Flash Mafia: You won!

[Snow White]

Well then i apologise that i misunderstood.

Rhinox who yesterday was having doubts that i was guilty should NOT have made it through to today.
Scum have left him alive so that i look as though i left him alive to have a supporter onside.

Why would someone want to incrimanate me? Because i declared yesterdaay given a choice between mike and AGOTI i would vote AGOTI in accordance with Rhinox's belief of mike's innocence.

The person who has been calling me the towniest player going from day2 suddenly changes her mind on day6? Because RHinox is still alive? Face it AGOTI its a fair enough reason to suddenly change your opinion of me.

Well tell me what else apparently brought this on AGOTI?

[mykonian]

I don't think you need a votecount

[Snow White]

ZAWNZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

[Rhinox]

yeah yeah i know, but I'm waiting for MBF to return (we couldn't lynch anyone without him if we wanted to), and I haven't taken the time to find any questions to ask AGOTI.

But I just thought of questions to ask both of you.

White: why are you not voting AGOTI yet?

AGOTI: why are you not voting white yet?

[Snow White]

Fair enough Rhinox.

Im not voting AGOTI because honestly the time has never been right, i dont like voting much anyway but equally im only sharing your belief in Mike's innocence. Im not convinced on either of them. And ive only re evaluated AGOTI and didnt want to seem rash. Therefore it is highly recommended for my own sake and for the sake of town i dont vote inappropriately. Or rush things which is the last thing that i would want.

[mikeburnfire]

Correct me if im wrong, if someone had apparently shown me this much faith in the entire game, were i scum, (im not) WHY THE FUCK WOULD I HESITATE IN KILLIING RHINOX??? AND THEN LEAD A LYNCH AGAINST MIKE SOMEONE WHO AGOTI MADE A CASE OF BEING SCUM!

I don't recall AGOTI making a case of me being scum. She's really just tunneled on Poro. As yesterday ended, here is where the suspicion seemed to lie:

MBF is suspicious of White
White is suspicious of MBF
Rhinox is suspicious of AGOTI
AGOTI is suspicious of nobody (except Porochaz)

If you are scum, then without Rhinox you'd have to convince me to vote AGOTI or AGOTI to vote me. Either way is tricky (well, maybe not the first one). With Rhinox alive, you'd at least have somebody arguing for AGOTI's lynch.

If AGOTI is scum, then without Rhinox she'd have to convince me to vote White, or White to vote me. Either way would be EASY, since we've been going at each other. With Rhinox alive, she would have to get me and Rhinox to vote White (difficult, as Rhinox insists that White seems town) or get Rhinox and White to vote me (unlikely, as Rhinox made it clear he was not comfortable voting me).

So to sum it up, keeping Rhinox alive is a pretty good move for you to make, but an ABSOLUTELY TERRIBLE move for AGOTI to make. (Which makes it a good move if she wants to WIFOM us). That is why I say we have either a desperate White or a devious AGOTI. ATM, I'm still leaning White, she really gives off the allure of being scum. But on the other hand, I'd be pretty livid if AGOTI-scum WIFOM'd me for the win.

[Snow White]

In Agoti's 45 iso's case on mike:
iso 20: pre tajo vote.
iso 22: List you second to porochaz as scum.
iso 23: makes a case against you.

Becomes quite clear no one is really ready to lynch you or theres not enough support for your lynch. Gives up. Everyone she wanted dead has turned up town bar tajo. Prozac, roflcopter, Snow Bunny.

Pomegranate(7):

populartajo

,

crypto, elvis_knits, SpyreX,

a girl on the internet,

Roflcopter,

Rayfrost.

Rayfrost(6):

Porochaz,

mikeburnfire,

Snow_Bunny, elvis_knits, SpyreX, crypto

Populartajo (5):

Snow White, Roflcopter,

a girl on the internet,

elvis_knits ,

mikeburnfire
Snow_Bunny (4): mikeburnfire,

Porochaz,

A girl on the internet,

Roflcopter.

Porochaz(3): A girl on the internet,

Snow white, Rhinox

*Sigh* i dont know why i thought that helped. The only thing i can think of is mike bussing Ray. Or AGOTI hoping her image can give her enough leeway to act as she pleases band hopping in the extreme and being on board every lynch bar the ray frost lynch.

@AGOTI. Why is the person you've been calling town day1 up for the noose instead of someone you previously found scummy?

