Open 187- Silence of the Yams! Over!

[ElectricBadger]

This is a strange game so far. Really not sure what to think of CSL.

Will try to do a re-read in the next day or two. Seems like a bit of a lull in the game, good time for it.

[don_johnson]

i'll be replacing parts and josh lyman asap.

[ElectricBadger]

Completed a re-read. Informative stuff.

First off,

Unvote Parts

since he's at L-1; If we're gonna bother getting a replacement I'd like to hear from them before they're lynched.


Kunkstar: Felt he deserved a more thorough re-read following Star's lurking accusation in 137. It's true K hasn't posted much, and it took him bit to contribute at all. His posts are decent, though, with observations that generally have a clear stance and show understanding of the arguments. His 'slip' in 105 also reads town to me:

How would you engineer a buddying attempt, before the game even began?

The lack of understanding that the mafia could talk pre-game seems genuine, and not something scum would miss.

The only thing I really didn't like about his iso is his vote; just the one out of him in 12, placed for an obviously random reason but still in place. Kunkstar, is the vote still random, or do you have a specific reason for leaving it there? You've expressed suspicion of other players: why no vote to back it up?


CSL: I'm still really not sure what to make of him. Sticky widgets for me: He's potentially an easy lynch due to his general lack of scumhunting and hypocrisy. But that would be more of a policy lynch: I don't think he's on the radar for being scum so much as for bad play. It could be easily scum-driven. I think a lynch here won't get us much info: no clear scumbuddy or in depth debate to work from tomorrow.

[More upcoming; back to work for now]

[kunkstar7]

His 'slip' in 105 also reads town to me:

How would you engineer a buddying attempt, before the game even began?

The lack of understanding that the mafia could talk pre-game seems genuine, and not something scum would miss.

The only thing I really didn't like about his iso is his vote; just the one out of him in 12, placed for an obviously random reason but still in place. Kunkstar, is the vote still random, or do you have a specific reason for leaving it there? You've expressed suspicion of other players: why no vote to back it up?

The question was originally posed at Parts as it didn't make sense to me how the scum could do that. How do you arrange a buddying action without having any material to work with, no idea of how the game will go? Trying to force a buddying action most of the time would just be so obvious. So it just seemed to me that Parts was trying to stretch his theory to add as much suspicion as he could.

Yes my vote is still my original random vote and honestly has no purpose where it is at the moment. I am not very judicious with my votes.

As it is a baseless vote, there is no need for it

Unvote.

[don_johnson]

Xscorpion-
Parts- alexhans, CSL (2)
alexhans-
kunkstar7-
Starbuck-
ElectricBadger- Starbuck, Parts (2)
CSL- Xscorpion (1)

Not Voting- ElectricBadger, kunkstar7

with seven alive it takes 4 to lynch.

alexhans replaces Josh Lyman. still searching for Parts replacement.

[ElectricBadger]

Starbuck: Not a lot to say here, as I've already addressed things. Only thing that really stuck out was the complete support of every one of Ecto's statements and suspicions. Reads to me like she's overly defensive because she knows the suspicions are valid.

XScorpion: A very interesting read through with my focus away from my initial suspects. A lot of things I don't like here. Initially expresses a like for bandwagons, but he's been avoiding every single one so far: most notably he dove off the Ecto wagon once it became a serious investigation, avoiding scumhunting in preference of RVS - possibly dodging any blame that arose from the wagon, or ending his bussing. Since then he has pointedly avoided involvement in the discussion between Starbuck/Ecto and I, not giving any firm commentary or asking any questions about it.

Later he moves to CSL, who - if town - is an obvious target for scum to push an easy lynch. He's spent most of the game there so far. Despite this, however, he's never made a case in the face of my repeated comments that the bad play there isn't necessarily scum tells: that is, while Scorpion has identified every fumble CSL made he hasn't made a single attempt to identify why they're scum tells: just lots of little cuts.

Post count is good, but not much content there. No lengthy posts. He spends a lot of time on side issues: a conversation with Ecto about another game, questions about whether people like RVS, addressing the mod, and fence-sitting posts like

I would normally threaten the hammer but I'm not prepared to support a lynch favoured by the person I believe to be scummiest (CSL).

- which manages to avoid the wagon without condemning it or supporting it, a great position to evade attention for a mislynch. He puts it well himself in blaming CSL for continuing the discussion he started:

I love the RVS.

