Mini 1021: Battousai's Mountaintnous Mountain Mafia (Over)

[Nexus]

Vote: LoudmouthLee

For having rust.

I expected that, PranaDevil.

[Nexus]

I also assumed that the first round of votes were random-that's what I was taught in the newbie game. Hence me posting purely because you were rusty.

[Nexus]

I'm afraid I'm gonna have to agree with iamusername.

CA, I find it very odd you switched your vote from Lee, which had three people on it, to another person. That's just prolonging the RVS, especially because your reasoning's been sketchy.

Plus, your bandwagons aren't achieving anything but put you under suspicion. So,

FoS:ConfidAnon

In other news, I nostalgia'd at your avatar.

[Nexus]

Plus, your bandwagons aren't achieving anything but put you under suspicion.

I don't see how this reflects upon my alignment.

It makes you seem desperate to get a lynch that you'll go for anyone. This, to me, is either a newbie town tell, or a scum tell. I'm going for the latter as I don't believe you are a newbie.

[Nexus]

Can I get my own cookie?

So if I agree with another user, who I believe to be a townie too, that means I'm a scumbuddy?

[Nexus]

I'm a guy :/

I generally FoS before actually voting, that's how I play. Except in RVS, which case it's pretty pointless to FoS.

I can't really add much more when there isn't much more to add. Sorry about that.

[Nexus]

Dalt has also switched his "random" vote. He voted saga, until told it wouldn't count, and then he changed his vote. I find that suspicious.

[Nexus]

What've I done now? fitz didn't mention him switching his vote, afaik. So I highlighted it, because I've been bitched out about not inputting new information. Sorry.

[Nexus]

EBWOP bitched at before in other games.

[Nexus]

Right. I think you're being far too harsh on me, and it's quite unnecessary. I don't really are about how suspicious you are about me, you're wrong.

I'm going to go through the posts in order, if I repeat information, tough. Hopefully I pick up something that someone's missed.

dalt's first vote against Saga would've been an OMGUS vote, as saga voted for him on the first page.

LmL posted his "roleclaim" as Vanilla Townie. Did he realise it was a joke?

However, fitz also seems to have missed iam's joke, although he didn't go as far as "roleclaiming." I don't understand why he's not read the OP, but that may have been an accident or not really realised.

Korashk updated the votecount for no reason...it didn't really need to be done. And again. He says "I like having that information readily available..." why not just have it on his computer in notepad or excel? Buddying up/coaching? It's possible.

I dunno whether it's suspicious that Commie's asked for a replacement. Maybe he thought he wouldn't be able to play scum very well? So, it'll be interesting to see what his replacement does.

LmL then takes his random vote off of PranaDevil, and then...puts it back on again. Really really no need to highlight that, unless he's desperate to start a lynchwagon. It's still partly an OMGUS vote, and he doesn't really give a decent reason for it not to be, which is silly.

PranaDevil does contradict himself-he wants to create a wagon on LmL, but he doesn't like a wagon on him that CA's just voted for him, on the same reason he got on the LmL wagon that I started. Which makes me think it's too close to home for him, otherwise he wouldn't be so defensive. He's saying that CA said outright he was getting a wagon going, but PranaDevil himself said he was simply voting LmL at the start "Because I felt like getting a wagon going." Him and CA argue about it for almost a full page, and don't really come to a satisfactory conclusion.

CA moved his vote from LmL, despite the fact he wanted a wagon to get on...and one was starting.

The fact that xite was being a bit of a troll by refusing to tell people what was scummy in my post was quite pointless-it was just distracting people. Maybe playing games with the rest of the players is a way to distract us?

Also, xite says I'm second most suspicious, but is on my ass the most. So, it's bordering on tunnelling.

This point's gonna be trouble causing, but: Post #98. Is it scum telling scum that they're here for them. It probably isn't, and I'm picking up on nothing, but something worth looking at.

Lat hasn't posted yet. He last logged in a couple of hours ago, so why hasn't he posted in here?

Not really much else I've got to say. Xite probably will say it's not good enough.

Re: Point 3. If I don't post, then that's scummy too. I dunno what else to say. I've tried to give some information, which is what I typed as I read posts.

[Nexus]

Sorry, I meant that: "I like having that information readily available..." I see as possibly being scumcoaching/buddying, because it's like "I've written the information for you too, my buddy." I'm no doubt reading too much into it.

The last sentence should read: "I've tried to give some information from what I've read, it's probably repeating some stuff, but that's 'cos I was typing it as I read each post."

1. Fine. I don't mind now you've explained. I just assumed you were being a jerk like I've experienced with no reason. Now worries.

5. I'm trying to answer your suspicions as best I can, but I've read through all the posts and that long post is what I came up with.

6. Post 87. You've named me, saga and havingfitz. I assumed you'd done it in the order of suspicion because of the way you'd laid it out. If that's wrong, apologies

7. I assumed it might be innocent, but hey, I needed to highlight it to get you to explain it.

My suspicions are thus:

Dalt. He's lied, he changed his RVS for no real reason, and he has been quiet since.
Korashk. He totted up the votes twice, for no real reason. Posting them in the thread just adds clutter, and at a RVS, it's even more unnecessary.
LmL. He got very defensive when the wagon rolled around. Since then, he had an argument with Prana which didn't really achieve much.
Prana. Same as LmL. When challenged about his wagonning, he got really defensive.
CA. He didn't take kindly to the wagon. However, not that suspicious.
Xite. I don't find you suspicious, I can see what you're trying to do.
Fitz. Has highlighted suspicions of fitz. Not really suspicious.
Lat. Hasn't posted yet, but is lurking the thread. Suspicious.

[Nexus]

Leech, sage and username, I have no suspicions on.

I knew I'd forgotten people.

