Open 242 - Friends and Enemies Mafia (Over!)

[CSL]

Mod: Confirmed date of return is Friday.

[zwetschenwasser]

If no one counter claims, which for scum would be pretty stupid, so I don't expect it, we're confirmed town. I was hoping to wait to claim until later. Zwet, unvote or you will almost certainly be lynched.

and he confirms himself as scum.

[Haylen]

Vote Zwetschenwasser

How on earth is that a scum confirmation?

[Haylen]

Vote Zwetschenwasser

[gandalf5166]

Yeah, zwet is just plain stupid. He's trying to push a case on confirmed town. Epic fail.

[Socrates]

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT:

Zwet (4) - JordanA24, gandalf, Super Smash Bros. Fan, Haylen
Gandalf (1) - CSL
DarkLightA (1) - zwet
Smashbro_of_the_SSS (1) - Jahudo

Not Voting: DarkLightA, molestargazer, Battle Mage, Smashbro_of_the_SSS

With 11 alive it is 6 to lynch.

CSL is V/LA until friday

JordanA24 has not posted since saturday and will be prodded.

[Socrates]

Also, I forgot to include the countdown timer I promised at the beginning of the day. Here: countdown

[Battle Mage]

Why We Are Not Lynching Zwetschenwasser Today

No please no more poems.

Unvote; Vote; BM

L-2 speedlynch!

Openly states he is performing an action that is frowned upon. Welcomes suspicion. And as is characteristic of Zwet-town, he wants to just lynch lynch lynch. This is a small town-tell.

Oi!

Unvote

BM is playing his normal town meta.

At this point i was at -1 still, precariously near a lynch, and fairly likely to die. However, Zwet exercises his judgement and meta of me, and wow, would you believe it, SCUMHUNTS, and backs off an easy mislynch. I don't see that from Zwet-scum, do you?? This is a

large

town-tell.

I find that scum use the "confused" gimmick to backpedal after recognizing a mistake.

Zwet attempting to scumhunt. Town-tell.

yay Jordan and Darklight don't know my meta. In other news, I was not joking with gandalf, and what makes me not a hypocrite is the fact that he was only behaving the way I do to draw attention away from the good cases that were being presented against him.

The interesting thing here is that Zwet isn't simply hiding behind his meta like he could. By Zwet's standards, this is a pretty good level of effort and contribution. I think Zwet-scum wouldnt bother pretending to scumhunt.

the two most scummy people in the game claim masons. What's wrong with this picture?

Confirm Vote: DarkLightA

This is not a scumtell for Zwet. It's basically the scum's wet-dream.

That rules out 3 candidates for today. So who's next?

BM

[Haylen]

BM...I don't think you quite get it...he's VOTING for CONFIRMED TOWN and saying that they're confirmed scum.

[Battle Mage]

BM...I don't think you quite get it...he's VOTING for CONFIRMED TOWN and saying that they're confirmed scum.

You're being ridiculous. This is Zwet. Trust me, i'm pretty confident he's town. Nobody's saying he's a genius. And besides, the claimed masons are not 100% confirmed town. lol

BM

[Jahudo]

I agree with BM on this one. I don't really have a zwet scum game in mind, but this attitude feels like playstyle he wants to have as town or fakes as scum. And I have a slight town read on him because I've seen him make a few decisions that don't look like the best scum strategy, or that there were other ones available. EX: he doesn't backtrack or take a wait and see stance when all logic is against him with the mason claim.

My one concern is that he defended himself using meta, which looks like a cheap shot. So he's only a slight town read now.

[gandalf5166]

PLEASE STOP REFERENCING ZWET'S META UNTIL YOU GIVE ME SOME ZWET SCUM-META. Just had to get that out of my system. And I don't care how fucking stupid he is, he's voting for confirmed town. That's scummy under any circumstances. Not to mention, he's not only leaving his vote there, he is actually trying to push a lynch.

[smashbro_of_the_SSS]

SSSS
what was scummy about Gandalf being a follower? You only said that it was, not why.

I'm seeing the point on Gandalf being a follower, including his last post, so I'm thinking that he is scummy at the moment.

This next quote is a very empty statement. It basically sounds like you want people to know you are reading the game, which should be a given.

There are a few other's I'm watching, but nothing enough to note at the moment.

Maybe you want to look like you are trying.

gandalf has done little in this game aside from the random comment or two, which usually isn't a firm stance on anything.

Pot calling the kettle black. How do you rationalize this for yourself?

I honestly can't disagree with your view of me calling out someone for what I did. I know I haven't posted much, and am trying to rectify that. What I saw scummy was the fact that Gandalf would vote for people who always had wagons on them, and I saw that as scummy.

I can see that Zwet might not believe the claim, but I don't know how. i mean, most people have posted now, so a counterclaim doesn't look like it's going to happen. Why are you still voting darklight Zwet, without a counterclaim? I'll be happy to vote for him, but at the moment, I'd rather not put him at L-1 range. I'd like to hear what he has to say.