Very crafty, trying to post but still heavily lurking. How about actually talking to people or doing something constructive?

Also interesting was 106; following Parts' error about pre-game mafia talk Scorpion makes an issue of asking the mod for clarification when it was easy enough to determine from the posted rules. Feels more like an over-played townie claim. 127, however, seems like the opposite: scum not quite understanding what's going on with town:

I'm curious as to what other links two people can have besides being scumbuddies? I was under the impression that town didn't know other town?

Scorpion, what is your take on the players so far - who's scum, who's town? Do you think CSL's actions are pro-mafia?

Vote Xscorpion

[alexhans]

Hi Everyone, interesting game... I've read this game without knowing if I would be able to replace in so I didn't really know my alignment. I'm glad I did anyway because now I will lose no time. I commented as I read so there's a lot of feelings, gut reads, comments and questions on the move... But probably the most important things are my final reads so far. I eagerly await your responses and comments.

Last but not least, don't be offended if I get intense with my "bullshit" yells... I feel like a PI in mafia and I tend to act like I'm about to unmask a conspiracy

I started with some lame notes...

Ecto says he will try to be active lurker. He then asks for experience from everyone.
XScorpion claims to be kicking off bandwaggons
Nice Ecto vs badger thing... this game looks interesting
I like both ecto and badger so far.
I don't like parts very much. It might be fresh player playstyle but those questions seem irrelevant.

What I don't get though is why a scum would claim to be a lurker then decide not to...

Weird post. Is he defending ecto? Ecto did not claim lurker... he was just starting the game.

but my record is placing a serious vote on the 2nd post of the entire game.

Link? Was he scum?

Undercut... So you weren't intending to actually lurk when you made that post, despite specifically saying so?

This I don't like. Looks like a lawyer trying to set at trap for an enemy witness.

I'll try to find it, but in his first post, a player voted the only other player he knew in the game and stated that was his reason. I immediately voted him for trying to remove the one player who might know his scumtells. (I guess technically that counts as RVS kicking off the game? Mafialosophy question there haha)

meh... I'm dissapointed. That is not a serious vote. Did you seriously think he was scum for it?
61: why was it a serious vote to you? define serious.

65 Egomancer Ok dude. You just got annoying. I foresee that you will never in your life admit being wrong about something

CSL votes badger after saying he would go on VLA... for lurking... mmmmm

In this case, he came, he read, he left, hence, he lurked.

This is just ridiculous. I've done this many times when I wanted to clear my thoughts. Sometimes it's better to let things set in your head before commenting about them.

I was right.

There it goes again...

Here's a hint, don't be quite so obvious when you are defending a scumbuddy or sucking up to town.

This is bullshit. This is the kind of anti-town attitude that loses games. Either you follow up on those lame accusations or you shut up.

oh... So Ecto was replaced... interesting... might be good, might be bad... we'll see.

Wow. Even discounting that I really can't hold Ecto's behavior against Starbuck, I am curious to see Starbuck's reaction to this: Starbuck, if CSL is not your scumbuddy, who is?

Ok... wtf?

Ok guys... from Josh's Lyman's post I can only say 1 thing... He sucks or he sucks as scum... but I'm not scum so he just sucks...

Then he votes Parts for being anti-town? huh?

He basically asked the same question to every guy... "who do you think is scum"?

@ Lyman: Here it is.

Badger: For Not enough scumhunting and/or lack thereof, and bad misrepping, which is why my vote is currently on him.

Parts: Ignoring information that could help us, and lack of scumhunting.

FoS: Parts

XScorpion, for using the word "buddy." Could that mean "Scumbuddy?" Only time will tell.

Ok... winner for scum candidate #1... Lame post... mild scum.

He did not state he was away. I did.

It needs to be stated that people are going away over the holidays? Come on dude, seriously, think logically.

maybe he is using Scumlogic? Scumlogic involves seeing scummy things in others that don't apply to you for farfetched reasons.

It’s mainly because of these quotes. This reads like buddying to me because I honestly don’t think I contributed enough to deserve statements like this about my play. He is also implying that appearing neutral and non-committal is a positive thing.

What a bunch of crap...

Third scummiest is CSL for non contribution but I’m not really looking at lynching him yet.

