Newbie 983 ~ Game Over!

[drmyshottyizsik]

@ Seraphim I never said you were Scum i said you were coming off as scummy. And if you read my post I apologized for my attacks on hindu and switz. I also never said Foilist was scum i said if I had to choose he would be up there, buttttt that was before you came in and acted Scummy. My vote for Prox is what I believe. AND! I never called G & H scum, Yes I think he is anti-town, but because I can't read him I have no proof to call him the slightest bit scum, thus the towniest. You are really seeming like Prox's scum buddy to me. Just saying.

[Switz]

@Arch:

Now I'm going to reverse it and ask what you think about Hinduragi. One of your first posts here denounced him out of nowhere, and since then you've been content to let everyone else do your work for you. Out of all your posts since then, you've mentioned him twice, and neither has been even remotely in response to his defense against your accusations.

Answer or you're getting my vote. Your avoiding this question only further cements my point above. You ask a lot of questions, get a lot of info from the rest of the town, but don't answer any yourself or do anything with the info you get.

@Seraphim:

My apologies for what you've got to work with, Haylen was starting to look pretty scummy by the time you got in. Her last few posts in particular are giving me really bad vibes, and while it seems there's RL issues behind them, I can't help but read them as scummy. If you hadn't replaced in just now, I'd have voted her, so I'll be keeping an eye on you.

@Hinduragi:

Sorry, I don't have any other finished games on this site, mafia or otherwise. And I haven't played online in years, so I honestly don't even know where I'd find old ones, but I'd hope my ability to play games like this has improved/changed since then, so it probably wouldn't help anyways.

@Shotty:

You are really seeming like Prox's scum buddy to me. Just saying.

As Seraphim has just said above, not everyone can be Prox's scumbuddy. If you are really town, give us some actual evidence for your accusations, not OMGUS and AtE. I decided to unvote you to go after G&H, but more and more it's looking like I should go back to you. (Arch: not an excuse to ignore my accusations).

Vote: Shotty

[Hinduragi]

Switz - Err, I think you misunderstood. The analysis of your post was simply in response to Bob's post. I wanted to know if he had any previous games as scum. I'll explain why after he posts some games.

Shotty -

You are really seeming like Prox's scum buddy to me.

Coming from you, this means absolutely nothing. You said this about nearly(Maybe even all of them?) every player who built a case against you. As Switz mentioned above, give us evidence and analysis if you can of who you decide to call a scumbuddy.

Seraphim - Haylen already had her vote on Shotty.

[KittyMo]

[3] drmyshottyizsik - (Hinduragi, Seraphim, Switz)

[2] Seraphim - (archaebob, foilist13)
[1] Good and Honest - (silverbullet999)
[1] Prox - (drmyshottyizsik)

[0] archaebob - ()
[0] foilist13 - ()
[0] Hinduragi - ()
[0] silverbullet999 - ()
[0] Switz - ()

[2]

Not Voting

- (Good and Honest, Prox)

With

9

alive, it's

5

to lynch!

Deadline is at Wednesday, August 4, 2010 at 9:00:00 PM (Los Angeles time)

[foilist13]

@Seraphim: I don't see nervous energy in Shotty's posts at all. His play falls firmly within the realm of newbie town. Yours, limited though it is, looks like scum. I have no reason to change my vote at this time. I'm not going to attack your points against shotty as that would be defending him too much, but I have a solid town read on him and you are not being successful at convincing me otherwise.

[silverbullet999]

Haylen's actions has seemed like haylen being her normal self to me, thus I don't suspect seraphim

G&H in my mind is the wild card, his position let's us assume he's town but there's no evidence in my mind to back that up. Though when was he already at L-2? Also the assumption that if G&H is scum he would act differently just seems absurd... whomever G&H is, he's a fully developed character that has been posting novels from the get go. If he is scum I highly doubt he would all of a sudden act more aggressive or different, he is very passive in my mind.

Shotty's been dancing around for me between newb and scum, his actions have been varied to say the least and his reactions when i asked why he was willing to lynch so soon his reaction was interesting.

Bob i really want you to answer my question/s.

Foil- wanna build on the seraphim case a bit more?

Hindu - what's your take on foilist view and seraph?

Shotty -

I decided to unvote you to go after G&H, but more and more it's looking like I should go back to you.

When did you heavily go for G&H? Pretty sure as soon as someone mentioned that your vote was supposedly useless you decided to unvote and drop it completely if memory serves me right.

