which in mafia nomenclature never has a good meaning (buddy-up, scumbuddy, buddy comedies staring owen wilson). And to say it to Reckamonic, who is a Hydra anyway. Just seems...odd. I know, friendly social rah rah rah, but sometimes it's just too odd.

We had a good reason. Trust me.

And what did I say about rolefishing discussing about me and Charlie? hmmm?

I hate this

"you're not allowed to discuss us! even though we're the only critical thing in the game so far!"

I also had a huge amount of problems with post #68 where he comes forward and says "we are both mod-confirmed town" but it takes charlie so much longer to get that out. I'm still not sure it is mod confirmed. Especially when his next comment is "I was able to figure it out from my Role-PM" (#75)

you keep pointing out odd things, find scummy stuff. or if you want, pro-town-tells (but I wouldn't always share those). what you are saying there is bullshit: it's so not game relevant. why is scum more likely to use the word buddy than town?

Hey, if he says so, he is either lying (and is scum), or there is absolutely no reason not to believe him. if he is town, he doesn't want to confuse us (at least this is what I hope and expect). the fact that your are still doubting this is starting to get scummy. it could be that you fear to confirmed town are too much for you to handle, so you try to discredit them. it you think they are scum, say so. bring arguments. but, in that case they are BOTH scum

Is it scummy? if yes, why?

Put this in your theorybox, dude, until I know the alignment of a single mafioso (and I will, even if just one), I can't find half as much scummy stuff as I will afterwards. Basically, the most scummy stuff is about interactions with and reactions to confirmed town and confirmed scum. Scum is not more likely to use the word buddy than town, but we use the word buddy to relate to to scummy things. To refer to something as "buddy" is what threw me. But it's about deeply ingrained thoughts there, and I'm not happy to vote on that early.

Two confirmed town are fine, it fits easily into mini-balance. My issue with it is how it came about, I'll say it again for you, charlie's initial claim is so vastly different from what was revealed at the end. It doesn't fit! But I don't think they're both scum, and I think you're cutting out possibilities of them being one-and-one for no reason.

Scummy because it's taking what is now a very public interaction at the role level and saying "you can't talk about it" and calling people scummy for doing so. It was what brought us out of RVS, it's been the major talking point. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if we found out they make a serial-killer when together, but alone are just survivours or something similar.

[*]PieMan: This guy does one of the biggest scumtells I've seen, dodges RVS without reason. He votes for backup mod, and then at #20 jumps on this "RVS sucks" bandwagon that is completely arbitrary.

Yabba, why push it further and try to discern anymore of their roles, when more info about everyone's roles, at this point is detrimental.

old school psychology. Doesn't hold water. Check again.

is old psychology = scummy?

No, it's just incorrect. People can be wrong about theory without being scum.

[*]Tasky replaces Me=Weird.

Tasky strikes me as a bit of a jerk. He's really arrogant in his first post #135. Theory box is jerky, posts are jerky, dogma comments are jerky.

Tasky just reminds me of every spammer that we find out later is playing 2 accounts in a game or just wastes time. I don't really feel like I have a lot of time for the guy, that said,

he does seem pretty sharp. I mean, he's thinking, which is good news.

And there seems to be enough respect that this game will play out well.

Even through out differences, we could play a strong game, Tasky.

Now are you with me or against me?

are you trying to buddy up to me?

I always respect the players I play with. should I get "jerky", it is as a mean in the game. I don't intend it against you or in general.

lol. I'm with you if you help me catch scum.

No, I just feel that you're like a version of Vollkan that was bullied as a child. You're an interrogator, you're sharp, and you think, but you're a dick about it. I'm a social player, and I'm going to make friends all the time, it's not buddying by a long shot.

You're not a bad guy, you're just very arrogant in a game where people are deprived of information (and therefor submissive by default). It's going to make for a fun game.

[*]Xite91 Lots of noise. The amount of posting doesn't correspond with the amount of information. Asking me if I was breadcrumbing is a stupid question, and definitely not a town one.

so, do you think Xite is scum or not?

The vote for him suggests so (but not always ) Yes at the moment I really do.

yabbaguy: Pulling off that mystery wedge guess was excellent.

But I honestly don't know what to think about it in the context of scum town, it's just too cleanly guessed that if either of them (or both) turn up scum, yabba guy is in on it (i.e. scum, or rolecop). If not, he deserves a prize for that guess.

#97, huge issue.

Xite has this habit of saying "I GET WHAT YOUR BREADCRUMB/VAGUE POST WAS SAYING!" I don't think it's helpful, it's definitely not a good idea. It adds nothing and it feels like buddying.

Made rolefishing #112.

#161 is a horrible post.

"AtE Noted" when did respect get kicked out of this game?

I posted that I didn't get the CKD vote, and I still mean it.

#178: Worst version of one of the worst ways to read someone ever.

Full of emotion, was never going to show anything.

he can't be right! there is no way there can be one and only one one scum in {Charlie FakeGod}. again, falling back on your craplogic

?? explain this again please, don't get it

do you think this kind of post is posted more likely by town or by scum

what about that post makes you think Xite is scum?

huh? what has respect have to do with that post?

what's "way to read someone" are you referring to? what's the "worst version". explanation please

I disagree with you on this point, and it seems like we won't resolve ourselves. By the way not agreeing with you doesn't mean it's craplogic.

Eh, looks like half of my xite stuff fell under yabbaguy. Sorry for the formatting, got drunk and sleepy prior to posting it.

Post 97 is Xite's first "I KNOW THE SETUP/ROLES! AREN'T I SMART?" It's pointless and it's scummy as hell. It makes it look like we need to listen to him, and post 97 is very terrible because it's an assumption.

Post 112 is more likely to be made by scum.

The post is very defensive, and very cold. Xite and CKD were very emotive towards each other, then all of a sudden Xite just goes cold and says "Appeal to Emotion is noted" which is in itself a bad idea. Appeal to emotion is one of my least favourite fallacies because people use it horribly. An appeal to emotion isn't just an emotive post, it's when the emotion within that post is calculated to present the best possible outcome for that player.

Isolation reads are the worst way to try to determine someone's alignment, because it lacks context even more so than any other kind of read. All you get are their posts, and some memory. If you use facebook, it's like reading back through one person's individual stream of status updates. It floods you, and it clouds the vision. And Xite's is terrible because it doesn't read or analyse anything. It's just bitter.