Weird statement is weird. Saying you're not looking to lynch someone means that you're willing to leach the other people? This early?

And you believe he is town because...?

I'm liking the Starbuck/Parts team right now, mostly.

Already pulling off scumteams? How is that smart? Or are you just trying to manipulate people?

It has crossed my mind that Ecto/Starbuck and ElectricBadger could be scumbuddies who engineered this whole thing in pregame talk to combine a buddying action by Ecto with a distancing act between Ecto and ElectricBadger.

How would you engineer a buddying attempt, before the game even began? It feels like you are just trying to find something to move suspicion off you.

You are distancing yourself from both of these players in this post. Logically, Starbuck seems a more likely partner as you are distancing yet not pointing them out completely, trying to still keep most suspicion on another player besides your partner.

Hey... It would make for an awesome gambyt... specially with this kind of open game where the only PR threat to scum is a hidden macho cop...

4. No talking outside the game thread unless your role pm specifically states that you may.

If it does, you may communicate until the thread opens.

How is the bolded not clear to you that you need to ask such a question?

but

During the day you need to try and blend in, but

at night you may talk

outside the game thread.

There's 2 options. You're pretending not to know (wich would make you scum) or you're really unobservant.

So...before the thread opened it was night 0?

Badger, you are at L-1.

Claim time.

SCUMPOINTS for you my lady... There was no need for a claim with so many players absent and noncommital. If someone dared to hammer he should be lynched inmediatly. But it's fascinating how you pushed for a claim in a game where it ABSOLUTELY BENEFITS SCUM...

TELL ME ONE SINGLE SCENARIO WHERE IT WOULDNT.

FoS Starbuck

Badger wins town points because he never seems afraid of the lynch.

I smell AtE...

You seem more scummy than anyone else....

BULLSHIT... WORST BULLSHIT I'VE EVER SEEN... AtE is what scum calls when they don't have an idea what the fuck to say because they've been caught on a contradiction.

ok... 125 posts and too many people are talking about scumteams... wtf?

Why is everyone so defensive? specially Ecto and his replacement...

Crap. The AtE was for another game. Excuse that.

Yep, other than what other people pointed out.

BULL SHIT... This is one lame attempt to escape a screw up. XD Is that other game ongoing? There's nothing else you want to contribute with?

So, who are we interrogating?

Oh God... this makes me think that he might just be stupid regardless of alignment... But he is still a great lynch because people like this will lose us the game.
141 CSL: No one can be so bad... this post is NULL... doesn't tell anything nor it doesn't commit to anything. Still scum.

Next, I shall do Badger, because that's who I voted for. Expect an ISOread by the end of the day. Real-time, not Game day.

this shows that he has no clue why he is voting Badger.

Badger, feast your eyes on post 143. I said I would do an ISO of you by tonight.

Still nothing.

I forget why.

Unvote

for now.

I should do all ISO's first, before I vote.

mmmmm... Still a horrendous player.

Honestly what I feel out of this is everything revolves around ElectricBadger and Starbuck. It seems to me that Starbuck is trying to cover for some early scummy mistakes that Ecto was making, and well she's doing it pretty well.

I've have the same feeling but need to analyze ecto's meta before I can say anything conclusive. I liked his argumentations at first.
Post 152

Why is calling for his claim when he is one vote away from being lynched too early?

Why would I call for his claim after he was hammered?

I want legitimate answers to both of these questions.

1) No one should be hammering suddenly. There was no need to claim. That wasn't a serious bandwaggon.
2) stupid question deserves no response.

3) You want legitimate answers? This looks like you want to scold him as if he was giving you ilegitimate questions and lying... This pre-emptive attack is scummy.

and lastly...

Give me ONE good reason for asking for a claim (in the context in wich you asked it) if you're a town player... You have none.

But he was at L-1, anyone could have hammered him and we wouldn't have his claim.

So how was my calling for his claim WHEN HE WAS AT L-1 calling for it too early? How was he not under pressure? He was at L-1. He was one vote away from being lynched.

You could've unvoted if that was what worried you... But you wanted to force a claim out of him.

I've seen scum do this in another open game (where i was scum too). open 127, check out hascow.

Ok... CSL is not doing anything with his "ISOs"...

It's a common scumtatic to look busy to make pbpa analysis and just summarize what people did instead of giving your opinions about it. It may be informational but it doesn't show what the poster thinks. It's not scumhunting.