[Seraphim]

Let's run this down.

I also never said Foilist was scum i said if I had to choose he would be up there

You missed the point then. The point is this: according to you, everyone and their dog is Prox's scumbuddy. That's the main gist of the quote wall.

Now, let's talk about Good and Honest and Drmyshotty. Here's how it boils down for me and really implicates shotty as scum. It's his entire idea of...well...this:

I never called G & H scum, Yes I think he is anti-town, but because I can't read him I have no proof to call him the slightest bit scum, thus the towniest.

This statement allows shotty to, at the same time, call G&H the scummiest...oh sorry, "anti-town"-est player in the game and push for his lynch, avoid giving any sort of town read on any player, and open up an avenue to push for his mislynch at any time. It is a contradiction: why would you want to lynch a player that you say is the towniest even if you don't have a read on that player? It doesn't make any sense from a town perspective to want to lynch the towniest player!

Seraphim - Haylen already had her vote on Shotty.

Cool. But my vote cements the idea that I am a separate entity from Haylen.

@Folist
Maybe nervous energy isn't the right phrase. but something about his posting doesn't sit right with me. So, please explain why my limited posting is so scummy. I am very curious to hear what you have to say. At the risk of defending him, explain why my points against Shotty are invalid. If you're going to vote me, I want to hear WHY.

[silverbullet999]

Meant SWITZ for the last quote above nottt Shotty

Sorryz

[Switz]

@Silverbullet:

I never said I was going "heavily" after G&H, as you put it. And I already explained why I had changed my mind on G&H.

@G&H:

At this point, I think I'm going to have to side with Foilist and Arch. If you don't take a more active (read: voting and actually scumhunting) role, we're going to have to get rid of you, because you're a liability to the town. Unvote, Vote: G&H

@ Switz - what are you accomplishing with your G&H vote exactly? I like most of your play so far, but I think you aren't maximizing the information generating potential of your actions right now.

I'm indicating that I think he should be lynched?...I'm not sure what your problem with this is. Would you rather I just voted and unvoted every player in succession, as you seem to be doing? We can question people without voting them arbitrarily. Also, how do you expect to definitively find both scum today? For one thing, you can't definitively know anything until after lynching a scum/N1 w/ a cop, and for another, I was under the impression you too were looking to get rid of G&H tonight.

I'd say you have it backwards. You can indicate who you think should be lynched without voting for them, but you can't really pressure players that much with just questions.

And ouch! What a misrep. Really? I'm just randomly voting all the players in succession? I've voted exactly two players, and I've explained clearly why those players got the votes they did. And unlike you, I'm making very active efforts to pressure the players that I vote in ways that I hope will expose their alignment. What are you doing to scumhunt G&H?

Also, I never said anything about "definitively finding both scum." I said I was optimistic about our chances of nailing both scum. Suspicions are almost never "definitively" right. They often are accurate though.

And finally, whether or not "I too" was interested in getting rid of G&H tonight should be irrelevant to whether or not you suspect him. And if you were reading the thread carefully, you might have noticed my most recent post that I addressed to him, in which I said I'd be willing to let him live at least into D2 if he were willing to compromise with me.

You're also right about me misusing my vote, and for that I apologize. I still think getting rid of G&H is our best bet, but it's best to keep an open mind and scumhunt as long as we can.

Unvote

So that's how that went down. I was going after G&H because Foilist and Arch's arguments had convinced me it was best, but as time passed, other arguments convinced me the opposite way. I still think G&H is a liability, but I never thought he was scummy. So when I said, as you quoted, that I unvoted Shotty to "go after" G&H, I wasn't going after G&H because I thought he was scum. Thus, Shotty's recent actions plus my prior suspicions are enough to justify my current vote.

[Hinduragi]

Hindu - what's your take on foilist view and seraph?

Well, Foil said he considers Seraphim's posts scummy. I don't really see it atm. Seraphim is null tell to me. Atm, though, I want to say he's scum if I look at what Haylen did earlier. I want to see more of a case brought against him before I even consider changing my vote. I did see the nervous energy in Shotty but that was only when he replied to that nervous energy. Such as "I not nervous at all" or his OMGUS vote. Take into account that he has had a part in voting for anyone who voted for him and that just about sums up what I would call possible nervous energy. Overall, I'm going to leave my vote where it is until I see more evidence brought towards Seraphim because, as he himself pointed out, he is a separate entity from Haylen. Also, SB, I asked you a question in post 269.

