Mini 1000: The Brave and the Beautiful (Game Over)

[Shotty to the Body]

V/LA till Monday

I'll get to your questions when I get back.

[ReaperCharlie]

MagnaofIllusion and Shotty to the Body: V/LA noted.

[ReaperCharlie]

The Brave and the Beautiful - Vote Count 4.2

MagnaofIllusion [1] - Furcolow
Not Voting [6] - bv310, Iecerint, Kdub, MagnaofIllusion, Muffin, Shotty to the Body


With 7 alive, it is 4 to lynch. The deadline is Tuesday, August 24 at 9:30 pm EDT.

[Kdub]

Going to take some time to think about Magna's claim. It's a lot of info to take in. With that said, I have a few concerns/questions that various people might be able to shed light on:

1. Ability thief seems like a possible scum role, especially considering that it also roleblocks. I'm also a bit wary of the fact that Magna was able to both steal AND use the stolen ability on the same night. Similar roles that I have seen in the past (e.g. role absorbers) don't get to use any "learned" abilities the same night that they get them. With that said, if Magna is scum, he could have easily implicated Fur and/or Muffin by claiming that they were lying about their role. The fact that he didn't, along with my town read on him previously, makes me inclined to believe him, although again I will think about it more.
2. I don't think Muffin would have fakeclaimed cop out of the blue on D2 just to get Robo lynched. I believe he is town, although his investigation results remain in question. Should we have him investigate himself to check his sanity? If it turns out that he is insane, then we can conclude that bv is scum based on Magna's results.
3. I also found it strange that Shotty decided to go after Muffin on N2, but I wanted to hear what info Magna had on him first. I would like to hear him explain why he targeted Muffin.
4. If Robo was indeed town, then I will have to take another look at Fur. I thought he was being set up yesterday as an "easy" lynch by Robo/Ythan based on his playstyle, but if both of them are town, then Fur is very possibly scum.

[Muffin]

Yeah...I was about to say the same thing. It's a little odd.

Edit: Ah, OK. Muffin's #2 makes sense. Is the IDD a well-known aspect of Muffin's rolename? Maybe RC assumed it was something everyone understands about the character (e.g. the same as hypothetically referring to Peach's parasol or whatever).

I've never known Lara Croft to use an Intention Detection Device.

[Muffin]

I'm going to chime in here and suggest that the flavor involved in my thefts is just flavor, as RC just said.

I think it is just a narrative justification for my ability to 'Steal' other's abilities. Unless it was tied to an item it wouldn't make sense. My own ability isn't linked to an item in my Role PM.

I agree that it's just flavor text, as I said earlier.

@Muffin

- Look closely at your PM. Is it outright stated you were wrong or is it possibly just flavor if some sort?

Ohhh how I wish I could quote this to you. I will at the end of the game I suppose. It is stated explicitly in the flavour text that I was wrong about Robo's alignment. Make of that what you will.

[Muffin]

MagnaofIllusion and Shotty to the Body: V/LA noted.

And muffin's V/LA as stated on the previous page?

[ReaperCharlie]

MagnaofIllusion and Shotty to the Body: V/LA noted.

And muffin's V/LA as stated on the previous page?

Sorry.

Also mod, I'll be V/LA from tonight until sunday evening around dinner time

Laughed at and ignored!

Jk, noted. Thanks

[Iecerint]

MoI, I'm a little confused about your Neto claim. If Neto protected SX, why did he die N1?

[MagnaofIllusion]

MoI, I'm a little confused about your Neto claim. If Neto protected SX, why did he die N1?

Here's how Neto's power was presented to me.

The Grapple Beam pulls the target closer to Neto. It prevents actions from directly affecting the target (Spyrex). However, because the target is nearer to Neto any action that affected Neto also affects the target (Spyrex). So when Shotty used a Nightkill on Neto it also affected Spyrex. Thus Spyrex died.

[bv310]

Seems pretty convincing to me.