Good post by kunst

@kunkstar7 - That was an excellent answer in Post 158. I need to go back and re-read EB.

smart of you to recognize that. Specially if you're scum. Wich I'm beginning to suspect more and more.

163: sigh, if you don't know who he is talking about it may be because he is responding to someone! If you just ISO people without knowing what is happening you won't understand anything.

Oh, and EB, claiming when you are at L-1 needs to be done ASAP, because some people who will be willing to hammer will say something about you, then hammer you.

People like you? Those kind of people are usually super anti-town or scum and must be lynched.

So let me get this straight... you're voting Parts using evidence from your ISO of Badger, without having done an ISO of Parts yet? Yeah ok.

Yeah man... it's not so hard... He is either scum or the worst player ever.

So how in an Open game knowing that we have 2 Mafia Goons, do you get 3 obvscum voting for EB?

EDBWOP: Never mind, I completely read that wrong.

Glad you noticed. I was about to scream.

So Parts is now at L-1, time to claim bud.

Ok... you're scum trying to look consistent.

First off,

Unvote Parts

since he's at L-1; If we're gonna bother getting a replacement I'd like to hear from them before they're lynched.

see? This is what town would do! Not what starbuck did.

CSL: I'm still really not sure what to make of him. Sticky widgets for me: He's potentially an easy lynch due to his general lack of scumhunting and hypocrisy. But that would be more of a policy lynch: I don't think he's on the radar for being scum so much as for bad play. It could be easily scum-driven. I think a lynch here won't get us much info: no clear scumbuddy or in depth debate to work from tomorrow.

I understand your concern. But if you think CSL is either scum or a bad player you shouldn't worry so much about lynching him because it will remove him from the game. This kind of player could be a liability to town. If you're sure of someone else, go ahead and vote them... but don't clear CSL just because he looks like an easy lynch. Sometimes scum are that bad.

Town Reads

ElectricBadger -> town read

Leaning town reads

kunkstar7 -> neutral read but I like his little contributions.
XScorpion -> mild town read.

Neutral

Parts -> Almost nothing to go on with. He may be just new.

Scum Reads

(ectomancer) Starbuck -> The whole business of the claim just reeks scum and the way in wich he keeps reacting. He seems to be a good player but he is still scum. I'll do an ecto meta ASAP to see if it changes my mind about something.
CSL -> scum read. He doesn't make sense and seems like newb scum. He is trying to look busy with those "descriptive" Iso's.

I'm up for voting CSL or Starbuck but I think that I may vote CSL in the end because he is more anti-town (in case he was town, he would be a liability).

Mod... the votecounts are confusing... why dont you try the following format?:

Votee (number) - Voter1, voter2, ...

it clearly separates voters from votees.

oh... and

unvote Parts, vote CSL

[Starbuck]

Only thing that really stuck out was the complete support of every one of Ecto's statements and suspicions. Reads to me like she's overly defensive because she knows the suspicions are valid.

That last statement is very WIFOMish.

Also, why don't you take a re-read me and Ecto separately? You'll see that there is quite a bit that I disagreed with him about.

[Starbuck]

SCUMPOINTS for you my lady... There was no need for a claim with so many players absent and noncommital. If someone dared to hammer he should be lynched inmediatly. But it's fascinating how you pushed for a claim in a game where it ABSOLUTELY BENEFITS SCUM...

TELL ME ONE SINGLE SCENARIO WHERE IT WOULDNT.

So how is it "not needed" because so many people are lurking?

And, why couldn't he be scum that doesn't want to claim his role?


What if someone did hammer and EB flipped scum? Why are you not thinking of all the other scenarios?



It's almost like you are subtly hinting that you know his alignment.

1) No one should be hammering suddenly. There was no need to claim. That wasn't a serious bandwaggon.
2) stupid question deserves no response.

3) You want legitimate answers? This looks like you want to scold him as if he was giving you ilegitimate questions and lying... This pre-emptive attack is scummy.

1. How was it not a serious bandwagon when the guy was at L-1? One vote away from dying.

2. I agree that it was a stupid question, but did you see where it stemmed from?

Kunkstar stated:

He is was still at L-1 when I was asked to make this if I'm not mistaken, and there wasn't a hammer.