Mod: Prox unvoted Haylen.

Gotcha, sorry for messing up again! Thanks for letting me know! ^^ ~KittyMo

[silverbullet999]

Switz - thank you

Hindu - whoops...

Why is your vote still on G&H?

Votes still on G&H cause I'm not sure if I wanna hop the shotty wagon just yet as we still gots a weekish before our deadline. (Basically the vote on G&H is harmless now and I want more responses from certain people before I decide to switch). When was he at L-2 though?

[archaebob]

Mod: I'm

V/LA

until the 31st.

I'll try to keep up with reading, and I might be able to interject one or two small comments, but I have a very special friend who is coming to visit me, and I can't spend the hour daily that I usually do.

[foilist13]

@Folist
Maybe nervous energy isn't the right phrase. but something about his posting doesn't sit right with me. So, please explain why my limited posting is so scummy. I am very curious to hear what you have to say. At the risk of defending him, explain why my points against Shotty are invalid. If you're going to vote me, I want to hear WHY.

See, I think you first need to explain what doesn't sit right with you. You've just posted a disclaimer on your original post, so you need to repost your case with the appropriate changes. Otherwise my analysis would be totally invalid as you could claim that any part of it was not actually what you meant due to the disclaimer. You need to post a case I can hold you to before I attack it if I still want to.

What my issue with your original case itself is, not taking into account you as a player, is that I believe you are wrong. Shotty's play has a few key characteristics that do not coincide with your representation of his play.

1) I see that he is erratic but not inconsistent. He has declared Prox to be scum, and that is clearly his most solid read. Every time someone posts something that spikes his suspicion he naturally pursues the possibility that they might be scum. If they are scum, it stands to reason that they would be Prox's partner as he is the strongest scum read.

2) The posts do not seem to be designed to avoid attention. He is enthusiastic, and is clearly a new player (no offense meant at all here Shotty). His posts reflect newbie town making an honest attempt to find scum. I don't see anything in your case that tells me otherwise.

So to make things easier for everyone I'll post my scum list as it is right now. There will be only two scum on this list as that is how many exist in the game.

SilverBullet: Town
Archaebob: Town
Hinduragi: Scum
Seraphim: Scum
Switz: Town
Good & Honest: Town
Shotty: Town
Prox: Town
foilist13: The Lord your God

[Seraphim]

It's called gut and I'm sorry if I can't explain it better than that. I saw nervous energy posted somewhere else in the game and thought that was an adequate phrase.

1) I see that he is erratic but not inconsistent. He has declared Prox to be scum, and that is clearly his most solid read. Every time someone posts something that spikes his suspicion he naturally pursues the possibility that they might be scum. If they are scum, it stands to reason that they would be Prox's partner as he is the strongest scum read.

How about when he accuses three people of being scum? How about when he calls G&H the towniest player in the game, while at the same time calling for his lynch and his playstyle anti-town? This(his inconsistent dealing of G&H) doesn't match up for me and is, I feel, the crux of my case.

2) The posts do not seem to be designed to avoid attention. He is enthusiastic, and is clearly a new player (no offense meant at all here Shotty). His posts reflect newbie town making an honest attempt to find scum. I don't see anything in your case that tells me otherwise.

I have played with overenthusiastic scum before. Not all scum are looking to avoid drawing attention to themselves especially newbscum.

[Good and Honest]

Hello Seraphim! I'm very glad to see that you are also interested in making music!

To everyone - if you can't endure reading my posts in their entirety, at least search them for your names because I'd like to know your reactions to my comments and questions directed towards you.

Some time has passed since archaebob's and foilist13's arrival so now I'll examine them. archaebob made a direct accusation against Hinduragi right from the start. While doing that, archaebob sounded really sure of having discovered a mafioso (although I have the impression that it's usual for archaebob to sound that way). After that archaebob concentrated entirely on trying to persuade me to change something about my playstyle, without mentioning Hinduragi again in the process. And then suddenly archaebob focused on Haylen, saying: "Also, I want to see what Hindu will do with a little breathing room. We might be wrong about him after all". I agree with Switz that this is confusing. archaebob, you didn't even comment on Hinduragi's reaction to your and foilist13's attacks. At least you could have explained what made you think you might be wrong - otherwise the other players are just left wondering.