Xite+Charlie+1 (either greyman or maybe even CKD, if he's got the balls for a confrontation this early)

this is total bullshit again. now tell me: WHY WOULD FAKEGOD CONFIRM CHARLIE IF CHARLIE WAS SCUM BUT FAKEGOD WAS TOWN?

That should be fakegod. My appologies. And don't bother telling me that's wrong, because we've already been over this and we disagree.

but I've still got my eye on you!

FoS: Oman

Understood.

[Xite91]

Sorry guys, been sort of V/La, getting back on track

Okay, I just read through all of Xite's posts, and his actions overall seem to be pro-town. He's asking plenty of questions, and calling people out on things that are scummy. BUT...there is the bit about CKD. I don't believe asking a question is scummy. Dismissing a question as unimportant or as blatantly obvious is not helpful. The answer clearly wasn't obvious to him, that's why he asked. The pro-town thing to do in this situation would be to ANSWER THE QUESTION! So what I want to know is...

What is it about CKD that you find so damn scummy, Xite?

Answer satisfactorily, and I might change my vote. Fail to answer, and you are obvscum.

Wait, if you read all of my posts, how did you miss my case on him?
First, he has been diluting the thread (For chrissake, he posted that same question how many times? And he even admitted to just copying and pasting his question.
He snapped like crazy because his little question wasn't being answered
And then he diluted the thread and when I made a case against him, he called it not a case and barely addressed it (something I find scum do more than townies)
And lets not forget, oh you asked me about the reasons I hinted at ROLEFISHING!!!

1) My biggest problems are that he said "Mason-like". There was no mention of confirming two players, which would have been the first thing out of my mouth as a town player making the call to softclaim. I also hate the "useless" thing.

2) Xite91 Lots of noise. The amount of posting doesn't correspond with the amount of information. Asking me if I was breadcrumbing is a stupid question, and definitely not a town one.

3) Xite has this habit of saying "I GET WHAT YOUR BREADCRUMB/VAGUE POST WAS SAYING!" I don't think it's helpful, it's definitely not a good idea. It adds nothing and it feels like buddying.

4) Made rolefishing #112.

5) #161 is a horrible post. "AtE Noted" when did respect get kicked out of this game? I posted that I didn't get the CKD vote, and I still mean it.

6) #178: Worst version of one of the worst ways to read someone ever. Full of emotion, was never going to show anything.

CKD says it best

you mean this "case"? there isnt a case here?

[/list]

7) Questions: Charlie: Did you two know who each other were, or have a way of identifying each other, either a callsign or something that needed to be posted in the thread?

1) If you read the thread (hey, part of it is even my posts... what was that about taking things out of context?)
2) Where's this "lot of noise?" Point out my posts that don't have any information in them.
3) The CKD one was because his breadcrumb is bullshit if he's saying that me asking him what his reasons were was rolefishing.
4) It may have been role-fishing, true, but it was because that was the only way I felt that they were both town. Also, that post shows why it's mason-like. Funny how you're not really looking at the big picture.
5) Here's the post that I said "AtE noted."

Hhey, ckd?
Quit repeating the same thing over and over again?
It's getting annoying and clogging the thread. I'm to the point where I just want to lynch you so you'll shut up. The answer should be obvious by now.
I feel like you're trying to keep us on this topic to keep us from scumhunting.

noted, then do it, or back off, you cant bully me.

Kind of reminds you of "sticks and stones can break my bones..." doesn't it? It looks like he's using emotion in his favor which is... AtE? Oh yeah!
Also, what do you mean respect being kicked out? Where was I disrespectful?
6) Where's the emotion? Oh, you mean my playstyle? Honestly, it's more sarcasm than emotion. Unless you have something else you meant.
7) It's funny that you read my posts, pointed out the "role-fishing" but failed to realize anything after it. Wait, did you ISO me?

Is it okay if I skim textwalls?

I'd prefer you didn't, but you're going to do what you want anyways aren't you?

8) The post is very defensive, and very cold. Xite and CKD were very emotive towards each other, then all of a sudden Xite just goes cold and says "Appeal to Emotion is noted" which is in itself a bad idea. Appeal to emotion is one of my least favourite fallacies because people use it horribly. An appeal to emotion isn't just an emotive post, it's when the emotion within that post is calculated to present the best possible outcome for that player.

9) Isolation reads are the worst way to try to determine someone's alignment, because it lacks context even more so than any other kind of read. All you get are their posts, and some memory. If you use facebook, it's like reading back through one person's individual stream of status updates. It floods you, and it clouds the vision. And Xite's is terrible because it doesn't read or analyse anything. It's just bitter.

8) I didn't go cold, and again, that wasn't so much emotion as sarcasm. The AtE annoyed the shit out of me because he was acting very much like a 3 year old who was being picked on by the big kids.

9) I only do ISO's after I'm convinced someone's scum. Also, most of the time (unless I remember what was going on at that point) I will go through and read a couple of posts above each of their ISO posts. (they have this nifty jump to post option...) It doesn't what? Really? Did you actually read the post? There were definitely points there. Would you like me to go through and make them easier to understand or something? Cuz I can.

[Oman]

I only do ISO's after I'm convinced someone's scum.

Then they're even more pointless. Confirmation bias.

Your overwhelming amount of sarcasm makes it seem like you're just bitter or angry. It looks irrational and leads me to disregard large amounts of your posts due to the overall feeling that they are spiteful.

Also, quit asking me if I read things. I reread the thread twice (in it's entirety, not isolating any posts). I can read, you can read, let's all assume that people who are posting, are reading.

[Xite91]

I only do ISO's after I'm convinced someone's scum.

Then they're even more pointless. Confirmation bias.

Your overwhelming amount of sarcasm makes it seem like you're just bitter or angry. It looks irrational and leads me to disregard large amounts of your posts due to the overall feeling that they are spiteful.

Also, quit asking me if I read things. I reread the thread twice (in it's entirety, not isolating any posts). I can read, you can read, let's all assume that people who are posting, are reading.

no, it's called making a case. That's what I was doing, it was nothing to convince me, it was to convince the rest of you.

I'm sorry? Try to just take them as they are and realize that I DO make some good points a lot of the time and I DO have a good signal-noise ratio, instead of just saying that I post too much noise.

