mini 943- Greek Mythology! (And the winner is... ?)

[Iecerint]

@ GiD, it's true that I didn't 100% know his second-language status ahead of time. Had I known it, I would have stated it instead of asking him. I don't blame you for getting excited about my failure to use subjunctive mood, but that's really all it indicates.

Either way, JJH's framing of my take on SD's tone is wildly incorrect.

[Shadow Dancer]

[*]

Shadow Dancer:

His buddying up with players is a bit disturbing (patting Iec on the back for finding out that English isn’t his first language and putting a townie stamp on Jack 136)

So admitting I feel a player is town is buddying up? I had to comment on the Jack vs. Iec argument for obvious reasons (i.e. it being over my case and me thinking I could help to resolve it).

, and so is his final words on his SV vote (that it is "momentarily", as if he expects to change pretty soon as something better appears, even though he himself has at lengths motivated why he votes in the first place) in post 144.

I also justified extensively why I am not too sure about my vote:

i) I did not state this explicitely, but it is obvious. SV announced V/LA until tuesday and still has not posted again, yet. I also think that he has a growing BW on him (I am not sure, last official vote count was friday as far as I can remember). I am not willing to lynch him without giving him the chance to defend himself.
ii) His lie was not about a relevant think, he did not try to manipulate any one or something like that. Because of that I do not consider his lie a sure scum tell
iii) I also have an eye on VV right now for reasons I also laid out in detail. And so far I am not very content with his aswer:

Well, primarily because the wincon here is a little different from a typical mafia game. The wincons is either from killing off scum or getting all tokens. If we know who has the token and the person is luckily Poseidon, we can win faster. That was the first plan but it really escaped me back then on how that can be baad against us. I only tried to get some discussion on the mechanic.

So you openly admit that you tried some role fishing? And it did not once cross your mind that that might be a bad/really really seriously anti-townish idea? I find harder and harder to believe you.

I give SV time until tomorrow to answer to the lie accusation. I will decide then, were my vote goes.

[Shadow Dancer]

I don't feel up to giving this game the analysis it needs. But I'd like to say that between Iec's summary of the case against SD and that comment that GiD just pointed out, I'm very much feeling the Iec-SD as partners theory.

Then elaborate on it, I really want to hear it because right now it seems quite far fetched to me.

[ooba]

Also, what would be the hypothetical relevance of having missed the "doesn't matter anymore" part be?

If Player A make a case against a Player B (even though it was based on a couple of RVS votes) and Player B posts "it does not matter anymore", I'd expect Player A to respond to that in some way. (such as "I may be voting someone else, but i still got my eye on you"). If Player A completly ignores it then I would consider it scummy.

Post 109/110 - I don't like Iecerint's defensiveness on why he did not vote SV followed by a vote. ( If SV = Scum --> Iecerint = Scum)

IIRC, you're misreading 109. The correct way to read 109 is that Joh did the same thing as SV, so, to the extent that SV deserves pressure for it, Joh does, too. Then I went into detail about Joh's posts. I find it a little odd that you would apparently get a negative gut from this post, given that you seem to have analogous reservations about Joh.

I do not have analogous reservations about Joh. I think SV's post 52 is far more scummier than Joh's post 44. Which is why I was surprised by a lack of SV voting by anyone.

I didn't see SV's "HYPERBOLE GUYS" post until after 109, so that's why I didn't vote him until post 110. That put him beyond Joh.

This makes sense. Although I cannot be entirely sure if it was SV's post or Plum's post which drove you more towards voting, but it does dilute my point about 110.

---

Ooba seems to be a bit too focused onShattered Viewpoint in post 166 where he comments on important posts so far, as if he really wants SV to be scum.

I read the thread in order and keep making notes as I progress. Post 52 really made my scumdar ping. SV's posts after that did nothing to reverse my opinion.

Do not have the time right now, but will post later with an iso on all other players I consider scummy.

[Iecerint]

SD, I think that last quote should be VVD rather than JJH.

I do not have analogous reservations about Joh.

My mistake.

Post 147 - Johoonhno - Not much content - "Trying to appear active" post.

I misread this as "Trying to appear active post

s

" before, so I thought it was a comment on Joh's play in general.

[VasudeVa]

@SD
Kind of, yeah. It was a rather careless post of me, but I don't think what I did is scummy at all. Go ahead and push for my lynch based on this argument if I said this 1 day before LyLo. At D1, I don't think so. Rolefishing isn't bad for town in itself but it is clearly more advantageous for scum. I was simply asking that in the off-off-offffff chance that the situation I mentioned actually happened. You never know.

But my main motivation for that post was to get some discussion on the topic, I simply started with a suggestion(A bad one, but a suggestion nonetheless). So far, no one offered any discussion about it.

[Shadow Dancer]

Oh, right, thanks.

Edit:

The last quote was by VV, of course (copypastaerror )

[LordChronos]

@Vas

Rolefishing is bad for town end of story. All it does is give the mafia a better idea of who to kill. I don't see why you are even bringing up roles at this point if you are town.