@Mike. If i was scum i would have killed Rhinox and talked AGOTI into lynching YOU since y'know the whole

Lastly, and i really hope i dont end up with egg on my face with this, if RayFrost is ScumRayFrost, VT is a really shitty fakeclaim.

^ town

that post was not a post i think snow white would make if she was scum. unless she was scum with ray, and she can't be, cuz he's town. anyway, by pointin this out, i hope to get smart town peeps to think about that post more and realize i'm right.

town
snow white
ray
rofl
spyrex
elvis
crypto
tajo
snow bunny
mbf
prozac
scum

scum
prozac
mbf
tajo
rofl/crypto
snow bunny
snow white
elvis
town

I guess she thinks it'll be easier to convince me to lynch AGOTI than to convince AGOTI to lynch me.

even though i've been acting like she's confirmed town for no apparent reason for most of the game! it's like she doesn't trust me or somethin. geez.

BUT I DIDNT AND I STATED AFTER THAT, THAT I WOULD PICK MIKE OVER AGOTI on post 1151. In regard to Rhinox belief mike was town.

So i'm going to advize lynching Porochaz today.
Rhinox will turn up dead tomorrow (obviously).
And there on in i'd advice an AGOTI lynch in lylo if mike, AGOTI and myself are left. lol. But i know i cant expect anyone to take my word on that but if thats what it comes down to we will see how things turn out. I only know this stalling is getting us no where.

Now after AGOTI admitting she thought i was town since the end of day1 because i said "If rayfrost is scumrayfrost that VT claim is really rather shitty". In future ill just keep my mouth shut btw. But thats what i felt!

BTW A QUESTION! Why did i get slack for NOT reading day1 regarding the RayFrost hammer on Pom (a wagon that AGOTI contributed heavily to iso9) and AGOTI who was aware of RayFrosts unprecedented hammer as was rofl and im the ONLY one who gets stoned. Whereas they/she KNEW what they were doing. KNEW IT AND I STUMBLE IN AND INSTADEATHDARAY.

Caps i know but they're for emphasis. Point still stands.

@Mike your blaming me for claiming i single handed spearheaded the tajo lynch as he was someone i had otherwise ignored makes no sense, there was no question marks regarding him and the only reason i examined him was because of

We have an anti-elvis anti-rolf group conformed by mbf, poro and subtly but still, snowwhite.

It didnt sit right then (for obv reasons now) i iso'd him and hounded him. I know its lame. But at the end game ill be smug in the fact that i was right on that at least. I gave AGOTI a large amount of credit because in my eyes few people listened to the case i made on tajo but reviewing i see that you and crypto supported it. She did clear the one point that Tajo said="i need a really good reason not to vote ray but i dont think there is one" to="cop, please ome out with an innocent on my godfather". But i stated this prior! To me she was the only one who copped it and wrote it in english for everyone else to see. Because i rant. Alot. So people dont always understand. But it got her town cred.

@Mike. AGOTI was declaring me innocent. Are you seriously saying that i could have convinced you to vote her? LMFAO.

She was calling me innocent since DAY1. How could it have bene hard to convince her if Rhinox had died?

Allure of being scum? LOL. I give out townie vibes because here's the thing, im townie!! Rhinox has somehow picked up on that, i dont get how if he can you havent.

TL;DR

Yah im pretty much tired of defending myself now. If your town mike grab your popcorn. Im getting ready to bleed town all over this game.

But it'd be nice if AGOTI could "justify my accusations" beforehand.

[a girl on the internet]

here's something that's bothering me. snow white really seems to be genuinely surprised that i am attacking her today. i've been grilling her for two reasons:

one is to try to get her to see the inherent ridiculous nature of her position re: rhinox being alive.

FAO snow white: if the best justification you can come up with for ME to leave rhinox alive is that i'm doing it to frame YOU, does that not necessarily require that there must be a more obvious motivation for YOU to leave rhinox alive?

the other is to try to figure out if she is fakin that surprise. and it doesn't feel like she is. that being the case, it really doesn't make a lot of sense for her to leave rhinox alive. if she's still takin all my "snow white is town forever and ever" comments at face value, then surely she would expect that i would immediately vote mike here, so why bring the guy who refuses to vote mike under any circumstances into endgame with me? that's just gonna muddy the waters.

rhinox, help me out here. why are you so sure mike is town?

[Snow White]

But you see here's the thing...