Then archaebob started interrogating various players and asking them to do certain things, which I think is good because it makes everyone more involved in the discussions. However, I was quite surprised by archaebob's expressed suspicion of foilist13. The only thing which I agreed was strange was that at first foilist13 has asked me to replace out but later told Prox that the goal wasn't to make me replace out. But I can understand that if foilist13 truly had misunderstood me in the beginning. But I was even more puzzled by archaebob's later explanation to foilist13: "You just seem more hardcore and jittery in this game than I'm used to seeing in your town meta". It might be that I don't really understand this sentence (in this case, archaebob, please clarify it) but I don't see how it relates to archabob's original expressed suspicion of foilist13.

Then there were some interesting interactions between archaebob and silverbullet999 but then archaebob neglected a detailed post by silverbullet999 (archaebob, I hope you'll address it at some point) and concentrated entirely on Haylen, whom I'll talk about below.

foilist13, I'm happy to learn that you also love to write! What can I say about foilist13? I did think at the time that archaebob should receive more credit for the case against Hinduragi simply because archaebob was the first to make it. While yes, foilist13 agreed, I wasn't sure whether foilist13 would have been so suspicious of Hinduragi without archaebob's analysis of Hinduragi's writing. However, since then archaebob has decided to leave Hinduragi be while foilist13 has constantly repeated suspicion of Hinduragi. More recently, foilist13 has expressed suspicion of Haylen - but it has to be said, again after archaebob. foilist13 doesn't seem to have such an investigative approach as archaebob in this game.

As a whole, for now I definitely find archaebob's behaviour stranger than foilist13's. archaebob has already commented on foilist13 (expressing suspicion). foilist13, I'd like it if you also comment on archaebob's behaviour in this game. Does it surprise you? How would you relate it to your previous playing experiences with archaebob?

drmyshottyizsik, well done for the effort to respond to Prox's big post! However, you're still neglecting some questions that you have been asked. I'll repeat a couple of mine now. After archaebob and foilist13 attacked Hinduragi, you said something I found interesting:

"I really wanna hear Haylen's views on who she thinks is the scum pair, cause if she thinks its Prox and hindu then she should unvote prox and get hindu"

So, why did you want to hear Haylen's views specifically? And it sounded like you found it likely that Haylen may suspect a Prox-Hinduragi mafia team. Why did you think so?

About Haylen... Well, there are many pecuilar things. For example, this statement: "I do admit though that I came into the game a lot more aggressive than I usually do". I didn't actually find anything aggressive about Haylen's behaviour in the very few posts Haylen had made prior to that statement (unless voting Prox for asking me whether I'm a mafioso counts as aggressive?!).

I had noted that immediately after drmyshottyizsik made the post cited above, Haylen appeared and addressed it - in spite of remaining silent for quite long periods of time before that. Haylen's comment to my observation was: "Technically, I am always online. However, I am not always available". But that didn't explain at all why Haylen suddenly was available especially for addressing drmyshottyizsik's post.

Then there was the fact that Haylen made statements about a few players - archaebob, Switz, me - but without offering explanations. The problem is that Haylen was going to be replaced any minute - it would have been helpful to give us as much information as Haylen had gathered until then. For whatever reason, Haylen chose not to. By the way, I have to agree with archaebob that it's extremely curious that Haylen decided to mention Switz specifically...

Haylen's last post started immediately with "Woahwoahwoah, who said I wasn't committed?". I have the feeling that Haylen might have insisted on being commited because of previously saying "As town I get very emotionally involved in the game"...

Finally, archaebob had told Haylen to vote for archaebob or drmyshottyizsik... and Haylen voted for drmyshottyizsik. However, previously Haylen had expressed suspcision of archaebob while only saying this about drmyshottyizsik: "I would look Shotty to be looked into". When voting, Haylen didn't mention actually finding something suspicious about drmyshottyizsik...

I don't know. It's a pity that Haylen won't be able to answer any of our questions now - and I wonder whether some of Haylen's actions were done exactly because Haylen wouldn't need to answer for them. If Haylen were in a bad mood when writing that last post, this should probably also be taken into consideration... Anyway, Seraphim has only recently arrived and I'll wait some time before commenting on Seraphim.

Hinduragi, I have a couple of questions regarding your post #222. You say to Haylen: "Enlighten us why we shouldn't lynch G&H since you don't have a vote on anyone". First of all, at that time Haylen had a vote on Prox. Also, why did you want Haylen to enlighten us why we shouldn't lynch ME specifically?