Okay, then post like it. Things you ask have been answered. Things you say have been said, that was the only real point I was trying to make out of that.

[Prof. Guppy]

@xite, I did catch your case. But it seems to me that CKD only posted the same question umpteen times because nobody would answer it. Specifically, you dismissed his question as unimportant. The man just wanted a straight answer, and you refused to give him one. Withholding information is always anti-town. Then, you claimed his overreaction (which you caused) was a scumtell, and that we should lynch him for it. I say your manipulation of player's emotions is scummy, and we should lynch you for that.

My vote stays.

[Tazaro]

Pieman is a bit of a suspicious person who is slinking through the game without having a vote on someone.
Pieman, please vote.

Vote: Pieman

[StrangerCoug]

brianj is prodded.

[curiouskarmadog]

ok, got more time, 2nd game to update, typing as I am (re)reading…starting from page 9,
sorry if it turns into a wall of words.

I dont want to make a quote pyramid here, but I dont think there is anyway to address the "points"...actually I will bold my reponse and hope the tags dont get fucked up.

1) you mean this "case"? there isnt a case here?

2) so you want me to go back through each of my posts, to see what you are commenting on?....

3) I have answered some of the questions though..like i am not going to provide my reasoning for pursuing questions against fakegod/charlie...I have my reasoning, and I am noting that you are trying to role fish..you will have to kill me tonight, if you want to find out my role, and I have a feeling you are dying to.

4) if you want me to answer individual questions, please provide the actual quote with the question so everyone can see what you are quoting (and what I am answering) without having to go back to ISO me...I mean, if you really feel that strong about a point, you should have already done that. if there is a case here, it is half ass.

5) Also I request once you quote whatever it is your what me to answer...you also provide 2-3 points to sum up your case...again this shouldnt be an issue if you really want people to believe you think i am scum.

6) personally, i think you are trying to throw shit against the wall to see if it sticks, try harder scum bag.

1) Of course it isn't. Or you're too lazy to actually defend against yourself and therefore just want to discredit me.

Wait what? There is nothing to defend myself to..there is NO CASE!..you havent put anything forward.

2) I do that in pretty much all of my games. You're supposed to read the case next to your ISO, I mean, hey, I made it next to your ISO, can't you stop being lazy and do the same? Also, I made it easy on you and added the ISO numbers so that you DON'T have to go searching for each question.

My point is this, if you want other's to believe that you really think I am scum, you would have posted the actual quotes you think are scummy. this is my I dont believe you think i am really scum. who is going to go back and forth/back and forth to read quotes??? It is bullshit..I started to go back and reread what you were commenting on, but all you did was state opinion on an ISO read....it is not a case

3) Again, I did not know it was role-fishing until I asked, which you then called out as role-fishing, which frankly is bullshit. At this point, I would like to know what role-based info you got when this was a DAY start, that is why I told you to claim, because you lying through your teeth. And again, I saw your "breadcrumb" and if that's what you were IF I were scum, I would not kill you, ESPECIALLY if you claimed it because town would have no problem killing you if you didn't get NK'd. None of your "role-fishing" accusation makes sense, therefore CLAIM NOW. because I'm tired of playing this game with you.

When you asked someone something about thier role REPEATEDLY..it is fucking fole fishing. I will not be claiming, so dont try to bully me scum bag....LOL, you better kill me tonight Xite...

4) If you really plan to defend yourself, you can just go back and read yourself in ISO

this is a ridiculous statement...."your scummy, why? just read your ISO"

5) Same request again, read 4. Also, all my points are there and it's really a small case compared to what I normally do, and no one asks for a tl;dr version, especially not the person the case is against because guess what? They actually care to defend themselves.

ok, next quote, going to quote "4" to see what the case points are.

Also, I'd like to point out that the only times I've ever seen someone not care enough to defend themselves to a PbP (With exactly 1 exception, and they seriously did not give two shits about the game and were only there to mess with the other players... worse than a VI) is when they're scum and the points made against them were good ones.

Again, i take defend anything if there isnt a case.

6) I lol'd
Are you going to actually defend yourself yet? Or just try more to discredit me?

I went back to look at the “case”…there isn’t one…I mean really…what “4” are you talking about. I ask you to provide a couple bullet points to explain why I am scum, and you cant even do that….please put together a case…I obviously don’t see one, so just do it…2-3 (or more if you got it) points, add some quotes to go with it…why are you scared to do this?

It's what he does?

Unvote

Yeah, I said that, are you reading?
Explains why you didn't comment on my CKD case

fuck me in the eye, no one is commenting on your case because you havent put one the fuck out there.

First, that wasn't the only point to my case, and I've NEVER seen someone in a game (if you have then show me) repeat the same EXACT thing that many times in order to get an answer. Also, he said he had reasons. When I asked him, he accused me of role-fishing when he hinted nothing at a role before hand. This is a common scum trap.

Really? how many times have you asked me to defend a case that isnt there?

I do have my reasons, if I didnt state those reason it is probably role related...you keep asking anyway, and I keep saying you are rolefishing, at that point it is obviously role related..but you keep at it..I am not going to tell you, scum bag…

Just a few initial thoughts-

CKD-

I'm a trifle lost; I would appreciate you giving your reasons for your TOWN/TOWNIE/PRO-TOWN/OTHER question (quote another post of yours if you answered this already). Were you skeptical at the time?

I have my reasons, I was skeptical yes. I obviously have a PM that states something…when they said they could confirm each other as “town”, I wanted to know the exact wording…for example the sample PM said “townie”…which was different than “town”….however, the correct answer, is not any of the first three (again, have my reason)…they correctly answered the question “something the like, but not those”. If they would have said any of the first three…They would have gotten a vote from me…

XITE-

Oman... uh... breadcrumb or random noise?

What is the point of this question?

Because the scum bag keeps rolefishing.

----
Xite, just post the case...points and why you think they are scummy, backed by quotes. If the whole case is "you asked the same question over and over again"..that is not a case..I have my fucking reasons for doing so...I didnt feel they answered the question...when they finally did (or I finally realized they did from Charlie)...I backed off, because i got the answer I was looking for...

[brianj]

My mistake on that last post, I should have declared proper v/la. Either way I'll read through the thread now.