I DIDNT LEAVE RHINOX ALIVE LAST NIGHT. But iunno. This could be because IM NOT SCUM. Therefore, i KNOW im being framed. And you, AGOTI are the one who is hounding me for it.

I declared yesterday that today AGOTI i would vote you anyway when Rhinox died even though Mike wanted me dead too. So ScumMike really had no motivation for leaving Rhinox alive today.

AGOTIscum realises that despite calling Snow White town the entire game, Snow White was still going to vote AGOTI at lylo. So AGOTIscum decides she wants to do a Uturn muddy the waters and frame Snow White by leaving the one person who doubted that Snow White was scum. Rhinox.

Because, in lylo how could she expain that she would vote for someone she had consistently claimed was town ahead of mbf? Because Rinox was still alive and thus the "inherent riddiculous nature of Snow White's position" DUN DUN DUN!!!!!

The End. Unless im missing something?

So uh... yah. I cant make things any clearer. As said. Tired of defending myself when it feels like theres no one else on the platter and i think i semi talked myself into voting now anway. Who you vote for is your own business tbh. If my vote is requisite to move its subject to a case and how substantial that case is.

@Mike please join conversation and give views. If you are scum i will be be orly orly upset and tearful.

vote AGOTI

*must now wrestle with herself for fifteen minutes to click submit button GAH!! CLICKIE... CLICKIE!!!*

[a girl on the internet]

do you even read my posts

[mikeburnfire]

@Mike. If i was scum i would have killed Rhinox and talked AGOTI into lynching YOU

Hmmn. I see your point. AGOTI has been more defensive of you than I had previously thought, so trying to get AGOTI to vote me might have worked.

On the other hand, Rhinox was suspicious of AGOTI and defensive of you and me, so keeping him alive just seems like a terrible move for AGOTI to make.

But on the other hand, you did say you'd vote AGOTI if Rhinox died, so keeping Rhinox alive turns out to be a good move for AGOTI.

I'm so conflicted.

if she's still takin all my "snow white is town forever and ever" comments at face value, then surely she would expect that i would immediately vote mike here

Doesn't sound like you anticipated that Snow White would take your comments at face value and you had to keep some options open.

[Snow White]

@mike hell yes she was shouting left right and centre i was innocent. :/ Rhinox was having doubts about my alignment after i addressed his concerns. I went to very scummy, to could be town. Then today, we wake up and Rhinox is still alive and while im not complaining, it is for my part, a further piece of incrimination.

*Sigh* at least if Crypto was here he would vote me slash and or hammer me and put me out of my misery.

Or does someone want to blame me for Crypto getting banned too?

BTW. Ever notice how AGOTI doesnt address questions, just uses another question to distract people? Or lists hypothetical explanations? Even the way she has phrased :

FAO snow white: if the best justification you can come up with for ME to leave rhinox alive is that i'm doing it to frame YOU, does that not necessarily require that there must be a more obvious motivation for YOU to leave rhinox alive?

How bad does that sound? Also it sounds premeditated. also notice how she doesnt ask the possiblity of Mike being the one to set me up and not her. (which is still possible but im just really hoping not) and then broadens her net to asking Rhinox why mike is so innocent. Its like she's covering all bases for gods sake

I guess we're waiting for either AGOTI or Rhinox to reply. Now im off to make tea and wallow irl self disgust over le RAG week. LOL. Gotta love RAG week.

[a girl on the internet]

FAO snow white: if the best justification you can come up with for ME to leave rhinox alive is that i'm doing it to frame YOU, does that not necessarily require that there must be a more obvious motivation for YOU to leave rhinox alive?

the point of this argument is not "snow white is scum", the point of this argument has never been "snow white is scum".

the point of this argument is "a girl on the internet is town". apparently more elaboration is needed, though i really don't see why. it is freakin obvious.

also notice how she doesnt ask the possiblity of Mike being the one to set me up and not her.

BECAUSE HE'S NOT THE ONE YOU'RE ACCUSING. WHICH IS RIDICULOUS, BECAUSE MIKE IS THE ONE WHO ACTUALLY HAD ANY MOTIVATION TO LEAVE RHINOX ALIVE. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT.

let me run through the possibilities for you. if snow white is scum, she had six options:

1) kill rhinox, convince mike to vote agoti - quite difficult, but worth considering, i'd say

2) kill rhinox, convince agoti to vote mike - also quite difficult, but apparently not from snow white's perception
3) kill no one, convince mbf and rhinox to vote agoti - looks easier than convincing mike alone

4) kill no one, convince agoti and rhinox to vote mike - rhinox was pretty clear about this never happening

5) kill mike, convince rhinox to vote agoti - looks easy until you realize that killing mike would be a ridiculous thing for agoti to do. call in the wifom brigade.

