Mafia 1013 - Prozacs Basic Theme - Game has ENDED

[Jack]

This is an outright lie.

And why did he do that as scum do you think?

I made no statement that being flippant is indeed a tell, so your case on me has absolutely no bearing.

What's his case on you? I just see a couple poorly put together comments. If he's scum he's bad scum.

Unvote
Vote: mallowgeno

How do you feel about lynching him?

[StrangerCoug]

Jack 94 - What part of saying scoug said something that he completely didn't isn't a blatant fabrication?

No I agree completely, you are misreading him I think. His english isn't that good.

You are telling another player that a native speaker of English isn't good at it? When I was in high school, I was the copy editor for our newspaper, so I feel a tad insulted here.

And psst... You're not supposed to use spoiler tags.

This is an outright lie.

And why did he do that as scum do you think?

Let's think of the ways it's beneficial for town to lie, shall we? Kokusho's Gambit, bomb trying to draw a kill... Not that many.

I made no statement that being flippant is indeed a tell, so your case on me has absolutely no bearing.

What's his case on you? I just see a couple poorly put together comments.

As far as I can tell, being flippant and trying to deny that's a tell. Weak as hell, I agree.

If he's scum he's bad scum.

So?

Unvote
Vote: mallowgeno

How do you feel about lynching him?

I'm quite confident until he explains himself.

[Flameaxe]

Oh yeah. I was planning an

Unvote

during that wall of words.

[Jack]

"You are telling another player that a native speaker of English isn't good at it? When I was in high school, I was the copy editor for our newspaper, so I feel a tad insulted here."

I was talking about mallow.

[StrangerCoug]

"You are telling another player that a native speaker of English isn't good at it? When I was in high school, I was the copy editor for our newspaper, so I feel a tad insulted here."

I was talking about mallow.

That makes better sense to me.

[Porochaz]

prods and a votecount going out tomorrow, deadline is August the 17th.

[llamaeatataco]

Who are you referring to when you say "we're"?

The town in general.

@Scoug: I'm pretty sure I said I was voting him for being annoying. It's an emotion vote with a side of scumminess.

[StrangerCoug]

@Scoug: I'm pretty sure I said I was voting him for being annoying. It's an emotion vote with a side of scumminess.

I'm talking about mallowgeno's vote. (Where is mallowgeno, anyway?)

[mallowgeno]

Gah what is it that you want me to explain? You and Mitsuru both said that I'm confusing you, but you're the ones who are confusing me.

[Mitsuru Kirijo]

I never said it was a tell. You just did. I WILL say that that just makes me suspect you more and I think you just slipped.

This is what's confusing me. You seem to be saying SC said flippancy is a tell. I don't get how he said that and how it makes him slip.

[Jack]

Gah what is it that you want me to explain? You and Mitsuru both said that I'm confusing you, but you're the ones who are confusing me.

I got a daycop result on you...it said you were guilty but the flavor hinted at miller (townie who appears guilty), is that really your role?

[llamaeatataco]

He'd be fine in my book if he didn't post #129. Anybody who cannot conceive his reason for voting Jack being insulting has lost all emotions whatsoever.

That's what I was referring to.

Also, if you think Mallow's English is bad...

This is what's confusing me. You seem to be saying SC said flippancy is a tell. I don't get how he said that and how it makes him slip.

screw this. I'm tired of watching you people be too dense to figure it out.
Normally I don't go in and answer people's questions for them, but this is getting on my nerves.

Eh, It'd be too hard to do the quotes and I can't figure out how to nest them in the right order. Basically, go read Mallow's 70, or his iso 4.

Here's the basics if you won't even do that:

Being flippant is not a tell. Sorry.

I never said it was a tell. You just did. I WILL say that that just makes me suspect you more and I think you just slipped.

Does that clear anything up?

Basically, Mallow thought SC was jumping the gun by rushing to say it wasn't a tell before Mallow ever even made that connection. The implication was obvious however, so I don't really know why Mallow thought this important.

I got a daycop result on you...it said you were guilty but the flavor hinted at miller (townie who appears guilty), is that really your role?

I dislike this. I mean, it makes me think your previous actions are less scummy, but it makes things more complicated.

[llamaeatataco]

EBWOP: I was in no way implying that Mitsuru has bad English. It just came out that way. I was just referring to a player from EM that has hilariously bad English, but I forgot to finish my thought before I jumped out into something new.

[Fishythefish]

Antiprod post.

Real post coming within an hour.

[Mitsuru Kirijo]

There's no offence taken. I was just finding it difficult to identify a proper answer.

However, Jack's post gives Mallow a potential way out. It opens up all kinds of WIFOM.

[Fishythefish]

@llama: in 100, you said "did anyone else see this?", and later clarified that you meant a change in my argument. I think you must have misunderstood one of my posts; can you explain this in more detail please?

To be clear, this is what makes me think you are scum:
- I said (69) that you were strawmanning my argument by condensing it to "scum use smilies more than town".
- You said (73) that that was what my argument was when you stripped away the crap.
- In 100, you admit that there was another part to my argument, that you agree with.
Now, I don't think 73 could have come from a player who had actually bothered to read over my arguments again when I accused you of strawmanning me. When accused of a strawman as town, I think the natural reaction is to read the argument you are supposed to be strawmanning. Since you didn't do that, I think you are scum. Here's your refutation of this in 100:

I don't believed that you actually went back and looked at my posts when I challenged you on that. And since your supposedly basing your vote off my posts, I find that pretty suspect.

I find it hard to believe that you really don't think I read your post at all... Especially when I quoted it to you. You = Liar. Liars = scum. Therefore, you = scum.

Oh wait, that was someone else who said that, so it doesn't have that ironic effect.


