Mini 930:Morning People Mafia (Game Over!)

[Deer]

Deer - Other then rz who's your next most likely to be scum candidate?

That's a pretty good question. Not a huge fan of SSSS's play, but Nobody Special has been active lurking quite a bit. If he keeps posting content-less posts like he has been, probably him.

[TeWuicah]

Vote: Nobody Special

. Lead by example! People need to start voting instead of being so noncommittal.

Agreed. I was hoping for quicker replacements, but doesn't seem to be happening.

Vote: water_foul

See my last two posts for reasons. You haven't answered any of my questions. Lurk much? Speaking of which:

mod:

water_foul needs a prod. Also, in your vote count Sucrose is voting for two different people.

Syke: My bad! I update votecounts from file. My mistake.

[chauchaudotcom]

We could always cut Sucrose in half, you know, to make it match. >=]

[chauchaudotcom]

That's a pretty good question. Not a huge fan of SSSS's play, but Nobody Special has been active lurking quite a bit. If he keeps posting content-less posts like he has been, probably him.

What's your thoughts on water_foul then? Who has openly admitted to not just lurking, but active lurking?

[Deer]

What's your thoughts on water_foul then? Who has openly admitted to not just lurking, but active lurking?

Well, at least he's admitted to it. It seems to me like he's just a busy-in-RL town so far. I wish he wasn't lurking, of course, but what else can you do?

[Sucrose]

Heh, I'll take that double-vote.

Anyway, It'll be nice when the replacements show up so the thread can continue. I dislike how few people are showing up during this period even with questions on them.

[havingfitz]

How many replacements are we getting again? Two?

If so...that leaves us with ten 'active' players...should be enough to progress the game.

Does anyone else think rz replacing out (or FA for that matter) compounds suspicions that were already on them?

If you suspected rz before he bailed...are you willing give rz's replacement a clean slate? For me the answer is no....whic h is why my vote is still on him.

Slow game. How many lurkers do we have?

[jbernier93]

It's hard to tell the lurkers from the nonlurkers, because some people are legit lurking while others don't want to post without having anything to respond to, and thus are unintentionally lurking as a result of lurkers.

[sykedoc]

People who have been prodded: Water_Foul, smashbro.
About to receive prod: Nobody Special.

[Nobody Special]

I'm here, but nothing new has really happened; I'm happy with my vote on rzhang.

I would like to note that I have over 24 hours until I need a prod (not now, obviously). Not that I would

ever

argue with the mod, but I don't agree that 24 hours away is "about to be prodded."

Syke: If someone lurks once or twice I consider it close as they usually don't post. At least that caught your attention, you get the benefit of the doubt next time.

[smashbro_of_the_SSS]

Sorry for not posting much, but its true, what jb said, not having anything to post about. and fitz, i plan on waiting to see what rz's replacement is like before deciding on what to think of the slot.

[chauchaudotcom]

I call bs on everyone complaining there is nothing to talk about. If there is nothing to talk about, you ask questions, you ACTIVELY scumhunt. What are you waiting for? Scum to run around screaming, "OMG I'M SCUM LYNCH MEEEE!!!"

Smash - I had a question for you on the page before this. Why would JB be worrying about 'pressure' if you're not even voting him, or even questioning him about his actions? Why aren't you pursuing someone you find suspicious? Given that there are 12 people in this game, and MORE THEN ONE SCUM, even if rzhang was scum, why aren't you trying to find the other scum?

Unvote: Vote: Smashbro

because you lot are pissing me off and I bloody feel like it.

And I fucking love how the three people who respond didn't even address fitz's question. (Yes, I am in a terrible mood today and I am projecting it onto you guys.)

Does anyone else think rz replacing out (or FA for that matter) compounds suspicions that were already on them?

The act of replacing out is a null tell, because we can never distinguish whether it was real life or role related. The suspicion cast upon the two before still remains, but it does not increase or decrease simply because they replaced out.

If you suspected rz before he bailed...are you willing give rz's replacement a clean slate? For me the answer is no....whic h is why my vote is still on him.

They have the same role, why would you give them a clean slate?

Slow game. How many lurkers do we have?

Too many.

So. I have a proposition. You guys should all join the smash wagon. Why? Because wagons are good. Wagons make stuff happen. Do it. You know you wanna.

