Pick Your Power II - Looks like the wine is gone (SCUM WIN)

[RayFrost]

Official Vote Count

Players needed to lynch: 10

Bouncy.Bouncy

- 5 - Fate, wolframnhart, Devotress, RedCoyote, The1fifi - (L-5)

Ellibereth

- 1 - Farside - (L-9)

Pomegranate

- 2 - Socrates, Porkens - (L-8)

Socrates

- 1 - StrangerCoug - (L-9)

wolframnhart

- 2 - Jack, Ellibereth - (L-8)

Players not voting: Bouncy.Bouncy, curiouskarmadog, DocPotter, Faraday, Hoopla, Pomegranate, Rayfrost, TonyMontana

If we

vote: bouncy.bouncy

, aren't we effectively killing off the 2 group? This might be an added reason to consider this vote.

Fate is on the money though. I think the scum used the deadline pressure to their advantage well, when the bouncy lynch could've been just as easy.

I'm currently not in support for the bouncy.bouncy wagon.

The logic of 'scum could've pushed the wagon just as easily as the one they did' is terribad.

As we are seeing (and saw), bouncy.bouncy is submitting virtually nothing of value... continually.

To contrast, fefifofum may have eventually at some point been of use and started scumhunting.

So fefifofum being lynched would be superior for scum.

Even if scum could just as easily push one lynch over the other, you have to consider the benefits too.

[farside22]

Lets see I have 10 more post then you. I have made a case on Pom and I'm not following players to the point of active lurkering like yourself.

True, but quantity differs from quality. And for someone to do reads, it takes someone to fish for reactions.

the only person I saw fishing was fishing for you when there was a BW vote against you yesterday that started with cobalt.
What fishing have you attempted? Or do you mean the let me follow everyone else because I have no desire (read scum motivation) to put a case out.

this isn't about who is best. is about who is town.

It's about doing what is best for the town.
Following others and not coming up with your own points it s big fat indicator of scum in my book.

[farside22]

If we

vote: bouncy.bouncy

, aren't we effectively killing off the 2 group? This might be an added reason to consider this vote.

Fate is on the money though. I think the scum used the deadline pressure to their advantage well, when the bouncy lynch could've been just as easy.

I'm currently not in support for the bouncy.bouncy wagon.

The logic of 'scum could've pushed the wagon just as easily as the one they did' is terribad.

As we are seeing (and saw), bouncy.bouncy is submitting virtually nothing of value... continually.

To contrast, fefifofum may have eventually at some point been of use and started scumhunting.

So fefifofum being lynched would be superior for scum.

Even if scum could just as easily push one lynch over the other, you have to consider the benefits too.

Were people ditching one player over the other in this case?

[RayFrost]

I believe it went from bouncy to FFFF, yes.

[The1fifi]

use I have no desire (read scum motivation) to put a case out.

this isn't about who is best. is about who is town.[/quote]

It's about doing what is best for the town.
Following others and not coming up with your own points it s big fat indicator of scum in my book.[/quote]

Why isn't your vote on me then?

[farside22]

You either have a bad sense of smell or miss sarcasm by a long shot. Either way your following of others is noted but I'm sticking with Eli and Pom till I'm happy with my answers.

[Ellibereth]

I maintain that bouncy is town.

[farside22]

I have to disagree with RayFrost. The wagon on bouncy wasn't any closer then the wagon that was on FFF.
from one page it went from 2 votes on FFF to 9 votes;

Bouncy.Bouncy - 3 - RedCoyote, Faraday, Fate - (L-9)
Cobalt - 1 - The1fifi - (L-11)
Dramonic - 1 - TonyMontana - (L-11)
Fate - 3 - Bouncy.Bouncy, Dramonic, FeFiFoFum - (L-9)
FeFiFoFum - 2 - Rayfrost, wolframnhart - (L-10)
Jack - 1 - DocPotter - (L-11)
Pomegranate - 2 - Socrates, Farside - (L-10)
Socrates - 2 - Hoopla, StrangerCoug - (L-10)
The1fifi - 3 - Cobalt, Porkens, Devotress - (L-9)
wolframnhart - 1 - Jack - (L-11)