Jokey style =/= trying to be liked by town. Jokey style = personality. End of story.

It's simply not relevant. I'm not saying you didn't read 69; I'm saying you didn't bother to go back and read what I said you were strawmanning. It's also actually not at all relevant here whether my "jokey style = trying to be liked" theory holds water. So, here's my question: when posting 73 in reply to 69, did you go back and reread my posts about BB? If not, why not?

@xvart:

So... do you think that trying to be liked is not a strong scumtell? Which is scummier: concocting cases or trying to be liked? And maybe opportunistic wasn't the right word, but I see your vote as trying to initiate a wagon for something that isn't there. I meant that there was a opportunity to make someone scummy available (even with weak justification) and you jumped on it. What has been the benefit to creating weak cases to avoid random voting in the past? How has this helped the town in your other games?

I think that trying to be liked is a weak scumtell.
I don't really know what you mean by "concocting cases". I think it's far too broad a phrase for me to answer that question meaningfully. IMO, making a weak case in the RVS isn't scummy at all; making a case based on a nulltell in order to vote on a big bandwagon is far scummier than trying to be liked.
Creating weak cases (but still based on scumtells of some magnitude) to avoid the RVS is far better at provoking discussion and reaction than the RVS in my experience. I've done this a lot in my games (probably more the more recently you look), and I think it makes the start of the game go faster and more productively. I don't have specific cases up my sleeve for how it's affected the rest of the day or game; I suggest you look into my history if you want to. I can't see why it would be better to cast a random vote than a not-quite-random vote.

[Porochaz]

Llama - 4 - raivann, Budja, Fishythefish, Anon
mallowgeno - 2 - Mitsuru, Strangercoug
Fishythefish - 1 - xvart
Strangercoug - 1 - mallowgeno
Budja - 1 - Blackberry
Jack - 1 - Llama

Not Voting - 2 - Jack, Flameaxe

Deadline August the 17th

[Porochaz]

It appears I made a mistake in the last two votecounts. Luckily noone noticed but make sure your vote is in the correct spot.

[Porochaz]

Blackberry will be prodded, raivan, budja, Anon have 24 hours to post.

[Blackberry]

I am disappointed. I just spent so much time looking through things on two players and still don't have any ideas of what to make of it:

Budja

- in all your other games you are prone to making smiley faces quite often, yet you haven't made a single one this game (however, you've done this as mafia as well in the past, so I can't really make anything of it except you lost your emotions ) - and the thing that yall refer to as a "secret scumtell" Budja has done in the past as a town. However, I still want you to give more of yourself. Something about you makes me think you are mafia.

StrangerCoug was the other player I read up on (it took me forever to find a game where you were mafia). I didn't notice any difference in what I was looking for.

I am now looking at Jack and Fishy.

[Blackberry]

I was about to do Fishy, but reading Fishy's post I decided I'd do Raivvan instead. Here are my interesting results:

* Two of the three times he was previously mafia, his reasons for voting someone were "trying to make himself look like town" or too "townie" or something along those lines.

FoS:Blackberry

for 5 smilies and 1 Lol in 1 post, if you count the first O_o. With that many in a short post it looks like sucking up.

--> I thought at some point he accused me of being "too townie", looking back I realize that was Fishy -_- ... I thought I'd post this anyways since I'm wasting so much time looking at all this stuff.

* Also, I could only find one game where you were playing with Budja - in which you were lynched for being mafia. So the argument of "I always get lynched early" sounds silly in that case.

-----

To be blunt, I really have no idea what to make of anyone at this moment (probably because I'm tired ). Jack still has not answered my question, and I want that question answered.

Vote: Jack

[Fishythefish]

I never accused you of being "too townie".

[Blackberry]

((I had more time than I thought))

Anon

- I found my post where someone calls someone "too town"

Budja

- not really sure what to think, also, bandwagon on me, post 67 - when reading through old games, you said "bla blah's point is OK" when you were SCUM

Fishythefish

- second to take the bait, end of 52 sounds like scum

Flameaxe

- i originally thought he may be being nice to me, nothing he has done though as struck me as unusual yet, 64 looks like backtracking

Jack

- noncooperative? also, bandwagon on me without stating anything

llamaeatataco

- attacks the players attacking me (indirectly defending me, read: more an open-minded and logical player), his reasons for voting Fishy sounded legitimate and it sounded sincere, but him switching to someone else doesn't sound like town (it almost sounds like Mafia who gave up on his other wagon idea)

mallowgeno

- the only thing I have to note is that you didn't read my original post asking questions, indicating you weren't paying attention

Mitsuru Kirijo

- one of her early posts made me think town, post 60 - i don't see why anyone would think EVERYTHING SAID was overreacting-that indirectly means you think none of them are mafia almost?

Raivann

- first to take the bait, however, didn't really vote me, just started it

StrangerCoug

- attacks the players attacking me (indirectly defending me, read: more an open-minded and logical player), 55 just looks odd

xvart

- i didn't write anything down about you on my reread, i guess you didn't do anything that caught my attention

----

This is a side note away from the game. What exactly is a Prozac?

There are three definitions:

1: My medication

...

2: Medication for people with Depression or Anxiety (Panic Attacks). It inhibits the serotonin-reuptake.

3: It is also a nickname for Porochaz because (insert reason).

---

Also, why are people saying they're read on Jack is going up/sour? My read on Jack is going NO WHERE is he is being an uncooperative asshole.

[Fishythefish]

When you say Raivann and I "took the bait", does that imply a deliberate trap?

[Mitsuru Kirijo]

I thought the reaction to your smiley use was over the top. Perhaps I should have been more specific. I don't see how smilies are an attempt to be liked. I thought votes and FOSes based on such a strategy were overreactions. And judging by your meta, you often use smilies anyway