Open 204: Friend and Enemies Over

[McGriddle]

Vote: McGriddle

Why haven't you voted yet?

Obv scum, lets get more votes over heah thanks in advance.

Mindgamer, why is it boring to play w/people you know?
discoroboto, do you like techno?
don_jonnson, what is your view on lurkers?
pwnman, how experienced would you say you are?
light, why do you identify with a criminal character?
paltryexcuse, explain your avatar.
water_foul, what would you do if I voted you?
kunkstar7, do you usually turbolurk?
farside22, what's your opinion on day vs night start for this setup?
hewitt, do you prefer RVS or attempting to get out of RVS as soon as possible?

My apologies everyone, for some reason every time I tried to reply it sent me back to the home page, not to mention half of the time I couldn't find the game lol.

[McGriddle]

I think the questions are great, they spark discussion, the only downside is that they can spark a wrong answer and lead to a mislynch.

[McGriddle]

Not Voting (4): hewitt, Light, McGriddle, water_foul

Why aren't you participating in RVS?

Because at this point, to me, it seems like it wouldn't be random if I were to vote. RVS is not my favorite point in the game either.

And I apologize because I took so long to confirm.

[McGriddle]

Sigh, way to miss the point D:

I like the RVS stage. Is that a scum-tell in your eyes? I like it as both town and scum, so no worries.
I don't really asks questions because I'm honestly not too familiar with the 'RQS' and I'm not creative enough to make up any flashy and cewl questions : ( Besides, there was nothing specific that I saw in other posts. Besides, I did ask questions, there's even one in the post you quoted from me, lol.

I say that I don't think so because someone asked me if pulling things out of context is anti-town. I merely answered the question, but clarified. I rather give complete answers then adding bits of my answer later.

I agree with you. The RVS is a good way to break ice so I don't mind it.

@Disco, if you were to be put at L-1 and you were actually a VT would you lie to keep yourself alive and claim doc/cop? Or would you be honest and tell everyone you are VT at the chance of you being lynched?

[McGriddle]

Well, that's an interesting question, while formulating my answer I actually realised something. Let me elaborate on some situations;

1. I claim cop/doc:
- I don't get lynched, but I get nightkilled. 'waste' of a night kill
- The real cop/doc counterclaims, this outs them in the hope of getting a scum lynch. Now we get a mislynch on me and a doc/cop gets night killed.

So this depends on what the doc/cop thinks.

2. I claim vanilla townie:
- I have a chance to get lynched, but at least the cop/doc don't possibly get outed.
- I DIE AND THE BEST PLAYER IN THE GAME IS LOST.

Actually, this question is not really relevant to the game, but I understand the mentality behind asking it.
Then again, I've never been lynched besides my first game as scum (which was also my second mafia game ever) so I'm not really sure what I'd do if I was in the situation.

I don't entirely agree with your points. I don't think (at this point in the game ie. not lylo) a counterclaim is likely to occur, because they dont want to get killed off, especially when there's a chance for you to still be lynched anyways.

[McGriddle]

Well you never said 'at this point in the game' so I didn't assume that's what you meant.

My apologies, I should have been more specific with the question, but I was referring to this Game Day.

So...

@Disco, if you were to be put at L-1

today

and you were actually a VT would you lie to keep yourself alive and claim doc/cop? Or would you be honest and tell everyone you are VT at the chance of you being lynched?

[McGriddle]

McGriddle,
Why are you talking about doc/cop at all?
Do you realize the setup we're in?
If someone claimed doc or cop, we'd likely lynch them instantly in this setup.

There isn't always logic but saying someone didn't vote when they didn't post and then he doesn't vote when he comes on I have to wonder about it.
I hate people that has my opinion and not post one of there own it looks like wanting to see a case so you can put forth a vote.

I'm not sure what you mean here.

Fine, claim 'Mason' then... Happy?

[McGriddle]

McGriddle why are you asking Disco this question right now? Are you trying to role fish and looking for the PR in this game?

Why would I want to do that?

[McGriddle]

Water_foul
i don't have much mafia experience so i don't know how to jump into RVS RQS type stuff. I will be much more active day 2.

Because on Day 2 you will suddenly have lots more experience? Huh? Is this your way of asking a freepass to Day 2?

@ McGriddle

Why are you asking DiscoRoboto these cool questions instead of me?

Actually I am only asking him 1 question, I am just rewriting it to form to the rules and to clear up the vagueness of it.

@Water_foul: What would you do if your number 1 suspect who was at L-1 suddenly claimed a PR?

[McGriddle]

McGriddle why are you asking Disco this question right now? Are you trying to role fish and looking for the PR in this game?

Why would I want to do that?

unvote:
vote: mcgriddle

You want to actually anwser my question instead of asking a question without answering this time?

it's obvious my answer was no.

[McGriddle]

McGriddle why are you asking Disco this question right now? Are you trying to role fish and looking for the PR in this game?

