Mini 901: Real Time Mafia (Over)

[farside22]

10 Alive

Snow Bunny ( 4 ) Juls Flareonage farside22 Plumegranate
DeathRowKitty ( 0 )
bigmc109 ( 3 ) Fishythefish don_johnson Ellibereth
don_johnson ( 0 )
Ellibereth ( 1 ) bigmc109
Flareonage ( 1 ) Snow Bunny
Plumegranate ( 0 )
Juls ( 0 )
farside22 ( 0 )
manho ( 0 )
Fishythefish ( 0 )
No Lynch ( 1 ) manho
Total Votes ( 10 )

With 10 alive, 6 needed to lynch.
Next Lynch Available at: January 16th 00:01 EST
Lynch Will Be: Snow Bunny

Reading Bigmc in ISO

Bigmc:

You want to lynch him so he doesn't lynch himself? That's the only thing you linked to, so I assume that's the extent of his anti-town play. He seems fine in this game so far. If he's town, we lose him either way, and if he's scum, why is self-voting such a problem? I understand how it's anti-town, but I think it could work in our favor. Why not just give him a chance to play?

This doesn't make sense how do we lose someone that most consider anti-town? Have you played scum before? I ask this for a good reason.

Vote: Elli

I see how there could be a pro-town reason for his push, but that's incredibly WIFOM-heavy. I think it was blatantly scummy, and just because it was obvious doesn't mean it should be ignored.

Elli's play started off incredibly scummy, and just because he's corrected it somewhat does not mean he's necessarily town. I think he's most likely scum trying to act as pro-town as possible.

If we did what Elli said, it would be very hard to find an alternate lynch, and we would more than likely fall back on the default. And setting up a policy lynch is in no way pro-town. What that does is ensure for Elli that if he and his buddies are unable to build up a legitimate case in 7 days, there is a default townie that is guaranteed to go anyway. And if and when CSL flipped townie, Elli wouldn't even be attacked very much for it, because he could simply claim that it was a policy lynch. And while people like me would attack him, people like you wouldn't even give it a second thought because it doesn't fit in to your picture of being scummy.

Reading these post just blows my mind. Basically elli is doing something pro-town but can be scum because he can just go back and say all I did was a policy lynch.
Does this makes sense to anyone?

The last three post from Bigmc makes it sound like the town has no comman sense what-so-ever to look back and read up on things. However I noticed lately more often then not the people pushing a policy lynch isn't scum it's the people who agree with the idea and hop on the BW that is scum.

There is no other reason to support a policy lynch so strongly, and considering no one else did except DRK, who explained he was joking, or, according to SB, as part of some bigger strategy, it makes Elli look like he was trying to set-up an easy lynch.

Most of the day DRK was saying he was serious about the lynch of CSL, it wasn't till he was close to being lynched he said he was joking and even though he flipped town it's hardt o believe someone who kept saying they were serious, over and over again till he was close to lynch.

[Snow_Bunny]

You see, if I claimed who my target was, there was a chance scum would use that information. A jailkeeper doubles as a doc, you know.

Maybe I'm being dense, but I don't see how scum would use the information.
I'm suggesting you claim your past target, not any future ones.

Ok, let's take for granted the mod's post 40:

A Rule clarification:

An action that comes in during the middle of a duration does that action beginning at that point.

Take two examples:
Doctor: Duration 10 days
Roleblocker: Duration 5 days
Doctor protects X on Day 0. Roleblocker blocks Doc starting on Day 2.
Result: X is protected from Day 0-2, not protected from Days 2-7, then is protected again from Day 7-10.

In this case, the action did not FAIL, thus the recharge time will be the full recharge time and not the half or 4 days whichever comes first.

Another example:
Framer: Duration 5 Days
Tracker: Duration 5 Days
Framer frames X beginning Day 0. Tracker tracks Day 2.
Result: Framer frames X without being seen Day 0. On Day 2, Tracker tracks and sees that Framer is visiting X.

I hope that makes things clearer rather than more complicated. Any other questions, don't hesitate to direct to me.

If scum knows who I am jailing, they won't target that person for a time. Or, if I have jailed scum, that scum won't submit the kill as he might lose the action. Or, if I claim to have not used the ability yet, they might hurry and try to target someone before I send my action. Or, etc, etc, etc. Giving more info to the scum is not good for town.

