Too many D1 lurkers prevented us reaching a majority...though the primary D1 target was lynched fairly quickly D2 w/ an assist from a self vote and flopped town.dramonic wrote:Okay, I need a few things clarified (havent done a reread yet)
Why in the name of god was there a NL day 1?
Why are we only getting 1 kill per night when we have a mafia and a SK?
The "easy mislynch" label is easy to apply in hindsight. I suppose everyone who voted against fifi is scum too?LlamaFluff wrote:You continue to miss the point that its a wagon on town who right now is looking to me like was intended to be an easy mislynch.
Also you didnt unvote him after the claim either. In fact you STILL are voting him.
Its a good lable though. We actually HAVE to have at least one anti-town on that wagon, and if we are going to play the "from my perspective" game, there has to be at least two. I wouldnt be surprised to find scum on the fifi wagon as well, again it was a town wagon that got a claim. With a third of this game being anti-town from the start, I would expect a few to of gotten on that wagon.almightybob wrote:The "easy mislynch" label is easy to apply in hindsight. I suppose everyone who voted against fifi is scum too?LlamaFluff wrote:You continue to miss the point that its a wagon on town who right now is looking to me like was intended to be an easy mislynch.
Also you didnt unvote him after the claim either. In fact you STILL are voting him.
Do you think the entire Suave wagon is/was town?If a player plays scummily, I vote for them. Suave was playing scummily. I voted for him.
Hell, I could easily say that what you're doing now is trying to paint Townies as scum for what was a perfectly valid conclusion to make at the time.
So unvote him then. There is no point to have your vote on that wagon if you dont want him lynched.I haven't bothered unvoting him because it makes precisely 0 difference whether I do or not. Suave will not be lynched today, so who gives a crap whether I unvote or just switch my vote when I actually want to? It makes absolutely no difference whatsoever. He is in no danger of being lynched.
almightybob wrote:If you look at the timing, I placed my vote against Suavebeforehe claimed, when he looked seriously scummy. I don't see how that can really count against me.
You are trying to make it look like you were not a part of the Suave wagon given the timing of his claim. You actually ignored the entire lack of vig arguement and kept pushing the Suave wagon after his claim.almightybob wrote:Not counterclaiming Suave's JK claim, but not really buying it either. Nobody forgets they're a PR. Plus julien raises a good point - why protect someone you think is scum on the very first night? When there was a fullclaim from fifi and a softclaim plus protection request from Haylen?
The wagon wasLlamaFluff wrote:Do you think the entire Suave wagon is/was town?
And there's no point having a vote that isn't doing anything either. So both situations are completely equivalent. ButLlama wrote:So unvote him then. There is no point to have your vote on that wagon if you dont want him lynched.
No, I'm not. I fully acknowledge that I was part of the wagon. I voted for him because I thought he was scummy, he claimed, I expressed doubt and hoped for a counterclaim because he did not seem like a Town PR. I was on his wagon, and I do not deny it. What I DO deny is that I was wrong to do so. We only know that now, after the claim.Llama wrote:You are trying to make it look like you were not a part of the Suave wagon given the timing of his claim. You actually ignored the entire lack of vig arguement and kept pushing the Suave wagon after his claim.
So then you immediately saw that no one could possibly be the vig?almightybob wrote:I didn't say much during the Vig argument because I was hoping that, if we didn't mention it too much, a stupid scum might claim Vig during the massclaim. It was a long shot I'll admit, but excessive explicit statements that there was clearly no Vig ruled that opportunity out anyway.
I'd thought it was incredibly unlikely since around the start of D3, yes. For 2 out of 3 kill attempts to be blocked each Night would be pretty far-fetched. I'm surprised at 1 out of 2 each night, so 2 out of 3 would take a lot of convincing.LlamaFluff wrote:So then you immediately saw that no one could possibly be the vig?
Llama...when was the Mr Suave VC made?LlamaFluff wrote:Check these two votecounts out
Darkstrike_11 (7): MrSuave, Civil Scum,TehWuicah, almightybob,The1fifi, Darkstrike_11,Mr. Sandman (voted post hammer)
Mr.Suave (3):havingfitz, almightybob,The1fifi,Mr. Sandman (in spirit)
Im debating revising my list a bit to add AMB as SK over fitz given that with Sandman he has been on both wagons (that almost everone on has flipped or proven town). Sandman has been much sneakier on the wagons though with the post vote and his play on Suave.
Can this sound any less genuine?havingfitz wrote:Also...fifi is past the prod deadline. Way to continue helping the team fifi. You are finally confirmed town and you contribute squat. I so wish you weren’t confirmed so I could have my vote on you. You are really a detriment to town winning this game. Thanks.
Can it be any more accurate? I've been on fifi the entire game and the only thing keeping me off him is the fact he is essentially confirmed town.dramonic wrote:Can this sound any less genuine?havingfitz wrote:Also...fifi is past the prod deadline. Way to continue helping the team fifi. You are finally confirmed town and you contribute squat. I so wish you weren’t confirmed so I could have my vote on you. You are really a detriment to town winning this game. Thanks.