[Nexus]

My list is:

Dalt,
Korashk,
Lat,
CA,
LmL,
Prana,
Everyone else.

[Nexus]

Alright, Lateralus, I'll move you down the suspicion list now that you've explained yourself. I just wanted to highlight it to begin with until you had a change to respond.

Dalt,
Korashk,
CA,
LmL,
Prana,
Lat,
Everyone else.

[Nexus]

Eh I'm still kinda new to this site (Played 3 games, all of which I replaced out of) but aren't those lists anti-town? It's good to know who you're suspicious but I don't really see how they actually help the town catch scum. Plus scum could use them as a tool to decide who to night kill in order to frame someone.

Well xite asked for a list, so I thought I'd give him an updated one.

LmL, that's because my vote's still there to see how you reacted. Also I sort of forgot I hadn't unvoted. You say it's not OMGUS but to me it still slightly smells of it, so now I'm keeping it where it is and waiting to see your long post.

[Nexus]

Right. I think you're being far too harsh on me, and it's quite unnecessary. I don't really are about how suspicious you are about me, you're wrong.

I'm going to go through the posts in order, if I repeat information, tough. Hopefully I pick up something that someone's missed.

dalt's first vote against Saga would've been an OMGUS vote, as saga voted for him on the first page.

LmL posted his "roleclaim" as Vanilla Townie. Did he realise it was a joke?

However, fitz also seems to have missed iam's joke, although he didn't go as far as "roleclaiming." I don't understand why he's not read the OP, but that may have been an accident or not really realised.

Korashk updated the votecount for no reason...it didn't really need to be done. And again. He says "I like having that information readily available..." why not just have it on his computer in notepad or excel? Buddying up/coaching? It's possible.

I dunno whether it's suspicious that Commie's asked for a replacement. Maybe he thought he wouldn't be able to play scum very well? So, it'll be interesting to see what his replacement does.

LmL then takes his random vote off of PranaDevil, and then...puts it back on again. Really really no need to highlight that, unless he's desperate to start a lynchwagon. It's still partly an OMGUS vote, and he doesn't really give a decent reason for it not to be, which is silly.

PranaDevil does contradict himself-he wants to create a wagon on LmL, but he doesn't like a wagon on him that CA's just voted for him, on the same reason he got on the LmL wagon that I started. Which makes me think it's too close to home for him, otherwise he wouldn't be so defensive. He's saying that CA said outright he was getting a wagon going, but PranaDevil himself said he was simply voting LmL at the start "Because I felt like getting a wagon going." Him and CA argue about it for almost a full page, and don't really come to a satisfactory conclusion.

CA moved his vote from LmL, despite the fact he wanted a wagon to get on...and one was starting.

The fact that xite was being a bit of a troll by refusing to tell people what was scummy in my post was quite pointless-it was just distracting people. Maybe playing games with the rest of the players is a way to distract us?

Also, xite says I'm second most suspicious, but is on my ass the most. So, it's bordering on tunnelling.

This point's gonna be trouble causing, but: Post #98. Is it scum telling scum that they're here for them. It probably isn't, and I'm picking up on nothing, but something worth looking at.

Lat hasn't posted yet. He last logged in a couple of hours ago, so why hasn't he posted in here?

Not really much else I've got to say. Xite probably will say it's not good enough.

Re: Point 3. If I don't post, then that's scummy too. I dunno what else to say. I've tried to give some information, which is what I typed as I read posts.

To firstly answer your questions, Nexus...

I claimed vanilla townie as tongue in cheek as the response to the bandwagon. I didn't quite know what other types of information they were looking for.

Nextly, I "removed the random vote" since so much emphasis (or at least, in my own mind) was placed on it pg 1. I was letting everyone know that I felt, at the time, there was a case for Prana. I, currently, like the case on you much better.

As for you, you have some major inconsistencies, post to post, with your view on some people. For instance:

CA. He didn't take kindly to the wagon. However, not that suspicious.

Dalt,
Korashk,
Lat,
CA,
LmL,
Prana,
Everyone else.

Just a little surprised to where you rank CA on your list, where, a few posts before, he "wasn't that suspicious."

I'm just getting quite a vibe from you. I'm really leaning towards Prana and CA looking scummy because they're overposters, that Nexus is scummy based on inconsistent behavior, and Dalt may very well be his scum partner that he would be throwing under the bus to clear his name for the rest of the game. I've played that way in a Normal Game here before.. and it worked.

I like the vote on Nexus, and I think that the most of you should follow.

We can lynch Dalt tomorrow.

Perfect tunnelling speak. Ten out of ten for effort.

You've really got a vendetta against me, which I'm not surprised about because I'm still voting for you. So, I'm taking all what you say with a pinch of salt, and I hope people don't pay attention to your blatant attempts to shift suspiscion onto me.

It's worked. You've got uber defensive and you're now trying to tunnel me...

[Nexus]

Explanation: I shouldn't have said "Not that suspicious." I re read again after I had posted that, whilst I was making the list, and realised he was more suspicious. I should've amended what I had written, but I didn't. For that, I apologise.

Why the random Flay related rant?

Either way, no matter where CA is, I think that dalt and Korashk are more suspicious, and am waiting for them to answer.

[Nexus]

I re read his posts from the first three pages where he changed his "random" wagons to three different people. That's where the majority of my suspicion lies. He hasn't really satisfactorily explained it yet, either, and has been quiet recently. Might be our timezones, though.

I didn't mean vendetta like it was something that's happened all the time. Vendetta was an overreaction, and I apologise.

I'm not intentionally trying to be jumpy and defensive, I've been just defending myself from accusations, perhaps to vociferously.

[Nexus]

Also, "Until then, my vote stands. I hope others follow suit."