@SD

What did you think of the exchange between Jack and Icerint?

[Iecerint]

What caught my attention right now is the argument between Jack and Iec about my case.

I was a bit sceptical about what seemed to be a buddying attempt by Iec.
However, for the most part he seemed not to defend me but himself against Jack's accusations, that obviously emerged from Iec's assumption that English is not my mother tongue.

And he is right about that, english is my 2nd language.

So that makes him rather a good observer than a suspect.

I get a townish impression from Jack as well. Though he seemed a little bit too focussed on Iec at first (which can happen with only those 2 players generating most of the posts at that time) all his hitherto actions seem like legitimate scumhunting to me.

[Snow_Bunny]

Snow_Bunny:

Keeping a very low profile, the game I’ve seen her in before I think she played a bit differently (but I’m not sure if it has to do with that being a newbie game). I seriously dislike post 151 where she doesn’t seem very interested in doing any scum hunting herself.

You're getting it all wrong. My Internet access hasn't been the best, and thus my activity has flaked (and, btw, I usually keep a low profile). As I didn't have time to reread everything, I asked for the points against SD. And seeing those are only the points, I'm glad I didn't waste my time rereading.

I'm getting a slight gut feeling about VV. And, on top of that, I'm reading him scummy. For once, he attacked SD, but when Iec posted the lame case against him he didn't say a word about it. Then, what's the pressure on SD then? Fake scumhunting? Second, his suggestion about the voting thing seems like a weak rolefishing. Third, his benchsitting. I admit I haven't been the most active player, but that isn't an excuse to bring that point up. One thing is not participating, and another is just sitting away as an "impartial observer". Seems more like he's trying to just pass under everyone's radar while still posting something here and there.

Oh, and I don't buy the so-used excuse of "I did that to start discussion".

So, in conclusion, VV is top scummy right now.

Unvote, vote: VV

[Iecerint]

For once, he attacked SD, but when Iec posted the lame case against him he didn't say a word about it.

Never in my life, except before knowing the /diceroll was standard SD, have I posted a case against SD. Are you confusing SD with SV, or did I type the wrong thing somewhere? I ask because JJH apparently made the same error.

I agree with the case on VV. I'm staying on SV atm.

SB played pretty similar to this in my only other game with her (OpenSource) IMO. She was town there.

[LordChronos]

@Ice

Thanks, I must have missed that.

[VasudeVa]

Snow_Bunny:

Keeping a very low profile, the game I’ve seen her in before I think she played a bit differently (but I’m not sure if it has to do with that being a newbie game). I seriously dislike post 151 where she doesn’t seem very interested in doing any scum hunting herself.

You're getting it all wrong. My Internet access hasn't been the best, and thus my activity has flaked (and, btw, I usually keep a low profile). As I didn't have time to reread everything, I asked for the points against SD. And seeing those are only the points, I'm glad I didn't waste my time rereading.

I'm getting a slight gut feeling about VV. And, on top of that, I'm reading him scummy. For once, he attacked SD, but when Iec posted the lame case against him he didn't say a word about it. Then, what's the pressure on SD then? Fake scumhunting? Second, his suggestion about the voting thing seems like a weak rolefishing. Third, his benchsitting. I admit I haven't been the most active player, but that isn't an excuse to bring that point up. One thing is not participating, and another is just sitting away as an "impartial observer". Seems more like he's trying to just pass under everyone's radar while still posting something here and there.

Oh, and I don't buy the so-used excuse of "I did that to start discussion".

So, in conclusion, VV is top scummy right now.

Unvote, vote: VV

Terrible reasoning. Hypocrisy is a strong scumtell. What you just did pinged my scumdar off the roof. If you are scum, this is a bad move and I will get you lynched for it.

Requesting your metas. Failure to comply will result in an OMGUS vote.

No offense, but your record as scum with that .5 W/L ratio as scum and makes me think that you just did a yet another bad move as scum(hence the meta request). I would have expected a post like that from the other players who have been building a case against me, but for it to come from you is quite unexpected and scummy. There hasn't been enough discussion between us for you to have that conviction against me, and you lacked any sort of doubt that, to me, is a town tell.

Also, you just used all the cases against me with weak conviction and lack of explanation. Not to mention the barren wasteland that is your ISO. Now that's active lurking.

[Snow_Bunny]

No, I didn't mean that the case was yours. But you were the one bringing the points others had against SD, right?

[VasudeVa]

SB played pretty similar to this in my only other game with her (OpenSource) IMO. She was town there.

And this is far too convenient to be posted right after that extreme show of hypocrisy. I believe I just caught two scum.

[Iecerint]

Oh, OK. I think I see what you meant.

