myko wrote:Rhinox: what makes me so important to you that your post (to put it in a different way) is pretty much focused on me?
Scum deserve extra attention.
Did you ever answer this question by the way?
rhinox wrote:So its ok to create WIFOM because any good scumhunter should be able to handle it?
Page 15 scum/town list discussion: IMO, they help scum more than town. They let the scum know who they can push for mislynches without arrousing suspision, and who they should nk. It also serves as a report card for how scum are doing in your view, so they can alter their play accordingly i.e. it lets scum know how well they're doing at looking like town.
popsofctown wrote:elvis_knits wrote:
I would rather have the scum forced to agree with our town reads and concentrate attacks on themselves and people who look like scum.
Hypathetical game.
6 townies, ABCDEF.
3 scums, xyz.
ABCDEF and xyz have some discussion during the day. During this process, Townies A, B, C, D, and E become 90% certain that F is town. They gain some other information, but not anything nearly that significant.
xyz are going to randomly select a townie to attack together. (yes, sometimes scum attack townies together, sometimes apart, it's not relevant to the example which method they go for).
Pro-readlist people would have each player post their opinions. Scum would realize F is a fortress impenetrable, and they select one of the other five players, and shoot F that night. (and don't say they would have known to shoot F that night anyway. If they would have known that anyway, why can't we grant the same assumption of intelligence to townies who haven't seen readlists yet and let them say they don't need the readlist to know who they agree is townie?)
Anti-readlist people would have these reads withheld. xyz might attack F. The lynch still fails. It's not like these readlists put a magic protective halo of holiness around players that look townie, they don't.
Then after the lynch fails, xyz scumteam look scummy.
:goodposting:
evilsnail wrote:Maybe if xyz are morons.
I'm sorry, but the scenario you're describing is spectacularly unlikely. ABCD are all picking up on some reliable town read that xyz for some reason have no awareness of? This tell, so elusive for scum, is somehow still so reliable that ABCD will not ever doubt it and change their minds. In addition, xyz somehow decide to all go after the same player together, without any plausible suspect action by F and build their case so poorly that ABCD are entirely unconvinced and stick to their town read. In addition, ABCD all recognise that not having this mysterious, magical town read on F means that xyz are scum.
More likely is x goes after F, y waffles on the issue and z disagrees. A changes his mind and goes after F too, B doesn't see what the big deal is and FOSes y for waffling, C is lurking, D is too caught up in his case on A to care and F OMGUSes x after a long drawn-out discussion with x over the minutiae of the discussion after which everyone else, including y and z, is too confused to be able to tell either way. At the end of the day, the only impression anyone is left with is that F did something scummy and this, coupled with F's unimpressive claim, ensures a sloppy mislynch of F when the deadline rolls around.
Evilsnail completely misses the point and strawmans pops. No, its not a black and white like in pops post, but if you have a town read on someone, you may be able to catch scum trying to mislynch that player if you withold that information. Afterall, unless your a cop, you don't know for sure, so there's no reason to announce that you think he's town (unless its part of some other grand scumhunting scheme). Giving a detailed list of who you think is town and scum lets the scum push wagons on townies you think are scummy, while they know not to bother bringing up cases on players you have locked in as town. Unless of course you're a scumhunting god and nailed the scumteam as your top suspects, but even then you have to get every other town player to agree with you.
popsofctown wrote:This is why no one will understand why they shouldn't post readlists until 3010.
I feel you dawg.
This is also why its not a scumtell yet. Townies don't realize making lists isn't ideal play. But it makes for nice theory discussion. Also look, after a few pages, everyone's mostly forgotten about it.
REGARDING THE VOODOO CURSE:
Also, anyone keep getting the "No posts exist for this topic" error?
This happens when the mod deletes a post. Its a bug in the page counting routine of the boards. Although the post is deleted and post numbers are reset, the ghost post is still counted while determining the number of pages in the thread. So if there is one deleted post in this thread, everytime someone puts the last post on a page, the ghost post will cause the error that there is an extra page even though there isn't.
Just in case everyone didn't know.
pops wrote:Everyone in this thread is being hilariously hypocritical. If it was such a horrible mistake that town couldn't make, then why did everyone in the thread except plum read over it and not notice?
I noticed it, its just not a slip. Attacking him for this slip is a distraction and allows him to strawman other more legitimite arguments.
pops wrote:For the scums in the thread, though, it makes a great <insert reason> for <insert vote> on <insert townie>.
You can only make this argument if you know myko is town.
Albert B. Rampage wrote:I think we should cut the fat and thin down the numbers before using the teleportation. Sending all the suspicious players to one universe could be a feasible idea later on in the game when we have claimed power roles.
I completely disagree.
CSL wrote:@ mykonian: quoting would've done MORE harm.
unvote
The vote has served it's purpose.
Enlighten me... what purpose was that?
-and-
Whats your new purpose? lurk until another opportunity arrises to jump on a wagon?
myko wrote:Placing these two in seperate universes would solve the problem without using a costly lynch for it. If one is scum, that person would lose his/her target, and would have to think of something new.
No, they need to hug it out, if there is a problem. A little drama can be good for scum hunting. people will pick sides.
E_K wrote:I also think people who are discouraging teleportation are anti-town. Scum have more of a reason to dislike telportation, especially since we have decided to try to teleport scummy players.
QFT
Myko, you claim the teleportation is a 0-sum game and causes confusion? Firstly, any good townie should be able to handle a little confusion, yes? ESPECIALLY if they can handle a little wifom
With the jab out of the way, time to get serious. Confusion isn't a funtion of the mechanic, its a function of the dedication of the players in the games. Townies playing towards their wincon will not become confused just because they have to read another thread. They might not like it, or they might just not choose to catch up (which is not really playing to their wincon).
Secondly, teleporting is not a 0-sum game. We may lose 1 scum only to gain another if the teleporters both hit scum, but the two uni's scums are separate factions. The chance of crosskills is a big plus for the town and is not offset by imaginary "confusion".