This pretty much alluded to me that he thinks that the request for a claim would be made when someone is hammered or after they are hammered.

3. Way to misrepresent me because I wasn't scolding him. I don't get where any of you think that someone being at L-1 isn't a serious bandwagon. The excuse that people were lurking really doesn't fly.

Give me ONE good reason for asking for a claim (in the context in wich you asked it) if you're a town player... You have none.

Way to assume and misrepresent me yet again.

Counterclaims. The only way that wouldn't work is if he was a VT.

So Parts is now at L-1, time to claim bud.

Ok... you're scum trying to look consistent.

Why can't I be town?

So far, you seem to have a full case on me, yet you're not voting me?


You and EB have been going on and on about how Starbuck is scum? Where's my wagon?

see? This is what town would do! Not what starbuck did.

Parts was lurking/getting replaced, where EB was active and EB could defend himself. You are insinuating that I'd never unvote. We never got to that point, so what's with the WIFOM?



You have defended EB far more than I think EB has defended himself all game.

Why are you so sure of him?


Also for the record, I have a female symbol under my name. I am no he.

[alexhans]

Starbucks... You asked for a claim in your 5th post! On page 5! With 111 posts. CSL had voted Badger with one sentence. You had no chance of hammering and anyone who did without warning would deserve to be lynched. You didn't unvote to make sure this didn't happen. You just wanted him to claim.

So how is it "not needed" because so many people are lurking?

It was not needed because his waggon wasn't even explained by it's members. It was too soon in the game and a pro-town attitude would've been to try to get reads from them. Wich you couldn't care less about.

And, why couldn't he be scum that doesn't want to claim his role?

Who says he couldn't. But as town, you are not supposed to know his alignment. So, you should've taken precautions. Wich you didnt.

What if someone did hammer and EB flipped scum? Why are you not thinking of all the other scenarios?

Because that is an unnecesary scenario to think about. You can't be serious about this stupid accusation (because it looks like you're accusing me of overlooking stuff that might benefit you, wich is lame and scummy). If you're town. You don't know his alignment. Therefore, you shouldn't gamble like that in the way you did. You wanted him to claim so he wouldn't be quickhammered before he did. Yet, you didn't unvote. You wanted him to claim so you could maybe get a CC? HAve you noticed the setup? 2 PRs. If one of them claims he DIES.

It's almost like you are subtly hinting that you know his alignment.

Another lame attack on the order of lame scum... You don't want to attack me directly in hopes I will leave you alone but you want to undermine my credibility. Classy.

If I was subtly hinting I KNEW HIS ALIGNMENT that would mean I knew his alignment. Only SCUM knows other peoples alignment. Subtle way to try and call me scum without catching flak for it.

1. How was it not a serious bandwagon when the guy was at L-1? One vote away from dying.

Yep... and 3 lame votes in... 2 from the most anti-town players this game and one from you. No one could hammer just because they liked. You didn't warn people not to hammer. You called for a claim. There's so many things you could've done if you were afraid of a hammer. Yet, you didn't.

2. I agree that it was a stupid question, but did you see where it stemmed from?

Yes, I do see what you're implying. My problem is with the claim you asked for.

3. Way to misrepresent me because I wasn't scolding him.

You said that you wanted LEGIMITATE anwers... As if he would lie if you didn't tell him.

It's a fallacy. Imagine if I asked you something and right after the question I said: "I want the truth this time".

If I ask you something you're obviusly supposed to tell the truth. Me treating you like that can only serve the purpose of tarnishing your credibility.

The excuse that people were lurking really doesn't fly.

That's not the main reason... And you're the one misrepping here. When you mean people were lurking you're referring to what some of us say that there hadn't been enough discussion and you couldn't possibly have decent reads on most of the players in the game. The fact that you wanted to rush a claim so early means that you didnt care to scumhunt.

Also... let's analyze the possible conclusions of a claim.

1) He claims VT. You ask for a hammer.
2) He claims Doc/Cop. He IS Doc/Cop. He may or not get lynched. He WILL be killed.
3) he claims Cop. He is scum. He may or not get lynched. If the true PR counter claims he will get killed. If the true PR doesn't claim he will jump on the waggon. He may be killed.

There's nothing positive about a claim unless the player is DEFINETLY going to be lynched.

Way to assume and misrepresent me yet again.