Unvote, Vote: Shotty

[Iecerint]

Hmm. That fits if "destroyed" is a generic death flavor. It creates a little bit of a mystery with regard to the D1 mafia kill itself, though. We'd have to believe that scum redundantly targeted SX, or that a separate protector stopped the scumkill.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Hmm. That fits if "destroyed" is a generic death flavor. It creates a little bit of a mystery with regard to the D1 mafia kill itself, though. We'd have to believe that scum redundantly targeted SX, or that a separate protector stopped the scumkill.

Or that Shotty is Mafia that went for the 'cleared by the non-Mafia kill' gambit I threw down. Honestly that was my hope when I was calling for the Vig to claim Neto's kill. Given what I knew at the time it was within reason that my pushing for Neto being the Vig kill would embolden scum to fake claim Vig if that was the actual Mafia kill. With Spyrex being an obvious target I couldn't be certain but was willing to see where things fell.

Will have more time Monday to process thoughts regarding Role-blocking.

[Iecerint]

Could be. Fits with Neto being a sort of crap vig kill. It's a little funny if there are no non-mafia kills, though.

Edit: I've thought about it, and I figure I can claim my actions up to this point without much risk:

N1: Track Ythan (null result)
N2: Watch MoI (null result, but flavor implied MoI targeted someone N2, which is consistent with his claim)

N3: Protect MoI

I figure this is worth claiming because MoI is banking on no other protective role being present, and he is incorrect. Also, the fact that two protective roles exist makes it somewhat less likely that there is only one kill in play.

[bv310]

Does anybody have a condensed version of the name claims so far? I'm trying to collect my thoughts, and that's the one thing I still need.

[Iecerint]

-bv310 --- ???
-Furcolow --- Tanya Headon -- Rolecop (unverified due to ability steal N1, other reasons N2 and N3)
-Iecerint --- ??? -- (Has tracked, watched, protected)
-Kdub --- ???
-MagnaofIllusion --- ??? --- (Has Ability Thief'd, has also done something else unclaimed N3)
-Muffin --- Lara Croft --- (Found that Robo was "Evil" N1, later told he was mistaken, no actions since then)
-Shotty to the Body --- ??? --- Vig (killed Neto, currently out of bullets)

Game Over
-millar13 | Sarah Kerrigan, destroyed Day 1 -- THRESHOLD-DROPPER, SCUM
-Netopalis | Samus Aran, shot Night 1 --- FORCES PLAYER TO HIDE BEHIND SELF, PRESUMED TOWN
-SpyreX | Cortana, destroyed Night 1 --- DETERMINES NUMBER OF SCUM ON A LYNCH, PRESUMED TOWN
-Robocopter87 | Chun Li, destroyed Day 2 --- SUPERSAINT, CAN MAKE OTHERS A SUPERSAINT, PRESUMED TOWN DUE TO MUFFIN'S BACKTRACK/NEW INFORMATION
-Ythan | Princess Peach, scratched and torn to death Night 2 --- BELOVED PRINCESS, PRESUMED TOWN

[Furcolow]

Going to take some time to think about Magna's claim. It's a lot of info to take in. With that said, I have a few concerns/questions that various people might be able to shed light on:

1. Ability thief seems like a possible scum role, especially considering that it also roleblocks. I'm also a bit wary of the fact that Magna was able to both steal AND use the stolen ability on the same night. Similar roles that I have seen in the past (e.g. role absorbers) don't get to use any "learned" abilities the same night that they get them. With that said, if Magna is scum, he could have easily implicated Fur and/or Muffin by claiming that they were lying about their role. The fact that he didn't, along with my town read on him previously, makes me inclined to believe him, although again I will think about it more.
2. I don't think Muffin would have fakeclaimed cop out of the blue on D2 just to get Robo lynched. I believe he is town, although his investigation results remain in question. Should we have him investigate himself to check his sanity? If it turns out that he is insane, then we can conclude that bv is scum based on Magna's results.
3. I also found it strange that Shotty decided to go after Muffin on N2, but I wanted to hear what info Magna had on him first. I would like to hear him explain why he targeted Muffin.
4. If Robo was indeed town, then I will have to take another look at Fur. I thought he was being set up yesterday as an "easy" lynch by Robo/Ythan based on his playstyle, but if both of them are town, then Fur is very possibly scum.