That really strikes me as scummy as it's like "look, vote Nexus. I'm right, listen to me!" it's really insistent.

[Nexus]

Lateralus: see post 131: I didn't just write the list again changing where you were. I re read all the of the posts again, and found that CA's flip-flopping between votes to be more suspicious than anything LmL and Prana had done. If he goes to the top of the three, then LmL goes to second, and Prana goes to third. That's how changing one position works-it changes all three.

No, I'm not trying to avoid a confrontation with Xite-I'm sure if he wants to continue fighting with me, he'll continue it. However, I was merely stating that I understood why he was being so vicious, and just because someone's a jerk, it doesn't make them scum. I've made that mistake before.

[Nexus]

Your vote count is so spectacularly wrong it's unbelievable.

I don't know whether that's a simple mistake, or deliberate, but don't post it if it's not up to date. :/

And you've posted another list, which is unnecessary, and wrong factually. So, you're really suspicious.

FoS:Korashk

[Nexus]

Maybe "My suspicions are thus:" was the wrong thing to say. "This is where I stand" would've been better. Whatever, it was a mistake.

However, if you look at my next two lists, Xite doesn't figure on them. I've also put that Fitz isn't that suspicious in that list. I was just typing as I was thinking, it'll teach me to take my time more.

I didn't say he wasn't suspicious to get him off my back, I said he wasn't suspicious because I didn't find him suspicious. Granted, I was stupid enough not to split it into two lists, but whatever. I'll learn from the mistake.

I think I was misusing the word tunnelling, Prana. Now you've explained it, I understand it better.

As for my vote on LmL. I didn't change it during the RVS because he hasn't convinced me he's town. I then forgot about it, but when it was pointed out, I made the decision not to change it.

[Nexus]

I'm not rushing through the game-I have a really short attention span, and if I don't get my ideas down, I forget them really quick. I know now that I should take more time, yes, write it all down, but then go over it again and stuff to make sure it makes sense x]

I didn't realise I was making such a hash of things, now I do, I'll be more careful.

The initial list was all the people who I could remember without looking through the thread, which was all the people who had stuck out to me. Saga and the others hadn't, so I didn't mention them in that list.

[Nexus]

I already answered that one, LmL. I reread his posts, after I'd written the "not suspicious" one, and decided he was more suspicious. I'm not doing very well at explaining myself at all.

The reason I haven't unvoted you now is that I assumed that if I did, now I've been challenged, I'd be seen as scum. However, as I'm getting close to being lynched, I'll

unvote

and vote the person who I think is most suspicious once I've reread the thread again.

[Nexus]

"Alright I understand, I assume you made all of your posts in a fast way?"

That bit?

Yes. Up until I made that comment, now I'm slowing down a bit.

[Nexus]

I object. I'm not lying.

Actually, I was writing that post as I was reading other posts, which is why it was so jumbled-as I read a post, and had a thought, I jotted it down. If you notice, it took me 26 minutes to write that post-I started after Xite posted his post 107. However, if I remember correctly, I actually was writing it in after 109 had been posted, because I remember having to read 110 before posting it. I didn't reference any posts, but I was writing it and reading the posts in two separate tabs. That's how I did it. I didn't slow down at all. If you read my post 111, it's each page and each few posts at a time, without putting any references in. It was a ramble, an attempt to make some sense. Then I pressed post once I'd written it down. I type really quickly.

Every single post I make has been done in the same way-I read the latest post, and post my thoughts to it. If I need to look back, I do, but I think 111 is the only post I've really had to look back through the thread, as it was made in order to show Xite my own thoughts, since they'd been asked for.

So, I don't think I've lied. Sorry.

The list I stand by is the third.

[Nexus]

Oh, I think you might be misunderstanding me. If I need to read posts, I'll read them as I'm writing. If I need to go back and reference them, I'll be reading them at the same time as writing-I don't read all 180 posts then write, because I forget stuff from the start then. If it's just one post, like yours now, I'll read that, and then type and answer it, as I am now.

I didn't copy Xite, I think we just think alike. I didn't realise his list was like that.

I first wrote CA was not that suspicious. Then, I had to make the second list...(the middle list), and I reread the posts, and decided that in fact he was more suspicious than my original thoughts. So, he moved up to third. CA/LmL/Prana are in that order because that's how suspicious I see them-CA flipped his vote a lot and got really defensive, LmL was really defensive, but less suspicious than CA because I had more reasons for CA-defensive and three votes in the space of as many pages, and the Prana because he was defensive, just less so than LmL. That was my way of thinking.

I think I've answered your questions, if you need more, let me know and I'll try my best.

[Nexus]

I already answered that one, LmL. I reread his posts, after I'd written the "not suspicious" one, and decided he was more suspicious. I'm not doing very well at explaining myself at all.

The reason I haven't unvoted you now is that I assumed that if I did, now I've been challenged, I'd be seen as scum. However, as I'm getting close to being lynched, I'll

unvote

and vote the person who I think is most suspicious once I've reread the thread again.

@mod. I

unvoted

[Nexus]

...

unvoted

I have no idea where the underline came from.

[Nexus]

OK. I went away and gathered my thoughts, and had allowed the exchange with Lateralus to distract me from Korashk.

The fact that he posted the list in post 140 which was wrong got my suspicions up. Which is why I FoSed him. He then proceeded to dismiss my opinion "because I was a noob", which, whilst true, is also a bit of a shit reason to dismiss my opinion. Furthermore, I think he has the ulterior motive that if he dismisses me, and sends me running away with my tail between my legs-something which sort of happened with Xite, I'd forget he'd made the mistake, or back off. Well, it hasn't worked. I left his post so as I didn't say anything rash and get into an argument, but now I've come back to it, that's my feeling on it.