Official Vote Count
Players needed to lynch: 12

Bouncy.Bouncy - 3 - RedCoyote, StrangerCoug, Porkens - (L-9)
Fate - 3 - Bouncy.Bouncy, Dramonic, FeFiFoFum - (L-9)
FeFiFoFum - 9 - Rayfrost, wolframnhart, Faraday, Hoopla, The1fifi, Ellibereth, Jack, Fate, TonyMontana - (L-3)
Jack - 1 - DocPotter - (L-11)
Pomegranate - 2 - Socrates, Farside - (L-10)
The1fifi - 2 - Cobalt, Devotress - (L-10)

Players not voting: curiouskarmadog, Pomegranate

TM is definately the worst offender when it comes to jumping on a BW to vote for FFF. Redcoyote and faraday were both on bouncy before moving to FFFF. So if bouncy isn't scum I could see those who were on the bouncy wagon jumping onto the FFF wagon to give it the fuel to go.

[Fate]

TM is definately the worst offender when it comes to jumping on a BW to vote for FFF. Redcoyote and faraday were both on bouncy before moving to FFFF. So if bouncy isn't scum I could see those who were on the bouncy wagon jumping onto the FFF wagon to give it the fuel to go.

This. Bouncy's flips gives us major insight to the jump to the FFF wagon. We can look into RC, Faraday, TM, etc... And if bouncy flips town we can see their moves as townish (If they were scum they would've stayed on bouncy, as he was the most ideal mislynch in terms of draft order.)

[Fate]

I maintain that bouncy is town.

I maintain that bouncy has done nothing to prove towniness, besides a few "posts" that you don't think scum would make.

He still hasn't scumhunted. Worthless town who's flip provides town with good information on multiple players? Let's go people!

[farside22]

TM is definately the worst offender when it comes to jumping on a BW to vote for FFF. Redcoyote and faraday were both on bouncy before moving to FFFF. So if bouncy isn't scum I could see those who were on the bouncy wagon jumping onto the FFF wagon to give it the fuel to go.

This. Bouncy's flips gives us major insight to the jump to the FFF wagon. We can look into RC, Faraday, TM, etc... And if bouncy flips town we can see their moves as townish (If they were scum they would've stayed on bouncy, as he was the most ideal mislynch in terms of draft order.)

This doesn't make sense. Why would scum stay on a scum wagon for a mislynch? Yes I know the bussing term but scum can go from one wagon to the other with the ease of a lion watching it's prey.

[StrangerCoug]

LOL at curiouskarmadog and RayFrost, who aren't awake (though in CKD's case it's probably unsportsmanlike of me as this is my first deep south game).

...I still can't get Socrates support, eh?

Well, I'll have to go with number two, which has support already.

Unvote: Socrates
Vote: bouncy.bouncy

Very minimal posting and making excuses about D1. Something about the vote on The1fifi rings false, also.

[Fate]

I don't get how you're confused.

If bouncy flips town, I would've expected scum to stay on the more likely power role. This means the first few to switch the wagon (Wolf, Faraday) are more likely town than those who pounced on later.

[RayFrost]

I don't get how you're confused.

If bouncy flips town, I would've expected scum to stay on the more likely power role. This means the first few to switch the wagon (RF, Wolf, Faraday) are more likely town than those who pounced on later.

[Socrates]

Hey, I wonder what Pomegranate thinks about all of this!

...

...

*crickets*

...

...

Bouncy isn't the only lurker who has contributed nothing. And he doesn't have that scummy request for a claim either.

[RayFrost]

LOL at curiouskarmadog and

RayFrost

, who aren't awake (though in CKD's case it's probably unsportsmanlike of me as this is my first deep south game).

?

[farside22]

I don't get how you're confused.

If bouncy flips town, I would've expected scum to stay on the more likely power role. This means the first few to switch the wagon (Wolf, Faraday) are more likely town than those who pounced on later.

Oh I thought you were saying anyone who switched over from bouncy to FFFF.

[StrangerCoug]

I was referencing #562 in that post, which Fate brought up already. Now that I'm not skimming, even if you weren't supporting the lynch of somebody already dead, I don't see how lynching the potentially useful player over the clearly useless player is necessarily beneficial.

[StrangerCoug]

EBWOP: That was to RayFrost, now that I look like an idiot.

[RayFrost]

I'm saying (and was saying) beneficial to

scum

.

How is that not clear?