6) kill agoti, convince rhinox to vote mike - lol

if mike is scum, six options:

1) kill rhinox, convince snow to vote agoti - probably not too hard
2) kill rhinox, convince agoti to vote snow - woulda been pretty easy, but mike might not have thought so
3) kill no one, convince rhinox and snow to vote agoti - also probably not too hard, and rhinox makes a nice safety net by refusing to vote mike ever.
4) kill no one, convince rhinox and agoti to vote snow - really seems to add unnecessary complications to plan 2), but still, the safety net is again appealing

5) kill agoti, convince rhinox to vote snow - why would snow kill agoti. no.
6) kill snow, convince rhinox to vote agoti - why would agoti kill snow. no.

if agoti is scum, six options:

1) kill rhinox, convince mike to vote snow - mike was already willing to vote snow over me without me making any effort to convince him so i'm damn sure he'd still be willing with it, fucking duh this is what i'd do

2) kill rhinox, convince snow to vote mike - much harder than 1), ergo pointless
3) kill no one, convince rhinox and mike to vote snow - harder than 1), ergo pointless
4) kill no one, convince rhinox and snow to vote mike - lol
5) kill mike, convince rhinox to vote snow - really out of left field, this play. prob would be my second choice, i guess, but it's no plan 1)
6) kill snow, convince rhinox to vote mike - lol, lol, a thousand times lol



^ bolded the ones that I think are at all plausible. snow white's option 2) looks like the best option from her pov, and doesn't involve rhinox being alive. mike's option 3) looks like the best option from his pov, and

does

involve rhinox being alive.

what does snow get out of leaving rhinox alive: a townie who, unlike mike, is more suspicious of me than her
what does mike get out of leaving rhinox alive: a townie who refuses to vote for him ever, thus guaranteeing that he will NEVER LOSE
what do i get out of leaving rhinox alive: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

Doesn't sound like you anticipated that Snow White would take your comments at face value and you had to keep some options open.

what does that even mean? what options? what possible bearing could this even have on my actions as scum?

then broadens her net to asking Rhinox why mike is so innocent. Its like she's covering all bases for gods sake

or maybe it's like i know i can trust rhinox, so i want to know why he's so sure about mike when i'm so conflicted. because either he's right, in which case hopefully his reasons will convince me, or he's wrong, in which case i need to show him why he's wrong, which is pretty freakin hard to do when i don't even know what he's thinkin.

[Rhinox]

or maybe it's like i know i can trust rhinox, so i want to know why he's so sure about mike when i'm so conflicted. because either he's right, in which case hopefully his reasons will convince me, or he's wrong, in which case i need to show him why he's wrong, which is pretty freakin hard to do when i don't even know what he's thinkin.

Well, there was the whole pursuing the case on ray. MBF is the one who got the wagon back onto ray when the town started going other directions.

Aside from that, yesterday I made it clear I wouldn't vote MBF and wanted AGOTI or poro lynched. MBF could have played along with that, but instead he started pursuing a case on white. That doesn't seem to me like something scum should do.

But neither you or white didn't make it easy on me and crossvote each other either which would have made me pretty certain one of you are scum.

Mike really did have the most motivation to leave me alive tho... hmm....

[mikeburnfire]

WHICH IS RIDICULOUS, BECAUSE MIKE IS THE ONE WHO ACTUALLY HAD ANY MOTIVATION TO LEAVE RHINOX ALIVE. THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT.

Except that White said that she was going to vote you following Rhinox's wishes, so I would have nothing to gain by leaving Rhinox alive.

1) kill rhinox, convince mike to vote snow - mike was already willing to vote snow over me without me making any effort to convince him so i'm damn sure he'd still be willing with it, fucking duh this is what I'd do

While I was leaning towards White-scum as night hit, I made it clear that I wasn't sure. I'm still not.

what do i get out of leaving rhinox alive: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING

No matter how I try to review a possible AGOTI-scum, it comes down to this. AGOTI not killing Rhinox is a stupid move because s/he gains nothing. Rhinox was the only one suspecting her. I still feel White as scum, but I can't shake the nagging feeling of AGOTI WIFOMing us. My brain tells me to follow Occam's Razor; that the simplest answer is correct, and White is indeed scum. As it stands, I'm leaning towards voting White.