Post 153: He's very dismissive of the points Lateralus makes, especially point 3. "It doesn't matter what you say, you're wrong." I admit to using something similar to this this in another game, and it was rightly pointed out as pompous, and scummy.

His "It doesn't matter if we lynch a townie or two" statement doesn't sit right with me either. It is technically true, but not really something a townie should actively go around saying, in my opinion. Maybe he's hoping others will agree, so he'll seem less scummy and not care. Yeah, it's fine if the RVS quickly leads to a townie lynch, in my opinion, but now we've gone past the RVS, I don't think this attitude is helpful.

unvote; (if it hasn't been sorted yet) vote: Korashk.

[Nexus]

...damnit.

unvote; (if it hasn't been sorted yet) vote: Korashk

[Nexus]

I was going to say-I've already explained those things.

Each post changed because I was/had been rereading the thread, and new things had come up/popped out at me. There's not a lot else I can say-I mean, would you prefer it if I mindlessly pursued the same point, even if it's completely wrong?

[Nexus]

Doesn't prodded mean a PM? Either way, I'm here.

Although, mod, I may well be

v/LA until the 18th August from tomorrow

as it's my birthday on Monday and my girlfriend's coming down to see me.

I'll spend what time I've got today looking through the last few pages, and try and get some thoughts up. No promises, though.

[Nexus]

EBWOP: Also, I will probably still be able to read, and if anything needs my immediate attention, I'll try and find time to answer it, I just wanted to let you all know my activity will be even lower for the next few days. You have my sincerest apologies.

[Nexus]

Dalt: I don't really understand why he's here if he doesn't want to post. Or why he hasn't requested replacement.

Korashk/Llamafluff: I admit, I was annoyed that Korashk requested replacement. He'd been under sustained pressure, and it seems to me like he's just quit before he was lynched, and now has left it up to Llamafluff to clean up the mess, which is a bit of a dick move. Re: Your points against me in post #225. I was defensive, yes, but I don't think I was any more defensive than one should be when trying to defend themselves against false accusations of being scum. I think that LmL was being even more defensive than me, which is why I brought it up. I also moved off LmL because I was less suspicious of him, and I wanted to make sure he wasn't lynched before I had the chance to reread the thread and collect my thoughts. Which I did, after I'd been allowed to (after answering the suspicions against me.) Which led to my vote on you. Well, Korashk, but your slot. So, I took off my vote from LmL for these reasons: 1. I was told it looked more suspicious keeping it on him. 2. I had decided that others needed checking first.

Lateralus: You were convinced I was lying, but I believe I've probably proved to you I wasn't, or it was unintentional.

Post #252 responses:

1. List one was written off the top of my head, without checking back in the thread. I couldn't remember some the players, so I listed all the players I could remember, hence some people being missed off. Which is why Xite is on the list. I thought, since I'd started listing most of the players I'd remembered, I might as well list what I thought of all of them. So, I did, but neglected to change the title.

2. Why wouldn't I try to avoid confrontation? It was getting more and more like a proper argument, rather than something to do with the game, so I was trying to defuse it. I didn't realise that would be seen as scummy.

4. I didn't just copy and paste, I re-read the thread, and I changed the order. That's how I considered the order. You're continually barking up the wrong tree, and I'm getting pretty sick of explaining the same thing over and over.

5. The largest post took as much time as it took me to read the thread and right my thoughts. It was the first time I'd done it, and that's why it was considerably longer than all my others-all my others had been immediate reaction posts.

6. Post #150 isn't a lie. It's my truthful explanation. The last bit is also truth.

LmL: Your question to me (Post 203) is quite leading, because even if I say "Yes, it could be seen as buddying," or "No, it can't be seen as buddying," I can't really take a step back if it's me you suspect. You are basically asking if I were buddying up, even if you claim you're not. Any agreement between players could be seen as buddying up.

Fitz: Really quite angry that people are arguing against the way he jumped on dalt. The fact that dalt still hasn't posted makes me think that perhaps he had made a genuine mistake, and feels like he can't come back to the game because he'll just get loads of crap again, with fitz calling him a liar despite the fact he'd only made a couple of posts which someone else pointed out. I think Prana has a good point that in this situation, it's more of a grey area, than a black and white area that fitz is claiming it is. The fact that Fitz is so focussed on one player, who hasn't even posted since the first couple of pages, is quite damaging to the town, imo.

CA: Post #240. Demanding votes for Korashk, despite the fact the guy's switched out. He doesn't even want to give Llamafluff the chance to explain himself. This seems a bit of a scum move for me, because he's seen an opportunity to get a lynch, and is pushing for it. Yes, I've voted for Korashk, but I'd quite like to see what Llamafluff has to say as a defence.

Llamafluff has actually provided some useful analysis, which Korashk hasn't. So, I'd like to see how people react to that and answer him.

I don't like the way fitz is still kinda focussed on dalt, and won't admit he's wrong.

I'm also wondering whether we might get a bit more from Prana.

[Nexus]

It was more a case of I wondered what your thoughts on everyone were.

[Nexus]

I was V/LA. I've been able to check in at brief moments, but because it had been my birthday and my girlfriend had been around, I haven't had a chance to sit and read and collect my thoughts and post. She's now left, so expect me to get back into the swing of things today/tomorrow. I have some stuff offline I need to do, but I'll catch up. Probably today, but no promises.

[Nexus]

(See Post 258 for my v/LA announcement)

Yeah, I'm back anyway

[Nexus]

Writing as I read again. Sort of.