Okay, I really do not get Xite91's motivation behind CKD vote. To my understanding he voted for CKD because of he asked Charlie/FakeGod a simple question that could easily have been answered, and voted for PieMan twisting his words. I do see he brings up more points in his iso, but since he stated that he only iso player he are fully convinced of scumminess, I'll treat those two as his major arguments for the moment.

First, why the hell are you persisting on the opinion that CKD question was distraction attempt? He made valid reply when he stated the question wouldn't have been prolonged at all if the response was not delayed by those two. Moreover, the line of inquiry did not prevent people that had other things to say from saying their things anyway. I also fail to see how CKD's vote was different from the votes made by rest of the players.

Though I am still skeptical of PieMan some of his arguments might be attributed to poor literacy, and Xite91 is really raising my suspicion level so I am willing to put him on L-2.

UNVOTE

VOTE: Xite91

@Oman
If your opinion on me is based on little but gut feeling, I want to know what you specifically meant by "It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something" on the post you voted for me. Reading through the thread I can't really see anything that justifies this statement at all, especially after hearing your reasoning. It just looks like filler statement thrown to make your vote look better.

[Xite91]

7) fuck me in the eye, no one is commenting on your case because you havent put one the fuck out there.
Really? how many times have you asked me to defend a case that isnt there?

8) I do have my reasons, if I didnt state those reason it is probably role related...you keep asking anyway, and I keep saying you are rolefishing, at that point it is obviously role related..but you keep at it..I am not going to tell you, scum bag…

9) I have my reasons, I was skeptical yes. I obviously have a PM that states something…when they said they could confirm each other as “town”, I wanted to know the exact wording…for example the sample PM said “townie”…which was different than “town”….however, the correct answer, is not any of the first three (again, have my reason)…they correctly answered the question “something the like, but not those”. If they would have said any of the first three…They would have gotten a vote from me…

10) Because the scum bag keeps rolefishing.

----
11) Xite, just post the case...points and why you think they are scummy, backed by quotes. If the whole case is "you asked the same question over and over again"..that is not a case..I have my fucking reasons for doing so...I didnt feel they answered the question...when they finally did (or I finally realized they did from Charlie)...I backed off, because i got the answer I was looking for...

1) Yes I have, I've said multiple things against you and I have made valid points and I even did an ISO against you.

2) Go back and read any one of my games. ANY OF THEM and you will see at least 1 ISO case. Also, I would like to invite you to read the thread again, I rarely do ISO cases unless I truly believe someone is scum. And in any other game, they will DEFEND themselves to each and every point, that fact that you won't makes you the scum here, bub.

3) Yes, now it can be called role-fishing, but considering that you only called it role-fishing AFTER I asked, I am calling bull shit on it and I am asking you nicely to claim. And ya know what, get me lynched. When I flip town, you'll be claiming tomorrow.

4&5) No, you're scummy, here's why, read it WITH your ISO. It's not a hard task. I promise you.

Again there IS a case, and when I flip town, people will start to realize how smart I was and you will be lynched next. Is that a fair trade mr.scum?

6) Hmm... read the thread. I did already respond to that when SOMEONE ELSE asked for it, because with you, you're looking for differences so you can shrug them off and say that it's still not a case. I've seen it before, and guess who does it? If you guessed scum, you're right
And I'm not scared, it's just that any townie I've ever made a case on RESPONDED TO AND EVEN DISPROVED MY POINTS IN ISO. If you refuse to do this you are SCUM

7) Really? I haven't? Again, read and the answer will be shown to you.

8) Uhm... no. I have never heard of anyone ever saying "if I didn't state my reasons it's role-related" that's straight up stupid. If you don't want people asking, don't say it. Since you said it, I asked, that is NEVER role-fishing. Now again, this whole argument is bullshit because you're LYING.

9) holyfuckingshit a role pm that says something. Noooo it can't be.
Anyways, I thought your reasons were because of YOUR role-pm. How does me asking about your reasons that are based off the SAMPLE pm = role-fishing. Didn't I call bullshit? Oh wait, I was right.

10) It is now obvious I was not role-fishing when I asked you what I asked, try harder.

11) The ISO is the quotes, and the points are throughout the thread. again, READ. THE. THREAD.

[yabbaguy]

Pieman is a bit of a suspicious person who is slinking through the game without having a vote on someone.
Pieman, please vote.

Vote: Pieman

To be frank, I don't blame you, but at the same time, you're slinking through yourself.

The reason I don't blame him is that the pace of this game is maddening; the noise:content ratio is noise-skewed simply due to the fact that there are massive amounts of walls that just go quote-by-quote in an attempt to somehow pick people apart. Tasky is

REALLY

driving me crazy with

maddening

amounts of font style emphasis

that should not be present

ever

in any game of Mafia.

lol if I make text stand out,

PEOPLE WILL NOTICE IT!

(Point taken?)

I'm still waiting for Reckamonic to explain why they think Charlie/FG masonry claim is a lie, but they haven't had the chance to yet.

@Xite: -you still shouldn't be fishing at the breadcrumbs. Ignore if in doubt.
-How is "Not liking him so much yet. Not sure if it's the dumb blonde vibe I'm getting from him (sorry blondes) or if he's just plain scummy, but we'll see as we go along" not a potential VI policy vote? I mean, it's even fencesitting on which it is, and if so, why are you on the fence, yet voting? It makes no sense.
-Even if I can't call it a wagon, the above rationale for voting him isn't adequate as explained above. I also never said unvoting was scummy.

I don't see any reason to drag this Day out. I'm going to be ticked if anyone was voting without intent to end the Day.

Vote: Xite91

(L-1)

[Oman]

@Oman
If your opinion on me is based on little but gut feeling, I want to know what you specifically meant by "It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something" on the post you voted for me. Reading through the thread I can't really see anything that justifies this statement at all, especially after hearing your reasoning. It just looks like filler statement thrown to make your vote look better.

I do not remember and cannot find this post where i voted you. Can you point it out for me?

[Tasky]

I disagree with you on this point, and it seems like we won't resolve ourselves. By the way not agreeing with you doesn't mean it's craplogic.

ok. I really can't understand how you can still think that, but at the moment I am satisfied from you. we may continue our wall of text wall war another time, in case I change my mind on you. right now it's quite senseless.

@Xite:

STOP SAYING THAT YOU EXPOSED YOUR CASE ALREADY.

If you have, it was not clear enough. If you have, you should have no problem to state it again.