Why would I want to do that?

unvote:
vote: mcgriddle

You want to actually anwser my question instead of asking a question without answering this time?

oh missed the first question, I am asking in order to get a read off of him, why does anybody ask a question?

[McGriddle]

Why aren't you participating in RVS?

I don't vote in RVS.

- I DIE AND THE BEST PLAYER IN THE GAME IS LOST.

Doubt it. At this point anyway I think the whole back and forth exchanges between yourself and Paltry/farside/whoever the fuck else is participating is a moot point in finding scum. BUT it is helping us get out of the RVS so I'm happy for that at least.

But seriously though I think neither side is right.

Fine, claim 'Mason' then... Happy?

Who are you to suggest to anyone else in this game what they should be claiming unless you already know that they're not scum?

And quit apologizing. Jeez. Nobody cares.

What? maybe you should read a little...

[McGriddle]

What? maybe you should read a little...

Gooood job of deflecting away from my questions.

Im not answering because the question makes no sense. I wasn't telling anyone to claim, read the friggin thread.

[McGriddle]

No I understand he's not asking for anybody to claim. I just don't understand why he'd even be suggesting that somebody should be claiming any sort of power role on page four of a game.

That's because I am not. Why should I have to direct you to what we were talking about? You have eyes, go read yourself.

[McGriddle]

I just want to know how I am obvscum, other than scum pointing out flaws in my questioning... That's not scummy, it means I am not really paying attention to hard.

[McGriddle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0gHcHBTvXdE

HAHAHAHA LMFAO

[McGriddle]

Lol@you people seeing that as a scumtell.

Seriously, what the fuck? Do you really think a scum would say 'HEY GUYS IM SEPERATED FROM THE TOWN YO' n stuff? Nah, not even subtle.
The point is that I don't see why scum would do this rather then town. Because a townie is part of the town? Stop joking with me, lol.

lol seperating himself was not a scumtell... I can see what he was doing, as I am nota complete idiot. He was saying town would be effed, and he, whether that be town or scum, would also be effed.

[McGriddle]

look, a game without any special roles given to the townies, i believe would be stupid. if there were no special townie roles, this game would be more of a guessing game than a deciphering/strategical game which i love.

Um, no, without power roles you have to strategize and decipher on a deeper level, examine what people say why they said it and what they're trying to do. So the point is, how are you going to find scum by playing passively and waiting? Maybe you already know who's scum? If so, please share your info.

I agree with this so does any one get any scum vibes from any one else or should we exert pressure randomly?

What do you think?

I just want to know how I am obvscum, other than scum pointing out flaws in my questioning...

Scum are pointing out the flaws in your questioning? So, you're saying that don_johnson, farside22, hewitt, Excedrin and maybe water_foul are all scum (did I miss anyone)? If not, then who specifically that pointed out flaws in your questioning is scum?

DiscoRoboto unvoted hewitt after his attack and is now empty posting out being bored.

It would come to bite the town AND me in the ass later.

So you're not part of the town?

Unvote; Vote DiscoRoboto

EBWOP

Vote: Excedrin

for jumping Disco for using "AND" as an attack on Disco, even though he had all this (BS) info on me. He also goes for the easy lynchee, and as soon as a bandwagon begins he seems to hop on it right away, rather than just question and leave his vote out.

[McGriddle]

Vote: Excedrin

for jumping Disco for using "AND" as an attack on Disco, even though he had all this (BS) info on me. He also goes for the easy lynchee, and as soon as a bandwagon begins he seems to hop on it right away, rather than just question and leave his vote out.

So, my vote for DiscoRoboto is bandwagoning? Did I repeat PaltryExcuse's reasoning for his DiscoRoboto vote? Why do you see DiscoRoboto as an easy lynchee?

Why do you think it's better to leave your vote on someone else after your top suspect changes?

"for jumping Disco for using "AND" as an attack on Disco, even though he had all this (BS) info on me." What does this even mean? As I stated in a response to DiscoRoboto, I voted based on his active lurking and the fact that he's generally not playing the game. That he sees himself separate from town is suspicious, but it's a minor detail. I also note that you haven't explained your "other than scum pointing out flaws in my questioning..." statement.

Its a start.
I don't know
because he made that minor slip
because your reason for switching was less informative than staying on me.
It means you jumped on him for saying something that wasn't even scummy, then throwing a vote on him for it.
How is he active lurking? It's the beginning of the game
Don't try to change the subject now that you're caught.

As for Hewitt. I am doing as much as I can with what I have to work with. I am not "overly defending" anyone. I am stating that you guys are a couple VI's for using the word and against him. You think that defending someone from stupid accusations is defending? Well it's not. I don't want a mislynch, and you and excedrin seem to be pushing for one based off of the stupid mistake. You complain he is active lurking, but what about the people who are just lurking?

[McGriddle]

whatebber scum

[McGriddle]

alright then paltryexcuse, i will get more involved. tbh the other mafia game i've been participating in seems much more interesting, which is why i've diverted a lot of my attention to it rather than split it 50-50.

I do not think Exedrin is scum, however i may be swayed to vote for him if evidence is presented.