[farside22]

snow: I'm going to ask you the same question I asked big. What has been your experience on the site from people who lynch based on policy lynch?

[Snow_Bunny]

snow: I'm going to ask you the same question I asked big. What has been your experience on the site from people who lynch based on policy lynch?

My experience tells me that it ends usually in a town lynch. And a non-informative one.

[farside22]

snow: I'm going to ask you the same question I asked big. What has been your experience on the site from people who lynch based on policy lynch?

My experience tells me that it ends usually in a town lynch. And a non-informative one.

But what about the person who starts the idea of a policy lynch. Is that person who discusses town or scum or is it sometimes both? (IE: null tell)

[Snow_Bunny]

Null tell. However, the point here is not the discussion of that. The point here is the eagerness of it was pursued. In a normal game you have like two-three weeks to talk about it. Here, Elli wanted the lynch as soon as possible to leave it as backup and then discuss. With the small amount of time (a week) chances are the lynch would stay like that.

Take for example, my current situation. I am going to be the lynch unless town decides someone else is scummier in what, 4 or 5 days? Chances are I'm going to end up lynched (unless scum acts blatantly scummy) even if town no longer feels I'm scummy. Why? Because we would need another candidate.

[farside22]

Null tell. However, the point here is not the discussion of that. The point here is the eagerness of it was pursued. In a normal game you have like two-three weeks to talk about it. Here, Elli wanted the lynch as soon as possible to leave it as backup and then discuss. With the small amount of time (a week) chances are the lynch would stay like that.

Take for example, my current situation. I am going to be the lynch unless town decides someone else is scummier in what, 4 or 5 days? Chances are I'm going to end up lynched (unless scum acts blatantly scummy) even if town no longer feels I'm scummy. Why? Because we would need another candidate.

But if your town would you advicate looking for policy lynches to secure your position or would you scum hunt?
What if the person you feel is most town is up for lynch and no one seems to agree with who to lynch do you think targeting the anti-town policy lynch is bad at that point or do you hold true to your feelings and lynch a person you feel is town.

unvote:

I'm satisfied with bunny's logic on this I just want her to think about other possiblitys

vote: Bigmc

I am not a mindless townie. I think the whole WIFOM is based on people not scum hunting which just illogical. I notice for example people eager to lynch a player and jumping on BW's without reason. It's called scum hunting.

[Snow_Bunny]

Null tell. However, the point here is not the discussion of that. The point here is the eagerness of it was pursued. In a normal game you have like two-three weeks to talk about it. Here, Elli wanted the lynch as soon as possible to leave it as backup and then discuss. With the small amount of time (a week) chances are the lynch would stay like that.

Take for example, my current situation. I am going to be the lynch unless town decides someone else is scummier in what, 4 or 5 days? Chances are I'm going to end up lynched (unless scum acts blatantly scummy) even if town no longer feels I'm scummy. Why? Because we would need another candidate.

But if your town would you advicate looking for policy lynches to secure your position or would you scum hunt?
What if the person you feel is most town is up for lynch and no one seems to agree with who to lynch do you think targeting the anti-town policy lynch is bad at that point or do you hold true to your feelings and lynch a person you feel is town.

Well, if no one is a good option for a deadline lynch, then yes, I would advocate for a lynch of an anti-town player. However, this anti-towness should be proved as the day go on, not as a first resource. For example, I would advocate for a CSL policy lynch if he acted anti-town in this topic. But, in order to know that, some amount of time and post must be required. Meta is one thing I don't use often, as the way a player plays a particular game does not necessarily inform about how a player will play another particular game.

[Flareonage]

I may have missed it but has the 3rd neighbor confirmed snow bunnys claim?

[Snow_Bunny]

Of course you have missed it because you are not reading the thread. You just look at the current votecount and hop in the largest wagon.

[Flareonage]

So then you won't mind telling me who the third neighbor is

[farside22]

So then you won't mind telling me who the third neighbor is

READ THE THREAD!

[Snow_Bunny]

...

......

Why? Why, oh mighty god of randomness that decides upon the roles, why can't I ever have a vigshot when I need it?

[Snow_Bunny]

I can't believe I got majority of votes when we have Flare just right there.

Sheep town makes me sad. T_T

[Flareonage]

Fine, you win.

