Of Gods And Men (GAME OVER!)

[dramonic]

I read your plan MO, but there is an important flaw in it, which I wont point out.

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, do you at least recognize that putting someone quiet in Limbo is a terrible choice at this point? Without fully knowing how your power works it's hard to tell what you think the flaw might be. It's clearly not a fear that they could be lynched anyhow as there's no need to lynch someone who's in limbo but has been useful to the town. It's also not that it stops them from using whatever powers they have as they wouldn't be able to use them tomorrow anyhow. There are other things that you could be thinking of but I won't go into them either at this point.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, unless there's more to the power that isn't public knowledge at this point the only good pro-town uses for it that I can think of are to use it as a jailkeeper to try to roleblock someone or to protect someone. Anything else just deprives town of a voice for a day unnecessarily and makes it harder to get reads in the long run. Roleblocking someone tomorrow shouldn't be useful.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[dramonic]

Well...
If you can convince the psycho lynchmob who wants me dead to chill I can take someone protown =_=;
but the person I take to limbo becomes my meatshield. If I take someone protown and a vig or lynch hits me the protown guy will get zapped.

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, and how about a mafia kill? Would that kill the person in limbo as well? Or is there some other reason you failed to bring that method of death up?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, also, if your limbo-resident did get killed on a given day would you be able to put someone else in limbo the next night or does it only work until it's protected you once? Or some other mechanic?

Further, do you know if it will work to protect you tomorrow if all abilities, even passive ones, aren't working?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[dramonic]

@dramonic, and how about a mafia kill? Would that kill the person in limbo as well? Or is there some other reason you failed to bring that method of death up?

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

Same for mafia kills, but so far I seem to have garnered enough negative attention to not be the most viable mafia target :S

@dramonic, also, if your limbo-resident did get killed on a given day would you be able to put someone else in limbo the next night or does it only work until it's protected you once? Or some other mechanic?

Further, do you know if it will work to protect you tomorrow if all abilities, even passive ones, aren't working?

I'm not going to answer the first half. I would suppose I won't be protected if even passive stuff is nulled, but I dont know what would happen then to the person in limbo if I die.

[Mighty Orbots]

So I've thought about it a bit. I don't particularly trust dramonic; his play doesn't seem to be helping find scum (his main contribution today was pointing out that ooba's list changed a number of people from scum reads to town reads but, really, it was obvious far before he pointed it out and he should have mentioned that when he first commented on the list as a whole.) It's probably worse that he used that claimed inconsistency as a reason to vote for Iecerint instead of ooba. On the whole he hasn't been much of a presence in the game and he seems more interested in staying alive than helping the town figure out what makes sense as a good course of action. The limbo thing is extremely powerful as a means to stay alive if he's telling the truth. I very much dislike that he's not interested in sharing whether or not it's a one shot thing; I think that town should be willing to do that. I'm also not that interested in messing around with it right away to see if he's telling the truth unless he puts someone particularly lynch-worthy in that spot tomorrow.

On the other hand, I don't think he'll be able to use the ability on Night Three so he should be an easy enough lynch on his own on Day Four. That'll give him some time to actually make a positive impact on the game via his play and his suspicions. If he doesn't by then I'm going to be a proponent of lynching him that day in particular (or vigging him, though that's less certain to work due to potential shenanigans.)

Having said that I'm still trying to process the information and I'd love to have input from others on the issue. It's complicated enough that I'm not sure that I'm wrapping my head around it correctly at this time.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[DarkStalker]

<<PF

JC seems like best worship so i believe thats where I'll go given the low turnout last time and no JC's seem dead yet

Blaze's claim is still beyond me. I tried to rationalize it before and I think i was wrong so I still can't make heads or tails of cover vs hammer and i'm not sure if the hammer is still in play even now. Can anyone make cents?

alot has been going on during the endless night. gonna try to get to all of this after work tomorrow

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, actually, at this point I want you to put Plum in limbo no matter what else happens. If someone's going to be a potential block to a kill it might as well be our survivor. As far as I'm concerned you might as well keep her there from here on out; while she's there she can't do the town any harm and if there ever is a desire to test a kill or lynch on you we'd know we wouldn't be in danger of losing anything important.

Again, others are welcome to weigh in on that idea but so far as I can tell given what I know it should keep everyone happy if you're town. Well, except maybe Plum but I'm not that invested in keeping Plum happy.