[TeWuicah]

Does anyone else think rz replacing out (or FA for that matter) compounds suspicions that were already on them?

I already answered this, but I'll elaborate on it since no one else seems to have any questions. I found rz's play unconventional and interesting, but I hadn't yet decided whether it was scummy or not. So kind of yes, with the information that he would decide to request replacement, it looks a lot scummier.

If you suspected rz before he bailed...are you willing give rz's replacement a clean slate? For me the answer is no....whic h is why my vote is still on him.

Obviously not a clean slate, but I would very much like to hear what he has to say.

So. I have a proposition. You guys should all join the smash wagon. Why? Because wagons are good. Wagons make stuff happen. Do it. You know you wanna.

Sounds like fun!

Unvote, Vote: smashbro_of_the_SSS

[havingfitz]

And I fucking love how the three people who respond didn't even address fitz's question. (Yes, I am in a terrible mood today and I am projecting it onto you guys.)

Does anyone else think rz replacing out (or FA for that matter) compounds suspicions that were already on them?

The act of replacing out is a null tell, because we can never distinguish whether it was real life or role related. The suspicion cast upon the two before still remains, but it does not increase or decrease simply because they replaced out.

If you suspected rz before he bailed...are you willing give rz's replacement a clean slate? For me the answer is no....whic h is why my vote is still on him.

They have the same role, why would you give them a clean slate?

I found their replacing out to be scummy. I know it can be a nulltell. I haven't looked to see if they have posted anywhere since their requests. I especially suspect rz more because I felt he was under a good bit of pressure at the time.

Personally...I would not give them a clean slate...as I mentioned in my own answer to my question.

[smashbro_of_the_SSS]

I call bs on everyone complaining there is nothing to talk about. If there is nothing to talk about, you ask questions, you ACTIVELY scumhunt. What are you waiting for? Scum to run around screaming, "OMG I'M SCUM LYNCH MEEEE!!!"

Smash - I had a question for you on the page before this. Why would JB be worrying about 'pressure' if you're not even voting him, or even questioning him about his actions? Why aren't you pursuing someone you find suspicious? Given that there are 12 people in this game, and MORE THEN ONE SCUM, even if rzhang was scum, why aren't you trying to find the other scum?

Unvote: Vote: Smashbro

because you lot are pissing me off and I bloody feel like it.

And I fucking love how the three people who respond didn't even address fitz's question. (Yes, I am in a terrible mood today and I am projecting it onto you guys.)

Does anyone else think rz replacing out (or FA for that matter) compounds suspicions that were already on them?

The act of replacing out is a null tell, because we can never distinguish whether it was real life or role related. The suspicion cast upon the two before still remains, but it does not increase or decrease simply because they replaced out.

If you suspected rz before he bailed...are you willing give rz's replacement a clean slate? For me the answer is no....whic h is why my vote is still on him.

They have the same role, why would you give them a clean slate?

Slow game. How many lurkers do we have?

Too many.

So. I have a proposition. You guys should all join the smash wagon. Why? Because wagons are good. Wagons make stuff happen. Do it. You know you wanna.

Ok, feel free to wagon me, at least it will get me more into the game. Just watch out for any premature lynches.

As for why jb would be worrying about pressure, I didn't think that one through at all, so I waited to answer, and then eventually forgot about it. I just thought that I wanted to see him under pressure, but unfortunately it does not look like that will happen soon.

As for the fact about my lurking, I don't know, I wasn't actively lurking, I truly had nothing to say, and so contributed to my not posting here. The only thing I have right now are a few town tells, and I'd rather not share them for the sake of hopefully not telling scum who would be the best nightkill. So, I guess just to hear more from him,

Vote; water_foul

[jbernier93]

Ok, feel free to wagon me, at least it will get me more into the game.

Just watch out for any premature lynches.

As for why jb would be worrying about pressure, I didn't think that one through at all, so I waited to answer, and then eventually forgot about it. I just thought that I wanted to see him under pressure, but unfortunately it does not look like that will happen soon.