[Snow White]

@Mike. I think your bad just cause the obvious answer is slapping you in the face and you're ignoring it in favour of what?

How is AGOTI so townie can i ask? For restating something i stated first re:tajoscum. Real good reason. Cause every other lynch she has actually spearheaded has been town bye bye. Btw. who was so convinced Rayfrostscumfather was innocent day1? Who also, didnt vote him the next day? Who miraculously found me innocent days 2-5, when i interject at a potential day1 gf lynch and still protests the ray is innocent after the Pom hammer, with a she'll show you attitude. LOL. Awh. Okaies. Im bored now.

@Rhinox. I have voted AGOTI.

*kicks back* As you were.

[mikeburnfire]

Rhinox still being alive is, I believe, evidence of AGOTI being a townie, but let me be clear that AGOTI is not townie. That is, in no way has she seemed town. She did a lot of lurking, didn't help out a lot until towards the end, and has made several bad moves, as you point out. She did a lot of what looks like buddying up to you, and tunnelvisioned players like Porochaz. At one point, I had her on my most-likely-to-be-scum list. In summation, she should have been lynched and probably would have, had Porochaz and Snow White looked better.

However, the "still protests ray after the Pom hammer" is actually a point in her favor, as any smart scum would the hell out of Ray after his stupid move.

So, yeah.

[Rhinox]

However, the "still protests ray after the Pom hammer" is actually a point in her favor, as any smart scum would the hell out of Ray after his stupid move.

hmmph orly...

Day 2 quotes:

ray's hammer was majorly bad, but i still don't think he's scum.

here's the real one that got away:

vote: mikeburnfire

Hm. If i have not yet been replaced i will be reading up on things shortly. If i have. Oh well and good luck. I am humbly sorry about my unexplained absence things were hectic with family and access was severely restricted. Anyway, enough excuses.

Vote MikeBurnFire

Talk is good.

*if ive been replaced that vote obviously doesnt count and someone pm me so im not reading over pages for nothing.

Vote: Rayfrost

I expect this guy dead when I get back from my classes.

MBF, you're the only one here who autovoted (bussed the hell out of?) ray on D2...

[mikeburnfire]

Huh. I didn't realize that Snow White was attacking AGOTI for something she herself had done.

MBF, you're the only one here who autovoted (bussed the hell out of?) ray on D2...

That's only because he was scum. A scum bussing Ray Day 2 would be a smart move because all the smart townies (like me) would be killing him.

[Snow White]

lol...? Uhm. Well now this awkward.

[Snow White]

I think the problem here mike is that you have more or less said in the position of you hypothetically being scum, you would have acted exactly like did.

[mikeburnfire]

I probably would have.

On a similar note, why are you acting like not voting Ray on Day 2 is scummy, when you yourself were doing it?

[Snow White]

I was originally arguing that i hadnt read it. And that you were all excusing AGOTI because that appeared to be "just how she played" whereas i was queen~de~scum for extenuating circumstances.

While also drawing attention to the way she had no problem declaring rays innocence after he clearly intended to hammer mislynch and draw a cop investigation to get himself off the hook.

But she is accusing me after Rhinox turned up alive today.

I may be proved wrong. You might be the scum. But im hoping everything bar Rhinox's innocence is coming under scrutiny at least after the above. Im going home now but will be back laters.

[Rhinox]

What happened to AGOTI? I need some AGOTI action before I have much else to comment on.

[Snow White]

*waiting on AGOTI's response* she appears very lack luster.

@Mike. So in your humble opinion is it smart scum we are dealing with or WIFOMie scum?

Iunno. If anyone took my above quote as "hold on and i will try to absorb some of Rhinox's sheer brillance and rererereread the whole topic again" your mistaken. I have college work to do. And a shit load of it to do at that.

I still like AGOTI for the lynch though. She hasnt explained why she let go of her suspicions of mike in favour for me. Because Rhinox is alive today.
So Ray hammers Pom quite scummily and AGOTI still protests his innocence the next day. Quite clearly, she lvoes her reads and will not let go of them.
But Rhinox wakes up alive and Snow White is insta-scum list in lylo? LOL. a set up if i ever sawed one.

And yet on isoing tajo.... He was forever trying to lynch AGOTI wwhile mike was forever trying to lynch tajo. It makes me ah so sad.

And thus limbo'd i am.