[Hoopla]

I have to disagree with RayFrost. The wagon on bouncy wasn't any closer then the wagon that was on FFF.
from one page it went from 2 votes on FFF to 9 votes;

Bouncy.Bouncy - 3 - RedCoyote, Faraday, Fate

- (L-9)
Cobalt - 1 - The1fifi - (L-11)
Dramonic - 1 - TonyMontana - (L-11)
Fate - 3 - Bouncy.Bouncy, Dramonic, FeFiFoFum - (L-9)
FeFiFoFum - 2 - Rayfrost, wolframnhart - (L-10)
Jack - 1 - DocPotter - (L-11)
Pomegranate - 2 - Socrates, Farside - (L-10)
Socrates - 2 - Hoopla, StrangerCoug - (L-10)
The1fifi - 3 - Cobalt, Porkens, Devotress - (L-9)
wolframnhart - 1 - Jack - (L-11)

Official Vote Count
Players needed to lynch: 12

Bouncy.Bouncy - 3 -

RedCoyote, StrangerCoug, Porkens

- (L-9)
Fate - 3 - Bouncy.Bouncy, Dramonic, FeFiFoFum - (L-9)
FeFiFoFum - 9 - Rayfrost, wolframnhart, Faraday, Hoopla,

The1fifi, Ellibereth, Jack, Fate, TonyMontana

- (L-3)
Jack - 1 - DocPotter - (L-11)
Pomegranate - 2 - Socrates, Farside - (L-10)
The1fifi - 2 - Cobalt, Devotress - (L-10)

Players not voting: curiouskarmadog, Pomegranate

TM is definately the worst offender when it comes to jumping on a BW to vote for FFF. Redcoyote and faraday were both on bouncy before moving to FFFF. So if bouncy isn't scum I could see those who were on the bouncy wagon jumping onto the FFF wagon to give it the fuel to go.

I tend to disagree. This analysis distorts the events, and makes it seem like the bouncy wagon was stagnant. But it

was

in competition when you look at 5 different names (in blue) were on his wagon over the same, short amount of time. The timing of vote counts doesn't reflect that though.

When you take that into consideration, it really looks like scum were trying to muscle a Fefi lynch ahead of bouncy. I'm prepared to vote for bouncy based on this evidence (with the added bonus of numbers playing to his advantage). But I also think there is at least two scum in the names in red I listed, which make good back-up lynches.

Vote: bouncy bouncy

[Jack]

The vote counts being quoted have very little useful information. You have to look at the thread and see where the FeFi wagon started (with faraday switching from bouncy). But neither of them seem scummy to me. What happens when two townies are being voted for lurking the day before the deadline? There's a run of votes on one of them. There would have to be something in particular to make the run of votes seem scummy.

[DocPotter]

Bouncy.Bouncy - 3 - RedCoyote, Faraday, Fate - (L-9)
Cobalt - 1 - The1fifi - (L-11)
Dramonic - 1 - TonyMontana - (L-11)
Fate - 3 - Bouncy.Bouncy,

Dramonic, FeFiFoFum

- (L-9)

FeFiFoFum

- 2 - Rayfrost, wolframnhart - (L-10)
Jack - 1 - DocPotter - (L-11)
Pomegranate - 2 - Socrates, Farside - (L-10)
Socrates - 2 - Hoopla, StrangerCoug - (L-10)
The1fifi - 3 -

Cobalt

, Porkens, Devotress - (L-9)
wolframnhart - 1 - Jack - (L-11)

Official Vote Count
Players needed to lynch: 12

Bouncy.Bouncy - 3 - RedCoyote, StrangerCoug, Porkens - (L-9)
Fate - 3 - Bouncy.Bouncy,

Dramonic, FeFiFoFum

- (L-9)

FeFiFoFum

- 9 - Rayfrost, wolframnhart, Faraday, Hoopla, The1fifi, Ellibereth, Jack, Fate, TonyMontana - (L-3)
Jack - 1 - DocPotter - (L-11)
Pomegranate - 2 - Socrates, Farside - (L-10)
The1fifi - 2 -

Cobalt

, Devotress - (L-10)

Bouncy.Bouncy - 5 - Fate <snip>

If bouncy flips town, I'm voting Fate. Too coincidental. The people who stuck on the Fate vote are either dead or leading the vote count.

[Fate]

If bouncy flips town, I'm voting Fate. Too coincidental. The people who stuck on the Fate vote are either dead or leading the vote count.

That doesn't prove anything other than they were stubborn town? When I die and flip town, are you willing to vote who ever I had my vote stuck on?

Seems like an excuse to vote me without actually coming up with a case on me...

[DocPotter]

Well for starters the chance that you are scum goes to around 60%