Teleportation Mafia Universe TWO (TOWN WINS)

[DeathRowKitty]

Day 1 Vote Count

animorpherv1 ( 0 )
Anon ( 0 )
DeathRowKitty ( 0 )
DocPotter ( 5 ) Lowell Ellibereth Nicodemus Jack fhqwhads
Starbuck ( 0 )
Ellibereth ( 2 ) Anon DocPotter
Elmo ( 0 )
fhqwhads ( 0 )
Jack ( 3 ) Kairyuu Elmo Starbuck
Jahudo ( 0 )
Kairyuu ( 0 )
Kise ( 0 )
Lowell ( 0 )
Maelyn ( 0 )
Nicodemus ( 0 )
Not Voting ( 5 ) Kise Maelyn animorpherv1 Jahudo DeathRowKitty
Total ( 15 )

With 15 alive, 8 needed to lynch.
Deadline: 2/8 11am

I'm a firm believer in meta on players for which it applies. Normally, I would see DP's actions as scummy, but this isn't the meta I remember from Annachie-scum. Speaking of which, I'll get around to checking on that within the next hour.

Also, I'm a bit erratic with my vote from time to time. Live with it.

[DeathRowKitty]

Brief meta complete. I'm now pretty confident on DP-town.

Annachie-scum was MUCH more submissive than DP is in this game. He was much more careful not to do anything that would create waves. The one time he did, he even posted in the QT (we were neighbors in that game) to say he might have gone too far.

He's been much more reckless this game. He was hardcore and relentless on Kairyuu for bringing up plans he felt were suboptimal, whereas he was more cautious going after Elli for suggesting a policy lynch in the other game.

Basically, I don't think we're dealing with Annachie-scum. (Besides, Annachie-scum was possibly female, whereas DocPotter is obv-male. Clearly not the same person.)

[Jahudo]

@Lowell, Elli: Do you think DRK was trying to distance from scum-Doc? I think his vote made it L-3.

I see one reason where it makes sense, but this also depends on Doc being scum.

It's also possible DRK is scum getting started on the next lynch if Doc is town. Or DRK is town and really believes what he says about meta. The timing of his hop-on, hop-off supports both possibilities.

I don't think meta is as strong an indicator when alts are involved. Alts can put you into a different persona, like this apparent gender switch Doc made somewhere. A player might act and react differently because they're pretending their alt is an original player.

It looks like DRK also made this point, but still came to a different conclusion:

Basically, I don't think we're dealing with Annachie-scum. (Besides, Annachie-scum was possibly female, whereas DocPotter is obv-male. Clearly not the same person.)

How can a different Doc and Anna personality lead to having the same playstyles?

[DeathRowKitty]

Annachie was never labelled as a female. He was male, but everyone called him "she".

Either way though, how submissive or aggressive you are isn't something that gets changed easily unless you're specifically trying to screw with your meta, since it's very much a subconscious feature of your play. I highly doubt that DP was so intent on changing his meta that he intentionally decided to play more aggressively. It's just not that easy.

[Lowell]

@jahudo- After reading 301 I actually think it's more likely DRK is trying to buddy up to DP-town than distancing from DP-scum. Something about that post makes it look like he's trying hard to win an ally and set himself up as indespensible if we end up lynching doc.

unvote, vote drk

[Jack]

I'll go along with that.

unvote:dp, vote:drk

[zorastermod]

Deadline in Less than FOUR days

Day 1 Vote Count

animorpherv1 ( 0 )
Anon ( 0 )
DeathRowKitty ( 2 ) Lowell Jack
DocPotter ( 3 ) Ellibereth Nicodemus fhqwhads
Starbuck ( 0 )
Ellibereth ( 2 ) Anon DocPotter
Elmo ( 0 )
fhqwhads ( 0 )
Jack ( 3 ) Kairyuu Elmo Starbuck
Jahudo ( 0 )
Kairyuu ( 0 )
Kise ( 0 )
Lowell ( 0 )
Maelyn ( 0 )
Nicodemus ( 0 )
Not Voting ( 5 ) Kise Maelyn animorpherv1 Jahudo DeathRowKitty
Total ( 15 )

With 15 alive, 8 needed to lynch.
Deadline: 2/8 11am

[DocPotter]

Might have over-reacted to Elli. Thinking back, and reading back, I never explicitly said that I prefer playing as scum though I believe it could be infered from the end of game comments for mini901.

Unvote

[Nicodemus]

Might have over-reacted to Elli. Thinking back, and reading back, I never explicitly said that I prefer playing as scum though I believe it could be infered from the end of game comments for mini901.