DO THAT

. Pick Quotes of CKD and write in a

systematic

,

clear

and

concise

way why he is scummy! after every point, add a

link

to your post where you already stated it. should you fail to do so in your next post

HAMMER HIM, GUYS.

@everyone else, don't hammer until he has the chance to post that god damn case (if it exists).

Tasky is

REALLY

driving me crazy with

maddening

amounts of font style emphasis

that should not be present

ever

in any game of Mafia.

lol if I make text stand out,

PEOPLE WILL NOTICE IT!

lol. do you know a better way to address specific points in a quote?

[brianj]

@Oman
If your opinion on me is based on little but gut feeling, I want to know what you specifically meant by "It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something" on the post you voted for me. Reading through the thread I can't really see anything that justifies this statement at all, especially after hearing your reasoning. It just looks like filler statement thrown to make your vote look better.

I do not remember and cannot find this post where i voted you. Can you point it out for me?

Clearly you wrote the quoted person wrong, the comment was from me not CKD which I suspect is source of your problem. Just in case:

I'm not sure where this Pieman wagon is coming from, but I haven't had a chance to go back and review him or the cases on him.

VOTE: brianj Nothing you have done is interesting me to the point that it takes away that early suspicion. I took the vote off due to the focus being elsewhere, but

your analysis is poor, and undisciplined. It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something.

Post #160.

[yabbaguy]

lol. do you know a better way to address specific points in a quote?

If your points are solid, you don't need big font sizes to get the point across.

Notice how that last sentence is supposed to resonate in your mind, and all without fancy fonts.

[Xite91]

@Xite: -you still shouldn't be fishing at the breadcrumbs. Ignore if in doubt.
-How is "Not liking him so much yet. Not sure if it's the dumb blonde vibe I'm getting from him (sorry blondes) or if he's just plain scummy, but we'll see as we go along" not a potential VI policy vote? I mean, it's even fencesitting on which it is, and if so, why are you on the fence, yet voting? It makes no sense.
-Even if I can't call it a wagon, the above rationale for voting him isn't adequate as explained above. I also never said unvoting was scummy.

I don't see any reason to drag this Day out. I'm going to be ticked if anyone was voting without intent to end the Day.

Vote: Xite91

(L-1)

- Uhm, sorry? that's part of how I play?
- Because if you look at it in context,

First, I'm going to have to read a few games from Charlie because he's playing completely different than what I'm used to from him. (Mass posts wtf???) I'll have to see what his town/scum/third party metas are before I say if it's scum or town oriented or anything at all.
Second, how am I apprehensive?
Third, Okay I'm pretty sure I know what's going on, and if that's it, I can almost guarantee they're both town. Hey Charlie do you have a qt with FG?
Last,

Unvote, Vote Pieman

Not liking him so much yet. Not sure if it's the dumb blonde vibe I'm getting from him (sorry blondes) or if he's just plain scummy, but we'll see as we go along

I was taking my vote off my no longer top suspect and moving it to the next scummiest player, but I was pointing out that it was a gut feeling, which is a perfectly valid reason to vote someone if it's the first and sometimes second or third vote (based on game size)
- So what makes me so scummy that you'll put me at L-1?

We haven't really even had a lot to today yet, why do you want it to end so fast?

@Xite:

STOP SAYING THAT YOU EXPOSED YOUR CASE ALREADY.

If you have, it was not clear enough. If you have, you should have no problem to state it again.

DO THAT

. Pick Quotes of CKD and write in a

systematic

,

clear

and

concise

way why he is scummy! after every point, add a

link

to your post where you already stated it. should you fail to do so in your next post

HAMMER HIM, GUYS.

@everyone else, don't hammer until he has the chance to post that god damn case (if it exists).

*Sigh*
Here, all of the times I made one or more points against CKD
Points against him are bolded for those who are obviously too lazy to read them and find out for themselves;

Hhey, ckd?
Quit repeating the same thing over and over again?

It's getting annoying and clogging the thread.

I'm to the point where I just want to lynch you so you'll shut up. The answer should be obvious by now.

I feel like you're trying to keep us on this topic to keep us from scumhunting.

your statement makes no since....

pie was the one you was attacking charlie for the "if and when"..I am attacking pie for his scummy manuver of the words.

and was that anywhere close to what I was asking fakegod and charlie?...what case did I push against them?

sorry I'm half asleep and sick, let me see if I can make sense of what I'm trying to say for you;
here, I'll just do an ISO case on you, k?

1) What did you think he was saying? Or is this just a way to look town?
4) 1 and 2 are the same question worded 2 different ways
6) starting a count of how many times you ask, so this is for all intents and purposes the 2nd time
7) 3
9) 4
10) 5
11) 6 - and you're encouraging tunneling
13) 7
14) guess what? I voted you. And I'm prolly gonna get you lynched. Can I bully you now?
15) not exactly 8, but still not dropping it
16) I'll consider this and 15 = to one, so 8
17) 9
18) actually, it was 9
19) So what were those reasons? You never told me what they were
20) 10
21) Then you just dropped it??? What the hell?
23) Wow, so you had to ask the question 10 times??
24) correctly?
25) In a way, he did show that he thought I was town, but he did give some uncertainty, this did not warrant more than this one post against it
26) There is not wagon, and I could say you're doing the same thing.
27) This whole post is scummy, for what should be those weird reasons that you can see scum writing it but don't know exactly where the scummy is.
28) Because you are twisting what he's saying quite a bit. Also, you're attacking the popular wagon for shit reasons. Therefore, you are scum, or at least very scummy.

29) Is that better for ya?

1) hey xite, quit role fishing...I have my reasons for asking what I asked.

2) once he(they) answered my question, I dropped it....I never once pushed a case against them (though I was about ready to I think, I felt they were dodging me)

3) also, Please please please, provide to me the quote where I twisted ANYTHING?!?! What I find really "funny" is you are voting me for twisting words (when i did the exact opposite) and avoiding the Pie wagon (when he ACTUALLY DID TWIST WORDS).

4) I say if Pie flips scum, his buddy is Xite.

....

5) actually the more I think (and reread this is preview)...you are probably scum either way....

you are going out of your way to avoid (and make sure everyone knows you are avoiding) the pie wagon.

You are voting for reasoning that does not make sense.

You are actually down right misrepresenting me or just simply lying

.

