Open 201 v2.0 ~ F&I Mafia ~ Game Over

[chauchaudotcom]

Sando, please answer:

Also the timing of his apparent declaration of Lacey's innocence, when Lacey replaces, seems too coincidental.

Gheb pretty much declared Lacey townie in post 181, Lacey replaced out post 314. So can you explain to me exactly how these two are correlated in a manner that would make Gheb more likely to be scum?

Why are you town in the eyes of anybody but yourself

That better?

Not really. It's not just the question you ask that is important, but how you ask it. Furthermore he's already given his defense (not the 'I am town' part but the part explaining why his thoughts changed about the players) prior to your question. And part B and C aren't even questions. They're statements you wanted to make about his post. So you should have simply stated your opinions about his post and questioned from there rather then being unclear with such a broad, unanswerable question. It's like asking, "Are you scum?" to Jacob. Pointless.

I'd like to hear what exactly the "scummy" part about Jacob's contradictions is.

I said before that the contradictions themselves aren't scum tell. Rather, the potential motive behind that matters. If it is more likely to be scum motivated, I lean towards scum. On the other hand, I think being wishy washy is scum tell.

In any case, the reason why Jacob's contradictions rang scum to me was because it was too convenient on his part. It appeared as if he was swaying with the town momentum. Lacey rings town, after everyone establishes she's pretty much town, then Col ringing scum because his replacement gave him an opportunity to dub their role scum (which he pushed with a crappy reason also). But when kmd pointed out their roles would be the same he followed up with a "oh shit never mind" post (which he now retracts by the way and thinks Col is scum).

But even more so is his reactions so far after being bussed. Jacob's latest posts = fail. I'm trying to see if I can understand his actions from a town perspective but with each of his posts I can't help but feel confirmation bias hitting me.

Am I the only one who feels like Jacob is trying to desperately throw out as much wifom as possible before he gets lynched? ._."

Will do. I just wanted to throw that out here because it looked like a lot of people have just followed chauchau's case a bit too easily.

This.

The troubling part being that my initial town reads were the first to so easily be swayed. =/ Right now I'd say Yellow is most likely scum and Farside is possible scum (I'm having trouble reading far because of past meta). I'm not fond of Max but I haven't read much on yet so I need to do that. And Kmd's play has been solid but his initial dropping of the case bothered me so I need time to think on this one.

If we are talking cases alone (and by the case on Jacob, I mostly mean Chachu's big post on him), I think that the case against Gheb is stronger.

Reasoning?

I say that Col/Farside scumbuddies (reverse bussing) and Max/DTM (More Guess work)

So. If this is true. Why are you voting start?

Personal Interest, and gives more of a help to the town

HOW in the world does this help town? It doesn't. In fact, if you are town you are screwing town over by confusing town TODAY, which would result in your mislynch which is NOT good for town.

And can you please answer farside's question? "Jacob: how did Col steer the conversation? Why is this a scum tell in your book? "

[JacobSavage]

I have in fact explained all of these points, just you haven't looked at them because they aren't set out o

Jacob: how did Col steer the conversation? Why is this a scum tell in your book?

To put it bluntly, it is, its how I play. And in terms of how did Col steer the conversation *looks at all the votes on him*

[JacobSavage]

But even more so is his reactions so far after being bussed.

Right, Chau has just founded some new rules, townies can get bussed by their scum buddies! Yay! Oh... wait... crap they don't exist

Vote:chauchaudotcom

[farside22]

@chau game with gheb

So chau admits to bussing and jacob is the scum partner. Hey it works lynch one jacob flips scum, lynch the other. We have one less kill to worry about as of night 3.

[chauchaudotcom]

v_v" I used the wrong term. I meant bandwagoned.

[chauchaudotcom]

I have in fact explained all of these points, just you haven't looked at them because they aren't set out o

What? Exactly which post did you explain how this would help town?

[CSL]

Well, I won't be here at deadline, since I have to watch my little sister while mom's doing college stuff, so the day will end at

6pm EST TODAY

, as that's when I'm being booted.

Also, Guess what! I get to go replacement hunting. AGAIN! yawetag requested replacement. THE NIGHT PHASE 72 HR TIMEPHRASE WILL NOT START UNTIL I GET A REPLACEMENT.

[JacobSavage]

So chau admits to bussing and jacob is the scum partner. Hey it works lynch one jacob flips scum, lynch the other. We have one less kill to worry about as of night 3

You seem to be missing the point, I will not flip scum. So...

[JacobSavage]

So chau admits to bussing and jacob is the scum partner. Hey it works lynch one jacob flips scum, lynch the other. We have one less kill to worry about as of night 3

You seem to be missing the point, I will not flip scum. So...

[chauchaudotcom]

Let us pretend that I actually meant bussing (which I didn't, I meant bandwagoning). But for the sake of these scenarios, let's pretend that it was true.

If you really aren't scum why are you voting me exactly?

But if I am scum and you are town, me saying 'bussing' wouldn't make any sense, since you wouldn't be my partner. So how does that make me scum?

Unless of course you are scum and you think I am scum on the other team and you're trying to use your death to pull me down with you.

[CSL]

One hour.

[DTMaster]

@Sando

He's misrepresented himself on the Goro case as well. His claim that the buddying has always been a major part of his case (in fact it's pretty much all of it now) is clearly wrong considering his earlier postings.

Actually what bugs me is that Gheb addressed this in his initial assessment of Goro. Had Goro brought this up only now I would be suspicious, but his case remained the same from Goro's first post to now.

I don't like your Lacey point. Just because Gheb's arguments were forceful in comparison to KMD, he is scummy since he misrepped his case on Lacey? The fact that we have on record on Gheb was in favour away from the Lacey wagon.