As for the fact about my lurking, I don't know, I wasn't actively lurking, I truly had nothing to say, and so contributed to my not posting here. The only thing I have right now are a few town tells, and I'd rather not share them for the sake of hopefully not telling scum who would be the best nightkill. So, I guess just to hear more from him,

Vote; water_foul

(Emphasis added)
seriously? That's practically a scumclaim.

unvote, vote: Smashbro

Honestly, you are so scummy that, once you die, if you flip town, I will eat a sock.

[havingfitz]

Can we get a vote count?

[Deer]

Honestly, you are so scummy that, once you die, if you flip town, I will eat a sock.

Then why had you not voted him earlier, JB? I find it hard to believe that just him saying "feel free to wagon on me" gets you to say that above quote.

[jbernier93]

Honestly, you are so scummy that, once you die, if you flip town, I will eat a sock.

Then why had you not voted him earlier, JB? I find it hard to believe that just him saying "feel free to wagon on me" gets you to say that above quote.

I had voted him earlier. I changed my vote to Nobody special briefly. Pay attention please.

[sykedoc]

Vote Count:

rzhang86(3): Deer, havingfitz, Nobody Special
Deer(1): rzhang86
smashbro_of_the_SSS(4): Sucrose, chauchaudotcom, jbernier93, TeWuicah
water_foul(1): smashbro_of_the_SSS

If water_foul hasn't posted by monday, he gets replaced

peanutman replaces fallen angel

Also I believe this marks ONE WEEK left unless a replacement so requests an extension

[havingfitz]

Vote Count:

rzhang86(3): Deer, havingfitz, Nobody Special
Deer(1): rzhang86
smashbro_of_the_SSS(1): Sucrose, chauchaudotcom
water_foul(3): TeWuicah, smashbro_of_the_SSS, jbernier93

If water_foul hasn't posted by monday, he gets replaced

peanutman replaces fallen angel

Also I believe this marks ONE WEEK left unless a replacement so requests an extension

Just looking a few posts up from here I can tell this votecount is wrong. Could we get an accurate one?

Also...v/LA from 2300GMT tonight till 1500GMT this Thursday.

Syke: I'll just make you V/LA until the end of Thursday

[chauchaudotcom]

Mod: votecount's wrong. Both Te and JB switched to Smash

Syke: I accidentally put them under the wrong one. Fixed.

I especially suspect rz more because I felt he was under a good bit of pressure at the time.

For all of you who feel like the replacing out makes him for sure scum, how are you so positive that he replaced out because of scum frustration versus townie frustration? Given that just before to his replacement a lot of the attention was shifting towards Smash, RZ could have easily bounced back and tried to lurk it out or slide by as smash quickly rised up all of our scumdars. I just don't see how you can wifom it one way without considering the other possibility as well.

I saw that rz was not only frustrated with himself, but with town AND with the mod as well. Who knows what could have been going on in his mind, scum OR town. Giving the replacement a clean slate? Hell no. But the act of replacing out is a null tell.

And for FA he seemed genuinely busy with life (if you read his last few posts). Though I wish both had the courtesy of at least telling us prior to.

Sounds like fun!

Why are you willing to bandwagon someone you find town?

Other than that, I'm getting town vibes from your reply. I was more curious as to how you would respond when pressured than honestly suspicious, anyway. Hey, so long as everyone else is pulling off gambits. I see no point in having my vote on you anymore, so...

Ok, feel free to wagon me, at least it will get me more into the game. Just watch out for any premature lynches.

......

As for the fact about my lurking, I don't know, I wasn't actively lurking, I truly had nothing to say, and so contributed to my not posting here

Have you heard of the term scum hunting before? Well, do it.

but unfortunately it does not look like that will happen soon.

What do you mean? If you are suspicious of JB, why not question his jumping around and commit a vote to him? Why did you pick water_foul instead of JB?

[smashbro_of_the_SSS]

but unfortunately it does not look like that will happen soon.

What do you mean? If you are suspicious of JB, why not question his jumping around and commit a vote to him? Why did you pick water_foul instead of JB?

lol, while i was making a case against him, you posted this. I originally picked waterfowl because of the people who were under pressure of votes, water_fowl seemed like the best vote to get information from, and help make my decision.

Ok, feel free to wagon me, at least it will get me more into the game.

Just watch out for any premature lynches.

