Newbie 985 Game over

[Nikanor]

Bussing is voting for your scumbuddy.
In your case, that would be Kalofer.

[DavidParker]

Nikanor is town.

[tvellalott]

:O *Sticks up the Finger of Rudeness at Nikanor* I'm pretty certain that Kalofer is town.
DavidParker: What do you base that on?

BTW, No one is voting for me, so clearly I'm town. ^_^

[Kalofer]

Did your magic - 8 ball tell you that?

[FakeGod]

yo DP, I want you to use your magic 8 ball on every player right now.

Ask it "Is this player scum?" for each player, and post us the results, k?

[DavidParker]

Zombeh-Pugna: Ask again later
NashiNashi: Better not tell you now
Abe: Cannot predict now
tvell: Concentrate and ask again

Seems it doesn't want to tell me anything...

[FakeGod]

Your "magic" 8 ball is worthless.

I would throw it out first chance.

[Kalofer]

You DARE disrespect his MAGIC 8-BALL??!!! watch yourself, it's gonna say you're scum AND IT DOESN'T LIE!!!!

[DavidParker]

the magic 8 ball doesn't have feelings.. what do you think it's some kind of gimmick??!??!?!

[Kalofer]

...Maybeeeee

[Excedrin]

Day 1 Deadline, Sun Aug 8 21:21:00 PDT 2010


Vote Count

FakeGod (2): NashiNashi, Abe27342
Zachrulez (3): DavidParker, Kalofer, tvellalott
Kalofer (3): Nikanor, Zachrulez, FakeGod

not voting: Zombeh-Pug
alive: 9 majority: 5

[tvellalott]

We still got another week.

[Zombeh-Pug]

Bussing is voting for your scumbuddy.
In your case, that would be Kalofer.

What do you think be scummy about tvell?

Zombeh, to your irrelevant question I will make the honest but unfortunately dumb answer, it was to primarily add more fuel to confusion, to sate that which I bet was going on in your heads when you read it , and to test how much you I've managed to convince you I'm a townie. I won't do it again, because it was stupid...sorry.

Imma not take your try-to-act-newb apology at the end and I now consider you suspicious. Keep that in mind.

Some other suspicious people I be finding is:
Nashinashi- seems to be all-for discussion(#65) yet has been lurking
tvell- decided to self indicate himself as scummy in his own post(#268) so I will too

And david didn't answer the question asked in #277:

DavidParker: What do you base that on?

[Zombeh-Pug]

ebwop: What I meant by 'so I will too' on post above is that I'll just agree with his scum sign and think of him as suspicious.

[FakeGod]

Zombeh vote plz. (Did you see my post regarding people not voting?)

[DavidParker]

And david didn't answer the question asked in #277:

DavidParker: What do you base that on?

The Magic 8 Ball of course.

[Nikanor]

What do you think be scummy about tvell?

He was coaching Kalofer, someone who I find suspicious.

Zombeh, you look like a man who is willing to lynch Kalofer. Are you willing to put him at L-1?

[tvellalott]

tvell- decided to self indicate himself as scummy in his own post(#268) so I will too

I thought I already covered this.
Clearly I am not bandwagonning Zachrulez. I am voting for him because I noticed that out of four votes, he was never the first person to vote for anyone. At that point the three main contenders for votes (Kalofer, FakeGod and Zachrulez) were all 2+ votes, so you cannot classify any of them as bandwagonning in a game this small.

Can everyone voting reassert why they think Kalofer is scummy? I just don't see it.

[NashiNashi]

Analysis time. This took a wee while.

Kalofer

There’re so much fence sitting, the sort that I would’ve nailed him all over for if it’s not a newbie game. Yet those behaviour are so very consistent to just being new.

