Mini 1040 - Everyone's A Critic! [Game Over]

[Stef]

I agree with DP that RC's posting lately has greatly improved. I see no reason for my vote to stay where it is at the moment.

Unvote

I was pretty convinced jack is town and I still believe it but I may just be biased by my last game with him where he was town and played with a similar attitude. His meta gives me a pretty annoying blank on the scum-read which is coming as very similar to what I've seen him play as town. His play this game, however, despite my town read on him, has been rather anti-town. I haven't been pushing it because I still expect him to explain more closer towards the deadline but his self-vote which he still keeps, the constant lack of explaining, the lack of self-offered information... it's just unsettling.

So again – why bring up a theoretical point?

Mykonian was arguing balancing theory based on insufficient knowledge regarding the game setup. I was trying to explain that mod wifom is useless and it should never constitute the basis for a strategy. I honestly can't find the discussion regarding the imbalance of 12p minis considering the discussion was taking place at least a year ago as far as I remember and it's probably dug deep somewhere through the archives. However, it is now being attempted to introduce an additional player to minis and make them 13p instead of 12p to fix the said balancing issue in this topic.

Regarding the OMGUS, what is the difference between voting in RVS (no value for vote) and then keeping it for OMGUS reasons and voting for OMGUS reasons? I actually want to get to a conclusion on this because it's beginning to be frustrating.

This is it for now. If I missed questions please let me know.

Vote imaginality

You have offered close to no content. It's time you do so.

[mykonian]

fun david. I sure hope it isn't disappointing (wouldn't be too good for your ingame health) but with almost 2 pages of post from me, you shouldn't have any trouble.

But do me a favor, and when you present a tell, reason why it makes me scum (as in, "scum would do this, because ..."). It makes both our lives easier, and means that we can done with this earlier (or you are right and we lynch me, or your wrong and it shows much earlier)

[XScorpion]

The fact he would come out and say the setup has 2 scum is a peculiar thing to say, something that a scum wouldn't want to inform the town on.

Unless there are actually 3 scum, in which case he is simply misleading town.

[DavidParker]

Well yes, it's just a peculiar, attention-grabbing thing to say that doesn't strike me as something scum would do on page 1 with their first post.

Yes, it's WIFOM'y, but that's just how I see it. And I don't know anything of Jack's meta like you guys.

Also, mykonos, i'm anti-wall posts so don't expect a huge analysis on you.

[DavidParker]

Actually, my reason for voting you from earlier on in the day phase has been made moot by something I realized.

I'm going to do a '180 and OMGUS the socks off of Magna.

MagnaOfIllusion

For going after an "easy" target (me), and 10 pages in having his vote on someone (me) who hasn't even noticed it's been on him til now because of my absence from the game. To me that strikes as scummy behaviour wanting to use your vote somewhere you won't be called out for and you won't get caught on a bandwagon either. Your vote being on me has basically been as good as not voting.

And I'd like to reassert my sureness that Jack is, indeed, town!

[mykonian]

David, I agree fully. Just that you should have enough material to come up with something. The smaller it is, the clearer your point will be.

Pre-view edit: you disappoint me.

[DavidParker]

You're out of my black-book for now.

[DavidParker]

That was

Vote: magnaofillusion

Btw.

[danakillsu]

Maybe it doesn't suit you. Maybe it's just me. If I had to guess though, this is not you as a townie.

So....gut.

It would be nice to know what brought it on, you know, so it doesn't just stick out like a sore thumb. "RC, you are still scum. btw, jack is town" is basically what you said. Why? You've said nothing about Jack all game, have you? And what difference does it make if other people have called Jack town? What have they got to do with you? I'm not coming at you because you called Jack town; I'm coming at you because it's not good enough to say, "I agree with XScorp's post and Jack is town l8r". If you're just going to piggyback on everyone else's opinions, then why don't we just lynch you and keep them around?

I have played with Jack before when he was town. He posts in a manner very similar to this. He always acts like he has some master plan for catching scum and kind of...I don't know...aggressively lurks?? through the game.

HC? But what difference does HC's vote make if he's asking about you? I don't understand what you're saying here, this sounds like you're just talking around the issue.

I gave my opinion on what he wanted, if you didn't notice. So I wasn't just saying "that's not important" and moving on. But I added that it wasn't very important to him anymore judging by his vote. So there's absolutely no problem with what I did there.

So you still have nothing but gut on me.

[danakillsu]

David disappoints me as well, but seems quite town.
@ David and Stef
What more does it take to convince you that RC is scum? How is his latest post better than the earlier ones? It looks to me like a couple diversions and some gut feelings.

[mykonian]

unvote vote dana

for the case I mentioned earlier.

[danakillsu]

For post 208???
I answered that!
Why are you voting NOW for that, anyway?

[Jack]

fun david. I sure hope it isn't disappointing (wouldn't be too good for your ingame health) but with almost 2 pages of post from me, you shouldn't have any trouble.

But do me a favor, and when you present a tell, reason why it makes me scum (as in, "scum would do this, because ..."). It makes both our lives easier, and means that we can done with this earlier (or you are right and we lynch me, or your wrong and it shows much earlier)

Townies should never argue with their scum suspects about why they are scum. Scum hunting is very "sensitive" for lack of a better word, very touch-feely, people don't even agree on the basic tells, let alone the application of them. Any scum who puts in the effort will avoid committing an "obvious" tell on day 1. Good cases often come down to "here he knew so and so was town, but wanted to stay on the wagon" where "knew" and "wanted" are intuited from the post of the scum. Making cases is about sharing with other townies, scum don't get to play.