Point by repetition? Ad nauseaum without proof won't work for you.

Counterclaims. The only way that wouldn't work is if he was a VT.

Read my possible outcomes analysis and tell me how is it good.

Why can't I be town?

Who says you couldn't? Do you want me to call you possible scum each time? At this point. Looking at your answers... I'd say probable scum... Most likely than anyone else except maybe CSL.

So far, you seem to have a full case on me, yet you're not voting me?

And what is this? Is this an accusation? Do you think I'm scum for not voting you? Have you even read who my top 2 suspects are and why am I voting who am I voting? Have I expressed disgust for your lynch? No. Then stop BSing. thanks.

You and EB have been going on and on about how Starbuck is scum? Where's my wagon?

You can ask him yourself. I believe he said you were a bit more pro town or something. I think in a similar fashion. I think both you and CSL have acted scummy but he is a horrible player that doesn't add anything to the game. At least you seem capable of scumhunting and responding cases, attacking, etc wich could be useful even if you were scum. Also, I'd like to read ecto before getting anyone lynched because you're not just one person but a combination of 2 and I may be able to find telling reads in his play. Either way. I'm not forgetting how I thought you were scum in a game where you weren't so I want to be as sure as possible.

Parts was lurking/getting replaced, where EB was active and EB could defend himself. You are insinuating that I'd never unvote. We never got to that point, so what's with the WIFOM?

Ughh... This is not scummy. This is just lame... The overuse of the word WIFOM when people don't seem to know what it means is the most annoying thing I encounter. I keep explaining how your reasons for getting a claim could've been handled in diffent, much more pro-town ways, than asking him to claim.

Homework. Can you link me to a games where you asked for claims? Were they early? Where you town? Thanks. It may help me understand if you are, indeed, town.

You have defended EB far more than I think EB has defended himself all game.

And? What's your follow up? This is the precise bullshit scum throws to make subtle attacks. What's your opinion on this? Do you think it makes us a scumteam? Do you think I'm buddying up to him? Do you neglect the fact that I'll just STRONLY defend whoever I think is town? Especially if he is in danger of being lynched.

Read my wiki. Check out "Case Closed mafia". I entered and tried to disarm a lynch against a player named Firestarted wich I was sure of he was town. I continuosly attacked a player who ended up killing me and was SK.
I defended Mastin in Apennine mafia even though other players were bashing at him. I looked scum to a lot of people because of that defense. But I was right.

Why are you so sure of him?

Because of everything that he has said and done. I've tried to wear his boots (as I try to do with every player I analyze) and I feel he has nearly always behaved in a way that indicates town thinking. I think there's some examples of it in my previous post.

Also for the record, I have a female symbol under my name. I am no he.

I'm sorry. I'm sure I said my lady at some point. So I knew it. I just messed up. I assure you. It's worst when I play IRC mafia...

[ElectricBadger]

Only thing that really stuck out was the complete support of every one of Ecto's statements and suspicions. Reads to me like she's overly defensive because she knows the suspicions are valid.

That last statement is very WIFOMish.

How so? You could be scum sticking too closely to a mafia plan and playing too defensively, or you could be town

acting like scum sticking too closely to a mafia plan and playing too defensively?

WIFOM generally applies to proving someone is town, not dismissing scum tells, and attempting to use it for such implies you have no real defense.

Also, why don't you take a re-read me and Ecto separately? You'll see that there is quite a bit that I disagreed with him about.

I invite you to provide examples, but I don't believe you've differed from Ecto's stance on any players or admitted to any serious wrongdoing on his part.

You and EB have been going on and on about how Starbuck is scum? Where's my wagon?

You can ask him yourself. I believe he said you were a bit more pro town or something. ...At least you seem capable of scumhunting and responding cases, attacking, etc wich could be useful even if you were scum.

First off, Starbuck, the implied claim that you're town because no one is voting for you is probably the scummiest thing you've done this entire game. The assumption that lack of suspicion indicates innocence is an obvious fallacy, and smacks of bragging mafia trying to leverage peer pressure. Particularly since - as you know perfectly well - there's a fair amount of suspicion of you and at least a couple players willing to vote you, which negates your claim as well as your logic.