My reason for believing that he is more likely to be Town than Scum is that scums tend to be far firmer at grilling and FoSing, as they know for sure who they are accusing is. Yet Kalofer? He is unsure of himself? From the sound of it? How he ends so many of his sentences with questions? Which don’t come across as a good look regard less if he’s a town or a scum? He even asks “where did I screw up”(#195) within the game. I found this far too suicidal for a scum who knows what they are doing. Lots of the accusations are based on the assumption that he has some ideas on what he’s trying to do, while what I’m seeing is someone overwhelmed by a huge learning curve and no one in game is explaining anything to him.

If he was a newbie Scum, he would likely to be coached by the other scum in private to remove the hatch cross on his forehead. As a newbie Town, he’s on his own. He reminded me very much of the townie who was quick hammered in my last game with David, a player called Parkourie.

I still stand in that I read him as a newbie town. If Kalofer turned out to be a scum, then this would be hell of a learning of a game for me.

Verdict: Likely town.


Tvellalott

Wishywashy voter in the beginning (which isn't significant on its own but worth noting). Post #126, regard to voting for David on the basis that he didn’t analyse himself is truly bizarre. In a newbie game, would anyone seriously suggest not self-analysing their role a scummy behaviour? As if any self analysis in this sort of setting would ever be trust worthy to begin with.

I thoroughly enjoyed his analysis on page 11 though.

Verdict: Could be scum, right now I’m unsure.


Abe27342

Solid analysis, I read protown. Not much else to say.

Verdict: Likely town


FakeGod

I still don’t know where he stands, beside that the only thing that stood out to me was his “vote or you are scum” saga. That lead is truly dusted now, and even though I disagree with the logic, I think his explanation is sincere.

I no longer see the need of my vote.

Unvote FakeGod

Verdict: Unknown.


DavidParker (SE)

David is a character. Once I have moved on from the newbie phase, I can foresee some incredibly fun games with him in the future. Having said that, learning with David is a little bit nightmarish because of his play style.
He is very good at initiating discussions, a catalyst of the game. Based on my last game, something I had not commented on was that even though his scum-telling is not 100% accurate, he had made some pretty amazing observations just by reading between the lines. However, in this game he had forgo the arguing with logic and facts, and started with arguing with Magic-8-Ball –not that helpful for the new players. I found this strange and somewhat suspicious, but still I have not played enough with him to know whether it’s a common tactic. Further complicating the matter, I don’t know what his D1 usually goes as he was a replacement.

I get that he stated he doesn’t adhere to a single Meta, but still it’s something that I found worth looking at. And before anyone asks, no it’s not a policy suspicion. I’m more interested in seeing inconsistency in one player, than “all players playing like this should be lynched”.

Verdict: Unsure.


Zachrulez (IC)

I see Zachrulez as the either character right now, however I am quite disappointed at the mentoring from him so far. There are very little explanation for new players, and he is not encouraging discussions or giving out tips as what I think an IC should be. A link to another topic is the best you can do? Really?

Nor that I am convinced with “I’m not giving out standard game theories because no one asked”. (Post 183) This is a NEWBIE game. In order to even ask the right questions people would need some degree of experience. The IC should be taking the initiatives – be the locomotion choo choo, not the safety net.

He just does not come across as someone who is eager to help throwing the rope. Perhaps a scum who sees winning more important than being IC guide? So far both of the SE had done far more at teaching than he has, and Nikanor had stated right in the beginning that he didn’t want to teach. Ridding of the IC so early in the game is a risky move, and we are at the point that we could get hammered. Hence I'm holding onto my vote until later on, even if my FoS is on him.

Verdict: Likely scum.


Zombeh-Pug and Nikanor (SE), my questions are regard to you guys?

Nikanor
Something, intuitively about him, makes me think scum. Yet because I can’t pin point down why, this is conflicting. In the past I have passed pressing a “gut feeling” who later proved to be the winning scum, so this time I’m not going to ignore this.
Nikanor. Why should I vote Zombie-Pug over you?

Zombeh-pug
You are another lurker. Being a lurker myself, this alone is not enough for me to vote, but it does make my attempt of analysing you difficult. So question. Why should I vote Nikanor over you?

[tvellalott]

I really enjoyed reading that NashiNashi, good work.