[molestargazer]

why did you think gandalf’s agreement posts were scummy? People had already recognized him as a follower. Did you consider his motivation to do this as scum? Because you didn’t explain it like you did for the other tells in your case, and I don’t know why.

I would have thought that was obvious. It's not doing any scumhunting himself, and just tagging along to what other people said to try and look pro-town.

Just because people had already recognised it doesn't mean I can't bring it up when I read him over.

[Battle Mage]

i find it hilarious that some people think the real masons would counter-claim here.

BM

[CSL]

Ending V/LA early. Note that all my time on weekends is reserved for modding.

I honestly think the scum wouldn't claim masons this early.

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

@Battle Mage: Who do you propose we lynch today? Deadline is tomorrow, so please hurry up with this question.

Also not liking this contradiction:

That rules out 3 candidates for today.

You say here that it rules out three candidates for today. Then this quote:

And besides, the claimed masons are not 100% confirmed town. lol

You're saying that the claimed masons are not 100% confirmed townies.

Any reason for the contradiction?

[Jahudo]

PLEASE STOP REFERENCING ZWET'S META UNTIL YOU GIVE ME SOME ZWET SCUM-META. Just had to get that out of my system.

Fair enough. My theory is that his personality is so apparent that he knows whether he's keeping in character, so he could pull these types of stunts (voting for non-counter-claimed PR) as any alignment. And since they wouldn't help him as scum, I don't see it as a point against him.

Who remembers a zwet scum game?
@zwet: what was your last completed scum game?

Empire at War is one example. Haven't read it yet.

And I don't care how fucking stupid he is, he's voting for confirmed town. That's scummy under any circumstances. Not to mention, he's not only leaving his vote there, he is actually trying to push a lynch.

And we all recognize this, so what motivation does scum have to do this? The only one I can see if to avoid voting someone else, and we've already seen zwet doesn't have a problem initiating wagons on people. Maybe he doesn't have a valid reason for the things he's doing, but they wouldn't help him as scum either from what I can see.

[zwetschenwasser]

*doesn't remember last scum game

gandalf is very quick to mislead town into blindly believing the mason claim.

[Battle Mage]

@Battle Mage: Who do you propose we lynch today? Deadline is tomorrow, so please hurry up with this question.

Lol, i guess we're No-Lynching then. If we get an extension, i'd like to hear from others first. But rest assured, you are top of my personal list.

Also not liking this contradiction:

That rules out 3 candidates for today.

You say here that it rules out three candidates for today. Then this quote:

And besides, the claimed masons are not 100% confirmed town. lol

You're saying that the claimed masons are not 100% confirmed townies.

Any reason for the contradiction?

Lol, what contradiction? I said the claimed masons are not confirmed town. That doesnt mean we are going to lynch them today. In reality, we dont even need to worry about it until LyLo.

Now you have 2 options. Either:

A. Apologise for misrepresenting me.
or B. Explain in what sense you feel Zwet can be considered confirmed town. Because in the above quote, you assume that he is. I think that's called a slip.

Confirm Vote: SSBF

Ah, you got me.

BM

[JordanA24]

Sorry guys, circumstances have caused me to be V/LE till probably Sunday, if not Monday.

I proxy my vote to Ryan till I get back

[Haylen]

Oh jesus, not THIS again. *remembers the horror of the proxy voting in the first Zachtown game. CAUSED BY BM*

[Battle Mage]

lmao, brilliant

If the Mod allows it,

Vote: SSBF

with Jordan's vote.

BM

[Super Smash Bros. Fan]

Lol, i guess we're No-Lynching then. If we get an extension, i'd like to hear from others first. But rest assured, you are top of my personal list.

We are not No Lynching today. This is a terrible thing to do Day 1 and hurts us in the long run. Only on rare occasions should we No Lynch and this isn't one of them.

Lol, what contradiction? I said the claimed masons are not confirmed town. That doesnt mean we are going to lynch them today. In reality, we dont even need to worry about it until LyLo.

The contradiction is where you rule out zwetchenwasser, DarkLightA, and gandalf5166 as lynch candidates. Then you change the story by saying that the claimed masons are not 100% confirmed townies.

Now you have 2 options. Either:

A. Apologise for misrepresenting me.
or B. Explain in what sense you feel Zwet can be considered confirmed town. Because in the above quote, you assume that he is. I think that's called a slip.

Wrong, I did not misrep you at all. I attacked you for the contradiction I said above. Noticed that I specified claimed masons, NOT just lump all those three people together. I still think zwetchenwasser is likely scum. If anything, you're misrepping what I'm saying.

[Jahudo]

gandalf is very quick to mislead town into blindly believing the mason claim.

Are you going to counter-claim?

Actually, 1 day and 3 hours until deadline? I think I found a pro-scum reason for zwet to stay on gandalf. Stalling. He wants a scrambled lynch.

I changed my mind. Zwet is pretty scummy. Is there enough support for a zwet lynch?

I'll reconsider SSBF but I just haven't been feeling that wagon.