I feel that if anything, his claim is fake, and he is mafia. I disagree with you. You are just trying to defend him.

[Furcolow]

Seems pretty convincing to me.

Unvote, Vote: Shotty

what is convincing to you? i don't understand this vote. if you don't think he's a vig, what do you think he is? mafia? sk?

[ReaperCharlie]

The Brave and the Beautiful - Vote Count 4.3

MagnaofIllusion [1] - Furcolow
Shotty to the Body [1] - bv310
Not Voting [5] - Iecerint, Kdub, MagnaofIllusion, Muffin, Shotty to the Body


With 7 alive, it is 4 to lynch. The deadline is Tuesday, August 24 at 9:30 pm EDT.

[Iecerint]

I think it's unlikely that MoI is scum. He looked like the most obvtown player in the game for me, and there was no kill the night I protected him. Also, there've been a couple times where I think he's refrained from taking the easy bait on a player; can't remember where exactly offhand, though.

[Kdub]

Magna is likely telling the truth about his ability and his night actions. There's just too much detail in his claim, and in a PR-heavy game like this, there are just too many ways he could potentially be caught in a lie if he were making it up. His targets seem consistent with his play so far in the game, so I think he should be trusted until we have reason to believe otherwise.

Still waiting to hear from Shotty about why he tried to kill Muffin.

N1: Track Ythan (null result)
N2: Watch MoI (null result, but flavor implied MoI targeted someone N2, which is consistent with his claim)

N3: Protect MoI

Really hate these actions. We had a claimed cop, a claimed ability cop, and a claimed beloved princess (who you had at least some reason to suspect was being truthful based on your N1 track) on N2/N3, and you watched and protected Magna both nights, who you had no other info on? Why would you not watch/protect Muffin? If you thought he was scum (which your posts give no indication of), then maybe I could understand not targeting him, but even then, Ythan and Fur were far better choices. Unless you think all of them are scum, there's no reason to think scum would want to kill or block an unclaimed player instead of those claimed PRs. Explain please. And just saying anything along the lines of, "Magna was my best town read" isn't going to cut it.

[Iecerint]

I was not able to protect anyone N2. It wasn't a possible action for me. My abilities are varied, but they're balanced by only being available at certain times.

It's true that Ythan's claim was consistent with being a Beloved Princess (i.e. null track N1), but his play left me unconvinced he was town. For example, as someone who apparently had information that someone knew he had targeted no one and consequently was more likely than the background probability to be non-scum, he did a very poor job of cooperating with someone who all-but-screamed to have been said person (i.e. me). I spent most of D2 trying to get him to clarify his position on millar. I didn't want to Watch a player I thought was likely to be scum.

Of the remaining players, I thought that MoI was most likely to be killed given that I wasn't to be killed, so I Watch'd him. I ruled out Muffin because the result of Robo's lynch was pretty ambiguous, so I thought he may be a plausible wagon target for scum given that he was town; I didn't think MoI was a plausible wagon target, so I thought he was a more likely NK.

In hindsight, I wish I'd watched Ythan N2 on the basis that he was extremely likely to be targeted given that he was town, but I sort of struggled with it and ultimately decided against it. I think you'll pick up on my mixed feelings if you reread my D2. I basically continuously go after Ythan all day while saying that I don't think he's scum. It's because my null track weakly implied a non-scum alignment whereas his play did otherwise.

[Iecerint]

The probability that scum would NK Furco N2 or N3 is near 0%. His playstyle is obnoxious enough that scum can get town to lynch him given that Furco is town.

The only possible players to Watch were Ythan or MoI. I chose wrong N2 and right N3, or that's how I assumed things went.

[Furcolow]

i'm going to have to agree with you there
i get policy lynched in a lot of the games i'm in, even once in mylo or w/e

[bv310]

Seems pretty convincing to me.

Unvote, Vote: Shotty

what is convincing to you? i don't understand this vote. if you don't think he's a vig, what do you think he is? mafia? sk?

SK. I doubt Mafia would try to get themselves confirmed as Vig in the way Shotty did.