First things first: I really hate people using the reasonings "Because of gut." Xite, and Wendy are prime examples of this. Either provide some hard evidence, or don't say anything, because to me it seems like a random vote. I mean, gut probably is a large factor, but there has to have been a post that's set off your gut churning like that, surely? So, show me the posts. (Yes, I realise Leech makes this point too, but I wanted to reiterate it)

wendy randomly calling a scum team of xite and fitz was odd, because the two of them haven't really had many interactions. I haven't had much interaction with Prana, or you, Wendy, does that make us scum teams too?

Another thing: Xite seems to be really good at getting under people's skin-he did with me, and he has with wendy. I'm not sure if he's doing this because its his meta or if he's scum. He is being really distracting, though, which is to me anti-town.

Wendy: You're changing votes a lot. Since you've been here, you've voted for: havingfitz (14/8, post 288), PranaDevil (15/8, post 333), HERSELF (16/8, post 369), and then unvoting and voting a no lynch 2 minutes later (16/8, post 370). What? Absolutely ridiculous. In the space of 2 days, you've changed your vote four times. I moaned at CA, and gave that as a reason for my placing him in my scum list, so it would be bad of me to completely ignoring it. Flip flopping, if it's not scummy, is definitely anti town. You've shot up in my suspicions, on top of a lot of your random posts, some of which add nothing. Answering Question #347: I read the opening post. Once it was asked for people to reveal power roles, I re-read the opening post again, and was going to post my shock that someone was saying something silly, but was beat to it. When it was explained in the thread is when I realised. Having then read the next few responses to your questions, I don't actually see the point in this question, but hell, I'll give you your little pleasure of making me do what you want and answering you.

LML: Can I just clarify you mean the "I kept my vote on you because..." bit? Just to clarify, I'm not disagreeing, if that's what you mean.

Post 369 and 370 I actually happened to log on during a free moment, and I facepalmed. I don't even understand, and I was speechless for a good five minutes. I could understand if it was a hammer, as a townie, but it wasn't even a hammer. Pro-town wouldn't vote for themselves, pro town will defend themselves to the death, rather than give up.

Also, alt fail. I find it absurd that if you have an alt, that you don't want people to know, you won't triple check before you post. Especially when you then claim it was going to be an important post. Idk what that means, but it's odd.

I disagree with no lynch, full stop. So, tw pushing for this and claiming it's a good thing does not sit well with me-I can't see a pro town player agreeing with a no lynch. Yes, she gives statistics, but I always thought a no lynch was better for times when it's getting more difficult. Day one, imo, is not this time.

Fitz saying "I want to vote her but won't" is suspicious-if you're town, you've got nothing to worry about if you vote to lynch her (Post 378, 10.56pm, 16/8). And then, two days later, 30 posts later, you go ahead and vote for her. I don't really see the point in you being like "yeah, no gonna vote..." then "oh, the situation's basically the same, but I don't mind voting now." Don't like it.

Post #415: Suddenly I'm next on your list, despite being v/la and not actually having any interaction with you? I'm quite confused, but whatever. AND THEN you say gut. Urgh.

Also, two flips, then you're useful? Not really much point in you being here, then. You're just distracting town and making our lives more difficult, and are willing to sacrifice two townies. Then, we'd be down 4 town, and then you're gonna be useful? Noty. I'd rather lynch you now to get away from your distracting play. Also. You've just said "Fitz is scum, then Nexus" but, in the same post say: "i prefer to lynch Xite today if enough people don't see the light and elect nolynch." How does that work? If fitz isn't scum, and you're suspicious of Xite, why the hell would you lynch me? Yes, I know it's just "suspicion," but surely your answer would be Xite?

OK, so this is what I've got so far.

I have suspicions on Fitz and Wendy. Wendy is highest on my list, though. Her two flips then useful thing, plus "gut" is really grating on me.

I'm going to learn from my last mistake, and

unvote

because currently llamafluff is third on my list. I'm not going to vote wendy yet because I want her to explain herself, and if someone decides to hammer before she gets a chance, I'll feel quite bad. Even if she flips scum. but,

FoS:tomorrow wendy

That took a long time. I am never going away for five days again.

[Nexus]

Well, ok, you make fair points. Yes, the post #415 bit is about tw, not you.

The bit in quotations was paraphrasing a bit, rather than quoting, I apologise for not fully explaining that.

I was suspicious of you against dalt, not against wendy. You were tunnelling dalt on a very flimsy basis. I'm not suspicious of you for voting for tw based on HER actions, I was based on how you were reading dalt's.

Yeah, ok, I made a mistake there criticising you for doing the same thing, and I apologise.

[Nexus]

Wendy, you've changed your vote

again

...I don't think using a lottery is a good way to choose who you're voting for :/

[Nexus]

I dunno, I think you're both as bad as each other.

You're about to have another argument which will no doubt go on for another few posts, not really providing any of us with anything useful.

[Nexus]

The reason I didn't follow up further was that it was basically proving my point that she's been horribly inconsistent with her suspicions, and keeps flip-flopping. The fact that someone will continue to leave their vote up to chance is, if not scummy, incredibly anti-town. One of the reasons why I'm leaning towards voting TW over anyone else is that I see her as the most anti-town and distracting. Xite's not much better, but I believe that tw is more damaging for the town. It's frustrating me, but she keeps digging herself deeper.

[Nexus]

Oh come on tw. As an experienced player, wouldn't you fight your corner to the very last?

Prove to me and others that someone else is scum, and you could escape, instead of throwing in the towel :/

Saying that, last time someone did that in a game I was in, they were town. Not that I put much stay in that.

[Nexus]

Which three players? Wendy, Prana and Fitz?

Wendy: anti-town play, definitely. Not sure if scum or not, but the one I'm most tempted to vote for.
Fitz: I thought he was quite scummy the way he chased down dalt's slot, before switching. Still feel the same, but have been distracted by wendy.
Prana: I don't like that he went through a phase of not contributing anything unless poked. However, I haven't seen anything really scummy from him.