[Kalofer]

Something else I find scummy about Zach is his response to #268 because he didn't address Tvell's main point which was "Zachrulez has never made an original vote" , but instead started picking on Tvell for saying "You seem to want to lynch someone, anyone. " And "Third on bandwagon is classic sign of scum". In other words he started defending himself from Tvell's opinions in an attempt to turn attention and suspicion back on tvell but disregarded the fact of the post which was the most important part.

[Kalofer]

Oh and by the way Zombeh, that was an honest answer, I see no need for townies to lie and so I answered it, and instead of fabricating an answer I gave you the truth. Feel fre to think suspicious for that, If I were you, I'd think myself suspicious, as unfortunately lie detectors don't work over the internet.

And seriously Nik, why so merciless, isn't there at least a little bit of something gnawing at you in the back of your head telling you "he could be town", cause there certainly is in me for whoever I vote. Why and I really want to know why are you so certain that I'm scum and want to kill me no matter what?

[Zachrulez]

Something else I find scummy about Zach is his response to #268 because he didn't address Tvell's main point which was "Zachrulez has never made an original vote" , but instead started picking on Tvell for saying "You seem to want to lynch someone, anyone. " And "Third on bandwagon is classic sign of scum". In other words he started defending himself from Tvell's opinions in an attempt to turn attention and suspicion back on tvell but disregarded the fact of the post which was the most important part.

"Zachrulez has never made an original vote" is a non point. Just because I don't place the first vote on someone means that my vote is somehow less valid and more scummy? What?

And yeah, I want to lynch scum. That requires investigating and changing my vote accordingly. I do not see how that translates into me wanting to lynch anyone. (I do have town reads afterall.)

As for third on the bandwagon, it's a point against Tvel that's legitimately scummy about him. The fact that he thinks it's as simple as explaining his actions to set himself apart from HIS OWN STANDARD that he applied to Fakegod is just ridiculous.

[Zachrulez]

Zachrulez (IC)

I see Zachrulez as the either character right now, however I am quite disappointed at the mentoring from him so far. There are very little explanation for new players, and he is not encouraging discussions or giving out tips as what I think an IC should be. A link to another topic is the best you can do? Really?

Nor that I am convinced with “I’m not giving out standard game theories because no one asked”. (Post 183) This is a NEWBIE game. In order to even ask the right questions people would need some degree of experience. The IC should be taking the initiatives – be the locomotion choo choo, not the safety net.

He just does not come across as someone who is eager to help throwing the rope. Perhaps a scum who sees winning more important than being IC guide? So far both of the SE had done far more at teaching than he has, and Nikanor had stated right in the beginning that he didn’t want to teach. Ridding of the IC so early in the game is a risky move, and we are at the point that we could get hammered. Hence I'm holding onto my vote until later on, even if my FoS is on him.

Verdict: Likely scum.

The IC role is a role I am required to play regardless of my alignment. It has no bearing on my alignment. The issues you are bringing forth are a clash of styles with the way you expect me to play the IC role vs how I play it. It's also a role that can be influential and be used to a player's advantage when they are actively throwing out the IC term all the time. I don't believe in teaching a standard set of theory and accepted behavior to newbies. I believe more in letting them develop on their own and answering questions about things they aren't sure of along the way.

It doesn't matter what my alignment is, I have chosen to play the IC role in this way because it's what I believe in. (Go read some of my past IC games.)

I'm still a player in the game, and I still want to find and lynch scum. The most important job I have is to actually play mafia and not baby the players along the way. That means I'm not going to take it easy on my suspects just because they're a newbie and I'm an IC if I happen to think that they are scum.

You won't learn how to climb the hill if I do it for you.

[Zachrulez]

I'm treating Nashi's FOS of me as a 4th vote. If there's someone else that finds me suspicious enough for a vote that's not already voting me, they should make that intention clear. I'll work on posting my opinion of everyone in light of this, and if there is enough support for my lynch, all I ask is that I'm not hammered before being given a chance to claim. (Hammering before a claim is terrible play.)