You attack me while I was trying to scum hunting (when I was questioning charilie and fakegod)

....

AND you are role fishing.

unvote, vote Xite

6) I will still vote Pie if needed...but I think pressure should be applied here.

1) You said you had reasons, never said it was role-based, therefore it was not role-fishing. Nice misrep.
2) Yeah, you said you had reasons, but never acted upon them, even though you thought they were lying (though you never said why). Also, you said they answered "correctly" which just doesn't seem like a good sentence. So unless your role is that you get to read a pm of anyone else whenever you want or something like that, I would like these reasons, regardless if it's role-based or not, because you calling it role-fishing is just a way to put the attention on me, when I can almost guarantee that there's not a hint of role-based information in it.
Oh yeah, and I saw your "breadcrumb" so, if that's what you're going to claim, then there's STILL no reason for you to have asked that many times.
3) You were twisting pieman's words, I gave you the ISO number didn't I? Read it and you'll see.
4) Setting up lynches already?
5) bolded. I started the piewagon IIRC. And when I made my vote, it was to see who jumped on. And guess what? You took the bait.
Underlined. How does it not make sense?
@Everyone else - Does the case make sense to you?
Italicized. Am I? Where and how?
bolded2. How was that scumhunting? You didn't give us any information on why you did it or anything like that, and then you dropped it. You were posting to dilute the thread and that was all.
underlined2. Still lol'ing at this one. So hard. Can't be role-fishing if I don't know that your "reasoning" (if you actually have any) is role-based.
6) Ahhh, the classic fence-sitting trick. Please, please everyone see the scum in this guy? It's so disturbingly obvious I want to shield my eyes

1) you mean this "case"? there isnt a case here?

2) so you want me to go back through each of my posts, to see what you are commenting on?....

3) I have answered some of the questions though..like i am not going to provide my reasoning for pursuing questions against fakegod/charlie...I have my reasoning, and I am noting that you are trying to role fish..you will have to kill me tonight, if you want to find out my role, and I have a feeling you are dying to.

4) if you want me to answer individual questions, please provide the actual quote with the question so everyone can see what you are quoting (and what I am answering) without having to go back to ISO me...I mean, if you really feel that strong about a point, you should have already done that. if there is a case here, it is half ass.

5) Also I request once you quote whatever it is your what me to answer...you also provide 2-3 points to sum up your case...again this shouldnt be an issue if you really want people to believe you think i am scum.

6) personally, i think you are trying to throw shit against the wall to see if it sticks, try harder scum bag.

1) Of course it isn't. Or you're too lazy to actually defend against yourself and therefore just want to discredit me.
2) I do that in pretty much all of my games. You're supposed to read the case next to your ISO, I mean, hey, I made it next to your ISO, can't you stop being lazy and do the same? Also, I made it easy on you and added the ISO numbers so that you DON'T have to go searching for each question.
3) Again, I did not know it was role-fishing until I asked, which you then called out as role-fishing, which frankly is bullshit. At this point, I would like to know what role-based info you got when this was a DAY start, that is why I told you to claim, because you lying through your teeth. And again, I saw your "breadcrumb" and if that's what you were IF I were scum, I would not kill you, ESPECIALLY if you claimed it because town would have no problem killing you if you didn't get NK'd. None of your "role-fishing" accusation makes sense, therefore CLAIM NOW. because I'm tired of playing this game with you.
4) If you really plan to defend yourself, you can just go back and read yourself in ISO
5) Same request again, read 4. Also, all my points are there and it's really a small case compared to what I normally do, and no one asks for a tl;dr version, especially not the person the case is against because guess what? They actually care to defend themselves.
Also, I'd like to point out that the only times I've ever seen someone not care enough to defend themselves to a PbP (With exactly 1 exception, and they seriously did not give two shits about the game and were only there to mess with the other players... worse than a VI) is when they're scum and the points made against them were good ones.
6) I lol'd
Are you going to actually defend yourself yet? Or just try more to discredit me?

@Xite:
you are totally misrepresenting CKD... you say he did that question hammering thing in order to delay scumhunting, which obviously isn't true. look back, it's clear that he hadn't got an answer, it was his right to pretend one.
I don't know what he is going to do with that answer, maybe he IS scum, but then he is for other reasons (haven't seen anything major so far).
what you are doing is just creating stuff out of nothing to attack him, not good.

I voted Xite:

UNVOTE: VOTE: Xite91

Actually, no you didn't. Prove me wrong. Link it.

huh.

..

First, that wasn't the only point to my case, and I've NEVER seen someone in a game (if you have then show me) repeat the same EXACT thing that many times in order to get an answer. Also, he said he had reasons. When I asked him, he accused me of role-fishing when he hinted nothing at a role before hand. This is a common scum trap.

faillink. But okay, I missed it. It was hiding I deeply apologize.

why do I feel like that theory box is a blatant lie?

explain what you think is a lie there.
how can a theory thing be a lie? I could be wrong with my opinion, but how am I supposed to lie?

I meant the fact that you think that is a lie, because you never asked me to find your reasons or in the other case I saw you do this, you never asked them either IIRC. Why only him? That kind of disproves that you do it because of a theory.

Oh wow, I have four votes...

hey xite, quit role fishing...I have my reasons for asking what I asked.

once he(they) answered my question, I dropped it....I never once pushed a case against them (though I was about ready to I think, I felt they were dodging me)

also, Please please please, provide to me the quote where I twisted ANYTHING?!?! What I find really "funny" is you are voting me for twisting words (when i did the exact opposite) and avoiding the Pie wagon (when he ACTUALLY DID TWIST WORDS).

I say if Pie flips scum, his buddy is Xite.

....

actually the more I think (and reread this is preview)...you are probably scum either way....you are going out of your way to avoid (and make sure everyone knows you are avoiding) the pie wagon. You are voting for reasoning that does not make sense. You are actually down right misrepresenting me or just simply lying. You attack me while I was trying to scum hunting (when I was questioning charilie and fakegod)....AND you are role fishing.

unvote, vote Xite

I will still vote Pie if needed...but I think pressure should be applied here.

an OMGUS vote

I agree with Taz. Making the town play guessing games is anti-town. However, defending someone else's scummy actions the way Xite did is equally as scummy. I don't have a lot of data on Tasky at this point, so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Xite91

A bad sheep vote

Oddly enough, he was the second on the pieman wagon, too

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Tasky

Wont even state why hes voting.

yes, that's true. so what? why exactly is that scummy?