In the same post, you commented on archaebob's reasons for expressing suspicion of foilist13. You stated: "The second one just doesn't give me a scum tell but it looks to me like you were trying to hide a possible bus" - I must admit I don't understand this sentence, could you clarify it for me?

It was very interesting for me to read about your previous experience with the game of Mafia. I can certainly accept your explanation for the change in your playstyle/writing style - you're adapting to this forum. Unfortunately, it doesn't change the fact that archaebob's analysis of you makes sense for the beginning of the game, where it did seem like you were trying to avoid suspicion. I know you can't do anything about that now and it shouldn't really be considered definite evidence for anything but is something to have in mind...

foilist13, you haven't commented on Hinduragi's explanations for Hinduragi's style and the changes in it. What do you think about that?

Hinduragi, maybe I wasn't clear - I didn't mean "good" parts of my playstyle as opposed to "bad". I meant that my playstyle is characterized by being "good" and "honest". You explored the "honest" part but not the "good" one. Anyway, of course I'd like to see a full-depth analysis of my plastyle! But you don't need to do it immediately. If you think it's not really relevant to our current game, you may share it in the post-game comments.

Oh, and this question - "Do you leave subliminal or minute hints as to your faction within your posts without knowing it yourself?" - is impossible to answer from a logical standpoint, I think. If I myself don't know that I'm leaving hints, I can't answer whether I'm leaving hints without knowing! However, I can think of at least one thing which could probably show whether I have a "good" or a "bad" role in a particular game - but I hope you'll agree that it wouldn't be wise to tell anyone what it is!

silverbullet999, I have to agree with Hinduragi that it seemed strange that you voted for me when archaebob asked you why you weren't voting. Would you have voted at that time if archaebob hadn't asked?

As a whole, you were more active in Newbie 965 than in Newbie 940. It seems like now you are playing more like you did in Newbie 940 - but there you said the reason was that you were new. Now it seems like this is an intentional approach. By the way, interestingly, both in Newbie 940 and here there has been a "silverbullet999 strikes back" moment after someone has attacked you - it was Nobody Special there and archaebob here...

Prox, I want to ask you something about your post #206. You unvoted there and then it seemed like you wanted to vote Haylen. KittyMo even counted that as a vote for Haylen. But I want to be sure so did you really intend to vote Haylen in that post?

Also, I found those readibility statistics for my post quite interesting! What were they meant to prove?

[silverbullet999]

Really arch.... not even going to attempt to answer my question? Your feeling like a politician to me and I don't like that at all.

VOTE: Archbob

-Seraphim

I have played with overenthusiastic scum before. Not all scum are looking to avoid drawing attention to themselves especially newbscum.

Could you link to a game you completed where this was the case?

-G&H

To everyone - if you can't endure reading my posts in their entirety, at least search them for your names because I'd like to know your reactions to my comments and questions directed towards you.

Exactly what I am doing

silverbullet999, I have to agree with Hinduragi that it seemed strange that you voted for me when archaebob asked you why you weren't voting. Would you have voted at that time if archaebob hadn't asked?

I honestly don't know (I don't like what if scenarios). More than likely yes.

As a whole, you were more active in Newbie 965 than in Newbie 940. It seems like now you are playing more like you did in Newbie 940 - but there you said the reason was that you were new. Now it seems like this is an intentional approach. By the way, interestingly, both in Newbie 940 and here there has been a "silverbullet999 strikes back" moment after someone has attacked you - it was Nobody Special there and archaebob here...

I disagree actually, I was nervous as ell and completely changed my gamestyle a few times in 940. In 965 I was the leader for a bit then just sort of let someone else take the lead. Also I think both games had silver attack moments. My second game being with Uite I believe in the last day. What do you bring the silverbullet strikes back moments for though... are you implying anything with that?

[Prox]

xD I'm surprised it didn't take longer for this to happen. However, I don't get how it took someone else to say it for it to matter.

@G&H: I was able to skim through your post! No, I didn't want to vote Haylen; putting pressure on someone about to be replaced just seems stupid to me. The replacement cannot defend Haylen.

@Seraphim: I'm glad someone sees what I saw, but have you considered the possibility that shotty is just an idiot? I mean, he has, far too blatantly, OMGUSed everyone who's attacked him. I think that's more dumb than scummy. That's my current opinion on him, but of course, dumb people aren't always bad townies.

