Mini 1000: The Brave and the Beautiful (Game Over)

[Iecerint]

The parsimonious explanation is that scum saw that he would be quiclynched with Zerg Rush. They miscalculated because he happened to have a difference lynch threshold.

This theory is no good if RC posted elsewhere on the site AFTER the extra lynch vote claim and before RC's Zerg Rush post.

The alternate theory is that Roboscum has mischievously arranged these circumstances to make it appear that he has cleared himself. This is comparatively remote IMO.

[Robocopter87]

Most likely die in the night. My bad.

[Robocopter87]

Yes, I agree thats a possibility. But there is only one truth, even if there is a dozen possibilities, there is one truth. You may choose which one you believe to be that truth. I don't hold it against you for being suspicious. But personally I think the ultimate cover up is pretty reaching.

[Iecerint]

I said that I thought it was comparatively remote.

[millar13]

Oh im not saying i fully believe that, but in this game never leave any stone unturned

[Robocopter87]

Well, you can't be 100% sure all the time. I understand. If someone else would be in my shoes I would be slightly suspicious.

[Muffin]

Then why did it happen after a wagon started on you?

I bet because someone knew it would reduce the votecount by 2, and as a result thought they could get him lynched.

[Muffin]

However, someone did think they were going to kill you off though. Which means scum definitely fear you; which means despite everything i said earlier your 100% town.

LOL what a flipflop. First he's the scummiest player in the game. Then you refuse to provide quotations of what about him you found scummy. Now he's guaranteed town?

On top of that, Millar13 was the first person to come up with a reason for why the zergrush didn't kill Robo:

However, someone did think they were going to kill you off though.

I'm thinking "someone" in that sentence = "millar"

[Robocopter87]

Bingo!

This is to Muffins second last post.

[ReaperCharlie]

The Brave and the Beautiful - Vote Count 1.4

Robocopter87 [3] - Shotty to the Body, Furcolow, bv310
millar13 [2] - Muffin, Kdub
Ythan [1] - Iecerint
Muffin [1] - Mindgamer
Furcolow [1] - MagnaofIllusion

Not Voting [4] - Netopalis, millar13, Ythan, Robocopter87

Accounting for damage from the Zergling Rush, it is now 5 to lynch.

The deadline is July 22 at 5:30pm PST.

[Muffin]

My answers will follow everybody else posting their answers, and will be posted with the reasoning behind each question. I do this so that my answers and reasoning don't interfere with the answers generated by others, thus skewing the results.

Can we get your answers now? I don't think concerns about skewing the results are valid/warranted.

[Netopalis]

*shrugs* They've served their purpose.


1) Why do you play Mafia? I play Mafia for a number of reasons. Obviously, I enjoy it, it's one of the few games that can combine interpersonal relationships with strategy and logic. Also, it helps me hone my debating skills on topics where people can actually be swayed to your side - since I'm a law student, this is pretty important to me as well.
2) How many licks DOES it take to get to the Tootsie Roll center of a Tootsie Pop? "I never made it without biting! Ask Mr. Owl!"
3) Can you describe your thought processes leading into this game? Same as always - I start out by asking questions. The questions are really designed to spark discussion and the actual answers don't matter all that much. Usually, I find that a lot of people suspect or attack me due to my refusal to answer the questions - this can also be enlightening as well. I do find these calls for me to answer my own questions to be somewhat hilarious - do you honestly think that if I was scum I would write up questions that I would trip myself up by answering? But, as a measure of fairness, I do always answer them, mainly so that I can say with a straight face that I do always answer them. Really, though, the questions, the answers, they don't matter so much - what does matter is that it shifts the discussion to something more concrete than the RVS normally does. Instead of talking about dice and avatars, we talk about content and mindsets.
4) Let's say that you win the game. What conditions lead to that win? What qualities will the game have? Will it be ordered or chaotic, logical or gut-based, fast or drawn out? Most of my wins are achieved through ordered, logical play. I like breaking things down into their most simplest explanations and then working from there. I also tend to probe at one or two specific players until I get a good read on them, then shift my focus to someone who had previously been coasting by.
5) What is the square root of potato? Cucumber, duh.
6) Can you please link me to the one game that you're most proud of on this site? http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12561 - My scum game is admittedly a lot better than my town game, and since this was my best win as scum, I'll link to it. N910 was a close second, though (the game that made Robocopter paranoid about me)
7) This is not a question. This is an answer.

[Muffin]

do you honestly think that if I was scum I would write up questions that I would trip myself up by answering?

Certainly not. I just don't want town to get in the habit of letting promises go unfulfilled.

[Furcolow]

The parsimonious explanation is that scum saw that he would be quiclynched with Zerg Rush. They miscalculated because he happened to have a difference lynch threshold.

This theory is no good if RC posted elsewhere on the site AFTER the extra lynch vote claim and before RC's Zerg Rush post.

The alternate theory is that Roboscum has mischievously arranged these circumstances to make it appear that he has cleared himself. This is comparatively remote IMO.

I am inclined to believe him, and I am fairly certain we can find a better target for a lynch.

unvote robocoptor

[Furcolow]

Well, you can't be 100% sure all the time. I understand. If someone else would be in my shoes I would be slightly suspicious.

who were you talking to?