Right now my 2 suspects are:
water_foul - this is just my intuition playing in, but i think we need to check him/her out more.
pwnman - lurking

Yes I agree with pwnman lurking. Based off of meta, pwnman is a very active player and very aggressive when he is town, and a little more laxed and lurky when he is scum.

Unvote: Vote Pwnman

[McGriddle]

Right now my 2 suspects are:
water_foul - this is just my intuition playing in, but i think we need to check him/her out more.
pwnman - lurking

Yes I agree with pwnman lurking. Based off of meta, pwnman is a very active player and very aggressive when he is town, and a little more laxed and lurky when he is scum.

Is not posting for 5 days a sign of lurking or flaking?

lurkaking, I don't know but it merits a vote either way, whether it be to lynch him or get him active in here. I know he acted when he was scum in the other game i played with him in, and it's the same as now.

[McGriddle]

lurkaking, I don't know but it merits a vote either way, whether it be to lynch him or get him active in here. I know he acted when he was scum in the other game i played with him in, and it's the same as now.

Do you have any thoughts about players who are present and posting?

It seems like you dropped the idea that everyone who found problems with your cop/doc questions is scum.

did I have that idea? refer me, for I am mistaken if I said that.

[McGriddle]

Sure mindgamer, the first one we were a scum pair in:

http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... dd65baa83a

The second he actually flipped town and was really aggressive:

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... &start=525

[McGriddle]

I'm bored.

Unvote, Vote: Light

[McGriddle]

I also have issue with DJ saying I'm tunneling on him when that is all he's been doing with Disco most of the day. That comment smacks of hypocrisy.

i admitted that i was tunneling on you. thats not hypocrisy. hypocrisy would be if i was using it as an attack on you and denying that i was exhibiting the same behavior.

Your missing my point to DJ. Unless Disco or McG had the same theory as you about buddying your comment about not pointing it out early day 1 is invalid.

not at all. i have no idea how you can reach that conclusion, but whatever, this conversation is pointless. i came into this game with a theory. disco was under scrutiny, the attacks on him were poor, and he was doing nothing to diffuse the situation. i defended him. in response, he revealed(though he now denies it) role information and has so far failed to explain himself in any way shape or form.

McG's vote is stupid so close to dealine.

mindgamer is just being silly. i have repeatedly stated that i have been absorbed in my conversation with farside and disco, so of course i have not been paying as much attention to other posts, sorry i didn't realize deadline was so close.

I say DJ, McG and either Excedrin/Light

its funny, but you seem to have a "group" here. would i be correct in assuming that you came up with this group by looking at the interactions of the above mentioned players? if so, does it not occur to you that the scum team would hunt the masons in a similar manner? the scum are looking for connections just as much as you(if you are town). your entire disagreement with me seems to be based on the fact that you think the masons are smarter than the scum team. its kind of a bad assumption to make. it is not an assumption that i made at the start of this game. it occurred to me that the scum team would hunt for the mason team in a much similar manner as town hunts scum. therefore i used my theory to defenbd a player i thought was town and who was being pushed around by players with weak attacks. but whatever. for some reason you don't want to believe me, even though you are allegedly hunting scum in the same manner i proposed that scum might hunt the masons. oh well.

With mason's in this game the only list I plan on making is a list of those I think may be scum.

^^ you posted this on page 5. my point is that by a player making "scum" lists, or pointing out connections between players, one has the potential to out the masons. i.e. the masons make up an informed minority, much like the scum team, so they can(in effect) be hunted the same way. i think "scumlists" and "connections" are best left til after day 1 in friends and enemies due to the specific nature of the set up. the only players who can effectively look for a scum "group" are the masons themselves because they know who the mason "group" is. the vanillas should avoid such scumhunting tactics and if the masons want to stay hidden then they should also avoid making those "lists" public as it then alerts scum that they might be masons. get it?

POSTING SCUM LISTS ON DAY 1 HELPS THE SCUM TEAM NARROW DOWN GROUPINGS OF PLAYERS. THIS HELPS THEM DETERMINE WHO THE MASONS ARE. PLEASE STOP DOING IT.

MINDGAMER: DO YOU JUST REALIZE THAT YOU MOVED YOUR VOTE FROM DISCOROBOTO TO ME? WHAT HAS CHANGED YOUR MIND ABOUT HIM? BECAUSE I DIDN"T RECOGNIZE THE DEADLINE WAS SO CLOSE THAT MAKES ME SCUM? WHY WERE YOU VOTING DISCO IN THE FIRST PLACE?

Oh I am sorry, I meant to

Unvote, Vote: don_johnson

[McGriddle]

disco: please tell me that you realize the fact that 4/5 of your "list" is omgus. seriously, you are not playing pro town. the "lightning rod" theory should not apply.

Nor should your life, scum!

[McGriddle]

according to my calendar, deadline is today. farside, would you consider moving to disco?

excedrin, hewitt, kunk: would you consider moving to McG?

OMGUS much?