@DarkStalker, we should be able to tell if the hammer is still in play the day after tomorrow. If the extra votes are still there the hammer's probably still in the game. I do agree that BlazezRb's claims were a challenge to try to sort through.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[DTMaster]

Fuck. Why would you want to stop a kill on survivor. That's pretty scummy V.V. Plus scum wouldn't even kill the survivor. They'd focus on the cult or the townies.

[DTMaster]

Fuck. In fact, Scum would try and kill the claimed doctor. Or they'd kill dram because his Limbo status might act as a jail keeping action.

[DTMaster]

Fuck. Sorry nvm didn't read Drams full claim on the meat shield.

[Mighty Orbots]

@DTMaster, do you understand how dramonic claims his ability works at this point? Or are you being a fucking idiot again? I suspect the latter. Please be informed when you make posts rather than wasting our time (like you did with the last batch of them.)

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Plum]

At this point I'd be okay getting Limbo'd by Dramonic even given the meatshield business. It's probably best for you guys in general, and for various reasons I don't think it would seriously get in the way of me fulfilling my win condition, and it might even help me, too.

[Xite91]

I'll volunteer too, if it's coming down to that. At this point my big want is to figure out the mechanics of this game (Finding scum is pretty much impossible to me right now) that way if it backfires, at least you put someone in there that is a little less of a help in this game (sorry about that btw)

[Plum]

Xite, do you have any inkling why the lynch on Ort Day 1 didn't go through?

[Mighty Orbots]

@Xite91, we're relatively confident (at least I am) that Plum is a survivor. This is in some ways a great way to deal with her as, in the end we can't count on her to be trying to help the town. As far as winning the game goes she doesn't care who does it so long as she's still alive. With you there's still an alignment to be determined and if you're town you should actually be motivated by win condition to help figure out what's going on down the road even if it's confusing now (and it's tremendously confusing now.) I'd much rather have you in the thread contributing both for the read on you and for the work from you than have you tucked away in Limbo. That goes for anyone else I'm not sure about. If it weren't for the reverse bodyguard aspect I would be all for putting someone who I thought was probably town there for safe keeping but with the mechanic working how it does that's not a good idea. Later on it might make sense to put someone we think is probably scum there as a roleblock type action but for now I'm happier with the Plum move.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Xite91]

@Plum no clue, it says nothing in my post and the only real idea everyone is like "oh, that can't be it"
but my only guess is the placement shift, I'm two below CMAR, and he said his unlynchability was stolen, but again just a guess.

@MO Okay, I was just volunteering since we need someone to see what happens and I can't really find anything to contribute on that hasn't been said before, so I haven't been much use anyways.

[Mighty Orbots]

@Xite91, we've still got a lot of game to get through. If you'd like to feel like you're doing something I might suggest reading through some people in isolation and taking some notes. Ideally people who you aren't particularly aware are in the game perhaps. Maybe you'll notice something the rest of us are missing. Right now there's too much going on for any one player to process everything well (in my opinion) but the more we're paying attention the easier it will get as things simplify as the game gets smaller. Being up to speed when that starts to happen is key.

The unlynchability being stolen bit from CryMeARiver was his way of saying that he hadn't understood how it worked previously. It was a particularly poor way to phrase it (and he's not being helpful in general so that's somewhat par for the course.) Actually, as Iecerint said, your theory is the best one that we've heard but we really do have a reason to think that the shift shouldn't have applied to abilities that didn't require targets and the unlynchability shouldn't have required a target so there are still major problems with it. For now it's a mystery so far as I can tell.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, for what it's worth I know you've been about looking at various things more or less since you posted here last. I fully expect you to give some response to the Plum limbo idea tonight. Not doing so will look bad.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Iecerint]

Niki, when you said not to kill me, who were you talking to? I'm not on Snowie's shortlist.

[dramonic]

I don't "mind" the idea per se. I'm not sure it's the best, considering it doesn't block someone who could potentially be scum, but it's better than locking in a town PR <<

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, are you fairly certain that anyone in particular is scum (I guess and that Snow_Bunny probably won't be taking a shot at them if you're not sure about the order that your actions will resolve)? If so I can live with your putting them in Limbo but on the whole that strikes me as a better plan when we've got more certainty about roles.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh

[Mighty Orbots]

@dramonic, I guess at this point I go back to what I was saying to Xite91. Plum is completely safe to stow away in Limbo at this point; everyone else I'd like to hear more from to get better reads and I can't do that if they're in Limbo. There are a couple players I'm comfortable calling town but given how you're saying your role works I no longer love the idea of putting them there.

-Zorblag R`Lyeh