As for why jb would be worrying about pressure, I didn't think that one through at all, so I waited to answer, and then eventually forgot about it. I just thought that I wanted to see him under pressure, but unfortunately it does not look like that will happen soon.

As for the fact about my lurking, I don't know, I wasn't actively lurking, I truly had nothing to say, and so contributed to my not posting here. The only thing I have right now are a few town tells, and I'd rather not share them for the sake of hopefully not telling scum who would be the best nightkill. So, I guess just to hear more from him,

Vote; water_foul

(Emphasis added)
seriously? That's practically a scumclaim.

unvote, vote: Smashbro

Honestly, you are so scummy that, once you die, if you flip town, I will eat a sock.

What do you mean it is a scum claim? I'm saying that bandwagoning will both get me more into the game, and it will give more information to talk about. Which it looks like it has.

Also, deer brings up an interesting point, what are the exact reasons for my play being scummy? Is it just this quote, saying that bandwagoning would help, the makes me scummy?

So, since you gave little reason for your vote other than that, and deer's comment, i decided to look back at your votes in relations to everone else's votes starting on page 5, figuring that before that was mostly, if not all, RVS. Here's what I found (pay special attention to green, bold):

post 75: fitz unvotes, votes rzhang
post 78: waterfowl unvotes, votes rzhang
post 79: fallen angel unvotes deer
post 80: fitz unvotes rzhang, votes fallen angel
post 91: jbernier93 votes rzhang86
Post 95: fallen angel puts HoS on rzhang86
Post 100: deer votes rzhang

Post 150: Sucrose votes smashbro

Post 162: Nobody special unvotes whoever he had voted from RVS
Post 163: smashbro unvotes rzhang

Post 165: jbernier93 votes smashbro

Posts 166-168: chauchaudotcom votes me, takes off the vote due to not seeing jbernier93's vote, then puts it back on me, because there is no danger of a lynch.
Post 183: nobody special puts FoS on rzhang and fallen angel
Post 189: TeWuicah unvotes smashbro

Post 194: Fitz puts FOS on water_foul

Post 200: Sucrose unvotes, Votes smashbro

Post 204: jbernier93 puts fos on water foul
Post 213: jbernier93 votes nobody special

Post 217: fitz puts fos on waterfowl
post 218: chauchaudotcom votes nobody special
post 223: nobody special votes rzhang
post 226: TeWuicah votes water_fowl

post 236: chauchaudotcom votes smashbro
post 237: TeWuicah unvotes Votes smashbro
post 240: jbernier93 unvotes, votes smashbro

jbernier93 is jumping from vote to vote, once a decent case is presented on someone who has seemed suspicious. Also, what happened to your FoS on waterfowl from 204? It magically disappears?


Also, your posts tend to offer little to no explanations for votes, quoted below:

i voted Deer for the same reason fallen angel did...

vote:rzhang86

JB - Why do you think rz is scummy? You quoted a line he wrote when you voted but never explained.

I thought it was pretty self-explanatory? Basically it was a very weak explanation regarding his vote, because it seems to directly contradict the whole purpose of fallen's gambit. Also I get a bit of a gut feeling scum feeling from him.

Back.

Still happy with my vote, but

fos: water foul

for some pretty obvious active lurking and then focusing on denying it....

Also,

mod

: Pretty sure Nobody Special needs a prod.

This got me thinking, I know I've seen NS active on this site lately... check, and sure enough, he's posted much more recently in other places...

unvote, vote:Nobody Special

for pressure/horrible lurking, but will probably go back to SSSSSSSSSS at some point.

You even set yourself up to say, "don't blame me for coming out of nowhere to vote smashbro next time I do"

Ok, feel free to wagon me, at least it will get me more into the game.

Just watch out for any premature lynches.

As for why jb would be worrying about pressure, I didn't think that one through at all, so I waited to answer, and then eventually forgot about it. I just thought that I wanted to see him under pressure, but unfortunately it does not look like that will happen soon.

As for the fact about my lurking, I don't know, I wasn't actively lurking, I truly had nothing to say, and so contributed to my not posting here. The only thing I have right now are a few town tells, and I'd rather not share them for the sake of hopefully not telling scum who would be the best nightkill. So, I guess just to hear more from him,

Vote; water_foul

(Emphasis added)
seriously? That's practically a scumclaim.

unvote, vote: Smashbro

Honestly, you are so scummy that, once you die, if you flip town, I will eat a sock.