In other news, I have town reads on 5 (maybe 6) players and scum reads on 3. Feeling very good about 2 of the scum. Still 2 or 3 people I'm unsure about though.

[mykonian]

@Dana: because I want to?

@Jack. If I;m town and David is, I'd rather have David make a very good case about me, which I can then defend in one post and then let people decide if they lynch me or not. If I;m town, my defense should be easy enough, and then we can continue again with the real scum as a target.

[mykonian]

and (5 or 6)+3+(3 or 2) = 9

you didn't count yourself, so there are 11 people you could get a read on. I'm missing 2 players.

[Jack]

@Jack. If I;m town and David is, I'd rather have David make a very good case about me, which I can then defend in one post and then let people decide if they lynch me or not. If I;m town, my defense should be easy enough, and then we can continue again with the real scum as a target.

What game do you play where arguing (as town) with someone who thinks you are scum easily convinces them? Often they just tunnel. Scum don't mind because all they want to do is trash the argument so that no one else follows it. He had already dropped it so I'm making a broader point. On the whole it's much more likely to be scum friendly.

(5 or 6)+3+(3 or 2) = 9

What is this

6+3+2 = 11
5+3+3 = 11

[Jack]

When I feel I have a good enough lock on the third scum I will post my reads, and choose a town seeming player (if there is one interested) to debate them with. If anyone disagrees with this strategy they can explain why the conclusions about attitude polarization that the researchers came up with are incorrect :smug:

[mykonian]

@Jack. If I;m town and David is, I'd rather have David make a very good case about me, which I can then defend in one post and then let people decide if they lynch me or not. If I;m town, my defense should be easy enough, and then we can continue again with the real scum as a target.

What game do you play where arguing (as town) with someone who thinks you are scum easily convinces them? Often they just tunnel. Scum don't mind because all they want to do is trash the argument so that no one else follows it. He had already dropped it so I'm making a broader point. On the whole it's much more likely to be scum friendly.

Now he dropped it (:P) it is mostly me friendly. The easier the opponent makes it to defend against his case, the easier my defence becomes, and the sooner I'm done with it.

Jack, since discussion is grinding to a halt, I wouldn't mind if you restarted it. Waiting won't achieve a lot, I think.

[kunkstar7]

:: VoteCount 1x7 ::

Antihero (0) -
MagnaofIllusion (1) -

DavidParker

RedCoyote (1) -

danakillsu

danakillsu (2) -

RedCoyote, mykonian

Jack (2) -

Jack, Xscorpion

Haschel Cedricson (1) -

imaginality

jelly jiggler (0) -

XScorpion (0) -

Stef (2) -

Haschel Cedricson, Antihero

imaginality (1) -

Stef

mykonian (0) -

DavidParker (1) -

MagnaOfIllusion

Not Voting (1) -

LynchMePls

With 12 Alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

September 19, 2010 5:00PM EST.

LynchMePls replaces jelly jiggler effective as of this post.

Imaginality has been prodded.

[LimMePls]

Hello. I read the game this morning after I sent the PM to the mod asking if I could take the replacement slot, so I'm already caught up. I'd like to do two things:

Claim: Miller

No idea why jelly didn't claim this, perhaps he doesn't know that it is generally considered correct to claim miller D1. And my second thing:

Vote: Stef

Primarily for his disagreement with mykonian about the setup (read like he had inside information) plus the interactions with XScorpion (the weak fos that wasn't even bolded or explained, followed by the OMGUS vote and later claiming the XS was the one who OMGUS'ed).

[mykonian]

one reason I can think of why you wouldn't claim miller in a game where you know there is a vig would be because you generally won't make it to day 3. Vigs have a tendency to shoot millers.

anyway, nice protown move. Gives away that scum also have to worry about a cop (or are already worrying about a cop), and that the cop won;t have to investigate you now. Even if you fakeclaimed, he would get a "guilty".

[Haschel Cedricson]

one reason I can think of why you wouldn't claim miller in a game where you know there is a vig would be because you generally won't make it to day 3. Vigs have a tendency to shoot millers.

anyway, nice protown move. Gives away that scum also have to worry about a cop (or are already worrying about a cop), and that the cop won;t have to investigate you now. Even if you fakeclaimed, he would get a "guilty".

This post feels rather expositiony.

dana, on the other hand, couldn't be playing it more safe (or "relaxed" as he puts it; I'll get to that later in this post). Completely shut off to the rest of the game. Check out the exchange he had with HC. They go on and on about how he said you had good logic but seemed scummy. HC, over multiple posts, tries to get dana to open up, and, boy, dana does everything in his power to effectively shutdown HC's interrogations. They look to have eventually settled on a poor choice of words, but that may just be because HC has been away from the game for a bit.

This post, on the other hand, feels great and everybody should read it.

Vote imaginality

You have offered close to no content. It's time you do so.

Why are you voting for imaginality?

Second question for you, Stef.* I am the vigilante.** I am probably going to kill dana tonight, but I'm wavering.** Convince me to either pull the trigger or spare Dana's life.

*It's actually more of a hypothetical scenario than a question, but the gist of it is the same.
**Statement may or may not actually be true.

[mykonian]

sorry haschel, can't find that word. What are you trying to say?

[Haschel Cedricson]

sorry haschel, can't find that word. What are you trying to say?

I guess I mean what you said should be so obvious to everybody playing the game that the act of actually saying it almost feels like you're providing exposition to an outside reader who is unfamiliar with Mafia.

There's probably a better way to phrase that.

[imaginality]

Argh. Sorry all. Prod received; I'll be fully caught-up within 24 hours.