Let's look at the Pieman bandwagon. Well, there's two good customers on it: Curiouskarmadog reads as town. Reckamonic reads as town. The guy called Pieman is being defended too much by Xite in post 172 (you're next on the lynch list as far as I'm concerned, Xite), and Pieman was weaksauce attacking Charlie for the when and if thing.

Vote: Pieman

would you mind rephrase this post? I honestly didn't really understand your point here.

I didn't see them as legit because it looked like nitpicking (as did pieman's) but CKD seems to be trying REAL hard to derail the scumhunting process based on his ISO

now this is serious bullshit. you think CKD's intention was derailing scumhunting with his question-thing on Charlie/FG. you can't really believe that?
I don't know whether CKD really had anything there or if he just wanted to get town cred, or what else. but his point is completely legitimate until proven otherwise. he obviously had some inside information and the wording of the claim didn't match it, so he asked for a clarification?
I really think you are misrepresenting people here.
UNVOTE: VOTE: Xite91

a blatant wagoner's vote... but actually looking at it, I will take back that his vote on me was a blatant wagon, I forgot he made a point against me... Super buddying up to CKD, how do you know? I didn't find it obvious. This vote is a buddying vote more than anything else

why do I feel like that theory box is a blatant lie?

Theory box is obv credible.

Vote: Xite

And a neurotic player vote (no offense taz, that part is a joke)
that has to do with me questioning a tactic that a player believes in but doesn't use every time he blatant wagons (his vote on me wasn't a blatant wagon, as stated above, but this isn't the first time I've seen it, like I said, here are games he's done it that are completed, this one he asked and said it was a new technique, but read the last url, he didn't here, and he didn't ask why here. this one is the most important to make my point though.)
There's my defense of asking tasky what was going on, also, he didn't correct me to say that his vote on me wasn't a blatant wagon...

Sorry guys, been sort of V/La, getting back on track

Okay, I just read through all of Xite's posts, and his actions overall seem to be pro-town. He's asking plenty of questions, and calling people out on things that are scummy. BUT...there is the bit about CKD. I don't believe asking a question is scummy. Dismissing a question as unimportant or as blatantly obvious is not helpful. The answer clearly wasn't obvious to him, that's why he asked. The pro-town thing to do in this situation would be to ANSWER THE QUESTION! So what I want to know is...

What is it about CKD that you find so damn scummy, Xite?

Answer satisfactorily, and I might change my vote. Fail to answer, and you are obvscum.

Wait, if you read all of my posts, how did you miss my case on him?
First, he has been diluting the thread (For chrissake, he posted that same question how many times? And he even admitted to just copying and pasting his question.
He snapped like crazy because his little question wasn't being answered
And then he diluted the thread and when I made a case against him, he called it not a case and barely addressed it (something I find scum do more than townies)
And lets not forget, oh you asked me about the reasons I hinted at ROLEFISHING!!!

1) My biggest problems are that he said "Mason-like". There was no mention of confirming two players, which would have been the first thing out of my mouth as a town player making the call to softclaim. I also hate the "useless" thing.

2) Xite91 Lots of noise. The amount of posting doesn't correspond with the amount of information. Asking me if I was breadcrumbing is a stupid question, and definitely not a town one.

3) Xite has this habit of saying "I GET WHAT YOUR BREADCRUMB/VAGUE POST WAS SAYING!" I don't think it's helpful, it's definitely not a good idea. It adds nothing and it feels like buddying.

4) Made rolefishing #112.

5) #161 is a horrible post. "AtE Noted" when did respect get kicked out of this game? I posted that I didn't get the CKD vote, and I still mean it.

6) #178: Worst version of one of the worst ways to read someone ever. Full of emotion, was never going to show anything.

CKD says it best

you mean this "case"? there isnt a case here?

[/list]

7) Questions: Charlie: Did you two know who each other were, or have a way of identifying each other, either a callsign or something that needed to be posted in the thread?

1) If you read the thread (hey, part of it is even my posts... what was that about taking things out of context?)
2) Where's this "lot of noise?" Point out my posts that don't have any information in them.
3)

The CKD one was because his breadcrumb is bullshit if he's saying that me asking him what his reasons were was rolefishing.

4) It may have been role-fishing, true, but it was because that was the only way I felt that they were both town. Also, that post shows why it's mason-like. Funny how you're not really looking at the big picture.
5) Here's the post that I said "AtE noted."

Hhey, ckd?
Quit repeating the same thing over and over again?
It's getting annoying and clogging the thread. I'm to the point where I just want to lynch you so you'll shut up. The answer should be obvious by now.
I feel like you're trying to keep us on this topic to keep us from scumhunting.

noted, then do it, or back off, you cant bully me.

Kind of reminds you of "sticks and stones can break my bones..." doesn't it? It looks like he's using emotion in his favor which is... AtE? Oh yeah!
Also, what do you mean respect being kicked out? Where was I disrespectful?

6) Where's the emotion? Oh, you mean my playstyle? Honestly, it's more sarcasm than emotion. Unless you have something else you meant.
7) It's funny that you read my posts, pointed out the "role-fishing" but failed to realize anything after it. Wait, did you ISO me?

Is it okay if I skim textwalls?

I'd prefer you didn't, but you're going to do what you want anyways aren't you?

8) The post is very defensive, and very cold. Xite and CKD were very emotive towards each other, then all of a sudden Xite just goes cold and says "Appeal to Emotion is noted" which is in itself a bad idea. Appeal to emotion is one of my least favourite fallacies because people use it horribly. An appeal to emotion isn't just an emotive post, it's when the emotion within that post is calculated to present the best possible outcome for that player.

9) Isolation reads are the worst way to try to determine someone's alignment, because it lacks context even more so than any other kind of read. All you get are their posts, and some memory. If you use facebook, it's like reading back through one person's individual stream of status updates. It floods you, and it clouds the vision. And Xite's is terrible because it doesn't read or analyse anything. It's just bitter.

8) I didn't go cold, and again, that wasn't so much emotion as sarcasm. The AtE annoyed the shit out of me because he was acting very much like a 3 year old who was being picked on by the big kids.