Jacob, WTF is with asking for who your partner is? This serves literally no purpose if you're town, and gives scum a lovely bit of information. Unless someone can't rationalise anyone being your partner, there's not a lot of reason for town to state this on D1.

Um. Why would this give scum information again? I don't see how it gives them anything. It's more accurate to say Jacob is adding the fuel to his own fire.

What you're saying is: Jacob softclaiming scum is anti-town because it gives scum information when I read this. Not: Jacob is obviously WIFOMING scum with this argument:

If I'm scummy find my partner argument rather then on his case alone.

IGMEY: Sando

@Jacob
Gut vibes say: You are playing like the old 201. Anti-town, less bandwagony, but it's a sign of improvement in comparison to the old 201. I want to hear from you quickly, if you turn this wagon around: Who is the most suspect on your case. Who is the least.

@Yellow
Hold on, are you seriously settling for Jacob when you find Gheb's scum case stronger?

@Farside
Oi, oi! OIIIII! Hello? Earth to Farside that post of yours is extremely scummy.

[farside22]

@Farside
Oi, oi! OIIIII! Hello? Earth to Farside that post of yours is extremely scummy.

How? Is the logic faulty based on chau's comment stating she was bussing?

[startransmission]

Vote: Startransmission

Vote of Self-preservation and Starting to think the he could be scum with DTM or Max?

I voted Gheb because I think he's scummy. My defense has been self-preservation, as that's my responsibility.

I'm of the opinion that either Gheb or KMD (or both) is scum, with my gut leaning towards Gheb. Both took advantage of Spring who was an easy target. Both kept fighting for that lynch. Not to mention KMD's defense of Gheb, which could be either defending or buddying.

But, as it's deadline time...

Unvote, Vote: JacobSavage

[CSL]

You all hesitate, knowing that the bell would ring any minute. In a last-minute effort, you all pointed to JacobSavage. Just then, the bell rings, and JacobSavage's podium flickers superiorly fast.

JacobSavage left the room, in utter dismay. You check his things, and notice something peculiar about his organization. It was all messy. Guess you just sent an innocent to the principal's office.

JacobSavage - Innocent - Expelled Day 1

It is Night 1. QT talking is now acceptable between now and 72 hours after I find the replacement for yawetag. If you forgot the link to your QT, contact me ASAP.

[CSL]

The End of Day 1 votecount

kmd4390 (L-7)
Max (L-7)
farside22 (L-7)
Sando (L-7)
The Quintastic One (L-7)
Gheb (L-6) Sando
startransmission (L-6) Gheb
DTMaster (L-7)
yellowbunny (L-7)
yawetag (L-7)
chauchaudotcom (L-6) JacobSavage

JacobSavage (L-1) Max, kmd4390, farside22, chauchaudotcom, startransmission, yellowbunny !

Not voting: Everyone else

With 12 alive, 7 will lynch

~ "!" = indicates the wagon that will resolve at deadline

~JacobSavage is at L-1

~JacobSavage was deadline lynched...

[CSL]

Chronopie replaces yawetag.

Night 1 will end on Friday, April 2nd, at 9:30am EST. Any actions you don't send in will not be used.

[CSL]

You all wake up in the classrooms after a long, night's sleep. You all return to the gymnasium. A quick headcount reveals that only 9 of you are left. You all head into the classrooms they slept in...

The first one is kmd. You see him roasted to perfection. You all wondered why the fire alarms didn't go off.

The second one is chauchaudotcom. She lies there, with her hands folded and resting on her coat. You all approach her, and when you attempt to nudge her, all you feel is solid ice.

Depressed at losing two of the best students to the mafia, you all headed back to the gymnasium, back to stand on the mocking podiums.

kmd - Innocent - Burned Night 1

chauchaudotcom - Innocent - Froze to death quietly Night 1

It is now Day 2. Deadline is 3 weeks from now, as per the rules. With 9 alive, 5 will expel.

[CSL]

The Dead people votecount

Max (L-5)
farside22 (L-5)
Sando (L-5)
The Quintastic One (L-5)
Gheb (L-5)
startransmission (L-5)
DTMaster (L-5)
yellowbunny (L-5)
Chronopie (L-5)

Not voting: Everyone else

With 9 alive, 5 will lynch

Deadline is Wednesday, April 21st, @ 8:00pm EST

~ "!" = indicates the wagon that will resolve at deadline

[farside22]

Vote: Max

[Chronopie]

/confirm

My slot has had such a shitload of replacements, I'll try not to follow suit.

Vote:Gheb

Really not liking the way Gheb's been playing.

[Sando]

The way the votes melted away from Gheb onto a townie at the first sign of a real counter-wagon make me think scum taking the opportunity to get an easier lynch against an easier target. Gheb not desperately pushing the counter-wagon makes me think more pro-town at this point.

I'm not feeling the Max wagon at the moment, and Gheb needs a rethink.

Vote: Startransmission

The deadline vote just for the sake of it, yeah not liking that. Especially with the previous setting up of being V/LA as an excuse.

[Gheb]

Gonna take a close look at KMD's and Chauchau's suspects to see if I can find connections.

[yellowbunny]

Gheb not desperately pushing the counter-wagon makes me think more pro-town at this point.

That is an interesting point.

Also, I really had KMD & Gheb pegged as a scum team. Now that we know that is not the case, I need to go back and reread his case in defense of Gheb.

Chrono, what specifically about the Gheb case did you find compelling? And what other reads do you have at this point?

[farside22]

Gonna take a close look at KMD's and Chauchau's suspects to see if I can find connections.

Don't forget how the scum used that to frame others in the last game.
I remember elf using that gambit to try and frame Gayle last game so I'm super careful of falling into that trap.