Regarding my own vote - no, I don't think Starbuck is town, and I'd happily lynch her. Three reasons I'm not voting her at the moment: I'd rather build up a wagon to give pressure than have votes scattered around; as alex mentions in his last line, she's active and so good to keep around for a while (at least the full day) even if she is scum (no need for pressure to keep talking, her defensiveness is doing that for us); and I really don't want to leave D1 without investigating as many players as possible with some degree of depth - I'd rather our cop spend their investigations confirming mafia than clearing lurkers.

[kunkstar7]

Alexhans, you came into this quite strong.
In my view, I'm leaning more Starbuck, considering some things that have been pointed out this page. Between the claim situation and the answers on this page, she's a more likely candidate than any other at this point. The reason I'm leaning Starbuck is because although CSL has been playing badly, a lynch on him won't give us anything to work with the next day. From one of my previous posts I pointed out that the alignments in this game seem to revolve around Starbuck and ElectricBadger. With a Starbuck lynch I think we will have the best position for the next day.

Vote: Starbuck

[Starbuck]

So kunkstar, what happens when I flip town?

How will you feel about that?

[XScorpion]

Scorpion, what is your take on the players so far - who's scum, who's town? Do you think CSL's actions are pro-mafia?

I don't make town lists, they don't help town.
CSL is my #1 scum obviously, and I think that his idea this game was to try to slip through everyone's viewpoints by posting very little yet enough that he isn't seen as a lurker. I add on to the fact that he just supports all the bandwagons with poor reasoning and I don't see why not to lynch him...even if he turns up town, all we lose is a weaker player.
Starbuck would be my second choice for scum...I'm really not a major fan of all the aggressive demands for claiming, especially since I don't see how a claim would help town anyway. But I'm definitely not up for lynching Starbuck as long as CSL is around...come Lylo, I want to have someone who I have a lot to read on (starbuck, as opposed to CSL).

[CSL]

Ugh, do I have to claim? Or am I at L-2?

[ElectricBadger]

So kunkstar, what happens when I flip town?

How will you feel about that?

...and now AtE.

Unvote Scorpion, Vote Starbuck.

CSL, you're at L-2, so only claim if you're mafia.

[Starbuck]

How was that AtE?

I was asking kunkstar a question.




Also, I'll be tackling the 2 walls of text shortly.

[kunkstar7]

If you flip town, then we have some basis to go off of. We can review the cases that have been given so far knowing that you were town, and that allows us to look at the posts that have already been given and work out something more. For example the coaching of Parts earlier in the game, and possible ties between you and Parts. If you flip town we can review those ties and determine if they are still viable or not. Thats all assuming you would flip town of course. Either way, lynching you gives us information, regardless if you flip scum or town, much more than a CSL lynch would give us at this point.

[Starbuck]

Why wouldn't CSL's lynch give information?

[don_johnson]

The "Oh, okay, he's an electrisified Badger, I get it!" vote count:

Xscorpion-
Kdub- CSL
alexhans-
kunkstar7-
Starbuck- (2) kunkstar7, ElectricBadger
ElectricBadger- (2) Starbuck, Kdub
CSL- (2) Xscorpion, alexhans

Not Voting-

with seven alive it takes 4 to lynch.

Kdub replaces Parts

.

[Kdub]

I'll catch up and post either tonight or tomorrow morning.

[kunkstar7]

CSL: I'm still really not sure what to make of him. Sticky widgets for me: He's potentially an easy lynch due to his general lack of scumhunting and hypocrisy. But that would be more of a policy lynch: I don't think he's on the radar for being scum so much as for bad play. It could be easily scum-driven.

I think a lynch here won't get us much info: no clear scumbuddy or in depth debate to work from tomorrow.

This is the quote I refer to when I mention that CSL won't provide much information the next day. He has made little contribution to the game so far, and there wouldn't be much to work with if he is town or scum. If town, well he was town. Does that provide us with any connected information? Can you name some such information? If he is scum, then one scum down, but no clear line as to a connected scumbuddy. So we are lost for a day two lead.

[Starbuck]

So you are telling everyone that you are parroting off Badger then?

[ElectricBadger]

How was that AtE?

Really? You see a logical reason not to vote you here:

How will you feel about that?

'Bout the clearest case of appeal to emotion I've seen yet.

[CSL]

Unvote

So, 3 players, including myself, are at L-2.

If I say anything, people are going to accuse me of copying other's points. So I won't...YET.