9) I only do ISO's after I'm convinced someone's scum. Also, most of the time (unless I remember what was going on at that point) I will go through and read a couple of posts above each of their ISO posts. (they have this nifty jump to post option...) It doesn't what? Really? Did you actually read the post? There were definitely points there. Would you like me to go through and make them easier to understand or something? Cuz I can.

7) fuck me in the eye, no one is commenting on your case because you havent put one the fuck out there.
Really? how many times have you asked me to defend a case that isnt there?

8) I do have my reasons, if I didnt state those reason it is probably role related...you keep asking anyway, and I keep saying you are rolefishing, at that point it is obviously role related..but you keep at it..I am not going to tell you, scum bag…

9) I have my reasons, I was skeptical yes. I obviously have a PM that states something…when they said they could confirm each other as “town”, I wanted to know the exact wording…for example the sample PM said “townie”…which was different than “town”….however, the correct answer, is not any of the first three (again, have my reason)…they correctly answered the question “something the like, but not those”. If they would have said any of the first three…They would have gotten a vote from me…

10) Because the scum bag keeps rolefishing.

----
11) Xite, just post the case...points and why you think they are scummy, backed by quotes. If the whole case is "you asked the same question over and over again"..that is not a case..I have my fucking reasons for doing so...I didnt feel they answered the question...when they finally did (or I finally realized they did from Charlie)...I backed off, because i got the answer I was looking for...

1) Yes I have, I've said multiple things against you and I have made valid points and I even did an ISO against you.

2) Go back and read any one of my games. ANY OF THEM and you will see at least 1 ISO case. Also, I would like to invite you to read the thread again, I rarely do ISO cases unless I truly believe someone is scum. And in any other game, they will DEFEND themselves to each and every point, that fact that you won't makes you the scum here, bub.

3) Yes, now it can be called role-fishing, but considering that you only called it role-fishing AFTER I asked, I am calling bull shit on it and I am asking you nicely to claim. And ya know what, get me lynched. When I flip town, you'll be claiming tomorrow.

4&5) No, you're scummy, here's why, read it WITH your ISO. It's not a hard task. I promise you.

Again there IS a case, and when I flip town, people will start to realize how smart I was and you will be lynched next. Is that a fair trade mr.scum?

6) Hmm... read the thread. I did already respond to that when SOMEONE ELSE asked for it, because with you, you're looking for differences so you can shrug them off and say that it's still not a case. I've seen it before, and guess who does it? If you guessed scum, you're right
And I'm not scared, it's just that any townie I've ever made a case on RESPONDED TO AND EVEN DISPROVED MY POINTS IN ISO. If you refuse to do this you are SCUM

7) Really? I haven't? Again, read and the answer will be shown to you.

8) Uhm... no. I have never heard of anyone ever saying "if I didn't state my reasons it's role-related" that's straight up stupid. If you don't want people asking, don't say it. Since you said it, I asked, that is NEVER role-fishing. Now again, this whole argument is bullshit because you're LYING.

9) holyfuckingshit a role pm that says something. Noooo it can't be.
Anyways, I thought your reasons were because of YOUR role-pm. How does me asking about your reasons that are based off the SAMPLE pm = role-fishing. Didn't I call bullshit? Oh wait, I was right.

10) It is now obvious I was not role-fishing when I asked you what I asked, try harder.

11) The ISO is the quotes, and the points are throughout the thread. again, READ. THE. THREAD.

But you probably will still keep saying that I'm scum because I'm actually scumhunting, which is more than I can say for quite a few of you. I'm getting tired of games where people don't read the game so you know what? Lynch me. And I suggest that when I flip town, you look at CKD, Prof. Guppy, and yabbaguy, you'll find all the scum in that group (2 if there's only 2 and 3 if there's 3)

[Xite91]

lol. do you know a better way to address specific points in a quote?

If your points are solid, you don't need big font sizes to get the point across.

Notice how that last sentence is supposed to resonate in your mind, and all without fancy fonts.

This is only true if people are reading

[PieMan]

@CKD Is it possible for you to address how you know them to be town based on the answering of the role not saying town, but something similar? Like what does yours say, or why would it say something different, just something to explain why you would hammer at that for that long. Yes, I know based on the wording of your role, somethign that explains it, but my role says townie, so there should be some way you can explain this.

@xite if CKD can answer the above question in such a way that makes sense I would say your original reasons for voting him, are wrong, not scummy, but wrong.

[Xite91]

@xite if CKD can answer the above question in such a way that makes sense I would say your original reasons for voting him, are wrong, not scummy, but wrong.

Considering how many times he asked, and the other points to why I think he's scum, I don't believe that just the answer to that question makes him town.

[Oman]

lol. do you know a better way to address specific points in a quote?

If your points are solid, you don't need big font sizes to get the point across.

Notice how that last sentence is supposed to resonate in your mind, and all without fancy fonts.

This is only true if people are reading

I read that, and I already told you it was horribly offensive to assume that because people don't agree with you, that they're just not reading.

[Xite91]

lol. do you know a better way to address specific points in a quote?

If your points are solid, you don't need big font sizes to get the point across.

Notice how that last sentence is supposed to resonate in your mind, and all without fancy fonts.

This is only true if people are reading

I read that, and I already told you it was horribly offensive to assume that because people don't agree with you, that they're just not reading.

No, I'm assuming that because people ask me questions I already answered repeatedly, they aren't reading.

[Charlie]

Look, people, I think Xite91 is not the best lynch today. It should be one of those three jokers. Having said that I think it is time for me to unvote.

UNVOTE: brianj

[Oman]

Clearly you wrote the quoted person wrong, the comment was from me not CKD which I suspect is source of your problem. Just in case:

I'm not sure where this Pieman wagon is coming from, but I haven't had a chance to go back and review him or the cases on him.

VOTE: brianj Nothing you have done is interesting me to the point that it takes away that early suspicion. I took the vote off due to the focus being elsewhere, but

your analysis is poor, and undisciplined. It feels like you're trying to throw smoke out to cover something.

Post #160.

Sorry dude, that was the source. As I said "it feels" I take a lot of my early wagons from a gut feeling rather than specifics because I honestly feel that early reasoning is even worse than early gut.

A lot of your posts were "don't know what to think about..." or about "arbitrary alignments". Those early posts were about how you didn't know or weren't sure. It kind of threw out that you didn't want to put your own opinions out.

[Tazaro]

Xite's #291. Holy sh*t.