VOTE: Fishythefish

I still haven't seen a false role claim so I believe you

[Plumegranate]

But I don't think that we'll miss every deadline, only the ones in this game day. Once we have a night, everything won't be set to specific day (lynch deadline Friday night at midnight, for example).

Do we have a night? My understanding is Day 2 started immediately after the lynch thus each "day" will end Friday at midnight.

Yeah, you're right. I forgot about the nightless part.

^^ well, the only reason for sb to reveal her target in thread is for future use. if fish is town then she could reveal it in quicktopic, but then we have to trust fish with that info. more than likely, sb is the next mafia kill. i would rather have the info in this thread before she dies.

now lets lynch bigmc. plumegranate is now my number two target. the v/la is too convenient to ignore.

flareonage and manho could be lurking scum. if there is a vig, kill them please.

I see no reason for her not too, once she's claimed jalkeeper. (In response to SBs most recent post: I see your reasoning. If you don't want to, don't, as you know the specifics of your role and we don't, but I still think stating your past target, if there was one could be helpful. If you were jailing someone at the time of the kill, it could be of use. But ultimately, it depends on what info you have, so it's your choice.)

We are both V/LA in all of our games at this time, so I'm sorry if it seems "convenient". It's a pain, but it's weekly and that's that. If you want to check, you can see that neither of us has ever made a post Friday at midnight (at least in our timezone).

I find it slightly scummy that you keep pushing this forward. It's unavoidable, and didn't "conveniently" pop up right around the time the game started.

Flare and Manho are scummy, yes. Especially manho. He's V/LA until the 17th.

FoS: manho

.

So then you won't mind telling me who the third neighbor is

Flare, DO SOMETHING QUICKLY... LIKE SCUMHUNTING... BECAUSE OTHERWISE YOU MIGHT HAVE A VOTE THROWN AT YOU....

[Ellibereth]

Fine, you win.

VOTE: Fishythefish

I still haven't seen a false role claim so I believe you

Try again next Time.

I mean, seriously, you seem very very confused. Read the entire topic again, slowly. kthx.

[Plumegranate]

Fine, you win.

VOTE: Fishythefish

I still haven't seen a false role claim so I believe you

Try again next Time.

I mean, seriously, you seem very very confused. Read the entire topic again, slowly. kthx.

This.

[Flareonage]

I believe that one of the three neighbors is scum (Didn't we all?). Now that Snow bunny has role claimed then we should switch to the remaining neighbor. If that fails then I'm an idiot

[Snow_Bunny]

You believe me? Believe what? Are you actually reading the topic? Why that vote?

[farside22]

...

......

Why? Why, oh mighty god of randomness that decides upon the roles, why can't I ever have a vigshot when I need it?

QFT ^
now you know why some people believe in policy lynch too.

[Snow_Bunny]

I believe that one of the three neighbors is scum (Didn't we all?). Now that Snow bunny has role claimed then we should switch to the remaining neighbor. If that fails then I'm an idiot

Then you are an idiot. READ THE DAMN TOPIC AND DO SOMETHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It might just be me, but Plum's mafia lessons to Flare are noted.

[Snow_Bunny]

...

......

Why? Why, oh mighty god of randomness that decides upon the roles, why can't I ever have a vigshot when I need it?

QFT ^
now you know why some people believe in policy lynch too.

Yes, I can see now. Though, I've never been a fan of policy lynching. For me, it's just like a scum point that adds to a case, but not a case in itself.

[Fishythefish]

I'm tempted to suggest Flare as a backup lynch until the time that someone actually claims scum.

@Flare: there's no good reason to suppose one of the neighbours is scum. (IMO, there's also no good reason to suppose SB is town). Your saying that everyone thinks or thought that at least one of the neighbours is definitely scum is an appeal to the majority, which makes it look like you don't believe in your stated opinions. I believe it's also simply false.
You asked whether I "confirmed SB's claim". Neighbours get to talk to each other. If you like, I'll ask her privately what her role is; she may forget herself and claim something else. Failing that, there's no way I can confirm or deny her claim.

Fos: Flareon

This could easily be VI play. However, it feels like Flareon has found a set of easy reasons for voting, and is following it blindly, because he thinks it will help him avoid suspicion.

Personally, I'm glad I'm not a vig with a charged shot atm. manho or Flareon? I'd hate to make that decision.

[Ellibereth]

iFeel Flare town.
P-fruit. what do you think about bigmc?
Need more wagon.