[Nexus]

I really don't like people using their meta as an arguement. Just because you've acted that way in every single other game, it doesn't mean you will in this game.

You're really clutching at straws. I think if you are a townie, your arguments should consist of more than just "Look at my meta" and "Because of my gut." You would be vociferously defending yourself, yet you're just rolling over and accepting it.

To me, you're being anti-town and distracting. I need to re-read CA's posts, and Xite's, but I'm getting closer to voting you.

[Nexus]

Particularly as I would believe an alt would try and play differently to their normal account. So your evidence isn't all that useful. At least not to me.

[Nexus]

tw: I could've told you not to bother looking at my meta. I'm pretty sure I said earlier in the game I was still relatively new. This is why I don'tlike using meta-it's pointless.

Llamafluff: Thanks for explaining that.

@Nexus - Is CA or Xite a better lynch and why?

Pass. I'll iso them later and have a look. Xite's definitely been more anti-town because of his attitude, and so if I'm giving that as a reason to lynch TW, that means I have to use that as a reason against Xite. I'm pretty sure I had some suspicions on CA after how he acted at the start of the game-I'll double check when I get back in this afternoon, and also read other people's cases. I'm also beginning to rethink my stance on tw because I think I'm getting too focussed.

@All TW voters - Does TW being an alt effect your read? [/b] No. I don't really know how people act with alts as I've not played games with their normal accounts, so it doesn't matter to me.[/b]

[Nexus]

Fitz: I can't help having things to do away from mafia. Here it is, anyway.

CA:

Three different random votes in the space of 24 hours, going from LmL, to Leech, to Prana. I know he wanted to start a bandwagon, but surely the easiest way to get a single bandwagon going is to keep your vote on one person, and keep pushing them? Granted, he then goes on to say that he believes Prana is actually scum, and his vote on Prana was not random-but why have two separate random votes during the RVS? Granted, this was early play, but it did make me suspicious.

He then "forgot about the thread" until iamausername pointed out that he was lying low to wait for his wagon to blow over. Since I was called scum and a liar for saying something similar about where my vote was placed, and why I hadn't changed it, I'm calling him out on this.

He bought up things I'd already explained (yes, I realise I'm doing exactly that), but he said he needed to reread to check he hadn't missed anything-he clearly did, because Xite pointed out that I had explained myself. At least I'm doing him the service of re-reading stuff and pointing these suspicions out.

He then tries to explain his bandwagoning gambit...and immediately says he didn't know where he was going with it. So, why do it and waste time?

He says he isn't engaged in the game. What's the point in him being here, then? Surely not being involved and engaged is anti-town?

I don't know if he's scum or not, and I don't consider him as anti-town or scummy as tw. So, I wouldn't support a CA lynch over a tw lynch.

Xite:

The fact that he started picking on me was a source of annoyance, particularly the way he went about it was because he was being so aggressive, but whatever. At least he was being fairly productive and trying to get some kind of information out of people. Althoug his "guess the scumreasoning" was silly, and a bit anti-town.

The fact he forgot Korashk in his scumlist, like iam said, is quite odd. Saying that, I'd done the same thing, so I don't think it's a scumtell.

He does have a lot of posts which are little more than just empty quotes or random one liners that aren't useful. I don't find that helpful at all, and it's a waste of everyone's time to have to read it. This continues all the way through-post #417 is a particular favourite-5 quotes, nothing added.

Post #196. Care to elaborate? (yes, 12 days too late. Apparently noone picked up on it.)

Your explanation of your gambit is bad. You tried to, by your own admission, make me look scummy by your attack, and my defense. Why on earth would you try and make other people look scummy unless you thought they were scum-you said you thought I was town. So why bother? You look scummy for making a townie look scum-it reeks of a mafia trying to lynch a townie so they don't have to nightkill.

His initial vote on tw was done with no reason. He quoted her post, and then put "interesting" and then voted her. I don't like this, even if tw is scum, he should've at least given a reason.

He was being quite confrontational again towards tw when she first replaced it-it's a terrible attitude to take.

He wants a wendy lynch if he gets lynched tonight, then IAU one afterwards. Is this because IAU is pushing for a lynch on his scum buddy CA? Plus, he doesn't give any reasoning for his suspicion, besides "based on his last post." What in his last post? Stop casting suspicion but then not backing it up?

I can't tell him off for his case on TW. I agree with most of the points.

Personally, I don't think Xite is scum. I would support a CA lynch over him, but still TW is most suspicious, imo anyway. Time's ticking

TW's last few posts. "META META META" Meta will defend me. No, no it won't. You're being distracting, and not really helpful. AND you try and push a no lynch again. I'm bored of it now.

So yeah,

vote: tomorrow wendy

she is the scummiest and most anti-town player so far, imo, and isn't really providing much more than raeg and meta.

[Nexus]

Why would you think that I would vote xite when I've repeatedly stated that you're most suspicious, and you have either ignored or failed to answer my points, and only served to reinforce them?

[Nexus]

You've basically ruined the first day, wendy.

You've been nothing but distracting, petulant, and now you're not getting your way, you're requesting out?

Pathetic.

Oh and CA too. Wonderful.

[Nexus]

Oh yeah, I'm not annoyed at CA, at least he hasn't taken the game off the rails before disappearing.

I'm just frustrated in general. I put a lot of time into the posts when asked, and tw ignored them, came up with a load of crap, and has just generally made things awful.

[Nexus]

"Signal:noise ratio increased, but signal in general also increased imo. "

eh?

[Nexus]

That's why I was so frustrated. Even if she isn't scum, she's dicked over whoever so replaces her.

[Nexus]

Nah, tis 5 all, and tw will get lynched at the deadline as she was on 5 first.