[Furcolow]

1) Why do you play Mafia? I like the rush of being near a lynch, but hate it at the same time.

2) How many licks DOES it take to get to the Tootsie Roll center of a Tootsie Pop? I can't do it

3) Can you describe your thought processes leading into this game?
I'm trying to become a better player.

4) Let's say that you win the game. What conditions lead to that win? What qualities will the game have? Will it be ordered or chaotic, logical or gut-based, fast or drawn out? Most of my wins are achieved through ordered, logical play. I like breaking things down into their most simplest explanations and then working from there. I also tend to probe at one or two specific players until I get a good read on them, then shift my focus to someone who had previously been coasting by.

Hopefully it will be my finding scum that lead to the win

5) What is the square root of potato? not funny

6) Can you please link me to the one game that you're most proud of on this site? it was a marathon game

7) This is not a question. Your mother is a terrible cook.

[Kdub]

OK I've done a reread of the game up to this point:

The original case against robocopter was reasonable since it was the only real lead at the time, but I'm surprised it went as far as to force a claim. I wouldn't call him confirmed town. It feels a bit convenient that he survived the zerg attack, assuming that an increased lynch threshold is not a common power in this game.

I think we need to be careful in future days and not vote until we are ready to lynch. Use FoS instead or something. If it turns out that robo is scum, I think millar could be his buddy since he immediately claimed that robo was confirmed town after that.
UNVOTE:

My initial problem with millar's post 113 still stands. Not sure why Ythan thinks it's weak. You can't confirm in a game, later say you never got your role PM, then suddenly have it all make sense by saying "oops, EBWOP: I actually did get it, my bad".

Furcolow's post 110 looks pretty bad. Poor excuse to jump on the leading wagon.

bv seemed oddly nonchalant about robo surviving the zerg attack, and then saying in 154 that he was still willing to hammer. I'm not liking his sequence of posts from page 6 onward.

Getting a town feel from Iecerint and Netopolis, a not-so-good feel from Ythan, but admittedly nothing to support that.

[Muffin]

The original case against robocopter was reasonable since it was the only real lead at the time, but I'm surprised it went as far as to force a claim. I wouldn't call him confirmed town. It feels a bit convenient that he survived the zerg attack, assuming that an increased lynch threshold is not a common power in this game.

Convenient indeed.

Realistically I wouldn't expect that scum would get increased lynch threshold as an ability... feels a bit swingy.

On the other hand I suppose speculating about the setup is WIFOM to a certain extent.

Furcolow and Millar 13 are the two scummiest players in my books right now. Both of them jumped on the Robo wagon for completely asinine reasons and then promptly reversed their positions. On top of that neither of them have really contributed anything in terms of content.

The fact that we got so close to a lynch so early is concerning.

[Iecerint]

I think it's very unlikely that Robo is scum. An extra vote (appearing to put him at L-1) in that time could have totally messed up a hypothetical ZergRush fake "confirm" on him and led to a real lynch.

The only way it is possible is if Robo was lying about his lynch threshold +1 ability altogether and he was actually just immune to the ZergRush altogether or something. Otherwise, the plan was too risky. And even WITH that, there's no reason for scum to pull a stunt like that D1.

Doublealso, that kind of plan posits either very hardcore pregame talk or daytalk. Several players seem to be accepting this premise implicitly, which is interesting. In light of the former possibility, I wish I'd made a note of the confirm order. I sent my confirm via PM rather than posting in the thread, so the posted confirms aren't a good cipher.

[Iecerint]

Furcolow, are you not reading the thread very well, or do you really think that present circumstances make Robo more likely to be scum?

[Muffin]

Furcolow, are you not reading the thread very well, or do you really think that present circumstances make Robo more likely to be scum?

He unvoted and claims that he feels we can "find a better lynch"

[Iecerint]

Oh. I misread it as "We can find a better lynch; namely, robocopter."

Question withdrawn.

[Netopalis]

Doublealso, that kind of plan posits either very hardcore pregame talk or daytalk. Several players seem to be accepting this premise implicitly, which is interesting. In light of the former possibility, I wish I'd made a note of the confirm order. I sent my confirm via PM rather than posting in the thread, so the posted confirms aren't a good cipher.

Not necessarily. If the Zerg Rush is an ability which is controlled by an individual member of the scumteam, then it could have been done without conferring with the others. It could be one scumster acting alone.

[Iecerint]

I think it would take a really rogue kind of acting-alone scumplayer to pull that kind of thing off if a scumfriend were the one closest to lynch. I'm sure there are some player personalities that might do it, but I think they're rare.

This is doubly true if ZR is a one-time ability, since it could probably give scum a free lynch under ordinary circumstances, which I'd see as a more effective use of the ability.

Again, it IS sort of vacuously possible that there is a conspiracy, but it is more remote.

[Robocopter87]

I think the most likely scenario is that scum tried to quicklynch me and it failed because I have a passive ability that increased my lynch threshold. I know this is the most likely scenario because I'm fighting for Good. But I can't convince everyone that because, I could very well be scum.