Did I come across as aggressive? Not my intention. Just providing my opinion. Which I'm pretty comfortable with in regards to fifi. I wholeheartedly welcome his potential replacement as they would have to be an improvement. Both in quantity and most likely quality of posts.dramonic wrote:Aren't we an aggressive little guy.
It's a flawless defense fifi has, he hasn't posted anywhere in multiple days. He'll just get replaced and we'll proceed from there.
It's becoming your standard operating procedure. No need to apologize.MrSuave wrote:o____o... really, my bad. ^_^;;;
Pre-claimhavingfitz wrote:Llama...when was the Mr Suave VC made?LlamaFluff wrote:Check these two votecounts out
Darkstrike_11 (7): MrSuave, Civil Scum,TehWuicah, almightybob,The1fifi, Darkstrike_11,Mr. Sandman (voted post hammer)
Mr.Suave (3):havingfitz, almightybob,The1fifi,Mr. Sandman (in spirit)
Im debating revising my list a bit to add AMB as SK over fitz given that with Sandman he has been on both wagons (that almost everone on has flipped or proven town). Sandman has been much sneakier on the wagons though with the post vote and his play on Suave.
When did you realize there was no vig?In all honesty...I was not sold on Suave’s claim until there was no counter and no Vig. So I can't fault others for the same reluctance at moving their vote (or having it there in the first place).
Sandmans post looked genuinely surprised to me when he was told that was hammer +1. Also remember scum is able to SK hunt in this game though, and SK is able to scum hunt.I get a town feel from AMB which leaves TW’s vote as the only scum on the DS lynch. I have not looked at Sandman that closely yet but I find it hard to believe scum (knowing they would be contributing to a mislynch) would jump on a mislynch wagon after the hammer had fallen. Though I would not rule him out for that...it’s just more a town move than scum IMO.
You look for who is reading as scum. They are probably the SK. That or you hope that somehow scum figured out who the SK is through a RB and use that to get them lynched.As for the SK...that would put him in the group I have just described as having a town feel to me (AMB, Concerned, Sandman). I have not played in a SK game before so I really don’t know what I’m looking for since for the most part (IMO) I would assume they would generally play like town...despite having a conflicting win condition. Which of these three it could be IDK. More reading required but I’m happy to focus on the players I at least have a strong suspicion of.
Then it should read:LlamaFluff wrote:Pre-claimhavingfitz wrote: Llama...when was the Mr Suave VC made?
When the last person to claim didn’t claim it. If I hgad to guess I would have thought there wasn’t one based on the low number of NKs...but there were possible scenarios (which I brought up earlier at your request) that could have allowed for there to still be one (a Vig).LlamaFluff wrote:When did you realize there was no vig?havingfitz wrote:In all honesty...I was not sold on Suave’s claim until there was no counter and no Vig. So I can't fault others for the same reluctance at moving their vote (or having it there in the first place).
Admittedly I need to give a few players a closer look over again....mainly Concerned and Sandman as they have not posted that much. My feel towards them is mostly that they haven’t done anything that at the moment caught my attention.LlamaFluff wrote:Sandmans post looked genuinely surprised to me when he was told that was hammer +1. Also remember scum is able to SK hunt in this game though, and SK is able to scum hunt.havingfitz wrote:I get a town feel from AMB which leaves TW’s vote as the only scum on the DS lynch. I have not looked at Sandman that closely yet but I find it hard to believe scum (knowing they would be contributing to a mislynch) would jump on a mislynch wagon after the hammer had fallen. Though I would not rule him out for that...it’s just more a town move than scum IMO.
Oh also if you want to add "sandman has done zero scumhunting since *argueably* his vote of DS" you can. He has spent the entrie day defending against me pushing him instead of going back to a suave case early (which would of made sense) or even pushing a new case.
I just need to go look in a few completed games that had SK’s to see how they were uncovered...assuming they were. Your last line read a little odd to me. Almost like it was advice coming from mafia.LlamaFluff wrote:You look for who is reading as scum. They are probably the SK. That or you hope that somehow scum figured out who the SK is through a RB and use that to get them lynched.havingfitz wrote:As for the SK...that would put him in the group I have just described as having a town feel to me (AMB, Concerned, Sandman). I have not played in a SK game before so I really don’t know what I’m looking for since for the most part (IMO) I would assume they would generally play like town...despite having a conflicting win condition. Which of these three it could be IDK. More reading required but I’m happy to focus on the players I at least have a strong suspicion of.
That was only one of the points I brought up against you. They were scummy IMO...but now we know they are town. When I look at the votes on them...any of the wagons I may have been on I rule myself out because I am not scum. Then I factor out any people I may have a town read on and any that are confirmed town. In more than one vote on D1, that leaves me with you. Ex below (ISO #s are for Nacho):julienvonwolfe wrote:Thinking more about fitz' case on me, he accuses me of mainly targeting people we know to be innocent (Suave and Fifi).
Yet he has himself spent much time voting for Suave, he voted for Darkstrike day one (and would have on day two), and FOSed Fifi. This makes him seem hypocritical to me.
Llama, you seem to think I'm scum. I'm not completely sure why, though. Can you explain for me?