@Shotty: ANSWER MY REQUEST. IT'S IMPORTANT. Don't try to dodge it again. Also, explain why you think Seraphim is scummy, aside from the voting for you thing.

@Silverbullet: Do you think archbob is scum?

@Foilist: you seem to ignore the fact that shotty attacks and calls scummy everyone who attacks him. The ONLY time anyone ever gets his suspicion is when they attack him, except for G&H, who his opinion of doesn't make any sense.

Honestly, if shotty is scum, it'd be better to lynch his more intelligent counterpart anyways. Not that I have a good read on him. I'm going to re-read the thread and attack somebody.

[Hinduragi]

G&H -
When I responded to Haylen, it was in reference to the following quote:

As a mod and a player, I teach and uphold rules on tolerance in mafia. I also think policy lynches are bad, anti-game - not scummy.

I wanted to see what she had to offer, as a mod/player with experience, as to the benefits and consequences of lynching you. I heavily weighed those consequences and benefits, mind you. I was just looking for anything that may be able to change my mind. I still am.

I'll clarify on your second question after I see some games posted when Bob's back. If I forget, don't hesitate to remind me.

And to be honest, I've considered your playstyle alot. I've had theories galore. Another question I want to offer up to you: "Would you kill if you were the only mafia remaining alive?" I have been pondering this for quite some while. And of course your playstyle is relevant to our current game. That's a given. You're playing in here and players are considering policy lynching you. Don't worry, I'll try to give up a detailed explanation of your playstyle if, as bob put it, "the rest of the town is ready". Maybe it will have some impact on peoples opinions. I'd also like to hear your thoughts and analysis of your own playstyle before, or during, that period in time.

About that last question, yeah, I wanted to see what you would think of it. As I said, I've been looking into your character to quite an extent. I thought you might respond like this. I just figured "Hey, it can't hurt to ask". And yes, let's not reveal that last part you mentioned.

Switz - Actually, yeah, I've been considering that too. Shotty may be one hell of a VI. I'm more inclined to think he's newbscum since he had a similar behavior in his last game, though.

[Hinduragi]

EBWOP:
The Switz part was a preview edit. I guess I misread names there? Apparently it was Prox who posted. My bad.

[Hinduragi]

EBWOTP: (This is beginning to get sad)

SB - He was at L-2 on page 4, post 85, during the VC. Also, is there another reason as to why you voted Arch so suddenly?

[Prox]

Prox - Actually, yeah, I've been considering that too. Shotty may be one hell of a VI. I'm more inclined to think he's newbscum since he had a similar behavior in his last game, though.

Looking at the wikia for VI gave me ideas ^^ too WIFOMy though.

[Prox]

PS: shotty is too new to play VI so perfectly.

[drmyshottyizsik]

Ok Prox here I go clean slate.
1. Gut feeling
2. It almost feels like you are pushing for a mislynch
3. You are too pushy
4. You exploit everything
5. You don't stick you what you say
6. Your attacks don't always make any sense
7. I get a scum vibe from you
8. You almost seem nervous sometimes

Ok there you go.

[Prox]

Ok Prox here I go clean slate.
1. Gut feeling
2. It almost feels like you are pushing for a mislynch
3. You are too pushy
4. You exploit everything
5. You don't stick you what you say
6. Your attacks don't always make any sense
7. I get a scum vibe from you
8. You almost seem nervous sometimes

Ok there you go.

Ah...yes, you're definetly town.

Okay, 1 and 7 is the same thing.

2 needs to be explained. You have to understand that I don't know your alliance.

3 is a character issue. Is scum more pushy than town?

4 is innaccurate. What have I exploited?

5 also needs to be explained. I'm sure that I've changed my mind no less often than you have (probably less so).

6 is subjective.

8 is a first. I'd like more info about this.

Remember my ask for info about Seraphim, too.

[drmyshottyizsik]

Ok ya you're right 1 and 7 are the same...
2. Idk you just seem like you know I'm town but are pushing anyway.
3. Deppends on the player. Could you send me a link to a game that you were scum and one that you were town?
4. I guess you more observe robustly
5. Yes I counted you have changed you mind less.... damn
6. I see
8. You seem like you need to comment on a lot in order for people to think you are town and are afraid if you don't that they will think scum of you.