[Nexus]

You've got the order of votes correct there.

[Nexus]

I don't even know why...I guess we should try and wade through tw's posts and see who he was most suspicious of.

*will do that today*

[Nexus]

Can't get anything from Dalt's four posts, he voted for saga and then Korashk. I was/am still suspicious of Korashk, but hey ho.

tw immediately comes in and votes havingfitz. He also calls a scumteam of Xite and fitz.

Changes to PranaDevil because PranaDevil is arguing against him, and he "claimed"-when he realised iamausername was making a joke.

Then votes for himself. *facepalm*

Pushes for a no lynch, I can't see why the scum would want rid of him 'cos of this.

Most of his reasoning is "gut." I dunno why the scum would be worried about this.

Votes for fitz again "randomly."

Reiterates the xite + fitz scum buddies, and then votes Xite.

Does quite a detailed Xite meta report.

Gets ANGRYYY and insults us all, votes himself, no lynch, himself again. derp.

Requests replacement. Votes Xite. DIES.

Now, all his points against Xite are null, since Xite flipped town. Soooo the only other people he really had suspicions against are: PranaDevil and Fitz, with occasional points against CA and iamausername, and myself. So. Yeah....

I dunno what to make of this stuff, but that's what I've gathered of tw's suspicions.

[Nexus]

@Nightwolf yes, because I can't think of any other reasoning to kill tw. As town, he was doing a great job at distracting us from the scum, so why would the scum get rid of him unless he had actually got close to the truth? Surely they would leave him so we would lynch him today? So, yes, that's the only explanation I could think of. Although, iam brings up a good point about it might've been to stop inHim from being a good town player and winning it for us.

I was just really stumped as to why tw was night killed when I would've put him at the top of my lynch list today, and I'm fairly sure most others would've too.

[Nexus]

Re: No lynch, I don't really know because I've not been in a game where it's come up yet. However, I think tomorrow would be the earliest we should think about it, personally.

[Nexus]

Because that's what makes sense to me in my head. Obviously, I'm not experienced, so don't know how it really works. Judging by other people's posts, I've completely missed the point, which is fair enough. I just assumed it was something to look into, which I did, and couldn't really draw much conclusive, so eh.

[Nexus]

@Nightwolf if we can't get a majority near the deadline, then I'd rather a no lynch than lose two townies again.

[Nexus]

After my wagon died down?

I didn't get "eerily quiet." I posted my reasons as to why I thought tw was scum, and then decided not to get involved in the massive argument that wasn't really helping anything but just distracting everyone and being lame. I posted whenever I wanted to contribute to the discussion.

CA: 32 posts
havingfitz: 40 posts
iam: 28 posts
Lateralus: 44 posts
Leech: 23 posts
Llamafluff: 17 posts
LmL: 53 posts
Nexus: 62 posts
Nightwolf: 19 posts
Prana: 74 posts
tw: 105 posts
Xite: 106 posts

Now, the last vote on my wagon was removed by the 15th of August. Now, I was v/LA until the 18th of August. So, since the 18th of August, I've made 26 posts. How is that me being quiet since my wagon died down? I've answered any and all questions put to me, I analysed CA, Xite and TW when I thought they were the scummiest, and I then isoed all of tw's posts after the lynch. So, how is that me being quiet? Especially when since my wagon died down, I've still made more posts the Llamafluff and Leech, and almost as many posts as iam and CA have altogether?

I realise you haven't really put any suspicion on me as such, but I thought I should at least defend the "eerily quiet" after my wagon thing. Of course I'm going to post slightly less when the heat is off, but I've made between 35-40% of my posts since the wagon died down, so that's not "eerily quiet."

[Nexus]

I also don't know what to make of the Lat/Prana exchange. I'll give it a reread later and see if it actually makes any sense, or if they're just arguing over and over about nothing.

[Nexus]

Having read PranaDevil's case on Llamafluff, he makes some good points. I still don't buy his reasoning for voting Xite, particularly after being on the CA wagon anyway. I still believe that whilst town, tw's play was a lot scummier/anti town than Xite's, so there's no way I'm going to agree that the Xite wagon was better than the tw wagon. The fact that his vote tipped the scales for the Xite lynch makes me suspicious anyway.

His sudden decision to stop supporting a lynch on CA is very strange. I mean, I want to wait until I get more off of him, but based on the Korashk stuff, and his recent play, I'm strongly suspicious of Llamafluff.

I think the Lat/Prana exchange was town v town, and from what I can tell, a lot of it is just a circular argument. Although, Lateralus does seem really angry that Prana's defending himself, which I don't even know why hes getting so annoyed. Surely Prana defending himself is a good thing, would you rather, if he was town, he rolled over and let you lynch him?

Now fitz. He comes in, votes iamausername, says he's suspicious of me and iam for "gut and IIoA", but he doesn't actually give any examples, but votes instead. Uh. Could you give us some actual reasoning, please?

[Nexus]

Having read PranaDevil's case on Llamafluff, he makes some good points. I still don't buy his reasoning for voting Xite, particularly after being on the CA wagon anyway. I still believe that whilst town, tw's play was a lot scummier/anti town than Xite's, so there's no way I'm going to agree that the Xite wagon was better than the tw wagon. The fact that his vote tipped the scales for the Xite lynch makes me suspicious anyway.

His sudden decision to stop supporting a lynch on CA is very strange. I mean, I want to wait until I get more off of him, but based on the Korashk stuff, and his recent play, I'm strongly suspicious of Llamafluff.

I think the Lat/Prana exchange was town v town, and from what I can tell, a lot of it is just a circular argument. Although, Lateralus does seem really angry that Prana's defending himself, which I don't even know why hes getting so annoyed. Surely Prana defending himself is a good thing, would you rather, if he was town, he rolled over and let you lynch him?