This is not and OMGUS vote, but a serious vote against my current top suspect.

unvote, vote: jbernier93

[/b]

[peanutman]

Hey guys. I am replacing fallen angel.

First things first, I did not particularly like some of the things that Fallen Angel did. For one, the gambit he explained as he played it was odd. I also don't agree on the importance of meta. I, like JB (I believe), don't give it much weight because of anyone being able to manipulate it for their own purposes. I also don't like how he basically tunnelled rzhang at the beginning, cluttering up the thread with mainly those two for half the game at this point. That being said, you may hold his actions against me, but that is not my style of play.

Water_foul

1) Reading through the thread, Water_foul struck a cord for me from the beginning, even before his "I know I'm lurking but because I'm saying it, you can't hold it against me" (or that's how I paraphrase it). His third post strikes me as him wanting to set the tone for his "townie" playing (purely gut feeling, no fact to back this up). He asks others to look into player's previous games and to post their findings, and that he would "tomorrow", but never came up with anything. It's like he's trying to coach others to work together as a town, without doing it himself. (There's also the fact that I hate meta, but I won't hold that against him). Finally, he votes for rzhang, among other things, "a little because deer acquitted himself nicely for now". Why would he vote rzhang because deer defended himself well. Odds are townies will make a case/vote a townie a lot on D1, especially at the beginning of the day. This doesn't necessarily clear rzhang (or his replacement), but it's an false argument.

2) Then, his list of players with percentages so early in the game seems utterly pointless. The main criteria was posting frequency/lurking, but so early in the game (and even now, the way it has played), this isn't helpful in weeding out candidates. Much more like a load of fluff than anything else.

3)Also, there's the whole lurking thing (which he brings up for more often than anyone else). What really gets me about this is in iso7 when he attributes at least part of his lurkiness to being in "untested waters" because players who were more at the center of attention requested to be replaced. He joined in 2007 yet he's thrown off by a replacement... that seems very odd to me, and more like making excuses for lurking, not being so active.

That, and he definitely needs a prod (last post March 1st). He certainly has a lot of questions to answer to.

Mod : please prod Water_foul

Vote : Water_foul

---

The other person that I wish to point out is Nobody Special.
I was also suspicious of his iso8, which started with

Hi. (In before prod!)

Why was it necessary to boast that he came in before the prod (which the mod had in effect said he would do barring loss of internet access 4 hours before). He then accuses everyone else of not posting frequently enough, he had more active games. For one, this comes off as over-confident in my eyes, kind of saying "I have more important games and am waiting for you guys to do stuff that I can react to". Although this applies to many players in this game, stop being reactive and start being proactive. Statements such as "I've been following but have nothing to add since there's nothing new" is not helpful. Keep looking further into things, repeat questions or follow-up on them. Heck, if you're into it, look into metas (though you can be sure I won't). In all, I'm not liking NS's attitude in this game so far.

---

I don't wish to comment on everything that has happened in this game so far, so as to not have a super long post and because I've only read through the thread once. But I will gladly address any events/issues any of you would like my comments on.
I will also like to make cleaner and shorter posts, without losing valuable content.
Finally, I wouldn't ask personally for a deadline extension because I think there's still a lot of material to come up with arguments/cases and an extension would most likely delay the end of the day without much benefit. This game needs pressure/incentive to be more active, and I don't think an extension will do that.

He's already prodded. If he hasn't posted by the end of today I look for a replacement

[TeWuicah]

Why are you willing to bandwagon someone you find town?

Because I also dislike when people come from a long hiatus only to post that they have nothing to post about. What's more this game seems pretty devoid of life and I came here expecting to have to make an attempt at RQS to get some discussion going. But when I saw your proposition, I figured that jumping on that bandwagon would serve the same purpose, so I suppose I got lazy there.

I'm a bit uncomfortable with him having four votes now though, especially given that his most recent post mimics my thoughts on jbernier3* and also because I may not be able to check this thread in the next 24 hours or so, so I'll

Unvote

.

*I don't find him my prime suspect, but I've noted his relatively low content posting and opportunistic vote jumping all over the place. Might be his playstyle, but it strikes me as odd.