Unvote

So now that the pressure is off you don't feel as much of a need to OMGUS?

Affirm Vote

[Ellibereth]

Bleh. My opinion on meta is that it loses importance when the person in question gains self-awareness over what their meta is, which looks to be the case with DoC. He has done nothing of worth this game so far, and his anwser is just to cry out "meta".
I would greatly prefer a Doc lynch but I'd also be willing to joy in on a DRK one.

[Jack]

I could still go for Nico. But honestly, it's good that we're deadlined...

[Nicodemus]

I could still go for Nico. But honestly, it's good that we're deadlined...

What's your case on me again? Because I can't remember.

[Jack]

I could still go for Nico. But honestly, it's good that we're deadlined...

What's your case on me again? Because I can't remember.

I don't have one. I do find the passive aggressive "what's your case on me again?" in response to gut votes annoying though.

Your vote on Doc was essentially a gut vote iirc.

[Lowell]

Nico doesn't look scummy to me, but doc isn't the right vote I don't think. Lynch DRK, deport doc, problems solved.

[fhqwhgads]

Any other reason than meta for Doc not being scum? This backtrack also doesn't help:

Might have over-reacted to Elli. Thinking back, and reading back, I never explicitly said that I prefer playing as scum though I believe it could be infered from the end of game comments for mini901.

[DeathRowKitty]

@jahudo- After reading 301 I actually think it's more likely DRK is trying to buddy up to DP-town than distancing from DP-scum. Something about that post makes it look like he's trying hard to win an ally and set himself up as indespensible if we end up lynching doc.

unvote, vote drk

I'll go along with that.

unvote:dp, vote:drk

Lowell, err, no, Jack, explain why you think my post sounds that way.

@Lowell
After Jack's given his reasons, I want to hear yours.

Also, has either of you actually bothered to read Annachie's scum meta?

---

Just a heads up, I have a fairly busy couple of days right now. I might be able to post tonight, but if not, I won't be able to until tomorrow evening.

[Lowell]

@drk- it seems like you latched onto a minor thing (possible meta) and used it to completely turn around on doc and start defending him. It's extreme. Makes me think you wanted a reason to justify not being on the bandwagon.

[zorastermod]

Prods have been sent to those who have not posted in 72 hours. Just a reminder that you can ask for a prod on anyone at any time so long as it's not abusive.

Kairyuu had a friend PM me that his computer is kaput and he'll be out indefinitely, so I'm looking for a replacement for him.

[zorastermod]

VP Baltar replaces Kairyuu

[VP Baltar]

Hi everyone, I'll try and read this universe today or tomorrow and post my thoughts. I'm a touch busy, so it might take me a bit longer to catch up on the other one if I need to.

Also,

Unvote

whatever Kairyuu had going.

[Maelyn]

Meta. Heh. Not the best argument you could come up with, Doc. Universe 1 scumhunting (that only helps the scum, remember, since there are two scumteams and the scum would be wanting to remove the other scumteam ASAP).

Backtracking is also not going to give you any townie points.

Vote: DocPotter

Love,
Mae

[Jahudo]

Also, has either of you actually bothered to read Annachie's scum meta?

I'm going to argue that he played pretty similarly in this game and that one. The meta doesn't count for much, but consider these parallels.

1. He directs his case on Kairyuu (here) and Elli (there) based on strategy preferences.
2. He starts off going strong on both people:

strangely Kair is pushing his agenda

This is so scummy because there is no completely random lynch!

3. He backs off pretty easily, and even accepts that they're strategy thinking isn't so bad:

Kair. That simpler idea might work better.

Well I must admit, that thread Elli pointed to did mention CSL as a policy lynch target

This is of little importance, and I'm disregarding meta in this case.
The Doc lynch is best because:
1. Initial unvote on Kairyuu hadn't resolved his initial reason for voting. It makes me think he was looking for a reason to disagree on strategy, and get on a wagon, instead of finding Kairyuu's vote on Jack suspicious.
2. Appeal to meta is not a townish defense even nearing a lynch.
3. I can agree that did too much scumhunting in the other universe only because he ignored too many people in this universe. He mostly interacts with Kairyuu, Elli and DRK. He mentions a few more people like once or twice, then ignores the rest completely.

Vote: DocPotter

[Jack]

I'm getting a bit of a scum feel from Jahudo.

[animorpherv1]

Im fine with either lynch, and ATM, I think DP has more votes.

vote: DocPotter

[Jack]

@the other universe: I think ABR is continuing to push the DGB lynch as a "mafia wouldn't keep pushing this, I must be a townie with tunnel vision" strategy.