What I thought you meant:
VV: OMG SD IS SCUM-E
Iec: INORITE. BLAHBLAHBLAH HYPOTHETICAL CRAP CASE AGAINST SD.
VV: *hands off once the wagons rolls*

What you really meant:
VV: SD IS SCUM-E.
*time passes*
SB: WTF WHY IS SD SCUM
Iec: THIS IS IT AFAIK.
SB: LOL CRAP CASE.
VV: *smiles nervously*

Do I have that right?

[Iecerint]

VV, you can refer to the game in question to see that SB was a lurker who periodically made well-reasoned posts. That's what her play seems like this game IMO.

What is hypocritical about her post? You claim that it was hypocritical, but I don't think you ever indicate why it qualifies as such.

[Snow_Bunny]

Snow_Bunny:

Keeping a very low profile, the game I’ve seen her in before I think she played a bit differently (but I’m not sure if it has to do with that being a newbie game). I seriously dislike post 151 where she doesn’t seem very interested in doing any scum hunting herself.

You're getting it all wrong. My Internet access hasn't been the best, and thus my activity has flaked (and, btw, I usually keep a low profile). As I didn't have time to reread everything, I asked for the points against SD. And seeing those are only the points, I'm glad I didn't waste my time rereading.

I'm getting a slight gut feeling about VV. And, on top of that, I'm reading him scummy. For once, he attacked SD, but when Iec posted the lame case against him he didn't say a word about it. Then, what's the pressure on SD then? Fake scumhunting? Second, his suggestion about the voting thing seems like a weak rolefishing. Third, his benchsitting. I admit I haven't been the most active player, but that isn't an excuse to bring that point up. One thing is not participating, and another is just sitting away as an "impartial observer". Seems more like he's trying to just pass under everyone's radar while still posting something here and there.

Oh, and I don't buy the so-used excuse of "I did that to start discussion".

So, in conclusion, VV is top scummy right now.

Unvote, vote: VV

Terrible reasoning. Hypocrisy is a strong scumtell. What you just did pinged my scumdar off the roof. If you are scum, this is a bad move and I will get you lynched for it.

Requesting your metas. Failure to comply will result in an OMGUS vote.

No offense, but your record as scum with that .5 W/L ratio as scum and makes me think that you just did a yet another bad move as scum(hence the meta request). I would have expected a post like that from the other players who have been building a case against me, but for it to come from you is quite unexpected and scummy. There hasn't been enough discussion between us for you to have that conviction against me, and you lacked any sort of doubt that, to me, is a town tell.

Also, you just used all the cases against me with weak conviction and lack of explanation. Not to mention the barren wasteland that is your ISO. Now that's active lurking.

As I always said, if you want my meta then go ahead and look for it. But this, this is omgus to no extend. More scummy points for you, sir!

[Snow_Bunny]

Oh, OK. I think I see what you meant.

What I thought you meant:
VV: OMG SD IS SCUM-E
Iec: INORITE. BLAHBLAHBLAH HYPOTHETICAL CRAP CASE AGAINST SD.
VV: *hands off once the wagons rolls*

What you really meant:
VV: SD IS SCUM-E.
*time passes*
SB: WTF WHY IS SD SCUM
Iec: THIS IS IT AFAIK.
SB: LOL CRAP CASE.
VV: *smiles nervously*

Do I have that right?

You have it right.

[VasudeVa]

VV, you can refer to the game in question to see that SB was a lurker who periodically made well-reasoned posts. That's what her play seems like this game IMO.

What is hypocritical about her post? You claim that it was hypocritical, but I don't think you ever indicate why it qualifies as such.

Her ISO is empty, she makes 1 line posts. And then a case on me builds up, then she suddenly starts a wagon on me. Which is why I find it definitely weird. If she is a lurkertown, she would question me every now or join in on a wagon. Goodscum know better than to be THAT inconsistent. However her scum W/L ratio makes me think that she is Badscum jumping early on a case. Even the scummy things I have done so far haven't gotten me a vote from JJH, you or anyone else prodding on my case then she jumps a vote on me.

Did she ever do anything like that in her towngame? What about her scumgame? I need those metas.

[Snow_Bunny]

Me wonders why VV mentions my scum W/L ratio but says nothing about my town W/L and my third party W/L when they are all exactly the same.

[VasudeVa]

As I always said, if you want my meta then go ahead and look for it. But this, this is omgus to no extend. More scummy points for you, sir!

Search is still broken. You can do better than that. What's the matter, afraid of me studying your scumgame?

[VasudeVa]

Me wonders why VV mentions my scum W/L ratio but says nothing about my town W/L and my third party W/L when they are all exactly the same.

Your town W/L has nothing to do with your scum W/L. Hence, why should I mention it? Also, why are you using it to defend yourself?

[Iecerint]

You should already have a link to OpenSource. I gave it to you awhile ago when you requested meta from Jack and me. It's the same game.

Also, that is nice, but it doesn't address why her playstyle is hypocritical.

[Snow_Bunny]

Meh, VV's attack is weak at best, based only on omgus because I put him on the spotlight.

And no, if you want games of mine, then search for them yourself. What makes you think I keep track of the links of my previous games?