Now fitz. He comes in, votes iamausername, says he's suspicious of me and iam for "gut and IIoA", but he doesn't actually give any examples, but votes instead. Uh. Could you give us some actual reasoning, please?

Fitz?

[Nexus]

Llamafluff "debating to set alarm to force no lynch"-no. That was never going to happen, in any way, why would you even think that?
Absolutely hooked on the idea of a no lynch, despite the fact it's only D2. No lynch was never an option on Day 1. Noone wanted it besides TW, you didn't really mention it D1, I don't think. He basically hammered, he's completely misread the rules.
Lateralus blames Prana for the walls of text meaning we ignored him, but I'd say he is as at fault, but eh.
Fitz: joke votes don't help anyone, it's Day 2, it's not really necessary, but whatever.

Nightwolf: My vote was waiting to see how Llamafluff defended himself.

Not reading the rules is not acceptable. I don't understand why you wouldn't check the rules.

I just can't see past Llamafluff being scum. I thought he was scum D1, and he's done nothing to convince me otherwise today, so VOTE: Llamafluff I realise he's defended most of these accusations, but I wanted to reiterate why I was voting.

I think that puts him at L-1, but I wanted my vote somewhere.

[Nexus]

unvote

Damnit. I want to prevent a hammer until LmL defends himself.

[Nexus]

Sorry, I misread something. My mistake.

I dunno why I said Damn It. Because I felt like it, perhaps?

[Nexus]

Jesus.

Damn it was a sign of annoyance, that iam had presented such a good case on LmL that I wanted to give him a chance to see what he said before fluff got hammered. I think Llama is scum, and I now think LmL might be too.

I didn't want to deprive the town a few days to discuss-I didn't think there were any other massive suspicions, UNTIL iam posted. So I unvoted as soon as there was more massive suspicion. No, it doesn't change my opinion on Llama.

I do think the LmL accusations are valid, which is why I unvoted to explore them further.

No, I'm not his buddy. I'm nobody's buddy.

[Nexus]

My top two are probably LlamaFluff and Loudmouth Lee.

[Nexus]

LmL's case: This bit: "LoudmouthLee votes LlamaFluff, putting him at L-2, for speculating about the night kill, something that he also did himself, and something that the person he had previously been voting also did."

Now, onto other news:

I'm v/la from now until the 18th September. The mod knows, and I should be able to keep up, but don't expect too much activity from me-I'll chip in when required/if I think of something major, but for the most part, I'm not here.

[Nexus]

LmL's case: This bit: "LoudmouthLee votes LlamaFluff, putting him at L-2, for speculating about the night kill, something that he also did himself, and something that the person he had previously been voting also did."

Now, onto other news:

I'm v/la from now until the 18th September. The mod knows, and I should be able to keep up, but don't expect too much activity from me-I'll chip in when required/if I think of something major, but for the most part, I'm not here.

Bolded for relevance.

[Nexus]

unvote

vote: LoudMouthLee

He hasn't arrived to defend himself, so eh.

[Nexus]

@Nightwolf because I wanted my vote somewhere before I went v/la, and if I put it on Llama, that'd put him at L-1 meaning no more information could be got if someone decided to hammer.

*shrug* I was doing what I thought was best.

I'm currently on the train, once I reach my destination I won't be checking much.

[Nexus]

Oh yeah, that's true. Well then I'll put it on him, he's the scummiest in my eyes, closely followed by LmL.

I'm going to stay with my girlfriend, and I'm not sure she'll appreciate me sitting online, so I can't make any promises whether or not I'll have enough time to do anything today, migh

unvote

VOTE: Llamafluff

[Nexus]

Well, the deadline's today, and Llamafluff looks like getting lynched.

I don't have time to address all the points made against me, but I would like to know if LmL is awol or whether he's lurking-if he's doing the latter then I would prefer to lynch him over Llamafluff.

Also, I can address some: Leech: I didn't say I didn't want LmL at L-1. I Didn't want Llamafluff at L-1 when there was three days to go, because he could've self-hammered to prevent anymore scum hunting. I thought should have my vote somewhere before I went v/la, so I voted for my second suspect. After that, Nightwolf had voted for me, so Llamafluff was no longer at L-1, meaning I was happy to, whilst Ihad internet access, change my vote back to my initial, main suspect. I'm not bussing LmL, I just believe that a townie would not go awol without saying anything, and yes I believe not defending yourself is a scumtell. A minor one, but still relatively scummy, imo anyway.

No lynch: I am not on the fence for a no lynch-I don't want one this day. Sorry, but that's my take on it.

@Lateralus: Why would I interact with Prana just because he brought me over to MS? You can read the thread again, I haven't spoken to him unless necessary. I was always under the impression it was against the rules to discuss the game outside of the thread, and as I have no means of doing so with him, I haven't had much interaction with him in the thread.

Iso my posts #64 and #66 for why I voted Llamafluff, on top of the Korashk stuff.

I also don't believe voting me will get me lynched, Llamafluff, as it'll put me at 4, and you were at 4 first.

[Nexus]

EBWOP it looks like in fact I could answer some of the points towards me. Didn't take as long as I thought.

I am still v/la though. Sorry guys.

[Nexus]

Oh. Of course. No worries.

Do whatever you think is the best course of action, then.

[Nexus]

Nexus is Llama your number one pick for scum?

Yes. Hence my vote being on him. The only reason I took it off was to keep him from L-1 three days before deadline, so as noone hammered before we could explore all avenues. I put it on LmL so it was somewhere, and he was my second choice.

[Nexus]

Good game scum.

I was a little disappointed to be lynched whilst v/la, but eh, you win some, you lose some.